Ren'Py Summertime Saga [v21.0.0 wip.5091] [Kompas Productions]

[Count Morado]

yes dude but still you make 60k a month, you owe your patreons that you will retire as a millionaire in a couple years so don't you think you have some responsibility to do everything you can to do right by them and not let them wait for 5 years for a fucking tech update?

You keep saying this. He owes his patreons what he promises in his tier benefits for them... And he fulfills those promises, monthly. Any game update and release are not part of the benefits for his subscribers. I don't think you seem to get this.

The contract he has with his patreons are the tier benefits as his only obligation in exchange for the compensation. If anyone thinks differently - they are wrong. They are incorrect. They are mistaken. And anyone who continues to argue that the game is an obligation after being reminded dozens, hundreds of times is the fool they are taken for.

I am still curious of the folks that signed up and just forgot.

Yes, there are probably a decent number of people who subscribed and forgot. For those people who do not miss that $1 or whatever each month tells you more about their financial situation than anything else. The monthly fee they pay is so small compared to their personal income and wealth that it doesn't matter to them. Why should it matter to anyone who is not them?

Now, for the people who sign up for the service you mention - they realize they are spending money they may or may not desire to and after receiving the report from that service, make informed decisions about continuing. Again, why should it matter to anyone who is not them?

Stop milking people with this line "Omg I have to work two jobs thats why I don't get enough time to finish update on time, if you support me on patreon, i will be able to hire another artist so we can update the game faster" LMFAO.

I think you are in the wrong thread. This is the developer's full time job. He has a staff of about 10, including himself, who fill the roles of artist, writer, coder, image posers, and more which he pays a salary to.

Also, for other games, I think you forget that yes - this is a side gig at best and for many simply a hobby. If you want them to work more hours on a game they are developing, it means people will need to subscribe so that they can quit one of their jobs (or reduce their hours) in order to devote more time. There are only 24 hours in a day and 7 days in a week. Again, though, we are taking these games for free - whether the developer intends that to happen or not - us bitching about what they do to attempt to earn some money is not our business... and is off-topic for game threads per the site rules.

 

[otranu]

i don't know, it's not me who makes 60k a month and is given 2 years to find a solution. first thing i'd do is probably get the whole team together and make a real calculation (based on math, not whatever he used to come up with the old estimation of 3 months) of how long the tech update with the current speed of things is going to take and if it turns out that it will probably take a couple more years i'd be honest with my patreons and tell them that. there must be a way to do a rough estimation on how much longer it will take. i would also do anything that i could to find better/more coders, sure at the beginning it might slow things down if you got 2-3 coders working at the same time because the lead coder has to explain to the other ones what they have to do. that's the thing though he had 2 years until now to train some new coders and to do all of that and wasn't his sole coder only employed part time until very recently?

Estimation:

He never made an estimation of 3 months, i think the lowest was like 9, which, still, is a lot less. This is, for me, the biggest mistake he made i think the estimation was rushed and he did not think true when presenting it to the patrons, and that is failing in communication.

Having said that, estimations are tricky, for not saying imposible for this kind of tasks. So I think there are two options: try to do even more planning and distract the team (delaying even more the update) to do a new estimation that probably, almost defenetly, will be false, OR try to communicate the velocity of the projects and what tasks are being done so you can be transparent with the people who pays.

Now, if next year with a functioning base system, adapted to new techonologies and a solid team , they say that the Rhonda update will be 5 months and it ends up taking 10, well , they really suck at this.

Coders:

You can not have what you want with 60k. Actually He has at least 7 people on the team and i have no idea how he could manage that if some of them were not part-timers. Also taxes, patron share, and expenses.

2-3 senior programers who are willing to participate in a porn game are hard to find and REALLY EXPENSIVE. 2-3 juniors dont take desiciones , so now he needs someone to formulate and explain tasks, also expensive. This at the start would be a suicide specially because, as i said , the scope was bad and i dont think they knew what they really want, And now, as you said , would slow down the progress, which has been steady for some months, so it would be a high risk.

lastly i would stop wasting my time drawing more school desks or other shit nobody cares about and work on lots more h-scenes so i can inlude them with the tech update so that the fans don't have to be satisfied with 16:9 resolution, some new empty locations and nothing else after years of waiting.

seriously i was looking at his latest picarto stream checking if it really was true that he was drawing more bullshit and it's true. he's obviously struggling to find stuff to draw so that must mean he has already finished converting all the backgrounds to the new resolution and finished drawing all the ronda, annie and judith art assets right? (lol)

Only work on more scenes for the tech update:

I mean... do you want them to take longer or... ?

Priorities:

Again ...I mean... I do want him to draw school desk and other shit? Part of the quality of this game is how detailed it is. I like to enter to eve apartment and find lot of details, you might want another game but i dont think patrons want that.

Now , this is the thing for me that is really hard to understand: The bottleneck is the code, so why are people so fixated that DC changes what is he doing to speed up the development.

 

[Deleted member 6297007]

This 'tech update' is certainly a bone of contention. Arguments for and against the developer and the development structure are valid and I can sympathise from both perspectives. However, constant bickering solves nothing and gets us nowhere. Either support DarkCookie or don't...the tech update will be done when it's done...hopefully before I die!!!

 

[exsomon]

so developer tried to upgrade engine used for some reason,
fucked something up, could not find the reason which might be trevial as a missing semicolon
ther started from scratch
it is better to abandon this one and start another
takes less time

 

[Senigata]

true but what i wonder is, do these people who are still supporting STS financially realize that they are actually harming the game development by doing that.

I doubt most of them actually notice supporting him on their bank account amongst all the other bills they pay each month.

lastly i would stop wasting my time drawing more school desks or other shit nobody cares about and work on lots more h-scenes so i can inlude them with the tech update so that the fans don't have to be satisfied with 16:9 resolution, some new empty locations and nothing else after years of waiting.

Then make your own goddamn game. At least you'd be doing something of value that benefits this place instead of wasting everyone's time.

 

[teraptuss]

Yes, there are probably a decent number of people who subscribed and forgot. For those people who do not miss that $1 or whatever each month tells you more about their financial situation than anything else. The monthly fee they pay is so small compared to their personal income and wealth that it doesn't matter to them. Why should it matter to anyone who is not them?

Now, for the people who sign up for the service you mention - they realize they are spending money they may or may not desire to and after receiving the report from that service, make informed decisions about continuing. Again, why should it matter to anyone who is not them?

Dude I don't know what your deal is and why you get so condescending and sanctimonious. Even if you claim you are not trying to be, your tone comes off as so.

Crap load of the people in this thread complain about the dude milking or not hiring enough folks or why he makes too much money. The other half piss and moan that those folks are in here and not people just trying to have a discussion about what ever they deem germane to this thread.

Yet when folks try to ask something out of curiosity, people like you shit all over them. I was legit interested, not trying to insinuate what why how people spend their money.

Reading a handful of the posts, its almost like you enjoy the folks complaining just so you can get those hits of dopamine trying to be the smartest self righteous twat in the room.

 

[Senigata]

Since it apparently bears reminding

 

[Count Morado]

I was legit interested, not trying to insinuate what why how people spend their money.

This reads like someone insinuating something (emphasis added)--

who actually forgets they have a subscription. A LOT is the answer. My mind was blown on just how many folks had subs to Netflix or apple TV and just forgot, let alone small amounts that most of Dc's tiers are on Patreon are set at. Patreon is actually one of the large "offender" our subsidiary scrubs out for clients....

Dunno if its related...but seems like good business practices for DC or other creators to have low tiers since folks are more likely to forget about a $1 here $5 there a month. I am not a supporter or hater of DC either way ...just curios of how many of his Patreon's are long forgotten pay zombies

I hope you can see how a reader might take this as such - a backwards way to complain about "pay zombies" and stating it is "good business practices" for creators to have low tiers specifically for people to forget, with Patreon a "large 'offender'".

I apologize I misread your intent. Thank you for clarifying.

Since it apparently bears reminding
View attachment 2947233

Thanks, though as we've seen... LUL

 

[sucklepuck]

The only milkers I care about are Diane's tbh.

 

[McSlut]

Estimation:

He never made an estimation of 3 months, i think the lowest was like 9, which, still, is a lot less. This is, for me, the biggest mistake he made i think the estimation was rushed and he did not think true when presenting it to the patrons, and that is failing in communication.

Having said that, estimations are tricky, for not saying imposible for this kind of tasks. So I think there are two options: try to do even more planning and distract the team (delaying even more the update) to do a new estimation that probably, almost defenetly, will be false, OR try to communicate the velocity of the projects and what tasks are being done so you can be transparent with the people who pays.

Now, if next year with a functioning base system, adapted to new techonologies and a solid team , they say that the Rhonda update will be 5 months and it ends up taking 10, well , they really suck at this.

well you are wrong, he made an estimation of 3-4 months and put the whole thing to a vote

https://f95zone.to/threads/summertime-saga-v0-20-16-pre-tech-kompas-productions.276/post-11358944

now how he got to the number is one of the biggest mysteries in summertime saga development. maybe he did just pull it out of his ass or something but the fact that it will not take 3 months but 3 years (by this point a pretty optimistic view) is pretty much proof that he doesn't know what the fuck he is doing and that the whole project is in dire need of some project planning

also getting the team together and finding out what the fuck they are even doing isn't delaying the game. progress came to a crawl anyway, the tracker has been stuck at 82% for months so if they take 2 days to make a real estimation of how much longer the tech update is going to take might slow down development from barely progressing to not progressing at all for 2 days but then he could at least be honest with his patreons so i think it would be worth it

 

[Count Morado]

DC 100% could've paused patreon support tbh like some devs do, but didn't. So "im forcing nobody to support the game" is a redundant argument because there are people who would 100% still support even after a year of no updates and DC knows it.

Your argument falls flat because you're not comparing apples to apples.

Spoiler: Why? Because...

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Goth chick is better than Diane

Here we are in agreement.

 

[Count Morado]

now how he got to the number is one of the biggest mysteries in summertime saga development... he doesn't know what the fuck he is doing

Perhaps you should take a page from this guy's book:

frankly i also have no idea how much work goes into such a project, but i think there is a reason why DC makes 50k and others on patreon don't. if it was so easy to make a game like SS we would have seen dozens of games with the same kind of quality on patreon but we don't.

complainers are sort of shitting up the thread. this thread is far better and enjoyable to read if people post their wishes regarding the games content or discuss their favourite characters. posting the same complains over and over and over and over again gets on everyones nerves especially when the far more effective method of protesting would be to just pull your donation to DC and be done with it. if you are not satisfied with the product pull your pledge and come back in two years or so when enough content has be added to your liking. the sad thing is most people who cry about DC are not even patreons.

 

[Senigata]

well you are wrong, he made an estimation of 3-4 months and put the whole thing to a vote

https://f95zone.to/threads/summertime-saga-v0-20-16-pre-tech-kompas-productions.276/post-11358944

now how he got to the number is one of the biggest mysteries in summertime saga development. maybe he did just pull it out of his ass or something but the fact that it will not take 3 months but 3 years (by this point a pretty optimistic view) is pretty much proof that he doesn't know what the fuck he is doing and that the whole project is in dire need of some project planning

also getting the team together and finding out what the fuck they are even doing isn't delaying the game. progress came to a crawl anyway, the tracker has been stuck at 82% for months so if they take 2 days to make a real estimation of how much longer the tech update is going to take might slow down development from barely progressing to not progressing at all for 2 days but then he could at least be honest with his patreons so i think it would be worth it

Do it then. Stop complaining and try to be the change you want to see since, apparently, you know much better how to handle it. So, go on. Stop talking some hot air for a change and go to DC.

 

[McSlut]

Do it then. Stop complaining and try to be the change you want to see since, apparently, you know much better how to handle it. So, go on. Stop talking some hot air for a change and go to DC.

i can't "go" to dc since you just get dogpiled by his crazy fans and then banned on his discord for questioning his working methods. he also said on stream that he doesn't care what people say and that he wants to keep things doing the way he wants to. that's why i said the only way to make him change is mind if his financial support keeps dropping significantly

 

[DeepSpace_Potato]

i can't "go" to dc since you just get dogpiled by his crazy fans and then banned on his discord for questioning his working methods. he also said on stream that he doesn't care what people say and that he wants to keep things doing the way he wants to. that's why i said the only way to make him change is mind if his financial support keeps dropping significantly

The interesting part regards his patreons is the total count. It usually drops to 50k and after 1-2 week/s, so I noticed 2 times, gets 6-7k back. No idea how considering he doesn't release a single valuable thing, but if it keeps like that, then nothing will change as it's the perfect formula with little or 0 effort. I suppose people supporting him since 2016-2017 are scared of him deciding to abandon the project if the money drops under a certain level.
The turning point will be the release of this famous tech update and if it'll really speed up things after that(I doubt it).

 

[Count Morado]

The interesting part regards his patreons is the total count. It usually drops to 50k and after 1-2 week/s, so I noticed 2 times, gets 6-7k back. No idea how considering he doesn't release a single valuable thing, but if it keeps like that, then nothing will change as it's the perfect formula with little or 0 effort. I suppose people supporting him since 2016-2017 are scared of him deciding to abandon the project if the money drops under a certain level.

This is typical of all creators, but more noticeable in the trends after they hit a certain level of support because of the sheer numbers of subscribers. It has nothing to do with people abandoning and returning or large numbers of new subscribers.

It's people who either don't have enough credit available on their credit cards or don't have enough funds on their debit card or other similar problem that cause a "soft-decline":

“Patreon retries soft-decline (transactions that don’t go through because of a temporary issue, like insufficient funds) several times during the month. So if a payment declines on the 1st, we have more opportunities to get those funds back.” — Maritza Dominguez, Patreon’s Payment & Risk Operations Manager.​

That's why you see those dips that rebuild - it's successful transactions on retries after the first soft-decline.

The turning point will be the release of this famous tech update and if it'll really speed up things after that(I doubt it).

There will be a HUGE uptick in subscribers the month(s) after the tech update. Also, the tech update won't speed things up. People should expect the updates to be similar as before - about every 3-4 months on average. Some quicker, some longer. The "speed up" may only be internally while they code/implement/etc - but don't expect the public to see any change.

 

[itsyeboii]

The only milkers I care about are Diane's tbh.

View attachment 2947596

Man I really hope Diane gets more content, preferably with Debbie in the farm, you know to maximize production

 

[Count Morado]

when it comes to their masturbation material some people just stop using their brains

Irony

 

[Senigata]

i can't "go" to dc since you just get dogpiled by his crazy fans and then banned on his discord for questioning his working methods. he also said on stream that he doesn't care what people say and that he wants to keep things doing the way he wants to. that's why i said the only way to make him change is mind if his financial support keeps dropping significantly

So you are just wasting your and our time. Good job.

 

[itsyeboii]

Irony

I was thinking the exact same thing lmao