VN Ren'Py Where the Heart Is [S1 v2024-07-10 BETA] [CheekyGimp]

4.40 star(s) 325 Votes
Discussion Reviews (325)
Y

Yurnero322

Newbie
Sep 22, 2017
26
75
masioya said:
can anyone share new message in cheeky's patreon it says that game development is paused ..
Click to expand...
Hi folks,



I know this won't be a popular decision for some of you but I need to pause development of the final two episodes of WTHI for a couple of months so we can focus on a re-do of the earlier episodes. This is not a decision I am taking lightly and I've mulled this over for the past few months. The re-do is not just an upgrade of the early episode art, it will be a full script overhaul of ALL of the earlier episodes (removing some scenes, adding some new ones, editing some scenes and extending some scenes) in addition to re-doing all of the art and adding animations. Why not finish WTHI first and then start on the re-do? (Fair question). Here's why...

As most of you know, I have a real-life job in addition to working on WTHI. For the first four years of working on WTHI, I used to do the equivalent of working two full time jobs where I would work my normal job Mon-Fri and also squeeze in 40-60 hours of WTHI per week ( 4-5 hours Mon-thur evenings, an all-nighter on Friday and then as many hours as possible on Sat-Sun).

But after four years, that was no longer sustainable (was burning me out) so what I have been doing recently is alternating my time between my real-life job and WTHI by taking unpaid leave from my job (either a couple of days a week, a couple of weeks a month or more recently, I have taken a whole month off work to concentrate on WTHI). When I'm working WTHI only, I can easily squeeze in 60 hrs per week. But when I'm working my real-life job, I can only manage about 20-25 hours per week on WTHI. And Cell (our long suffering artist) is continously churning out 50+ hour weeks. I thought we could keep this set-up going until I finish WTHI completely but I cannot. To finish the game properly (without cutting corners and ensuring we give each character the ending they deserve), I estimate there is at least 6 months work left (to complete EP24 and EP25) plus I want to do an epilogue scene for each character (or group of characters), so there's still many months of work needed to complete WTHI fully. I was hoping to get it all done by the end of this year with the current system of alternating between unpaid time-off from my real-life job but I can't.

Currently, WTHI requires over 100 hours per week spread across Cell and I. After Patreon costs, transfer fees and all the other outgoings associated with game development, this means that working on WTHI actually pays Cell and I less than minimum wage per hour (based on where we live). So continously taking unpaid leave from my real-life (decent-paying) job to earn minimum wage is just not sustainable for the rest of this year.

So, the current plan is to increase the audience/income for WTHI by releasing on Steam. If all goes to plan, the extra income from Steam will give me more financial wiggle-room to take more unpaid time-off from work to focus on WTHI. So, although it means a lack of progress on new episodes in the short-term, it is the best decision for the overall completion of the game.

In order to get onto steam, we have to re-do the earlier episodes, because they are just not up to scratch. So the current plan is to spend the next two months working on a re-do of episodes 1-10 (Season 1) and release on Steam. And obviously we will also release the new upgraded game on patreon too. And once Season 1 is complete, we can then switch our focus back to current episodes and complete and release Episode 24.

I know some people have been clamoring for a rework, while many others would prefer that we just finished the game before going back and re-doing but in the long-run (and based on my personal circumstances) this is the best approach for the overall completion of the game and to keep the quality high. So, for any of you that have been asking for a rework of earlier episodes, it is coming. For any of you that have zero interest in a re-do and only want the new episodes, then consider this a two-month postponement of the new episodes. And for those in the zero interest category, I fully understand if you drop/cancel your pledge.

As always, please ask any questions or add any inputs/comments in the comments section below or feel free to DM me directly.



Thanks,

CG
 
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polycentric

polycentric

Member
Donor
Mar 26, 2019
469
1,791
SI:7 said:
Hi folks,



I know this won't be a popular decision for some of you but I need to pause development of the final two episodes of WTHI for a couple of months so we can focus on a re-do of the earlier episodes. This is not a decision I am taking lightly and I've mulled this over for the past few months. The re-do is not just an upgrade of the early episode art, it will be a full script overhaul of ALL of the earlier episodes (removing some scenes, adding some new ones, editing some scenes and extending some scenes) in addition to re-doing all of the art and adding animations. Why not finish WTHI first and then start on the re-do? (Fair question). Here's why...

As most of you know, I have a real-life job in addition to working on WTHI. For the first four years of working on WTHI, I used to do the equivalent of working two full time jobs where I would work my normal job Mon-Fri and also squeeze in 40-60 hours of WTHI per week ( 4-5 hours Mon-thur evenings, an all-nighter on Friday and then as many hours as possible on Sat-Sun).

But after four years, that was no longer sustainable (was burning me out) so what I have been doing recently is alternating my time between my real-life job and WTHI by taking unpaid leave from my job (either a couple of days a week, a couple of weeks a month or more recently, I have taken a whole month off work to concentrate on WTHI). When I'm working WTHI only, I can easily squeeze in 60 hrs per week. But when I'm working my real-life job, I can only manage about 20-25 hours per week on WTHI. And Cell (our long suffering artist) is continously churning out 50+ hour weeks. I thought we could keep this set-up going until I finish WTHI completely but I cannot. To finish the game properly (without cutting corners and ensuring we give each character the ending they deserve), I estimate there is at least 6 months work left (to complete EP24 and EP25) plus I want to do an epilogue scene for each character (or group of characters), so there's still many months of work needed to complete WTHI fully. I was hoping to get it all done by the end of this year with the current system of alternating between unpaid time-off from my real-life job but I can't.

Currently, WTHI requires over 100 hours per week spread across Cell and I. After Patreon costs, transfer fees and all the other outgoings associated with game development, this means that working on WTHI actually pays Cell and I less than minimum wage per hour (based on where we live). So continously taking unpaid leave from my real-life (decent-paying) job to earn minimum wage is just not sustainable for the rest of this year.

So, the current plan is to increase the audience/income for WTHI by releasing on Steam. If all goes to plan, the extra income from Steam will give me more financial wiggle-room to take more unpaid time-off from work to focus on WTHI. So, although it means a lack of progress on new episodes in the short-term, it is the best decision for the overall completion of the game.

In order to get onto steam, we have to re-do the earlier episodes, because they are just not up to scratch. So the current plan is to spend the next two months working on a re-do of episodes 1-10 (Season 1) and release on Steam. And obviously we will also release the new upgraded game on patreon too. And once Season 1 is complete, we can then switch our focus back to current episodes and complete and release Episode 24.

I know some people have been clamoring for a rework, while many others would prefer that we just finished the game before going back and re-doing but in the long-run (and based on my personal circumstances) this is the best approach for the overall completion of the game and to keep the quality high. So, for any of you that have been asking for a rework of earlier episodes, it is coming. For any of you that have zero interest in a re-do and only want the new episodes, then consider this a two-month postponement of the new episodes. And for those in the zero interest category, I fully understand if you drop/cancel your pledge.

As always, please ask any questions or add any inputs/comments in the comments section below or feel free to DM me directly.



Thanks,

CG
Click to expand...
This sounds utterly reasonable to me; something that started as a hobby project has become an albatross around his neck and he needs to change that.

My solution, and the solution of many people, would be to walk away from it. I have a family that I work hard to keep happy and healthy and, make no mistake, I would drop this like a hot rock if it negatively impacted them.

I think that the majority of people here are reasonable but I'm sure that there are going to be a bunch of armchair quarterbacks that are going to provide free 'advice' to Cheeky and tell him how to manage this project and his life in general. Please - give it a rest. No-one likes delays but equally no-one is going to die if WTHI is delayed.

Maybe, just maybe, we can just skip the whole milking/bad dev/fraud thing and do something more productive, which is literally anything else.
 
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botc76

botc76

The Crawling Chaos, Bringer of Strange Joy
Donor
Oct 23, 2016
4,422
13,215
DaimonFey said:
It's only 2 month postponement.
Click to expand...
First off, don't get me wrong, I do not think that Cheeky isn't completely honest, it's also not that I don't understand the financial aspects, Cell and Cheeky need money to live, just like we all do. He's not a milker, never will be.
I've just seen this scene played out too many times to have a lot of hope left, after reading this.

2 months, that's how it starts. Then it doesn't work quite as it should, then perhaps their ambitions for the first part of the game grow even bigger, then frustration sets in, because in the end you are not doing anything new, just retreading what you already did, throw in some unforeseen complications and then the burnout comes inevitably, and the project is first further and further delayed, then abandoned.

And even if everything works out perfectly, how would 2 months be enough to rework 10 fucking episodes? That's never gonna cut it.

No, this game is very likely done for, and it breaks my heart. Cheeky was so smart for so long, not to fall into the trap of reworking your game before finishing it, something that has led to dozens of games being abandoned.
I cannot think of a single game that had major reworks of the earlier parts and has actually been finished.
Yes, some games might still go there, Timestamps for example might actually be able to finish despite reworking part 1 for the steam release (in this case part one was actually already finished, they didn't go back, mid-work and started it all over again), but even then that would be like one game against 40-50 games that either stopped development completely after starting a rework/remake/overhaul or where the dev got caught in the trap of going back to rework the rework or suddenly finding that if the first part gets a re-work, the rest needs one as well, which will most likely also lead to a burnout and then abandonment.

Fuck! And the finish line was in fucking sight. Two more fucking chapters, and it would have been done. Then Ace leaves and now this.
I hate this so much, I can't believe this is happening.
 
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S

Seekeros

Newbie
Dec 20, 2022
17
52
dudeipoop said:
```
I'm sorry, but an uncaught exception occurred.

While running game code:
File "game/script.rpy", line 520, in script
if persistent.ph_advstart_ep >= 2:
File "game/script.rpy", line 520, in <module>
if persistent.ph_advstart_ep >= 2:
TypeError: '>=' not supported between instances of 'NoneType' and 'int'

-- Full Traceback ------------------------------------------------------------

Full traceback:
File "game/script.rpy", line 520, in script
if persistent.ph_advstart_ep >= 2:
File "C:\Users\rayan\Documents\WhereTheHeartIs-Ep23-pc\renpy\ast.py", line 2115, in execute
if renpy.python.py_eval(condition):
File "C:\Users\rayan\Documents\WhereTheHeartIs-Ep23-pc\renpy\python.py", line 1092, in py_eval
return py_eval_bytecode(code, globals, locals)
File "C:\Users\rayan\Documents\WhereTheHeartIs-Ep23-pc\renpy\python.py", line 1085, in py_eval_bytecode
return eval(bytecode, globals, locals)
File "game/script.rpy", line 520, in <module>
if persistent.ph_advstart_ep >= 2:
TypeError: '>=' not supported between instances of 'NoneType' and 'int'

Windows-10-10.0.22621 AMD64
Ren'Py 8.0.3.22090809
Where The Heart Is Ep23
Wed Feb 15 17:44:05 2023
```





Help?
Click to expand...
keep clicking ignore in the bottom, it will eventually work
 
ZoneIT

ZoneIT

Member
Apr 17, 2020
189
1,554
I knew something was bad from all the delays in the past...Seem like he read the book of the western porn developer.

Delay, Excuse, Censor critic, Burn out, Remake when almost done.
These are the ingredient of a western porn dev

Only on wester porn games do you see projects that take 5+ to complete a visual novel-type game.
To give an example.. one man made stardew valley in 4 years
And you can look up other indie games' development time you will be surprised...and most of them did not have Patreon backers to help them live the good life

Milking is the disease that all of them suffer.

Begger of the net approves your decision
CheekyGimp
 
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jamdan

jamdan

Forum Fanatic
Sep 28, 2018
4,292
22,952
I don't have a problem with reworking it. They've , for the most part, been consistent. Only longer delays for when IRL issues get in the way, and whenever that clears up, the updates become regular again. Saying Cheeky is "milking" is braindead. Comments like that show that no developer, no matter who they are, will get hit by the "milking" train eventually. I've even saw Dr.Pinkcake be accused of milking. So, that word has no meaning since it's flung at any and every developer at one point or another.

But I do think they should finish the last 2 update before reworking the first 10. I get that making, as far as hourly wage goes, next to nothing is hard, but I don't think they need to work as much as they've been doing. Even if that means the updates take a while to complete.

There are popular developers (like Naughtyroad) that release 1 update per year and another popular developer (MrJet) just took a year to complete the final update of their game too. You don't need to finish the final 2 episodes in 6 months. You can finish both episodes in the next 12months. After that is done, rework the first 10 episodes. Release that on steam. And then release the rest of the game on Steam. And finally, release epilogues as DLC.
 
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T

Tumblingjoint

New Member
Sep 23, 2020
9
56
Somber news for what I consider the best game on this site. A rework generally is a red flag for the future development of a game.

But. This game in particular has continually exceeded expectations I set for it, so here's hoping for that to be the case once again.
 
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K

keefer43

Well-Known Member
Dec 24, 2019
1,449
2,269
SI:7 said:
Hi folks,



I know this won't be a popular decision for some of you but I need to pause development of the final two episodes of WTHI for a couple of months so we can focus on a re-do of the earlier episodes. This is not a decision I am taking lightly and I've mulled this over for the past few months. The re-do is not just an upgrade of the early episode art, it will be a full script overhaul of ALL of the earlier episodes (removing some scenes, adding some new ones, editing some scenes and extending some scenes) in addition to re-doing all of the art and adding animations. Why not finish WTHI first and then start on the re-do? (Fair question). Here's why...

As most of you know, I have a real-life job in addition to working on WTHI. For the first four years of working on WTHI, I used to do the equivalent of working two full time jobs where I would work my normal job Mon-Fri and also squeeze in 40-60 hours of WTHI per week ( 4-5 hours Mon-thur evenings, an all-nighter on Friday and then as many hours as possible on Sat-Sun).

But after four years, that was no longer sustainable (was burning me out) so what I have been doing recently is alternating my time between my real-life job and WTHI by taking unpaid leave from my job (either a couple of days a week, a couple of weeks a month or more recently, I have taken a whole month off work to concentrate on WTHI). When I'm working WTHI only, I can easily squeeze in 60 hrs per week. But when I'm working my real-life job, I can only manage about 20-25 hours per week on WTHI. And Cell (our long suffering artist) is continously churning out 50+ hour weeks. I thought we could keep this set-up going until I finish WTHI completely but I cannot. To finish the game properly (without cutting corners and ensuring we give each character the ending they deserve), I estimate there is at least 6 months work left (to complete EP24 and EP25) plus I want to do an epilogue scene for each character (or group of characters), so there's still many months of work needed to complete WTHI fully. I was hoping to get it all done by the end of this year with the current system of alternating between unpaid time-off from my real-life job but I can't.

Currently, WTHI requires over 100 hours per week spread across Cell and I. After Patreon costs, transfer fees and all the other outgoings associated with game development, this means that working on WTHI actually pays Cell and I less than minimum wage per hour (based on where we live). So continously taking unpaid leave from my real-life (decent-paying) job to earn minimum wage is just not sustainable for the rest of this year.

So, the current plan is to increase the audience/income for WTHI by releasing on Steam. If all goes to plan, the extra income from Steam will give me more financial wiggle-room to take more unpaid time-off from work to focus on WTHI. So, although it means a lack of progress on new episodes in the short-term, it is the best decision for the overall completion of the game.

In order to get onto steam, we have to re-do the earlier episodes, because they are just not up to scratch. So the current plan is to spend the next two months working on a re-do of episodes 1-10 (Season 1) and release on Steam. And obviously we will also release the new upgraded game on patreon too. And once Season 1 is complete, we can then switch our focus back to current episodes and complete and release Episode 24.

I know some people have been clamoring for a rework, while many others would prefer that we just finished the game before going back and re-doing but in the long-run (and based on my personal circumstances) this is the best approach for the overall completion of the game and to keep the quality high. So, for any of you that have been asking for a rework of earlier episodes, it is coming. For any of you that have zero interest in a re-do and only want the new episodes, then consider this a two-month postponement of the new episodes. And for those in the zero interest category, I fully understand if you drop/cancel your pledge.

As always, please ask any questions or add any inputs/comments in the comments section below or feel free to DM me directly.



Thanks,

CG
Click to expand...
Do what is needed for you - get that done, and come back to WTHI. We know you (your track record is older than some posting on this thread) and we understand. You are telling us beforehand what is happening, so kudos for being forthright and honest. Keep the flame burning and we'll see you soon. 2 months is nothing, not in the big picture.
 
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BigTyson

Member
Dec 6, 2017
308
763
I think it is perfectly reasonable for Cheeky to start the rework now. Remeber, the team lost Ace and that is huge blow to writing portion of the game. I think the rework will give Cheeky time to figure out how they want to finish up the story, and give him a better picture on how he wants the narrative to wrap up
 
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4.40 star(s) 325 Votes