Hmm...not sure how I feel about that. Sure I am greedy and want more constant updates happening on a shorter timeframe. But I understand that this way is better for him. I for one would have been happy with a monthly update schedule, but it is what it is and is not much I can do about it. This 2-3 month update schedule does make me somewhat uneasy but so far BD delivered big time so I guess we can see what happens.You must be registered to see the links
Thank you guys a ton for all of the feedback on my last post.
So I've slept on it and I've taken all of the comments and feedback into consideration and after seeing some of the major concerns I think it'd be a good idea to talk about them and talk about how I'd try to plan against them. As well as some other things.
The main concern that was brought up is a lack of productivity that can come with the new schedule:
As a few mentioned I'm not the first to go this sort of route where you only update when it's ready and without deadlines. Not all but a lot of devs that decide to go this route seem to slow down some.
And it isn't anything to do with effort, it can just be the nature of a looser schedule. You'd want to tweak things and be a perfectionist and it's easier to do and fall into that trap without a rigid schedule.
This is a very valid concern and one that I've already put a ton of thought into.
I would never try to claim I'm immune to this because I've already been there. That exact scenario is where I found myself with Day 7 final.
It's not the perfect comparison because on top of everything I was only a half functioning person at that point in time but still. I completely understand why some of you would be worried about this.
I'd like to think I've learned the signs of falling into that and I'd know how to avoid it. I also would like to think I learned how to get out of it. But in all honesty that's not a safe enough bet.
So let's talk a little about how I'd try to keep myself in line.
- Continuing the weekly mind drops and being completely honest about how an update is going with full weekly reports on it
- Render count in weekly mind drops
I'll post the amount of renders I made in that week so you guys can sort of check on how I'm handling things.
(Render counts don't tell the whole story. Some of my most productive weeks have been on weeks where I didn't render much. But they are a good gauge of overall work over a period of time. And of course I'll go into detail about where my time was spent. I have no issues doing that.)
- I'll plan out specific events better so I can give a realistic roadmap for each update.
As I work now I plan out all the scenes and everything that will happen in those scenes but I don't plan out the specific renders. Which is why it can sometimes be difficult to gauge how much time I need for something. But I'll work on fixing that. And luckily it's not a difficult fix.
- I'll set private timelines for things
On top of all that I'd be the first to tell you guys if I felt I wasn't living up to my own expectations of myself. And if this change happens and it doesn't work out then we could always try something else. There's no reason this has to be permanent.
Another big concern is amount of time needed for a full update to be made:
It's no secret Day 7 and Day 8-9 are both very large updates that both took / are taking a lot of time to make.
As the update schedule moves towards weeks instead of days I understand why you could assume the amount of time needed to make an update would continue to expand but it'll actually shrink.
As the story calms back down and some of the plot lines are completed / past the point they need to be for now the pacing will change.
Most full updates will be between 800-1200 renders. Which will usually include a few big events and a basketball game. (Sometimes the games will be 300-400 renders long and sometimes they'll only be 50.)
So given my expectations for myself and the private timelines I'd give myself you can expect 2-3 months per update.
(Also some updates would be shorter so potentially only 1 month for some)
The next full update after day 9 will be days 10-14. Then after that will be week 3.
And in the event that an update exceeds that timeframe I'd likely release it in 2 parts.
I wouldn't go more than 3 months without a release. Potentially less.
Betas:
- A few people brought up the idea of doing beta builds for higher tiers when I think a good chunk of content is complete. I like this idea but I wouldn't want to put any sort of timeframe on them. They would be more of a "when it works" kind of thing.
Why not hire help?
- WVM is my baby and I'm not good at managing others. I really don't want to give any creative roles to others that directly influence the game but there are some things I could use help with.
I've mentioned them before but I should hire a programmer and an artist. (In the works)
A programmer to help with some cool features like the calendar and interactive character sheets. And an artist for different team's logos and some clothing.
Losing the render buffer could be an issue right?
- I mean, yeah. Any time lost would have an immediate impact instead of a future one. But with a "when it's ready" update schedule it's not as crucial to have a plan for the immediate impact. I think I have to weigh the pros and cons and realize I as an individual work better without the buffer.
How would pledging work? When would you pause?
- My previous promise was "if I get the things I promise out, I won't pause." But now that there won't be many promises it's not the best thing to go by.
So I suppose I'm not sure yet. I'd likely just go off of if I think I did the work that you guys expect from me in that month. And pause if I don't feel that way or if things are taking longer than they should.
I won't be super duper hard on myself. Not everyday has to be a perfect day but I won't relax on myself either. I have enough experience to know what I can do and I'll just be honest with myself about it.
Why not just do monthlies?
- I mentioned in the last post that I think this route would have the same problems as the bi-weekly just over a longer period of time.
It does fix a lot of the issues for the most part but only sometimes. And in all reality this is a plan that would probably work, honestly I could make the bi-weekly plan work if I had to.
But I thinking moving to full updates are what would make me the happiest and would give me the best chance to consistently put out updates that I'm proud of. And in turn that gives me the best chance to deliver quality content which is at the end of the day the most important thing.
Regarding the polls I mentioned as potential tier rewards:
Just a quick note that all game altering polls would be held for all patrons, such as the client polls.
The tier specific polls are only for the tier specific content like monthly render sets and pinup sets that have no affect on the game. (Though some may be featured at some point in game)
Okay, that's all. Just wanted to clarify a few things.
Thank you all for the feedback. I was a bit worried that things would go south after the post yesterday but everyone has been really respectful in giving valid support / addressing concerns. You guys are amazing.
Sorry for the books these last two posts! I'll probably be quiet for a few days but you'll see me again soon. Once again thank you all.
Love you guys <3
- Thread starter 7767
- Start date
- May 23, 2020
- 933
- 2,963
- Mar 9, 2020
- 1,528
- 2,389
People take this voting shit way too seriously - ive almost managed to double my ENTIRE facepalm count in a SINGLE day by most part complete randoms some with zero posts to their name. Sad sacks the the lot of them lol - still im sure their imaginary video waifus are impressed by you're defending their honour at being deemed inferior to Liz haha
- May 23, 2020
- 933
- 2,963
Liz was a bitch for most of the game. Sure she is nice now, but caused a lot of headaches. It doesn't matter if she's hot if her personality is that of a bipolar potato.
Facepalm all you want I am right. There are several moments where I'd wanted to facepalm Liz myself.
Facepalm all you want I am right. There are several moments where I'd wanted to facepalm Liz myself.
- Dec 4, 2018
- 1,111
- 1,446
Just ended Day 7. Holy Fucking Shit that got real!! 
Man the MC can't take break there will always be troubles after troubles. After Ryker and his goons fucks your day up the next was your girlfriends mother being....honestly idk wtf is wrong with her. she has seen how happy their daughters right now and if both of her daughters not happy they'll happily return to her with her abusive husband waiting at home like goddamn man. If anything that options to go back with her are the worst idea ever.
- Feb 12, 2019
- 231
- 1,024
Well the decision is up to him and he only needs to listen to his community of patreons, but beside what's already been mentioned, with that kind of time frame for releases there is another concern that should arise: the loss of engagement for his community. People are very active in the community and I'm convinced that is because the updates have been so frequent that you can just hang out on the thread all the time. Make it a 2 or 3-month wait and I can see it become a lot quieter over time.You must be registered to see the links
Thank you guys a ton for all of the feedback on my last post.
So I've slept on it and I've taken all of the comments and feedback into consideration and after seeing some of the major concerns I think it'd be a good idea to talk about them and talk about how I'd try to plan against them. As well as some other things.
The main concern that was brought up is a lack of productivity that can come with the new schedule:
As a few mentioned I'm not the first to go this sort of route where you only update when it's ready and without deadlines. Not all but a lot of devs that decide to go this route seem to slow down some.
And it isn't anything to do with effort, it can just be the nature of a looser schedule. You'd want to tweak things and be a perfectionist and it's easier to do and fall into that trap without a rigid schedule.
This is a very valid concern and one that I've already put a ton of thought into.
I would never try to claim I'm immune to this because I've already been there. That exact scenario is where I found myself with Day 7 final.
It's not the perfect comparison because on top of everything I was only a half functioning person at that point in time but still. I completely understand why some of you would be worried about this.
I'd like to think I've learned the signs of falling into that and I'd know how to avoid it. I also would like to think I learned how to get out of it. But in all honesty that's not a safe enough bet.
So let's talk a little about how I'd try to keep myself in line.
- Continuing the weekly mind drops and being completely honest about how an update is going with full weekly reports on it
- Render count in weekly mind drops
I'll post the amount of renders I made in that week so you guys can sort of check on how I'm handling things.
(Render counts don't tell the whole story. Some of my most productive weeks have been on weeks where I didn't render much. But they are a good gauge of overall work over a period of time. And of course I'll go into detail about where my time was spent. I have no issues doing that.)
- I'll plan out specific events better so I can give a realistic roadmap for each update.
As I work now I plan out all the scenes and everything that will happen in those scenes but I don't plan out the specific renders. Which is why it can sometimes be difficult to gauge how much time I need for something. But I'll work on fixing that. And luckily it's not a difficult fix.
- I'll set private timelines for things
On top of all that I'd be the first to tell you guys if I felt I wasn't living up to my own expectations of myself. And if this change happens and it doesn't work out then we could always try something else. There's no reason this has to be permanent.
Another big concern is amount of time needed for a full update to be made:
It's no secret Day 7 and Day 8-9 are both very large updates that both took / are taking a lot of time to make.
As the update schedule moves towards weeks instead of days I understand why you could assume the amount of time needed to make an update would continue to expand but it'll actually shrink.
As the story calms back down and some of the plot lines are completed / past the point they need to be for now the pacing will change.
Most full updates will be between 800-1200 renders. Which will usually include a few big events and a basketball game. (Sometimes the games will be 300-400 renders long and sometimes they'll only be 50.)
So given my expectations for myself and the private timelines I'd give myself you can expect 2-3 months per update.
(Also some updates would be shorter so potentially only 1 month for some)
The next full update after day 9 will be days 10-14. Then after that will be week 3.
And in the event that an update exceeds that timeframe I'd likely release it in 2 parts.
I wouldn't go more than 3 months without a release. Potentially less.
Betas:
- A few people brought up the idea of doing beta builds for higher tiers when I think a good chunk of content is complete. I like this idea but I wouldn't want to put any sort of timeframe on them. They would be more of a "when it works" kind of thing.
Why not hire help?
- WVM is my baby and I'm not good at managing others. I really don't want to give any creative roles to others that directly influence the game but there are some things I could use help with.
I've mentioned them before but I should hire a programmer and an artist. (In the works)
A programmer to help with some cool features like the calendar and interactive character sheets. And an artist for different team's logos and some clothing.
Losing the render buffer could be an issue right?
- I mean, yeah. Any time lost would have an immediate impact instead of a future one. But with a "when it's ready" update schedule it's not as crucial to have a plan for the immediate impact. I think I have to weigh the pros and cons and realize I as an individual work better without the buffer.
How would pledging work? When would you pause?
- My previous promise was "if I get the things I promise out, I won't pause." But now that there won't be many promises it's not the best thing to go by.
So I suppose I'm not sure yet. I'd likely just go off of if I think I did the work that you guys expect from me in that month. And pause if I don't feel that way or if things are taking longer than they should.
I won't be super duper hard on myself. Not everyday has to be a perfect day but I won't relax on myself either. I have enough experience to know what I can do and I'll just be honest with myself about it.
Why not just do monthlies?
- I mentioned in the last post that I think this route would have the same problems as the bi-weekly just over a longer period of time.
It does fix a lot of the issues for the most part but only sometimes. And in all reality this is a plan that would probably work, honestly I could make the bi-weekly plan work if I had to.
But I thinking moving to full updates are what would make me the happiest and would give me the best chance to consistently put out updates that I'm proud of. And in turn that gives me the best chance to deliver quality content which is at the end of the day the most important thing.
Regarding the polls I mentioned as potential tier rewards:
Just a quick note that all game altering polls would be held for all patrons, such as the client polls.
The tier specific polls are only for the tier specific content like monthly render sets and pinup sets that have no affect on the game. (Though some may be featured at some point in game)
Okay, that's all. Just wanted to clarify a few things.
Thank you all for the feedback. I was a bit worried that things would go south after the post yesterday but everyone has been really respectful in giving valid support / addressing concerns. You guys are amazing.
Sorry for the books these last two posts! I'll probably be quiet for a few days but you'll see me again soon. Once again thank you all.
Love you guys <3
Personally I'm fine either way but I probably would not have made that choice in his shoes.
- May 23, 2020
- 933
- 2,963
If we can wait 6 months I think we can last 2-3 months, and even if it gets a little less active, every time an update drops it will become active again.
- Oct 5, 2017
- 7,550
- 10,059
Just had another thought about the Millie situation, she came to WVM alone, what does her husband know about what's going on? I didn't really think of him before because I was still thinking of her as a single mother, but with her staying with us, what if he turns up and causes trouble?
- Feb 18, 2019
- 57
- 138
hmmm... I don't know 2 - 3 months to wait for an update, it's like this past summer all over again.
Granted its only half the time, but damit I almost lost my mind waiting, but then again I might
be a greedy bastard that just wants more of this great VN and story. Well whatever works for
BD is best and I will have to learn to wait.
Granted its only half the time, but damit I almost lost my mind waiting, but then again I might
be a greedy bastard that just wants more of this great VN and story. Well whatever works for
BD is best and I will have to learn to wait.
- May 23, 2020
- 933
- 2,963
I wouldn't think so considering he doesn't care about Millie or his daughters. He be too busy fucking some whore to care about them.
Hiring a programmer is understandable, but why an artist? Just draw the logo in inkscape, export with the necessary parameters (if necessary, make a transparency \ opacity mask from the same spline) - the vector is always easy to modify and scale. This is not a complete brandbook for all occasions from printing to souvenirs, just a logo for texture and maybe for a list of characters, hiring a designer / artist for this is redundant, IMHO or are he afraid of the similarity of the logos? He don’t use them in reality and don’t get a zillion U$D profit from the game as creators of AAA games? - but then it is more a copywriter's job, not a designer's - to check the matches in the patent office or what is it called in America, where all trademarks and logos are registered?
The only thing, I'm afraid that if he increase the time between updates for more than a month or two, he will start reworking the ENTIRE game completely, and will stop creating new content - he's a damnInsidious Villain workaholic-perfectionist, always dissatisfied with himself and the result of his work - if he is not rushed by the limited time frame , he will just start redoing everything over and over again
So, BD have THAT days again, you know, THAT - girls will understand - when the mood changes, insecurity, discomfort, panic..
And this is all because fiancee informed him that he would soon become a father.. or because he pulled heavy furniture during the move - I too, when i moved, thought: "I'm done, bury me in the backyard under the barbeque area.." despite the fact that I hired movers to carry the heaviest , but I disassembled and assembled the furniture myself. still after move feel as if a truck ran over me
or are he afraid of the similarity of the logos? He don’t use them in reality and don’t get a zillion U$D profit from the game as creators of AAA games? - but then it is more a copywriter's job, not a designer's - to check the matches in the patent office or what is it called in America, where all trademarks and logos are registered?The only thing, I'm afraid that if he increase the time between updates for more than a month or two, he will start reworking the ENTIRE game completely, and will stop creating new content - he's a damn
So, BD have THAT days again, you know, THAT - girls will understand - when the mood changes, insecurity, discomfort, panic..
And this is all because fiancee informed him that he would soon become a father.. or because he pulled heavy furniture during the move - I too, when i moved, thought: "I'm done, bury me in the backyard under the barbeque area.." despite the fact that I hired movers to carry the heaviest , but I disassembled and assembled the furniture myself. still after move feel as if a truck ran over me
- May 23, 2020
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- 2,963
Well him hiring an artist kind of makes sense. Getting a professional to get professional results is usually the best course of action plus BD can spend his time working on renders and code instead of trying to create the 'right' logo. Cause trust me usually anything you create your self (especially artwork) will never feel right and feels like it could be improved. So a professional doing the art work would be much more higher quality and looks more appealing (no offence BD)Hiring a programmer is understandable, but why an artist? Just draw the logo in inkscape, export with the necessary parameters (if necessary, make a transparency \ opacity mask from the same spline) - the vector is always easy to modify and scale. This is not a complete brandbook for all occasions from printing to souvenirs, just a logo for texture and maybe for a list of characters, hiring a designer / artist for this is redundant, IMHO
The only thing, I'm afraid that if he increase the time between updates for more than a month or two, he will start reworking the ENTIRE game completely, and will stop creating new content - he's a damnInsidious Villainworkaholic-perfectionist, always dissatisfied with himself and the result of his work - if he is not rushed by the limited time frame , he will just start redoing everything over and over again
So, BD have THAT days again, you know, THAT - girls will understand - when the mood changes, insecurity, discomfort, panic..
And this is all because fiancee informed him that he would soon become a father.. or because he pulled heavy furniture during the move - I too, when i moved, thought: "I'm done, bury me in the backyard under the barbeque area.." despite the fact that I hired movers to carry the heaviest , but I disassembled and assembled the furniture myself. still after move feel as if a truck ran over me
still not sure - i'm designer, first logo i made over 20 years ago.. as long as there is 25% difference and there is no registered word in the logo, there is no problem and the teams logos is not as important as the good story itself and the characters - and with this there is all ok.
and switching to another type of activity is useful while working with 3D - taking breaks it is better to notice small glitches that are not striking during the deadline
and switching to another type of activity is useful while working with 3D - taking breaks it is better to notice small glitches that are not striking during the deadline
- May 23, 2020
- 933
- 2,963
I don't think BD is gonna trademark the logos (maybe a game logo/icon) when the logo he means are just for in game such as the school logo, basketball team logos. Fair enough not being like another logo but I highly doubt that is something to worry about for a lewd visual novel game.
- Apr 28, 2020
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- 11,391
I just want to remind some of the newer folks here that the community was very active during the dark months. Some posters were putting out 20 plus posts a day here, and all were about game content and theory crafting. It wasn't a complaining fest, sure we got a lot of is the game dead or when is the next update people. however, a lot of good stuff came out during those months without an update. The FAQ and Game Guides were created during that time. We did our first tier during that time too. We had a lot of fun here even without an update.
Look no matter what BD decides to do I will support him {I am not just talking about a Patreon supporting way}. I would rather wait 2-3 months for an update then to find out he is burned out and no longer wants to make the game. We need him to be happy with his schedule we need it to work for him as he is the one creating the content we all love. Sure we may be a little selfish and just want the content now, but I think BD has earned the right to try out a few things to see what works best for him too.
Then Skye comes on by and stand in his way with the MC, CAUSE HE'S A FUCKIN HOMIE LIKE THAT!
I guarantee Skye could not only kick Millie's husband's ass up and down the block, but he could do it and then go a full practice day with the MC afterwards with no problems.
As for schedule? I think whatever keeps the develop the most engaged is the best solution, that creates the best product typically. Burnout is a very real thing as we've seen. As a writer I can turbo relate to burnout.
BD has a proven fuckin track record, remember that, he has come out of burnout, the loss of very important people, and grown up so much from when he started this project. The least we can do is trust that he is wanting to keep improving, and feeling better about the work he's doing.
Hiring professionals to do a job for you is nothing to be ashamed of either, that's what they're there for. They're SUPPOSED to be there to hire when you want a job done better than you can do by yourself.
- Jan 20, 2020
- 2,874
- 4,267
It's like the face on mars, you're seeing shapes that don't exist.So i started a new playtrough again and noticed something.
I am not sure but did Braindrop made a Penis there ?
Maybe i see this wrong but it looks like it
View attachment 1061591
- Apr 26, 2020
- 15,465
- 36,128