I sure to God this will be the last time I talk about it. So your interpretation is that Helen is the mother figure of a group of friends ? Like Helen is the mother of Katie who was friend with Leia and William and became a mother figure to the other two ? About SG, I really don't see how it is a standard to anything. SG does not make any sense if you take it at face value, none.
Again, I can't see how SG makes sense. But this is not the point. Of course people are stuck with their headcanon, this is the most normal reaction, and until now Ocean did little dissuade people of that. Just to be clear. You think that WiaB until now was not written as a IC game ? Regarding bloodlines, I think Ocean once called it Zaneverse, and is not a wild thing imagine that the first protagonist of the first game and his action will be importance to the entire universe. But I agree that it is not supported by the story in any way. I really hope that Ocean did not lied to his audience, is the worst thing a storyteller could do.
It is overtly supported in the games. The Zane family is the only recognisable part of WiaB to be present in SG from the first chapter, other than Wollust being Wollust. We have the earrings and we have Ayua, and we have ZPR. Even before Ch5 we have Katie's car, Katie's name, Ayua's family fighting style, etc. The Reveras only get mentioned in Ch 4.5 by Mila, and although the Petrovas are there the whole time, we haven't seen any confirmed Revera or Petrova in WiaB.
So yes, 100% there is a focus on the Zane family. We even have teasers of Gefritzel in SG.
This doesn't mean the family dynamics of the Zanes are central to SG though. We don't know that at all. What is central to SG is NIka developing mental health (or not), and what is central to WiaB is Willi repairing his fuckups (or not). I can imagine that the effort Willi will have to make to repair things with Mon *should* be a greater effort than patching things up with Leia, other than we've already seen that Mon is a normal human and Leia is a vengeful harpy who revels in her perceived pain.
About lying, all authors of stories are liars, that's why they work in fiction. There's no such thing as written truth when it comes to stories. It's the consistent lies that stand the test of time. Ocean's at least more plausible than what I read in the news some days
Disingenuous question yossa. Even if you choose to ignore the fact that Noji is of an entirely different race, there was never any sort of ambiguity there. The MC always stated he was adopted. The siblings only ever refer to Noji as "mom" in her presence. They call her "Noji" when she isn't around. Nothing ever pointed to the possibility of Nojiko ever being their mom.
While in the siblings case every single detail did point to it.
EDIT: You gotta come to terms with this. It isn't my "headcannon". It isn't an incest fetish. I've stated numerous times I would rather Nami was not related to the MC. It is simply the story Ocean chose to tell. The way he chose to tell it. Same with WiAB. Helen, Dylan, Katie, William and Leia were supposed to be related. They were supposed to be Zanes. Ocean told us this. I didn't make it up.
The important thing is it WAS the story Ocean chose to tell, but WiaB got nuked, and he's had to rethink it. There is no guarantee he'll do X, Y or Z to provide development stability. We'll see how it goes. The least plausible outcome is trying to keep it a mystery for the whole game. Everyone on screen knows the dynamic, but we don't? That'd be the chicken burger choice for every interaction.
And you're right, it wasn't a fan obsession headcanon like in some other threads of this site, it was in the unpatched version from memory. Even before patching, we had Noji Cyrus. But the story has changed, which means we get future chapters, and hopefully Ocean will get better at telling lovely lies ...I mean storytelling
There's no conflict if Helen, Leia and Katie are all related. Katie could simply be the jealous little sister who caught Leia with her hate fuck buddy who threatened to out them to the groups mother figure, who is also their mom. That's a toxic relationship, more than enough reason to prevent William and Leia from risking a pregnancy. It's not complex. This whole "Zane bloodline" theory is contrived and doesn't exist in either story at this time.
SG is REALLY simple to understand. It's a slice of life story with two children who grew up together, were orphaned at the same age, but share no biological relationship. Sitcoms with similar scenarios existed from the 70s to the 90s. People are confused why they look so different bc they THINK that Nika and Nami are related and it's addressed repeatedly. They don't even have to come from the same city. You literally have to go out of your way to inject incest into that story to see it at this point. Even if you proceed down Nami's path, which goes no where currently, they are still not related. Certainly not biologically.
Even if you want to argue that if they were adopted, they are legally related, that is never addressed. Personally, I find it ridiculous that if you had two identical households, one where the children adopted and the other fostered, one would be considered incest and the other not. And it doesn't matter bc YOU have to make the leap to it being something perverse for it to be something perverse. That only says anything about you. And, mind you, we're talking about a fantasy incestuous relationship which doesn't even exist in the story itself. And, unlike WiAB, SG has progressed further than it originally had before the changes. So you're making a massive fucking reach in the best of circumstances. At worst, you're on a forum arguing semantics to defend your fetish from non-ridicule, which is desperate and pathetic.
Now, why would Nojiko NOT want the two kids she's raising to suddenly have a kid of their own? The question answers itself. It's the same reason parents don't want their own kids having a kid with a non-sibling.
You're seeing 2+2= and 2+X=4 and coming up with 5 and 3 as answers. You're making leaps beyond the evidence you're being given. Sure, that's enough to satisfy some peoples fetishes w/o going too far, but it's a leap they have to make in their own minds. The rest of us can see it, roll our eyes, and continue with the story as it is being presented to us. The only conflict exists bc one party is determined 2+2=5 and everyone that says its 4 is wrong. Make your leap, it was left ambiguous to allow you to do just that, but stop demanding everyone else make that leap as well.
The Zane "bloodline" theory hasn't existed in any game - bloodline means descendants, and only
Donna got potentially pregnant, and that is old and no longer part of the game even if it might be. But the Zane family is the only point of continuity CURRENTLY in both games. That is a thing. As far as your idea of the unoofical foster family/friendzone, that's not what Ocean said in his redacted devlog. Because it's here but not on SS, it's hard to say if the leak was doctored by the leaker (nudge nudge wink wink). Regardless, the future relationships will be defined, and Ocean has specific roles. I gave up trying to work out which roles they will be as a good story teller can make at least 27 plausible origins from what we have now. The problem we suffer is we don't know the majority of the story, and we only look to what fits what we've seen. Ocean is able to manipulate the future of the stories to fit his adjustments, so he'll add details that we can't currently notice, or that we think are silly.
You've come to SG since the rework then, I'll not try to persuade you otherwise, as we're now in a post SG rework world. Only post rework truths apply. Most people arguing otherwise have played each release of the games before the reworks, and it's hard to unsee or unlearn details, when the new details are like the old details but only slightly different.
Now, why would Nojiko NOT want the two kids she's raising to suddenly have a kid of their own? The question answers itself. It's the same reason parents don't want their own kids having a kid with a non-sibling.
This isn't the way to think about it. Rather why do Nika and Nami feel terrified about a race against impossible odds? Whatever Ocean intends there is something they feel is inherently a problem that will be used to bring them down. Because this is a Wiab thread though, I'll stop there. Ocean might have a similar mechanism in WiaB for Katie and William, and if he does, it essentially becomes the same story with different skins. So I'll hope for more ingenuity and variation.
Also chill on the personal attacks. You don't want to cross the line into personal attacks and kink shaming. I'd dare say 100% of the incest stories on this site are unrealistic and fetishised to the point of ridiculousness - it's no wonder that games like WiaB that appeared to deal with the shame aspect of it in a slightly more realistic way would get attention.
At the end of this discussion, we're still left without a ch4 that will provide a hint of whether Leia and Willi are still Zanes. If they're name stays, we can assume at least a basic level of the names of the characters. That's a good outcome for now.
Yeah, thanks, I'm quite disingenuous, I've been told so.
In the Chapter 2 version from SG thread, she was addressed as mother. But since only compressed versions remain for such an old release, it is possible that they were pre-patched.
So they don't see her as a mother figure? They don't respect her opinion, they don't try to help her the best they can, like they would for their own mother, you know, this unique dynamic... Oh, and they were nameless until 3y/o, since I've been told that Noji gave them these One Piece names?
I don’t understand these nitpicks to Ocean, souns like it’s a typical household, with a landlady and tenants.
Yeah, no shit. Masterful fatality, I'm devastated.
So you're telling me the update is in June? I'm off until then.
She was Noji Cyrus. That's why she is now Noji Miyazaki. See you here in June, or later today ...whichever comes first
It was Bella from the future
This is the way. Bella, responsible for all the shit in Wollust from when it all begain.
Agreed! Do you think this benefactor was the one who made Noji switch names halfway through the story?
I think it might be aliens? Because at some point they all had the Cyrus last name. Then something happened and suddenly only the MC had that last name. That's the connection to WiAB! I bet they were the ones who also changed the relationship between Willi&Leia and the rest of the Zane family! Maybe not aliens? Not time travellers. Reality benders? I don't know there are so many possibilities.
EDIT: HOLY SHIT! Wollust doesn't have shapeshifters! It's reality benders changing the size and shape of the girls bodies!!! It has to be!
I told you about the lake, there is the elder god thing that makes all plot holes plausible. IT is the benefactor, and IT's thoughts and desires are beyond comprehension. We say a lake, but it's story bending abilities are as vast ...as an Ocean
sorry not sorry!
