VN Ren'Py Victoria in Big City [v0.6.5] [Groovers Games]

[wildride69]

Don't READ annoyed rant.

Why? Why? Why?

I have gotten used to people who don't like NTR inevitably downloading the VN/Game and complaining bitterly that the game has NTR. Most will come up with the excuse that they were hoping it was avoidable. Then they go review the game poorly but keep playing the game for years to come.

It amazes me that in a CORRUPTION labeled VN, people do the same and feign ignorance that the game is meant to be corruption based. They tend to make the excuse of White Knighting and wanting to save the heroine, or they wanted corruption but not THAT person corrupting them. Even more so when the person is clearly wanting to see pure lesbianism but get upset they can't avoid all the dicks in a game.

Then you get the people who have been here seemingly from F95's inception, complaining about "O it's Another corruption game and we've seen it all before 2Stars I've seen so many similar games."

Victoria is in a Corruption based game, and you can fully expect to see her be CORRUPTED. Shocking I know!

You are not the Dev and you are not telling Victoria's story so it may not go the way you want the story to go.

If you don't like corruption games may I suggest you EXCLUDE corruption tags.... I exclude gay games and I can assure you the exclude feature works as I have never found myself watching two males go at it. Even if I did, it would be an oops, not for me, delete and move on to the next game.

Not start crying in a review or whining about it in a thread.

Before the last couple of posters think I'm talking about them, I am Not.

 

[Ssato243]

I wanted to play a lesbian route but not

 

[Zara Scarlet]

So this game started out very strong in my opinion, but during the past hour or so of playing there's been nothing but frustration building up in me. I'm going to hide it all behind a big spoiler because this will definitely contain a lot of them...

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If you can't be bothered to read through all of that, I don't blame you. It's a lot, and a decent chunk of it is just me venting. However, if you haven't played this game yet and you don't mind spoilers too much, I really recommend you at least skim through what I wrote here. I can't imagine there aren't a lot of people who feel at least somewhat the same way I do about certain things that happen in this game and to those people, this might serve as a warning.

If you're playing the Bad Girl route, why did you choose David over Michael? He's the bad boy, and by not choosing him, you get David automatically. It's really simple, have sex with Michael during the party, and David doesn't get a look-in. He just becomes a guy she occasionally talks to at work.

Lucas, is all about the cheating. Victoria can't become a cheating whore, with nobody to cheat on. And Lucas is naive and stupid enough, for even a girl like Victoria ( who is hardly devious), to pull the wool over his eyes, with barely any effort. He's the perfect fall guy, who virtually nobody will feel too bad about being betrayed, since it's very difficult to like him. And he pretty much gives her an excuse to begin looking for other options, by kind of splitting up with her intially. Enough so that even Victoria, can begin seriously doubting whether they have a future. And of course, they don't have a future. Because if they did Lucas would feature in the relationship stats as well. The fact that he doesn't, shows that eventually they are going to split up. Once the Dev has had fun, getting Victoria to tease the fuck out of Lucas, and probably starting to enjoy cheating on him ( on the bad girl route at least).

That sex scene at his uncles, was important to demonstrate to Victoria, that Lucas was never very good in the bedroom. Back in her small home town, he felt like a big deal, because he was the son of a well-off local businessman. But in Big City, he's a fish out of water, whilst she's growing in confidence and totally out of his league. That sex scene brought everything into sharp focus for Victoria. Afterwards, she knows that Lucas can't satisfy her, the way other men in her life can. And she realises her feelings for him have changed, and she doesn't really love him anymore. But she feels guilty, because Lucas has given up everything to be with her, just like she asked him to. For a girl like Victoria, it's only right that she gives him a chance, even if she doesn't really want to. We know that ultimately she's probably going to dump him, but at that point she's not sure, and she's worried that Lucas will be so hurt, that he'll do something really stupid. So she makes, what is almost certainly the wrong decision for Lucas and her, but the right decision for the cheating part of the game, and decides to carry on being his girlfriend.

Later, we get the beach scene with Lucas, plus Harry and Miles. And that demonstrates where Lucas really fits in, in this game. With Victoria, teasing and messing around with both guys, right in front of the hapless Lucas, who is too naive and unobservant to realise what's really happening. One assumes this will eventually lead to Victoria having sex with other guys, with Lucas totally oblivious that his girlfriend has become a total slut, and gets off doing it with him in close proximity. So I think that sex scene with Lucas, at his Uncle's apartment, played a very important role, for what was to come.

 

[PedroDeLara]

It's a lot of bullshit man! Lots of good reviews here, well... let's go. I don't consider these GAMES but an animated COMIC, with some points of interaction with the reader/user, creating the idea of him gaining immersion and him "making decisions" for the character, but this is not "open world" it is about history, Porn comic with movement scenes, animation. This is well done, the character is well modeled and the script is being constructed to turn the "country girl" into a "hot slut". There are many fetishes but this DEV explores two recurring ones, interracial BBC and sex between a young girl and an old man, in the comics, DAVAL has caused a lot, provoked his followers a lot, there is a price to pay, but it's worth it. Provocation this is the point, messing with libido and emotions. It creates the environment that the developer wants to watch, heated clashes and emotional discussions.
Follow the game". Let's wait!!!

 

[Maviarab]

If you're playing the Bad Girl route, why did you choose David over Michael? He's the bad boy, and by not choosing him, you get David automatically. It's really simple, have sex with Michael during the party, and David doesn't get a look-in. He just becomes a guy she occasionally talks to at work.

Lucas, is all about the cheating. Victoria can't become a cheating whore, with nobody to cheat on. And Lucas is naive and stupid enough, for even a girl like Victoria ( who is hardly devious), to pull the wool over his eyes, with barely any effort. He's the perfect fall guy, who virtually nobody will feel too bad about being betrayed, since it's very difficult to like him. And he pretty much gives her an excuse to begin looking for other options, by kind of splitting up with her intially. Enough so that even Victoria, can begin seriously doubting whether they have a future. And of course, they don't have a future. Because if they did Lucas would feature in the relationship stats as well. The fact that he doesn't, shows that eventually they are going to split up. Once the Dev has had fun, getting Victoria to tease the fuck out of Lucas, and probably starting to enjoy cheating on him ( on the bad girl route at least).

That sex scene at his uncles, was important to demonstrate to Victoria, that Lucas was never very good in the bedroom. Back in her small home town, he felt like a big deal, because he was the son of a well-off local businessman. But in Big City, he's a fish out of water, whilst she's growing in confidence and totally out of his league. That sex scene brought everything into sharp focus for Victoria. Afterwards, she knows that Lucas can't satisfy her, the way other men in her life can. And she realises her feelings for him have changed, and she doesn't really love him anymore. But she feels guilty, because Lucas has given up everything to be with her, just like she asked him to. For a girl like Victoria, it's only right that she gives him a chance, even if she doesn't really want to. We know that ultimately she's probably going to dump him, but at that point she's not sure, and she's worried that Lucas will be so hurt, that he'll do something really stupid. So she makes, what is almost certainly the wrong decision for Lucas and her, but the right decision for the cheating part of the game, and decides to carry on being his girlfriend.

Later, we get the beach scene with Lucas, plus Harry and Miles. And that demonstrates where Lucas really fits in, in this game. With Victoria, teasing and messing around with both guys, right in front of the hapless Lucas, who is too naive and unobservant to realise what's really happening. One assumes this will eventually lead to Victoria having sex with other guys, with Lucas totally oblivious that his girlfriend has become a total slut, and gets off doing it with him in close proximity. So I think that sex scene with Lucas, at his Uncle's apartment, played a very important role, for what was to come.

While all fair points Zara...it does have issues you cannot just explain away with random theory to fit a narrative. You should be able to ignore both David and Michael. You can't. There is supposed to be a lesbian route...but there isn't, and most of the content on the not lesbian route is gated behind a male route.

I like this, but it does need a serious rewrite and soon....because at the moment, it's all over the place and yes, any type of forced decision taken out of the players hands (when it involves a lewd scene) is never a good idea if the Dev wants to have any long-term future.

That aside, like many a recent VN that has 'certain' content or 'debatable' content, the dev just needs to come out abd be honest about where it is heading and what his vision is. Would save 90% of these conversations straight away.

 

[Ssato243]

WHAT about lesbian route wish for it

 

[Nerra]

There is supposed to be a lesbian route...but there isn't

Where did the dev say that there's ever going to be a pure lesbian route?

 

[Maviarab]

Where did the dev say that there's ever going to be a pure lesbian route?

I don't recall him ever expliciitly saying so...but then there would be no need to be able rack up an impressive amount of 'lesbian points' would there....

 

[Prayforme]

I don't think this game is lesbian-oriented. Not at this stage, anyway. Be patient.

 

[Zara Scarlet]

While all fair points Zara...it does have issues you cannot just explain away with random theory to fit a narrative. You should be able to ignore both David and Michael. You can't. There is supposed to be a lesbian route...but there isn't, and most of the content on the not lesbian route is gated behind a male route.

I like this, but it does need a serious rewrite and soon....because at the moment, it's all over the place and yes, any type of forced decision taken out of the players hands (when it involves a lewd scene) is never a good idea if the Dev wants to have any long-term future.

That aside, like many a recent VN that has 'certain' content or 'debatable' content, the dev just needs to come out abd be honest about where it is heading and what his vision is. Would save 90% of these conversations straight away.

One of the things I don't like about this game, is that the Dev doesn't acknowledge scenes that have already happened, at least on the bad girl route anyway. I just played the scene with Ben, where she sucks his cock, and acts like it's the first big dick she's had in her mouth, when she's already done it several times with Michael, once with Kris, and twice with Mr Stevens all of whom have very big and thick penises. So not acknowledging those scenes on playthroughs where she's already had a fair bit of experience, doesn't make a lot of sense. What is the point of her getting bad girl points, if she never becomes one?

The same thing happens with her anal scenes, where she's always surprised how weird it feels, and acts like it's just going to hurt and she's not going to get any pleasure. In the scene with Kris, she ended up begging for him to continue, because she came so hard. Yet when Mr Stevens fucks her ass later, she ends up acting really reticent, when you'd imagine after her previous experience, she'd be really into the possibility of doing it again?

The Dev really does need to start showing in the game, that she already knows what anal is going to be like and already enjoys it, even if she only just says it to herself. And the same goes for any other sexual experiences, that she's already had within the game. I know on some playthroughs she may not have done any of that, and it might be her first time for real, but is it so difficult to acknowledge it, on those playthroughs where it isn't?

And you're perfectly right, there should be a distinct route for lesbian content. I don't see the purpose of her accumulating lesbian points, if there's no way of using them on a separate route. If you can avoid Michael on one route, and David on another, then surely it should be just as easy to exclude both of their sex content? Victoria's stats do give the impression that there will be a separate lesbian route, or at least one where you have the choice to eliminate M/F sex content. And there doesn't seem to be any particular necessity for not having an arrangement like that.

 

[Geko1711]

I don't recall him ever expliciitly saying so...but then there would be no need to be able rack up an impressive amount of 'lesbian points' would there....

If you saw the slut points I have accumulated they are more than double the lesbian ones, so it doesn't mean anything.... You're the one who thinks there's a path and hopes that this will happen.

 

[Zara Scarlet]

Where did the dev say that there's ever going to be a pure lesbian route?

The stats give that distinct impression, and he's never said that there wouldn't be either.

 

[Maviarab]

If you saw the slut points I have accumulated they are more than double the lesbian ones, so it doesn't mean anything.... You're the one who thinks there's a path and hopes that this will happen.

Who says they are mutually exclusive? Have you been a slut..then you get slut points...you have specific lesbian points for *shrugs*

This isn't rocket science....

 

[Zara Scarlet]

If you saw the slut points I have accumulated they are more than double the lesbian ones, so it doesn't mean anything.... You're the one who thinks there's a path and hopes that this will happen.

My slut points are more than double the lesbian points, but I still believed there was going to be one, and initially hoped to have such a playthrough, as well as my bad girl one. Why have lesbian points in the game, if there's no specific way of using them?
And if he was always planning to have a more lesbian route later, why would the Dev make it so you couldn't exclude M/F sex content earlier in the game? Yeah, you're probably right there isn't going to be a lesbian route, but that is not the impression that the Dev has given.

That doesn't bother me, because although I really like lesbian content, I don't need an exclusive lesbian route in the games I play. But I'm guessing a lot of people may have started this game, expecting that too happen. And it's easy to understand why they did.

 

[Balbaar]

If you're playing the Bad Girl route, why did you choose David over Michael? He's the bad boy, and by not choosing him, you get David automatically. It's really simple, have sex with Michael during the party, and David doesn't get a look-in. He just becomes a guy she occasionally talks to at work.

Lucas, is all about the cheating. Victoria can't become a cheating whore, with nobody to cheat on. And Lucas is naive and stupid enough, for even a girl like Victoria ( who is hardly devious), to pull the wool over his eyes, with barely any effort. He's the perfect fall guy, who virtually nobody will feel too bad about being betrayed, since it's very difficult to like him. And he pretty much gives her an excuse to begin looking for other options, by kind of splitting up with her intially. Enough so that even Victoria, can begin seriously doubting whether they have a future. And of course, they don't have a future. Because if they did Lucas would feature in the relationship stats as well. The fact that he doesn't, shows that eventually they are going to split up. Once the Dev has had fun, getting Victoria to tease the fuck out of Lucas, and probably starting to enjoy cheating on him ( on the bad girl route at least).

That sex scene at his uncles, was important to demonstrate to Victoria, that Lucas was never very good in the bedroom. Back in her small home town, he felt like a big deal, because he was the son of a well-off local businessman. But in Big City, he's a fish out of water, whilst she's growing in confidence and totally out of his league. That sex scene brought everything into sharp focus for Victoria. Afterwards, she knows that Lucas can't satisfy her, the way other men in her life can. And she realises her feelings for him have changed, and she doesn't really love him anymore. But she feels guilty, because Lucas has given up everything to be with her, just like she asked him to. For a girl like Victoria, it's only right that she gives him a chance, even if she doesn't really want to. We know that ultimately she's probably going to dump him, but at that point she's not sure, and she's worried that Lucas will be so hurt, that he'll do something really stupid. So she makes, what is almost certainly the wrong decision for Lucas and her, but the right decision for the cheating part of the game, and decides to carry on being his girlfriend.

Later, we get the beach scene with Lucas, plus Harry and Miles. And that demonstrates where Lucas really fits in, in this game. With Victoria, teasing and messing around with both guys, right in front of the hapless Lucas, who is too naive and unobservant to realise what's really happening. One assumes this will eventually lead to Victoria having sex with other guys, with Lucas totally oblivious that his girlfriend has become a total slut, and gets off doing it with him in close proximity. So I think that sex scene with Lucas, at his Uncle's apartment, played a very important role, for what was to come.

Again, I'm hiding my response on this behind a spoiler warning so that someone looking through this thread for specific info doesn't accidentally read any of it.

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[Maviarab]

Regarding Lucas, thank you for taking the time to write a detailed explanation but I have played the game so I already knew all that. Just because there's an explanation for it doesn't mean it's automatically a good idea for there to be a forced sex scene in a game where most (if not all) scenes can be avoided if the player doesn't want them to happen.
There are plenty of ways the developer could've shown us how Victoria starts to realize that Lucas isn't the one for her, and by adding an unavoidable scene they chose the worst possible way to do that.

Lots of VN's give you the option to 'tell your BF you have a headache' lol....I find this even funnier on a FMC game...so can still cheat etc...but you can avoid the BF you have been lumbered with from the start (which starting a VN with a pre-existing relationship is always, always tricky, so you need ways to get out of it/avoid it if you wish).

So agree with you...forcing it...again as I said earlier...the dev needs to come clean with what his vision is...people can then stop assuming or hoping for things...and then stay or leave.

 

[Geko1711]

Who says they are mutually exclusive? Have you been a slut..then you get slut points...you have specific lesbian points for *shrugs*

This isn't rocket science....

The slut points would be mutually exclusive with the good girl points, but this is not the case and how do you explain this? To me that means they don't count for anything.

 

[Zara Scarlet]

Again, I'm hiding my response on this behind a spoiler warning so that someone looking through this thread for specific info doesn't accidentally read any of it.

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Speaking from experience. I have jumped straight into bed with a guy, I met like an hour before, on more than one occasion. If you're really attracted to someone for whatever reason, it's not really that hard to imagine why you would do it. Just imagine it's not Victoria for a minute, but some hot girl you met at a party, and you've been drinking and she's made it clear she wants you. Are you saying you definitely wouldn't do it, because you want to take things slow? In such situations logic doesn't apply very often. It's easy to say that when you're viewing it dispassionately like we are. But in the heat of the moment, even someone as innocent as Victoria, might want to do something naughty and out of character. And at least one version of Victoria does fancy Michael, because he's so confident, masculine and charismatic. He's the total opposite of Lucas in every way, and that's what makes him so appealing to her. Whereas David is just an upgrade on Lucas ( Lucas plus).

It doesn't really matter whether she's had a few experiences by that point, because she's definitely not become comfortable with being that way. She still feels very guilty, and she doesn't really know what she feels about her and Lucas. Until she has sex with him again, and she can make a direct comparison with how he makes her feel and how those other characters did, she still has this idea in her head, that it was ok when she did it with Lucas and that he gave her that extra something because they were both in love, that other people couldn't. Only by having sex with him again, could she see clearly, that that extra something was now absent, and her feelings of love had evaporated. Before that she wasn't sure, afterwards she was. From that point on, she knows deep down that her and Lucas have no future, even if she feels too guilty to admit it totally to herself. And so she stays with him, until she's finally ready to acknowledge it.

Personally, I don't understand why you would object so strongly to her having a sex scene with her boyfriend? Such scenes are pretty much standard in the early part of these types of games. It certainly wasn't forced on Victoria. She did it quite willingly. And it's something that most people who play these types of games would expect to happen, even if there was a lesbian route. Because she wouldn't start as a lesbian, but a girl having a conventional sexual relationship with her boyfriend.

 

[Zara Scarlet]

Lots of VN's give you the option to 'tell your BF you have a headache' lol....I find this even funnier on a FMC game...so can still cheat etc...but you can avoid the BF you have been lumbered with from the start (which starting a VN with a pre-existing relationship is always, always tricky, so you need ways to get out of it/avoid it if you wish).

So agree with you...forcing it...again as I said earlier...the dev needs to come clean with what his vision is...people can then stop assuming or hoping for things...and then stay or leave.

Lot's of games do that. But it's not what Victoria would do. The way the Dev has constructed her personality, means she would feel exceptionally guilty about denying Lucas at that point. I think there are just some things in games, that you just have to live with, regardless of whether it's your particular thing or not. You can always just skip the actual sex if it's too much for you. But I think Victoria would have a lot more of headache, if she hadn't allowed Lucas to have sex with her at that point. Afterwards, she knows with certainty that it's not the same anymore, and in her own mind at least, she now has a reasonable excuse for trying to avoid it in the future.

 

[Balbaar]

Speaking from experience. I have jumped straight into bed with a guy, I met like an hour before, on more than one occasion. If you're really attracted to someone for whatever reason, it's not really that hard to imagine why you would do it. Just imagine it's not Victoria for a minute, but some hot girl you met at a party, and you've been drinking and she's made it clear she wants you. Are you saying you definitely wouldn't do it, because you want to take things slow? In such situations logic doesn't apply very often. It's easy to say that when you're viewing it dispassionately like we are. But in the heat of the moment, even someone as innocent as Victoria, might want to do something naughty and out of character. And at least one version of Victoria does fancy Michael, because he's so confident, masculine and charismatic. He's the total opposite of Lucas in every way, and that's what makes him so appealing to her. Whereas David is just an upgrade on Lucas ( Lucas plus).

It doesn't really matter whether she's had a few experiences by that point, because she's definitely not become comfortable with being that way. She still feels very guilty, and she doesn't really know what she feels about her and Lucas. Until she has sex with him again, and she can make a direct comparison with how he makes her feel and how those other characters did, she still has this idea in her head, that it was ok when she did it with Lucas and that he gave her that extra something because they were both in love, that other people couldn't. Only by having sex with him again, could she see clearly, that that extra something was now absent, and her feelings of love had evaporated. Before that she wasn't sure, afterwards she was. From that point on, she knows deep down that her and Lucas have no future, even if she feels too guilty to admit it totally to herself. And so she stays with him, until she's finally ready to acknowledge it.

Personally, I don't understand why you would object so strongly to her having a sex scene with her boyfriend? Such scenes are pretty much standard in the early part of these types of games. It certainly wasn't forced on Victoria. She did it quite willingly. And it's something that most people who play these types of games would expect to happen, even if there was a lesbian route. Because she wouldn't start as a lesbian, but a girl having a conventional sexual relationship with her boyfriend.

That's fine and all, but everything you said is irrelevant to my point though. It doesn't matter what you've done IRL, and it doesn't matter what I would do IRL.
I chose to not have sex with Michael, the reasoning behind my decision is not important. What's important, is that my decision caused the game to force a character (David) on me who I had already rejected, which is an inherent flaw in the game itself and trying to justify it through real life experiences doesn't change that fact.
In a choice driven AVN, you should never get a character forced on you if you were previously given (and made) the choice to reject that character. If the game is just going to ignore the fact that you're clearly not interested in a character, then why present us with the option to reject them in the first place?

You were the one who said "One assumes this will eventually lead to Victoria having sex with other guys", which is what I responded to. My point was that there's no need for that scene to lead to that, because that has already been happening for some time at that point in the game.
As far as the scene itself goes, no matter how logical it may seem to you, this is still a game based around the choices the player makes. There is absolutely no reason why that scene needed to be unavoidable, and that's all there is to it. It takes away a ton of player agency which happens to be why a lot of us (probably even most of us) play this type of game instead of kinetic novels.

The reason I object to it is because Lucas is an incredibly unlikable character, and when I finally thought to be rid of him he suddenly shows up and we're hit with one of the most cringy sex scenes between the MC and her doormat of a "boyfriend" I've ever seen in an AVN. It literally adds nothing of value to the game, and I'm sure plenty of people feel that way. Even though the scene wasn't forced on Victoria, it was forced on us, the players..
The biggest problem isn't even that that scene is in the game, the biggest problem is the fact that we don't get the option to avoid it. I could repeat what I said about this being a choice driven game and all that but I think you probably get my point by now.

I could ask you the same thing by the way.. Why do you object so strongly to me wanting an option to avoid certain sex scenes in a choice driven AVN? Why do you feel the need to justify bad design choices by applying your own real life experiences to any of the issues I've brought up? Such a question really goes both ways, as you can see.