RPGM Abandoned New Beijing [Day 7] [Banished]

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starvoyager

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Yeah but you see he's experiencing burnout and demotivation because his existing games aren't popular because they're on rpgm. As a result he's not excited about starting a third game, especially since he's not finished with his previous games. That's why the highest priority should've always been to port to renpy regardless of the huge sunk cost into rpgm.
I can agree with that for NB, it would be really nice to have it be so much easier to see those scenes.
though for Harshville, the actual game aspects are pretty much integral. losing money or popularity because you begged for food or rimmed a girl feels good *Because* it's effort to get, and winning feels nice because it's a struggle to get there.
I'd love for NB to be in renpy, but i think a harshvillerenpy version would feel a bit more hollow.

Regardless, having a renpy version of either obvviously doesn't ruin the existing versions, so you wouldn't see me complaining if he did end up doing Harshville renpy, and i hope his gfames get more popular
 
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Yandere Lust

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Yeah but you see he's experiencing burnout and demotivation because his existing games aren't popular because they're on rpgm. As a result he's not excited about starting a third game, especially since he's not finished with his previous games. That's why the highest priority should've always been to port to renpy regardless of the huge sunk cost into rpgm.
Actually, I like that it's in RPGM. Having a character to move around instead of the VN format is fun to me. Ultimately, I like variety though too. But, if all games were VN styled, it'd get overly redundant to me, and I'd really miss having games with controllable characters.
 
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taler

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Yeah it's an absolutely valid opinion but a tiny minority, and he should not listen to you guys haha. It's full survivorship bias as everyone who dislikes it already left. Listening to you guys ruins his career basically.
 

Yandere Lust

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Yeah it's an absolutely valid opinion but a tiny minority, and he should not listen to you guys haha. It's full survivorship bias as everyone who dislikes it already left. Listening to you guys ruins his career basically.
There is so much wrong with your post, where do I even begin? For one, you are coming from your own place of bias. There are both renpy and rpgm games that have seen great success. There is nothing suggesting that only one can succeed. You are assuming that the reason this game hasn't seen a lot of success is because of the engine, rather than any other number of possibilities. It could be advertisement. It could be the theme of the story heavily involving race. When you have a game appealing to a niche form of sub/dom play, you need to know how to let that niche know your game even exists. That's just one potential angle. Also, 'you guys?' We are all individuals, not unions advocating for our position. I'm just someone who came across the thread and am giving my feedback on things. Also, survivorship bias? This isn't a scenario where there are survivors and the dead. This is a question of people interested in buying the game vs. not interested in buying the game, and you don't speak for either group. You are just one individual like anyone else, likely trying to manipulate things to get your way because you only care about yourself. You do not have his best interests in mind, and it's plain to see. Seeing that games can be successful in either engine, it's a complete shot in the dark to suggest that's the reason for their troubles as it is. Goodness, can you be less on the nose?
 

taler

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Nothing wrong with defending your position, but an objective look at the market will come to the same conclusion as me.

Edit: Do you not understand survivorship bias? It's the idea that asking the people who are still here in this thread or on his Patreon if things should change is a bad idea.

The classic story of survivorship bias is about WW2 bombers. They used to look at the bombers that return and reinforce armor in the places where there are the most bullet holes. In actuality, that's the exact opposite of what you should do. The bombers that made it back reveal the places where it's okay to get shot and still live, whereas the places where they aren't shot don't have survivors, those bombers don't make it back. So in reality you should reinforce the places where the bombers who make it back aren't shot.

It's a pretty common mistake in business too. The people in this thread are the bombers who made it back, they're the customers who are still around. Ask them what needs improvement and they won't tell you the most important things. The biggest problems have caused the majority of customers to already not be customers, they have already left. All the survivors will tell you they are okay with how things are, because of course they are, the group is already preselected to be those who are happy with things.

Looking at things objectively, your existing customers will of course be okay with even severe problems with the game that should objectively be fixed, but they will be an ironically preselected group that will lie to you and tell you they are not problems.
 
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Yandere Lust

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Nothing wrong with defending your position, but an objective look at the market will come to the same conclusion as me.

Edit: Do you not understand survivorship bias? It's the idea that asking the people who are still here in this thread or on his Patreon if things should change is a bad idea.

The classic story of survivorship bias is about WW2 bombers. They used to look at the bombers that return and reinforce armor in the places where there are the most bullet holes. In actuality, that's the exact opposite of what you should do. The bombers that made it back reveal the places where it's okay to get shot and still live, whereas the places where they aren't shot don't have survivors, those bombers don't make it back. So in reality you should reinforce the places where the bombers who make it back aren't shot.

It's a pretty common mistake in business too. The people in this thread are the bombers who made it back, they're the customers who are still around. Ask them what needs improvement and they won't tell you the most important things. The biggest problems have caused the majority of customers to already not be customers, they have already left. All the survivors will tell you they are okay with how things are, because of course they are, the group is already preselected to be those who are happy with things.

Looking at things objectively, your existing customers will of course be okay with even severe problems with the game that should objectively be fixed, but they will be an ironically preselected group that will lie to you and tell you they are not problems.
No, it will not. There are RPGM games that see massive success. It's possible to have success with such a game. The market supports what I am saying.

You are the one who does not understand it. We are not dealing with a scenario where it's living people vs dead ones in some tragic incident. This is about customer appeal in a very specific niche within a niche. Niche games see success all the time. As do RPGM games. There is a precedent that both niche games and RPGM games can succeed. This has nothing to do with what people who currently are interested in the game like or not. You can like a game and still give feedback on how to improve it as well. Your whole scenario is what's filled with holes and self serving assumptions.

You are not looking at things objectively even slightly. You are looking at things purely through a lens of your own bias. For one, we aren't customers. We are commenters on a thread of people who have tried the game. This is a work still in production. We aren't bloody lying to the developer, lmao. We just don't have some weird hate boner for RPGM games like you do. A game being made on the RPGM platform is not an objective problem that needs to be fixed. Look at Tower of Trample. They haven't put out an update in over a year and they are still rolling in money each month. While it isn't quite as niche as this game, it is still rather niche. This has absolutely nothing to do with this being a RPGM game.

I like the game because I enjoy different takes on the sub/dom niche, especially between women. This is a unique game in a market that's rather baron. The RPGM aspect of the game is appealing to me, but I enjoy both renpy and RPGM games, but welcome this one being RPGM. I will say that it could be polished more, but before polishing it, it's sensible to get the core skeleton completed, and then polish it after there is plenty to work with.

There are a number of bugs currently that can make a typical user frustrated that should be worked out. Some of the scenes could be polished, and there should probably be more interactions with more scenes that give player choices more meaning. RPGM game's strongest asset over renpy games is how much interactivity they can have with characters and the world. Having more exciting H-content that rewards that interaction would make the game better combined with more general polish. Beyond that, getting the game noticed more by people within the niche it's catering to is paramount. Swapping the game over to renpy is going to virtually have no effect on things if everything else was the same as it is now. A game like this does not succeed or fail based on if it's based in RPGM or renpy.

'Objectively,' this is factual or else we would not see RPGM games succeed as much as they do. It is probably fair to say though that a RPGM game has a certain minimum it needs to reach to see it succeed that is likely higher than that of a renpy game, as you have to make the interactivity meaningful, engaging and rewarding. While a renpy game can be made very interactive, fundamentally, it's more suited to a VN style of game which is much less interactive by comparison, and thus is more driven by just the dialogue and scenes, rather than how fun the interactive aspect is in conjunction to them. But, at the same time, if you get the interactive aspect down in a RPGM-styled H game, it can be very fun and engaging, and see great success if its a polished experience on-top of that.

If the game is fleshed out more, polished, refined, and expanded upon after the fact, it will be a better experience, and thus retain interest of who it reaches. It's entirely possible as well though that this game has not reached enough of its audience in the first place though. Crying about it being a RPGM game though is useless as feedback for the developer. That's your personal bias coming into play, and it has little to do with the success of the game in and of itself.
 

starvoyager

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Jul 22, 2017
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Nothing wrong with defending your position, but an objective look at the market will come to the same conclusion as me.
I understand why you may think that RPGM is hated and that it kills games, and there are definitely a decent amount of people on f95zone who think that, but if you take A New Dawn (one of the more popular RPGM games) and Long Live The Princess (one of the more popular renpy game) a new dawn has 250 more patrons, so RPGM games are very capable of being popular.

i think that if you ported NB to renpy, and then made an RPGM version ofit that cuts out all of the race stuff and changes the setting to just be witch trainer style femsubbondage type stuff, i think the RPGM vanilla-er would do better than the renpy raceplay social degredation.
 
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starvoyager

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i guess mine looks a lot shorter in comparison >///<
i think one reason is also that since the game is being updated very horizontally (IE 3 long paths and not like 20 short paths, which is preferable for me and most people, buuuut....) Replaying it when a new day is added is a pain to go through it again, so if you only somewhat liked it and started when the game was on day 3, you probably stopped by the time day 6 released because you didn't completely replay the game 3 times

also i like your name
 
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Yandere Lust

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i guess mine looks a lot shorter in comparison >///<
i think one reason is also that since the game is being updated very horizontally (IE 3 long paths and not like 20 short paths, which is preferable for me and most people, buuuut....) Replaying it when a new day is added is a pain to go through it again, so if you only somewhat liked it and started when the game was on day 3, you probably stopped by the time day 6 released because you didn't completely replay the game 3 times

also i like your name
Oh danke~ And yeah, the process to test new content could be more optimized for sure. As for the niche the game has, I don't think that has to change, and if that's what the developer is passionate about, then it's good for him to be able to explore that. I'm not bothered by that since I can see the fun in it as a sub myself in a fantasy setting like this. It is true though, that if the niche wasn't as specific, that it would have more broad appeal. But, I think the game can still see improved success with just general polish combined with more things to do. Maybe they could make it a bit less linear and implement a way to pick who ends up as your partner for the program for instance. That would create a lot of replay value and each partner could explore different kinks in conjunction to the core stuff the game has as to broaden the appeal without dropping the core theme or paths that explore it in full. That's just one option though. I think there is a number of things the developer could do to spur life back into the game. It would be better to start a completely separate game in renpy if the developer would want to work on one for that platform as well in my opinion.
 

starvoyager

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stuff they said
oh yea, i agrree wholeheartedly.
i wasn't trying to say they should makie it vanilla for mass appeal, i wwas just making a hypothetical situation, i love the mana ray style way of making the MC inferior, and i like how you can have personality changes. though i wish summer's caretaker person in charge would have more content
 
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Yandere Lust

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oh yea, i agrree wholeheartedly.
i wasn't trying to say they should makie it vanilla for mass appeal, i wwas just making a hypothetical situation, i love the mana ray style way of making the MC inferior, and i like how you can have personality changes. though i wish summer's caretaker person in charge would have more content
I find all the characters interesting in their own way. I'd love if all of them had more content. Although, I'd love it even more if I could get involved myself as the player character. Personally, I like the idea of submitting fully and pleasing the other, like a puppy would I guess. If the game had like a sub stat, and things you could do to please others by choice, that could be used as a means to facilitate interactivity that could lead to scenes that involve you eagerly wanting to serve others. I just think that it shouldn't be too tedious to gain such a stat. Ideally, the means to gain those stats would be fun and not overly repetitive. I think there just is a lot of work that goes into making a polished game with many options such as this. Especially in a game that is trying to be very interactive like this one. But, I do think this game has a lot of great potential as well.
 

Yandere Lust

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You're a super subby one, hm?
submission in the end is pretty good, but i think it's a lot more fun and better if the embarrassment/humiliation/submission is from someone who doesn't want it
Not for me, I enjoy being a good girl. ♥ I'd like that option.
 

taler

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Past couple of comments is basically textbook lol. Both commenters do see that it's hurting the game's popularity but they think it's still just fine anyway. Because of course they do, the mere fact that they're present on the thread means they do.
 
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starvoyager

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EDIT: I'm stupid and saw 'december 2021' and then 'january 2022' and thought a year hadpassed between those two, and then i added 12 months to get january2023 and thought two years had passed when it's actually been 13 months :|
Well, mypoint mostly still stands, but a bit less strongly

Day 8 is two years old yet and isn't public.
I definitely understand 'This update takes 1/3/6 monthsto go publc' scenarios, and if that's what a creator feels like doing, i'm fine iwth it, but after two entire years of the update being out, isthere a single person going "Oh yea, i'll go to this guy's patreon and pay for day 8 because i haven't played it yet but am also interested"?

I feel like pretty much anyone who's never subbed to his patreon probably isn't interested enough to pay $5 for one update. Like me ofr example, i'm moderately interested in playing the game, but i'm not going to get 5 less LBs of pasta at the store this month to play it, it kinda feels like holding your work behind a paywall that doesn't benefit you (because people aren't paying just for that one update) and directly hurts people who are interested in playing.

Again, if the update were 1 or 3 or even 5 months old, i could definitely get behind "He's waiting to release it so he can make sureto get some money from his hard work". But it's been 24 months now, andi doubt that a single person to sub to his patreon for the first time in the last 8 months really did it because of NB D8, so in this scenario it seems like the kinda thing that's not helping him and is hurting some of his fans
 

taler

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This game def has enough content to warrant $5 ngl. But my problem is that I didn't even finish day 7 because of the obtuse RPGM interface.
 

banished

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You guys are funny. Here it is:

Anyway, I'm sort of back. Not with game dev but with just pure writing. I feel like I can better explore the fucked up scenarios in my head this way.

Hope you guys enjoy my new content, and NB day 8 (lol). It's probably the best day <3
 

taler

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Oct 5, 2017
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You guys are funny. Here it is: Mega

Anyway, I'm sort of back. Not with game dev but with just pure writing. I feel like I can better explore the fucked up scenarios in my head this way.

Hope you guys enjoy my new content, and NB day 8 (lol). It's probably the best day <3
Could you link the mac version please?
 
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