Ren'Py Summertime Saga [v21.0.0 wip.5091] [Kompas Productions]

[Deleted member 2063884]

Me watching the neverending discussion in this thread about DC that wont amount to anything tangible as usual:

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[Omnikuken]

................stuff
how DC bent over for Patreon's Mind Police sinking the game into vanilla porn instead of creating a legendary porn town where most have a dirty incesty secret at home.
................novel worth of stuff

So ? Remove wincest and stay on Patreon to actually make the game or drop Patreon for wincest and the game is dead ? Mad logic there. And no, he's not going to Subscribe star anytime soon nor was it an option 3 years ago when Patreon went fulltard

 

[exirock]

I'm gonna pile up my opinion about SS because why the hell not, you all have nothing better to read anyway.

I've been keeping in touch[ish] with this game for 3+ years now so I know plenty about its evolution.

From the get go I'll say the TL;DR: I love the artwork and some of the perversity. I hate how badly the project is managed, how it strings people along and how DC bent over for Patreon's Mind Police sinking the game into vanilla porn instead of creating a legendary porn town where most have a dirty incesty secret at home.

Now I'll explain each point.

I think everyone agrees with the good so there's no point going over it. Artwork is good. Perversity is sometimes good. That annoying sister is such a good hate fuck. Mom and aunt excellent whores. The lactating aunt, mmm yummy. The milk factory idea, fantastic! Preggers everywhere, fuck yeah! Shemales, uuuuuu nasty! Erik fucking his mom, mmmmmm mmm!

The bad however, oh THE bad!

First of all, many of you need to educate yourselves about philosophy of art in order to avoid stupid flame wars. All these "You didn't pay so don't complain!", "He don't owe you notin'!", etc. are arguments that have been settled centuries if not millennia ago because they apply to all artwork.

Once a work of art leaves its creator's arms and is exposed to the public, said piece no longer belongs to the creator but to everyone who has experienced it. In our material societies the physical piece does belong to someone and, unfortunately, the rights to create copies and derivatives also belong to someone but the spirit of what I said still remains. Everyone who has been touched by a work of art is the owner of said piece because it has left a deep impression in their brain and so has a right to critique or otherwise express an opinion.

This is why it doesn't matter at all if you paid money or not for this game. As long as you experienced it you have the right to express an opinion and, very importantly, you have the right to an opinion about its continuation and the path it takes into the future.

People are rightfully feeling betrayed when their work of art is undermined by its creator or mutilated. OF FUCKING COURSE! This was settled LONG LONG ago. Educated yourselves and you will avoid pointless squabbling. I certainly wasn't born knowing these things or figuring them out by myself, that's for sure.

Now, returning to a more succinct pointing out of the bad parts in SS.

DC is stringing people along. Or to put it another way, he has found a comfortable position where he gets $65k/month delivering at a leisurely pace and he's enjoying it a little too much. Frankly, I don't consider it immoral and I think every single one of you motherfuckers would do the exact same thing. Are you going to be the one who risks changing things and breaking that steady income stream? I think not. He's not forcing people to contribute, they just do. It is what it is.

On the other hand, everyone is free to whine. Go ahead. It won't change shit. Maybe there should be a dedicated thread just for these whines.

But then, the project is managed so SO badly. I don't mean just in terms of schedule (he suggested 0.20.x would take 6-8 months and instead it will take over a year). I mean artistically. I now play this game once per year and even that is too often if I want to play everything from the start. It takes too long, it's too fat and not in a good way. It takes a week to play it truly and read all dialogues. Nobody has the time for that. The decision to not break it down into some kind of episodes is so painfully stupid because the game already has very distinct internal "routes" but they feel extremely disjointed. If you play all the routes at once you are overloaded with events and yet you get the distinct impression that nothing you do on one route has any significant impact on another, as you would expect. Instead you get events happening in mechanical succession because of how you play but the events are on distinct routes so they appear incoherent.

The argument put forward by DC for not going episodic is laughably stupid. What he claimed was he wants to be able to keep adjusting inter-routes dependencies so that as new routes are added/changed, the other routes can also be adjusted accordingly. Well, that's top shelf stupid, isn't it? Because it sure as hell hasn't happened in practice. Every time completely new routes have been added there haven't been any significant changes on existing routes. Even with this latest adventure of upgrading the main story in 0.20.x, what was the impact on teacher's route, Roxxy route, Aqua, etc.? ZERO.

And what was the cost? Broken resume-saves and a disjointed game world that breaks the suspension of disbelief with a LOT happening simultaneously and yet each route happens within its own invisible bubble with no believable interference with another route.

That is what I mean by bad artistic project management. DC doesn't care about riding us along through a good story with many story lines. He just wants to jerk off for $65k/month by retouching the same shit again and again for however long the $ pours in. That is so shitty for him to do because it means we can't expect the story will be great at some point. Nobody ever stumbled into a great story by just rehashing the same shit aimlessly.

Finally, the bending for Patreon. That had very bad consequences. So much potential for perversity has been lost. How can Harold not fuck Mia? How can you pop in and not find Grace blowing her sister? How come you can't pop by Roxxy's trailer and find her fisting her mother's ass? FOR FUCK'S SAKE. The lack of these perversities is outrageous! Nobody can tell me mom shouldn't punish Jenny with some BDSM. In return, MC should tie & blindfold mom promising her some dicking only to have sis sliently snoop in to fuck her ass with a dildo in revenge. You know what I want? I want one day to look through the telescope and see Erik bent over by his mom and as she's fisting him she finds a ring he pushed up there to propose to her. That is just how things should be in a properly perverted SS world!

Instead, DC chose to bend over for Patreon and now we have a few perversions but mostly a mountain of vanilla porn.

In conclusion, everyone should just think and realise that as long as those $65k/month keep pouring in, there is literally nothing they can do except harm themselves by bitching about it.

Also, DC is a $ whore who draws well and is lucky. I can't hold my breath for him seeing the right path with a switch to episodic content where he doesn't revisit what was already shipped.

The solution for me was to switch to playing SS once per year but even that is too often. I'll try using the resume-saves they provide with new releases but I don't think that will work well. There's just too much effort needed to create those saves so that they match the end of the previous release so I have no confidence they'll make them properly.

Oh well. It is what it is. Let's all accept and work around it or just carry on.

You say you know alot about the development but cleary from your post u know nothing about it and how things work, next time do your homework.

Never seen such a huge bitching text before this one deserves an award.

 

[srksrk 68]

I wasn't gonna respond further, nor do I plan to after this, but since two of you seemingly made the same mistake in quick succession I will explain. The word critic is not synonymous with the word criticism. Critics refers to people. Criticism refers to their complaint. That they are all coming to you with the same criticism is to be expected, that pattern is how one would know there may be an issue. It would be more unusual and far less meaningful if every critic came with an entirely different complaint.

And I could be wrong on this as I do not observe this channel as religiously as you two, but by and large the only long time reoccurring critic I've noticed is the pepe guy.

Wow, now I've been promoted to "The Two". What an honor!

 

[asker]

If you pay and talk about milking then you are free to stop pay.If you don't pay and nagging about it just stfu.It is only adult game.

 

[srksrk 68]

I'm gonna pile up my opinion about SS because why the hell not, you all have nothing better to read anyway.

I've been keeping in touch[ish] with this game for 3+ years now so I know plenty about its evolution.

From the get go I'll say the TL;DR: I love the artwork and some of the perversity. I hate how badly the project is managed, how it strings people along and how DC bent over for Patreon's Mind Police sinking the game into vanilla porn instead of creating a legendary porn town where most have a dirty incesty secret at home.

Now I'll explain each point.

I think everyone agrees with the good so there's no point going over it. Artwork is good. Perversity is sometimes good. That annoying sister is such a good hate fuck. Mom and aunt excellent whores. The lactating aunt, mmm yummy. The milk factory idea, fantastic! Preggers everywhere, fuck yeah! Shemales, uuuuuu nasty! Erik fucking his mom, mmmmmm mmm!

The bad however, oh THE bad!

First of all, many of you need to educate yourselves about philosophy of art in order to avoid stupid flame wars. All these "You didn't pay so don't complain!", "He don't owe you notin'!", etc. are arguments that have been settled centuries if not millennia ago because they apply to all artwork.

Once a work of art leaves its creator's arms and is exposed to the public, said piece no longer belongs to the creator but to everyone who has experienced it. In our material societies the physical piece does belong to someone and, unfortunately, the rights to create copies and derivatives also belong to someone but the spirit of what I said still remains. Everyone who has been touched by a work of art is the owner of said piece because it has left a deep impression in their brain and so has a right to critique or otherwise express an opinion.

This is why it doesn't matter at all if you paid money or not for this game. As long as you experienced it you have the right to express an opinion and, very importantly, you have the right to an opinion about its continuation and the path it takes into the future.

People are rightfully feeling betrayed when their work of art is undermined by its creator or mutilated. OF FUCKING COURSE! This was settled LONG LONG ago. Educated yourselves and you will avoid pointless squabbling. I certainly wasn't born knowing these things or figuring them out by myself, that's for sure.

Now, returning to a more succinct pointing out of the bad parts in SS.

DC is stringing people along. Or to put it another way, he has found a comfortable position where he gets $65k/month delivering at a leisurely pace and he's enjoying it a little too much. Frankly, I don't consider it immoral and I think every single one of you motherfuckers would do the exact same thing. Are you going to be the one who risks changing things and breaking that steady income stream? I think not. He's not forcing people to contribute, they just do. It is what it is.

On the other hand, everyone is free to whine. Go ahead. It won't change shit. Maybe there should be a dedicated thread just for these whines.

But then, the project is managed so SO badly. I don't mean just in terms of schedule (he suggested 0.20.x would take 6-8 months and instead it will take over a year). I mean artistically. I now play this game once per year and even that is too often if I want to play everything from the start. It takes too long, it's too fat and not in a good way. It takes a week to play it truly and read all dialogues. Nobody has the time for that. The decision to not break it down into some kind of episodes is so painfully stupid because the game already has very distinct internal "routes" but they feel extremely disjointed. If you play all the routes at once you are overloaded with events and yet you get the distinct impression that nothing you do on one route has any significant impact on another, as you would expect. Instead you get events happening in mechanical succession because of how you play but the events are on distinct routes so they appear incoherent.

The argument put forward by DC for not going episodic is laughably stupid. What he claimed was he wants to be able to keep adjusting inter-routes dependencies so that as new routes are added/changed, the other routes can also be adjusted accordingly. Well, that's top shelf stupid, isn't it? Because it sure as hell hasn't happened in practice. Every time completely new routes have been added there haven't been any significant changes on existing routes. Even with this latest adventure of upgrading the main story in 0.20.x, what was the impact on teacher's route, Roxxy route, Aqua, etc.? ZERO.

And what was the cost? Broken resume-saves and a disjointed game world that breaks the suspension of disbelief with a LOT happening simultaneously and yet each route happens within its own invisible bubble with no believable interference with another route.

That is what I mean by bad artistic project management. DC doesn't care about riding us along through a good story with many story lines. He just wants to jerk off for $65k/month by retouching the same shit again and again for however long the $ pours in. That is so shitty for him to do because it means we can't expect the story will be great at some point. Nobody ever stumbled into a great story by just rehashing the same shit aimlessly.

Finally, the bending for Patreon. That had very bad consequences. So much potential for perversity has been lost. How can Harold not fuck Mia? How can you pop in and not find Grace blowing her sister? How come you can't pop by Roxxy's trailer and find her fisting her mother's ass? FOR FUCK'S SAKE. The lack of these perversities is outrageous! Nobody can tell me mom shouldn't punish Jenny with some BDSM. In return, MC should tie & blindfold mom promising her some dicking only to have sis sliently snoop in to fuck her ass with a dildo in revenge. You know what I want? I want one day to look through the telescope and see Erik bent over by his mom and as she's fisting him she finds a ring he pushed up there to propose to her. That is just how things should be in a properly perverted SS world!

Instead, DC chose to bend over for Patreon and now we have a few perversions but mostly a mountain of vanilla porn.

In conclusion, everyone should just think and realise that as long as those $65k/month keep pouring in, there is literally nothing they can do except harm themselves by bitching about it.

Also, DC is a $ whore who draws well and is lucky. I can't hold my breath for him seeing the right path with a switch to episodic content where he doesn't revisit what was already shipped.

The solution for me was to switch to playing SS once per year but even that is too often. I'll try using the resume-saves they provide with new releases but I don't think that will work well. There's just too much effort needed to create those saves so that they match the end of the previous release so I have no confidence they'll make them properly.

Oh well. It is what it is. Let's all accept and work around it or just carry on.

Well, at least one can say that this is not a "DC is milking everybody"-only post. It actually contains some valid points.

However, the sad thing is that you apparently do not have the slightest idea about the interna of this game, yet you go on and boldly call everybody who has an other opinion than yourself "stupid" -- most of all DC, no less than four times in your post. I know, in relation to overall word count, that's not too much, but this does not make it better.

A post of somebody who thinks everybody else stupid normally does not deserve an answer, but I will give one anyway (because it is not a DC-milks-only post).

If you look into the coding, you will notice that there is an enormous improvement of game mechanics, starting after the Erik update. Most importantly, they introduced state machines and later layered images. Without those, the game as it is now would never have been possible. I've looked into the sources of some Ren'py games, and this is one of some really clever people.

State machines make it possible to create independent stories, enabling an open-world-like free gaming experience. This is the direct opposite of your postulated episodes approach, and exactly what makes Summertime Saga special.

Layered images greatly simplify art development and re-use, at the same time reducing the required space. If they still would draw dedicated images for each pose, the game would most likely be over 2 GB in size already. The other genious thing with layered images is that they provide an easy way to automate things which would otherwise have to be coded by hand, speeding up such things drastically.

The development of all this did certainly not come for free, and slowed down things in the beginning. But later development will benefit from it. I am sure that Jenny, Eve, Consuela and Maria would not have gotten so much content without it.

Of course that's only my opinion, but I have some insight into that game. I certainly did benefit from those implementation decisions in the past when developing the mod.

The other thing is the, in my opinion, phantastic story writing (there are exceptions and not everything has the same level of quality, but I do know only a small handful of games that can compare to that).

You claim there is no real inter-story dependency. This is, as DC explained several times, to be dealt with once the game is in a more finished state. I cannot see what should be "stupid" with that wise decision. Stupid would be to change story dependencies with each new release, when it is to be expected that new stories will influence everything else. Better do this at the end, and for good.

 

[Omnikuken]

^ Are you saying you actually took time to read that monstrous novel ? Gotta debate if crazy or you had a few hours to burn

If you pay and talk about milking then you are free to stop pay.If you don't pay and nagging about it just stfu.It is only adult game.

You (not quoted, used as neutral) gotta be pretty dumb to keep paying something and come around threads to whine about it

 

[srksrk 68]

^ Are you saying you actually took time to read that monstrous novel ? Gotta debate if crazy or you had a few hours to burn

I flew accross it. Some things I would not comment, e.g. the section starting with "Finally, the bending for Patreon" because I will not lower myself to that level. I am confident DC won't as well.

Also, I hope my post contains some value not only as a response to that one.

 

[TheFapperBoy]

I'm gonna pile up my opinion about SS because why the hell not, you all have nothing better to read anyway.

I've been keeping in touch[ish] with this game for 3+ years now so I know plenty about its evolution.

From the get go I'll say the TL;DR: I love the artwork and some of the perversity. I hate how badly the project is managed, how it strings people along and how DC bent over for Patreon's Mind Police sinking the game into vanilla porn instead of creating a legendary porn town where most have a dirty incesty secret at home.

Now I'll explain each point.

I think everyone agrees with the good so there's no point going over it. Artwork is good. Perversity is sometimes good. That annoying sister is such a good hate fuck. Mom and aunt excellent whores. The lactating aunt, mmm yummy. The milk factory idea, fantastic! Preggers everywhere, fuck yeah! Shemales, uuuuuu nasty! Erik fucking his mom, mmmmmm mmm!

The bad however, oh THE bad!

First of all, many of you need to educate yourselves about philosophy of art in order to avoid stupid flame wars. All these "You didn't pay so don't complain!", "He don't owe you notin'!", etc. are arguments that have been settled centuries if not millennia ago because they apply to all artwork.

Once a work of art leaves its creator's arms and is exposed to the public, said piece no longer belongs to the creator but to everyone who has experienced it. In our material societies the physical piece does belong to someone and, unfortunately, the rights to create copies and derivatives also belong to someone but the spirit of what I said still remains. Everyone who has been touched by a work of art is the owner of said piece because it has left a deep impression in their brain and so has a right to critique or otherwise express an opinion.

This is why it doesn't matter at all if you paid money or not for this game. As long as you experienced it you have the right to express an opinion and, very importantly, you have the right to an opinion about its continuation and the path it takes into the future.

People are rightfully feeling betrayed when their work of art is undermined by its creator or mutilated. OF FUCKING COURSE! This was settled LONG LONG ago. Educated yourselves and you will avoid pointless squabbling. I certainly wasn't born knowing these things or figuring them out by myself, that's for sure.

Now, returning to a more succinct pointing out of the bad parts in SS.

DC is stringing people along. Or to put it another way, he has found a comfortable position where he gets $65k/month delivering at a leisurely pace and he's enjoying it a little too much. Frankly, I don't consider it immoral and I think every single one of you motherfuckers would do the exact same thing. Are you going to be the one who risks changing things and breaking that steady income stream? I think not. He's not forcing people to contribute, they just do. It is what it is.

On the other hand, everyone is free to whine. Go ahead. It won't change shit. Maybe there should be a dedicated thread just for these whines.

But then, the project is managed so SO badly. I don't mean just in terms of schedule (he suggested 0.20.x would take 6-8 months and instead it will take over a year). I mean artistically. I now play this game once per year and even that is too often if I want to play everything from the start. It takes too long, it's too fat and not in a good way. It takes a week to play it truly and read all dialogues. Nobody has the time for that. The decision to not break it down into some kind of episodes is so painfully stupid because the game already has very distinct internal "routes" but they feel extremely disjointed. If you play all the routes at once you are overloaded with events and yet you get the distinct impression that nothing you do on one route has any significant impact on another, as you would expect. Instead you get events happening in mechanical succession because of how you play but the events are on distinct routes so they appear incoherent.

The argument put forward by DC for not going episodic is laughably stupid. What he claimed was he wants to be able to keep adjusting inter-routes dependencies so that as new routes are added/changed, the other routes can also be adjusted accordingly. Well, that's top shelf stupid, isn't it? Because it sure as hell hasn't happened in practice. Every time completely new routes have been added there haven't been any significant changes on existing routes. Even with this latest adventure of upgrading the main story in 0.20.x, what was the impact on teacher's route, Roxxy route, Aqua, etc.? ZERO.

And what was the cost? Broken resume-saves and a disjointed game world that breaks the suspension of disbelief with a LOT happening simultaneously and yet each route happens within its own invisible bubble with no believable interference with another route.

That is what I mean by bad artistic project management. DC doesn't care about riding us along through a good story with many story lines. He just wants to jerk off for $65k/month by retouching the same shit again and again for however long the $ pours in. That is so shitty for him to do because it means we can't expect the story will be great at some point. Nobody ever stumbled into a great story by just rehashing the same shit aimlessly.

Finally, the bending for Patreon. That had very bad consequences. So much potential for perversity has been lost. How can Harold not fuck Mia? How can you pop in and not find Grace blowing her sister? How come you can't pop by Roxxy's trailer and find her fisting her mother's ass? FOR FUCK'S SAKE. The lack of these perversities is outrageous! Nobody can tell me mom shouldn't punish Jenny with some BDSM. In return, MC should tie & blindfold mom promising her some dicking only to have sis sliently snoop in to fuck her ass with a dildo in revenge. You know what I want? I want one day to look through the telescope and see Erik bent over by his mom and as she's fisting him she finds a ring he pushed up there to propose to her. That is just how things should be in a properly perverted SS world!

Instead, DC chose to bend over for Patreon and now we have a few perversions but mostly a mountain of vanilla porn.

In conclusion, everyone should just think and realise that as long as those $65k/month keep pouring in, there is literally nothing they can do except harm themselves by bitching about it.

Also, DC is a $ whore who draws well and is lucky. I can't hold my breath for him seeing the right path with a switch to episodic content where he doesn't revisit what was already shipped.

The solution for me was to switch to playing SS once per year but even that is too often. I'll try using the resume-saves they provide with new releases but I don't think that will work well. There's just too much effort needed to create those saves so that they match the end of the previous release so I have no confidence they'll make them properly.

Oh well. It is what it is. Let's all accept and work around it or just carry on.

 

[manneychin]

srksrk 68 I respect your work. I recommend you respect the value of written words as they are. I don't call "everyone" stupid, not even DC. I call arguments stupid and I call DC's decisions stupid and for the latter I do so 3 times, not 4 but this is less important. The distinction between calling an argument/decision or a person stupid is quite gigantic. Even geniuses can do stupid things and DC is no genius.

I am also not critiquing the code. I haven't looked at the code and have absolutely no need to do so in order to rightfully qualify the result. If you think software customers are happy or mad based on how nice the code is written then you're in for some major shocks in case you work in software development.

I already explained why keeping the routes disjointed for 8 years is not a valid argument. The true interpretation of this move is that he's just making it up as he goes along with his only commitment being not to the artistic vision of an epic story but to recurring $. To me at least, he already proved that $ comes first and foremost when he bent for Patreon with remarkable ease, chopping away the core incest premise of his game in 2018 like it was nothing and no artistic vision was perturbed. It just showed he went with incest when he launched this game because he saw there were many incest titles and he thought that'll sell. It certainly wasn't because he had the vision of a story with incest at its core because then he would've fought like many other successfully did despite making way less $ than DC.

When I smell the stench of a franchise that puts out content with the sole purpose of selling popcorn now and leaving room for the next instalment, I don't call that artwork. That's just something you feed to "consumers".

 

[KURO_NEKO_SAM]

 

[manneychin]

So ? Remove wincest and stay on Patreon to actually make the game or drop Patreon for wincest and the game is dead ? Mad logic there. And no, he's not going to Subscribe star anytime soon nor was it an option 3 years ago when Patreon went fulltard

Is there any explanation in your mind for how come DC failed to support his alleged artistic integrity of having incest at the centre of his game and yet the very successful games below managed to do it spectacularly well? Mind you I chose a selection of heavy hitters just so there's no discussion about them flying under the radar.

Why do you think DC was the only one that slavishly bent for Patreon?

• Dark Neighborhood [Psycho Delusional]
• Dreams of Desire [Lewdlab]
• Insexual Awakening [Sex Curse Studio]
• Lust Epidemic [NLT Media]
• Man of the House [Faerin]
• My Summer with Mom and Sis [NLT Media]
• Sisterly Lust [Perverteer]
• Tangled Up [SerialNumberComics]
• Timestamps, Unconditional Love [Motkeyz]
• Dating My Daughter [MrDots Games]
• My Legacy [saddoggames]
• Daughter for Dessert [Palmer]
• Main Seduction [Tremmi]
• My Girlfriend's Amnesia [Daniels K]
• Sister, Sister, Sister [Virtual Indecency]
• The Twist [KsT]
• Light of my Life [NaughtyRoad]
• Parental Love [Luxee]

 

[srksrk 68]

Is there any explanation in your mind for how come DC failed to support his alleged artistic integrity of having incest at the centre of his game and yet the very successful games below managed to do it spectacularly well? Mind you I chose a selection of heavy hitters just so there's no discussion about them flying under the radar.

Why do you think DC was the only one that slavishly bent for Patreon?

• Dark Neighborhood [Psycho Delusional]
• Dreams of Desire [Lewdlab]
• Insexual Awakening [Sex Curse Studio]
• Lust Epidemic [NLT Media]
• Man of the House [Faerin]
• My Summer with Mom and Sis [NLT Media]
• Sisterly Lust [Perverteer]
• Tangled Up [SerialNumberComics]
• Timestamps, Unconditional Love [Motkeyz]
• Dating My Daughter [MrDots Games]
• My Legacy [saddoggames]
• Daughter for Dessert [Palmer]
• Main Seduction [Tremmi]
• My Girlfriend's Amnesia [Daniels K]
• Sister, Sister, Sister [Virtual Indecency]
• The Twist [KsT]
• Light of my Life [NaughtyRoad]
• Parental Love [Luxee]

Ask Patreon that question. Include your list if you want those games shut down.

 

[Omnikuken]

You'd think the #1 pron game and top 5 overall for ~3 years to be a little more wary of Patreon's no wincest bots than a bunch of no-names/wannabes. And it got reported back in 2017 when the wincest ban happened. He had to remove it or the page was dead. Whatever you wetdream about him bending backwards, he removes it or the game is gone since 3 years ago

Also, wincest mods not provided by devs is considered outside of Patreon's rules. If the dev promotes it/makes it himself, he'd better be prepared to get butthurt by the thotpatrol and probably lose his page

 

[manneychin]

Ask Patreon that question. Include your list if you want those games shut down.

I hope you realise you reached the end of your answers. If you think Patreon doesn't know about those devs then you are simply lying to yourself. That is an incomplete list of heavy hitters totalling 30k+ patreons (with just NLT having ~10k) while SS has 24k.

You'd think the #1 pron game and top 5 overall for ~3 years to be a little more wary of Patreon's no wincest bots than a bunch of no-names/wannabes. And it got reported back in 2017 when the wincest ban happened. He had to remove it or the page was dead. Whatever you wetdream about him bending backwards, he removes it or the game is gone since 3 years ago

Also, wincest mods not provided by devs is considered outside of Patreon's rules. If the dev promotes it/makes it himself, he'd better be prepared to get butthurt by the thotpatrol and probably lose his page

Those "no-names/wannabes" I listed: 30233 patreons. SS: 24410 patreons. As I said, heavy hitters and yet they all managed to keep their integrity. DC bent over faster than any slut he drew so far. He just inhaled Patreon's cock.

Also, calling those developers "no-names/wannabes" means we talked more than enough so I'm stopping here.

 

[Omnikuken]

^ Lol, 17 dudes (2 on the list is the same dev) manage 30k patrons, DC has 24k alone. Gets even better after you pointed out NLT gets 10k alone, which leaves 16 dudes with 20k or barely 1200 each. Most of the games you listed have a patch (11/18), none of which can be official/dev made. Guess what game also has a patch to enable wincest ? Summertime. So your point is pretty moot. On top of any of them not being near the top of Patreon charts, they're "wannabes" until proven otherwise.

 

[Scapest]

Guys DC knows about the incest patch, he knows about f95zone, he started here 4 years ago, he just say things like he has no idea about a incest patch, cause he doesn't want to loose his patreon account, it's simple, there's no drama at all, when he changed the game to no incest, he said that one day he would do the game the right way, but with the patch he doesn't need to worry about that, his crew will never say anything cause they don't want to loose their jobs, period.

 

[j4yj4m]

Yes, well if you haven't heard about it then so what? I did heard about it back in '17 when DC bothered to give some incoherent answers to people complaining about save compatibility.

Is there some definitive AMA or FAQ where DC explains why he does what he does? No? Then we'll just have to live "hearing" different things.

Right, DC certainly changes his plans here and there, but it's really up to you whether you want to base your opinion on things he said years ago when the game was still basically in its infancy or whether you want to base it on what he says for years now.

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Well, you just seemed pretty passionate about these things and I think managing one's own expectations is important to not end up disappointed. If you want sushi you wouldn't go to an italian family restaurant, right? The same is true here. If you want really 100% coherent game plot which includes absolutely everybody and every plot as well as fetishes like the one you mentioned, SS just won't make you happy, because none of that was/is on the menu.

 

[j4yj4m]

It just showed he went with incest when he launched this game because he saw there were many incest titles and he thought that'll sell. It certainly wasn't because he had the vision of a story with incest at its core because then he would've fought like many other successfully did despite making way less $ than DC.

Wasn't that pretty much clear from the start? The game was always intended to be a school girl dating sim/VN and the incest was in there because MC obviously has a family, because it made sense and because it's a popular fetish. The fact that the game didn't lose support back then shows that it wasn't the wrong decision.

And I don't think anybody ever claimed that DC had a detailed plot/vision for the game drawn out and started working on it. The whole thing started as a coding exercise for himself without any further purpose or perspective at all and only then became what it is when he added several characters. Of course he always had a general plan for everybody, but the incest was never as central as it would have been for games like for example DMD, which simply do not work at all without incest. Sure, it takes away a few % from Jenny, Debbie and Diane, but their plots and characters work almost as good now as they did before. Last but not least they can (and hopefully will) easily be changed back once the game is removed from patreon for good.

 

[PriyaKarn]

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