Ren'Py A House in the Rift [v0.7.14b1] [Zanith]

[whichone]

Even autonomic responses are learned to some extent. We unfortunately have examples of this in feral children. Those are children that have for some reason or another been abandoned in the wild and left to fend for them self. When this happens the children inevitably end up developing animal behaviors to the point of going against basic human anatomical features such as walking on all fours.

No, they are not.
You do not teach the heart how to pump blood. We do not learn to breathe.
It's literally the first thing a baby does, breathe.
Nothing taught it to. They are autonomic functions.

They'll still cough when they get something in their throat.
They'll still cry when they get sad.
They'll still laugh when they find something funny.
Because they are autonomic responses to emotional feelings.
Being feral doesn't remove that.

 

[QQP_Purple]

They'll still cough when they get something in their throat.
They'll still cry when they get sad.
They'll still laugh when they find something funny.

I am not sure they would. At least not for the later two. Either way it's a terrifying proposition to consider and one thankfully not investigated too deeply to my knowledge. Unfortunately it seems like we are heading toward a forced confrontation with a future in which the question can no longer be ignored.

 

[mordred93]

Ha ha ha, don't.
I've heard "lol" used as word, instead of, y'know, actually laughing (out loud).

Usually someone (when I have heard it) is laughing and says LOL .. not spelling it out, but actually say LOL like lull. I cannot recall someone actually using the acronym instead of actually laughing.

But then again - my amount of social interaction is very limited. Living on an island, working as much as I do, I work and sit on my porch like 75% of my day.

 

[whichone]

I am not sure they would. At least not for the later two. Either way it's a terrifying proposition to consider and one thankfully not investigated too deeply to my knowledge. Unfortunately it seems like we are heading toward a forced confrontation with a future in which the question can no longer be ignored.

Being feral just means uncivilised & wild, not non-human.
Not knowing societal skills, or linguistics, does not mean that they do not have human feelings.
They will still feel sad. They may whimper like an animal when they do, but they will also cry because that is the automatic human emotional response & they are still human.
No-one learns to cry. Apart from actors and manipulators, but you know what I mean.
A baby, literally 2 seconds out of the womb, cries.
It has not learned that. It's an automatic/autonomic response.

 

[QQP_Purple]

My dog coughs when it has something stuck in its throat.
It whimpers when it is sad, or in pain. Crying is the same for humans.
It wags its tail when it's happy. Laughing & smiling is the same for humans.
Being feral just means uncivilised & wild, not non-human.
Not knowing societal skills, or linguistics, does not mean that they do not have human feelings.
They will still feel sad. They may whimper when they do, but they will also cry because that is the automatic human emotional response & they are still human.
No-one learns to cry. Apart from actors and manipulators, but you know what I mean.

Well I may have been exagarating a little bit for effect. But it's not too far fetched to say that a child raised by dogs will whimper instead of crying, wag his but when he is happy and think sniffing yours is the appropriate way to say hello.

 

[QQP_Purple]

It's thoughts and feelings are still human.

And unfortunately I am not sure the modern kids are. For I fear that in those minds, forever bound to their electronic gadgets there now lies less human than machine.

 

[mordred93]

And unfortunately I am not sure the modern kids are. For I fear that in those minds, forever bound to their electronic gadgets there now lies less human than machine.

I still say one of the best parenting decisions I made was making my son not get a cell phone until he was 16 and driving. He hated it for years. I had a home phone, and he could have friends call, and he could take the phone to his room. He didn't get a phone with apps until he got to college and he paid for it himself. While he still does a lot by phone now, he is not glued to it.

 

[QQP_Purple]

Nah, they still get upset by things.
Perhaps about different things & perhaps their justification may be different, but the human emotional response is the same.
Sadness, disappointment, it's not fair, anger, resentment.

Same emotions perhaps. But different expressions. Different behavior. And worse still different motivators which drive those feelings. And in the end is that not the measure of a man.

Beware is all I shall say. Beware of the children of the internet.
For though they are of flesh made and woman born they are unlike you and I.
Their flesh is soft but in their soul only a cold machine resides.

Beware and pray that by the day the world is ruled by the likes of them well all have traveled to our graves.

 

[mordred93]

Nah, they still get upset by things.
Perhaps about different things & perhaps their justification may be different, but the human emotional response is the same.
Sadness, disappointment, it's not fair, anger, resentment.

Studies show - kids instead of getting their dopamine and cortisol rushes from social interactions, they get it from electronic sources. So where a kid of the 80's (like me) would get a rush from showing up to school with a great outfit, and people would complement you. Kids now days get their mini-rushes from social media. They get excited and depressed by the number of likes and responses they get from posts. How fast people respond, etc.

The problem, is when people become attention seekers - due to wanting that rush (like any drug and dopamine high) - they get irrational. Hearing one of the Kardashians <sp?> going ape-shit crazy because one of their posts only got 10k likes and not 25k like their last one. That is the absolute downside of how the "gamification" of social media and our responses occur.

 

[mordred93]

Fortunately, I most certainly will be.
You don't have to worry, until the leaders start looking young!

Already there .. we have several congress critters (US Representatives and Senators) which are younger than I am.

 

[whichone]

Studies show - kids instead of getting their dopamine and cortisol rushes from social interactions, they get it from electronic sources. So where a kid of the 80's (like me) would get a rush from showing up to school with a great outfit, and people would complement you. Kids now days get their mini-rushes from social media. They get excited and depressed by the number of likes and responses they get from posts. How fast people respond, etc.

Fine, but that's just like changing drug supplier.
They're still taking the same drugs.
They are still producing the same responses to the receipt of dopamine & cortisol.
They just receive it from different methods.
They still smile & laugh when they're happy, cry when sad, they just find happiness & sadness in different things to previous generations.

The problem, is when people become attention seekers - due to wanting that rush (like any drug and dopamine high) - they get irrational. Hearing one of the Kardashians <sp?> going ape-shit crazy because one of their posts only got 10k likes and not 25k like their last one. That is the absolute downside of how the "gamification" of social media and our responses occur.

Yeah, just makes me think of the Mike Judge film, Idiocracy.

 

[QQP_Purple]

Either way you know things are grim when this old man breaks into poetry.

 

[QQP_Purple]

That's actually an excerpt from one of my poems. Well, it's an excerpt from an early draft of it anyway. The finished product is a bit different but I felt this version fit the thread better.

 

[QQP_Purple]

Cool! I like it, it's got a dark feel.

All my poetry is like that. I tend to write a lot about the human condition from that perspective.
These days it's become all too easy for us to pat our self on the back how we are all perfect and saving the world and other crap for making token gestures. And I feel that some times we need that little voice on our shoulder whispering into our ear that we are still but human with all that entails.

 

[QQP_Purple]

We have to acknowledge the darkness, in order to be able to appreciate the light.
If we do not acknowledge the shit, we cannot do anything about it. Heads in the sand.
I think it's the same with all things, too much of anything (even a good thing) is a bad thing.
Life is, for me, about trying to find some balance.

Exactly. We are neither angels nor demons, just men of flesh.

 

[Cartageno]

Usually someone (when I have heard it) is laughing and says LOL .. not spelling it out, but actually say LOL like lull. I cannot recall someone actually using the acronym instead of actually laughing.

It was roughly 20 years ago I actually first encountered this in a guy about my age, amybe a bit younger. He just said this "LOL" (as a word) deadpan. He wasn't deadpan though, just a guy with 24/7 computer stuff - studying IT, then working in it, online games (MUDs, the MMORPGs back then) rest of the time. So it's not that new even.

 

[mordred93]

It was roughly 20 years ago I actually first encountered this in a guy about my age, amybe a bit younger. He just said this "LOL" (as a word) deadpan. He wasn't deadpan though, just a guy with 24/7 computer stuff - studying IT, then working in it, online games (MUDs, the MMORPGs back then) rest of the time. So it's not that new even.

wow - been in IT for 30+ years and never seen it. Deadpan, etc. I would have looked at them and said are you being sarcastic or what ever as you didn't laugh.

 

[mordred93]

To be fair, I did say "leaders".

Spoiler: lol

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When he looks young, you know you're old.

yeah - if DeSantis gets in (I did say IF, not promoting, etc.) then I will be about that age.

 

[Volka]

c't play on IOS, poor game

 

[Cartageno]

wow - been in IT for 30+ years and never seen it. Deadpan, etc. I would have looked at them and said are you being sarcastic or what ever as you didn't laugh.

I know a lot of people from the field (ex gf was one and introduced me to a bunch, including the example mentioned) and nobody else did this but were normal people with normal social cues, even if sitting in front of a screen a lot of the time. Well, there was another extreme example of IT guy being IT guy at university but for a different reason. And as a mathematician myself I probably should watch out for generalizations, so no offence meant to your field of work