VN Ren'Py Where It All Began [S1 Ch.4 Fix 1 Steam] [Oceanlab]

[John972]

A lof if and maybe, but let us put that aside for the moment. The thing is, even if Ocean removed the incest arc with Willi and Leia, he did not have to rewrite the story with such a heap of BS and boring stupidity! The family drama with the dangers from the outside would still work, if Willi, Leia and Kati were still siblings, only the incest arc removed. A majority of players was with WIAB exactly for this type lost son returning into a dysfunctional, endangered, but loving family.
The new pseudo-Mafia soap opera destroys not only the character designs, it is also incredibly boring, dumb and grating. I had to grind my teeth when Willi told Miru in the style of a independence declaration that Leia and him were never morre than roommates.

Bravo!

I can't deny that rewriting parts of chapter 4 to accommodate William and Leia beings twins is a challenge, but given enough time, I think I'm up to the challenge. Here's my vision for it: William and Leia are the same family, taken in by the Zanes when their parents were murdered (that part doesn't change). But the reason for William bailing years ago is still because of the relationship with Leia, but not because of some "mob family" bullshit rule, just because...they're siblings...and because of "family" pressure. The forced mariage rules becomes a way to try and break that relationship at its roots, to distance Leia from William. So the whole mafia stuff will be there to stay, sorry if that still hurts your trying to make sense of it all

On a sidenote, I do believe that's what Ocean had envisioned himself at some point, when he said that only Leia and William would be related. When you have a closer look at the script and dialogues you do realize that stuff was probably the last to go in his numerous changes to family dynamics.

Yay, some reasoned arguments at last!

Yes, William/Leia could have remained siblings. Yes, Ocean just might (or might not) get away long term (in terms of platform support) with an implied i-relationship between them in the past that was nipped in the bud. However, Leia would need to be scratched from the LI list, without a doubt, and any hint of impropriety between them in the current timeline removed from the game.

I would've been OK with that scenario, if it improved the story. Others would be OK with that as well, but many people definitely would not. As the old saying goes, you can please some of the people some of the time, but you can't please all of the people all of the time...

As for the Jekyll & Hyde nature of Chapters 1-3 versus Chapter 4 - yeah it does need alignment. If Ocean was really capable and committed he could align the chapters without giving too much away in the first three chapters - most of the alignment would be through altered/added dialogues. Personally, I don't think he will. He will keep it as it is (and likely apply some "band aids" in future chapters). SG Season 1 still has plot holes and grammar/spelling mistakes that are unlikely to be corrected.

 

[BobTheDuck]

Yay, some reasoned arguments at last!

Yes, William/Leia could have remained siblings. Yes, Ocean just might (or might not) get away long term (in terms of platform support) with an implied i-relationship between them in the past that was nipped in the bud. However, Leia would need to be scratched from the LI list, without a doubt, and any hint of impropriety between them in the current timeline removed from the game.

I would've been OK with that scenario, if it improved the story. Others would be OK with that as well, but many people definitely would not. As the old saying goes, you can please some of the people some of the time, but you can't please all of the people all of the time...

As for the Jekyll & Hyde nature of Chapters 1-3 versus Chapter 4 - yeah it does need alignment. If Ocean was really capable and committed he could align the chapters without giving too much away in the first three chapters - most of the alignment would be through altered/added dialogues. Personally, I don't think he will. He will keep it as it is (and likely apply some "band aids" in future chapters). SG Season 1 still has plot holes and grammar/spelling mistakes that are unlikely to be corrected.

He's already don't some minor updates to the Steam version since released. One was to add an outline to the font because people complained about readability. SG had stealth updates to the script to restore some stuff with Nami, as well as spelling and grammar. I am sure he'll fix at least that much. This chapter has shown that he IS able to change the script without looking at the renders and taking a month to re-render what only needs to be a script change. Early access means Season 1 is still in beta form.

At very least, I expect he'll redo the renders where parts of katie go see through from camera angles

 

[Dr.TSoni]

SG had stealth updates to the script to restore some stuff with Nami, as well as spelling and grammar. I am sure he'll fix at least that much. This chapter has shown that he IS able to change the script without looking at the renders and taking a month to re-render what only needs to be a script change. Early access means Season 1 is still in beta form.

At very least, I expect he'll redo the renders where parts of katie go see through from camera angles

Bob you can tell us if Ocean mistreats you, you don't have to continue to put up with his abuse

 

[BobTheDuck]

Bob you can tell us if Ocean mistreats you, you don't have to continue to put up with his abuse

nah. You've seen where I moonlight. I get all my emotional abuse needs met in that game.

 

[ijako3]

The amount of crap dragging on and hardly any lewd content is awful.

I don't need orgies or whatever every second, but i was excited when i saw this latest updated games.
I really liked the original, but original at least had better balance between more erotic vibes and storytelling between characters.

I don't remember when was the last time this game was updated but it was a loong time, but playing latest update made me feel tired, like the game don't have any balance, it's just a lot of writing that lacks substance in execution at this point, the feeling probably would a little different if this game would be getting "normal" scheduled updates, but it won't have that ever prob so...

 

[Ara-sH]

Any scene with mom in new update ? I mean any even not sexual

 

[wizardcock]

I was wondering how the game is doing on Steam? Is 80 reviews a lot or not?

 

[Dr.TSoni]

Any scene with mom in new update ? I mean any even not sexual

There is no mommy, but you can feel your Boss's boobs

 

[Ali ibn Hassan]

There is no mommy, but you can feel your Boss's boobs

 

[Tremonia]

I finally had the opportunity to play through the game. I don't know why many here have a problem. The mafia aspect didn't come as a surprise if you paid attention to the story beforehand. Some form of organized crime was there the whole time. Now it's just “the mafia”. The best thing, however, is that all the incest bullshit is finally gone. Nevertheless, it has to be said that Ocean is fantastic at creating graphics, but when it comes to storytelling it remains mediocre at best.

 

[UncleFappy]

Thank god he said it. Leia looks ridiculous in that get up.

 

[Oasis951]

The best thing, however, is that all the incest bullshit is finally gone.

Well clearly you haven't been paying attention to the story. The incest part was one of the key parts to the backstory of WiaB. William had sex with his sister, Leia, and ran away. Taking away the incest, there's just no reason for William to run away like that.

Plus, I've asked on the Subreddit. William is still a Zane, and is related to Leia but Ocean can't officially put that in his game due to Steam and other restrictions (which I think he should just ignore and stop changing the story, displeasing the fans, to appease Steam and whatnot).

 

[Tremonia]

Well clearly you haven't been paying attention to the story.

Sure. I'm to dumb to read, you know?

The incest part was one of the key parts to the backstory of WiaB.

Emphasis on "was". It's gone and that's a good thing. And btw, I dispute that this should be the key aspect of the whole story. It was a partial aspect. Yes, but no more than that.

 

[Oasis951]

I dispute that this should be the key aspect of the whole story

Then please, O Wise One, explain to me why William left, which is one of the key points of the story (since this story is about his return and seeing how things have changed back home)? Please tell me why there is an underlying tension with his "family" members. It's clear that incest is the main part of the game and one of the main driving factors behind the backstory and current relationships. Now Ocean is trying to remove it and what we're left with is a shoddy attempt of trying to fill a plot hole.

It's like if George RR Martin decided that "Oh, Jaime and Cersei aren't actually biologically related; they were just adopted into the Lannister Family". The whole of ASOIAF (Game of Thrones) would make no sense because their relationship is what started the story, with Bran being knocked out of the window, Cersei killing Rob Baratheon and Ned Stark to continue and hide her relationship with her brother... And all of the rest of the events of ASOIAF

 

[Turret]

I finally had the opportunity to play through the game. I don't know why many here have a problem. The mafia aspect didn't come as a surprise if you paid attention to the story beforehand. Some form of organized crime was there the whole time. Now it's just “the mafia”. The best thing, however, is that all the incest bullshit is finally gone. Nevertheless, it has to be said that Ocean is fantastic at creating graphics, but when it comes to storytelling it remains mediocre at best.

Have to agree with Oasis951 , that you seemingly did not pay any attention to the storylines before. That part of the Zane family had some shady dealings, yes, but it was always a given fact that the legal business of the whole family outsized the semi- and illegal business by a huge margin. Not this mustache-twirling bunch of flat sharers and hardcore criminals he made them now. Utter BS and destroys the characters.
The incest part of Willi/Leia, which was never that big anyway, but a core part of the backstory and part why Willi and Miru finally travel to Wollust. The Willi from the new update has ZERO reasons to ever return and more, has every incentive to leave this sinkhole he once called home behind forever.

Plus, I've asked on the Subreddit. William is still a Zane, and is related to Leia but Ocean can't officially put that in his game due to Steam and other restrictions (which I think he should just ignore and stop changing the story, displeasing the fans, to appease Steam and whatnot).

Ocean seems to mix up his excuses for brownnosing Patreon to keep SG safe. Steam has, is and continues to give a flying fuck if incest is present in the games they sell. Hell, if the devs take care to not be blatant about it, even some well selling games and VHs have it in them. There is a popular VN series with great, but comparatively harmless pics, the text shows clearly that one possible LI is your sister and there is a full love path for her.

 

[NozToh]

As someone who discovered SG first, I've just finished this update. I can feel that the heart of the game was basically ripped out alongside the incest - I personally don't care that much for it but what really damages the game is the convoluted mafia family-rule nonsense. It could have worked as a fresh new game with a more coherent script but because of the rewriting it feels very disjointed. Just seems like someone tried really hard with an eraser to get rid of a certain part of a drawing, but then used a different coloured marker to draw the new part in. Maybe this new story will actually end up being better but with how long it takes, will we ever know? There are some intriguing potential plotlines but William is still getting introduced to new things and people 4 chapters in, with many more to still come. It's just moving extremely slowly.

With that being said, the renders are obviously the best out of any AVN along with the music. Ocean definitely shines in characters and the interactions between them. I don't think there are many better than him at that. But these long update waits for both games aren't feasible long term. I saw that he mentioned at the end of the update that WIAB is in the red, my prediction is it probably won't make it past Season 1 - if he tries to continue this dual development cycle.

Now that the incest is gone though, can't Ocean open up patreon for the game again?

 

[Oasis951]

Personal satisfaction is a part of my decision-making process on this ;-)
Yeah, I should reach out to Ocean and ask for a cut...I might just send Miru to collect

I doubt Ocean would pay. I'd like to say that William is a Zane at the very least but there's a lot of ambiguity. I made a post on subreddit asking this before it got removed:


Maybe this can give some clarification, maybe not. But I do know that Ocean does not want any mention of incest in his subreddit despite the facts that his games did hint at it, which is just strange and bizarre. I've been active on his subreddit fro a few months now, and have defended his games since, but it's really getting hard to now

 

[yossa999]

I'm not going to lie, I enjoyed the scenes with Katie, but with a bit of a bittersweet taste since my favorite part is the character and her dynamics.

Warning! I'm answering in the WiAB thread as it more and more goes offtopic for SG.

Dunno, I enjoyed the most scenes, Katie, Kata, Zoey, Gina - they all were entertainable. Didn't like much Leia's, got tired of this post-roomies aftertaste of the story. Miru, very nice but too clingy. Ni is awesome and her new chubby look has grown on me.
Heck, even Taylor was cute. Now dynamics between the characters makes sense to me and have value as standalone story, before I could only tolerate WiAB as a big bonus episode of SG.

 

[Oasis951]

 

[John972]

Have to agree with Oasis951 , that you seemingly did not pay any attention to the storylines before. That part of the Zane family had some shady dealings, yes, but it was always a given fact that the legal business of the whole family outsized the semi- and illegal business by a huge margin. Not this mustache-twirling bunch of flat sharers and hardcore criminals he made them now. Utter BS and destroys the characters.
The incest part of Willi/Leia, which was never that big anyway, but a core part of the backstory and part why Willi and Miru finally travel to Wollust. The Willi from the new update has ZERO reasons to ever return and more, has every incentive to leave this sinkhole he once called home behind forever.

Ocean seems to mix up his excuses for brownnosing Patreon to keep SG safe. Steam has, is and continues to give a flying fuck if incest is present in the games they sell. Hell, if the devs take care to not be blatant about it, even some well selling games and VHs have it in them. There is a popular VN series with great, but comparatively harmless pics, the text shows clearly that one possible LI is your sister and there is a full love path for her.

'Sorry to put it this way, but what is it that you just don't get?

I am absolutely tired of this "Steam doesn't give a..." BS. You know what? There was a time when Patreon and music licensees etc didn't give a toss either. How's that worked out?

If you were to commit full-time to AVN development and invest tens of thousands of Euros into it, would you take the risk of a third party income provider (like Steam) pulling the plug on your business at any time in the future without warning because of socially taboo content? Given the circumstances in which WIAB got released to Steam, people here should know better.