VN Ren'Py A Wife and Mother [v0.205] [Lust & Passion]

[GingerSweetGirl]

I think he probably has a little more than just the beginning and ending, but not much more. I imagine the typical outline for a character is something like this:

1. Background/Establishment
2. Major Event 1
3. Major Event 2
4. Major Event 3
5. Conflict
6. Resolution of Conflict
7. End

That sort of outline isn't bad, but it's not nearly sufficient enough. I'm sure that he has some ideas jotted down for each step, but nothing in great detail. And as anyone who has ever written any sort of fiction knows, the devil is in the details. Not only is he struggling with keeping to a plan (probably because his outline isn't detailed enough), but I also suspect that he doesn't have any notes regarding the connective tissue that links each scene together. Not every scene with a character is a major event, but every scene needs to advance the story- and he's having trouble with that. That's ok, writing is hard and there's no shame in that. What's killing him is that he doesn't seem to be making any changes to compensate for it.

 

[fex56]

I'm not in the first 15
but thankfully Bane71 shared his copy with me
View attachment 1199621

Thank you so much bro

 

[Bane71]

Here's a story.
Guy starts making story.
Guy knows how it ends.
Guy has the events thought out only for the next playable day and changes it as he goes.
People didn't like a certain twist? No problem, the script isn't written, guy just removes the twist.
Guy has only some sort of outline until the story ends with MC getting passed like a bycicle.

Guy needs a translator? Sure.
Can the translator have the script beforehand? Nah.
Why can't he? Because there's no script lol. Hence why the translator needs to be 12h for a few days with the Guy. Because that's when the story is being written.
The truth is usually the simplest explanation.


Bane71 your opinion was that a render farm wouldn't have the same quality as L&P rendering. Can you elaborate that opinion and explain how having an iray farm rendering your renders or rendering them yourself has any difference. Thanks.

I will repeat it again, because I believe in L&P. I think he has absolutely no reason to lie to us.

No, hypothetically false is possible, but not in the case of the L&P. The two years that I have been watching AWAM have told me a lot about the L&P itself. He's smart, talented and even though he doesn't reveal much about the upcoming plot. This is no reason for me to doubt his honesty.
The same goes for the rendering farm. I rely on his estimates. L&P says that the farm makes a lot of small mistakes, which then he needs to fix and, in general, bring the picture quality to his requirements.
He does not want to waste his time on using this resource, the poem of a constant conversation on this topic does not make sense.
He does not tell someone else to use the farm or not, he says about himself that this resource does not suit him.
This explanation is enough for me.

I'll tell you more. I see you are taking the first steps in creating 3D art. Don't waste your energy teaching L&P by telling him how to work, get busy with your project. I think this is a reasonable alternative.

 

[Bane71]

And yet, viper6, I have no desire to upset you in any way. I hope my electronic translation is good enough for you to understand.

 

[GingerSweetGirl]

I tell you what Bane71 , you are a true believer to the very end. I really hope your faith is rewarded.

 

[GingerSweetGirl]

Apparently you are misunderstanding something that viper6 or L&P is trying to say. ( Somebody teach me how to tag someone in a message ), farm does not make mistakes. The mistakes are already there when L&P has them and only after rendering he sees those mistakes and then sits to correct them. That's what he said from my understanding. Whether he does or the farm does the mistakes will be there. That's what he needs to minimize with his experience.

And the point is that not every render he makes can have mistakes. The guy is doing rendering for 4 yrs now. Maybe 30-40 can have errors in a batch of 500. But he atleast gets 460 renders completed. He can sit and tweak the 40 himself. The work still gets faster.

If you want to tag someone, use the @ symbol and then type their name, like Sabertooth__

Be careful though, there's a ton of users on this forum so you have to get the name exact.

 

[Talcum Powder]

gingersweetgirl - I didn't know the @ symbol thing - thx

 

[Bane71]

Apparently you are misunderstanding something that viper6 or L&P is trying to say. ( Somebody teach me how to tag someone in a message ), farm does not make mistakes. The mistakes are already there when L&P has them and only after rendering he sees those mistakes and then sits to correct them. That's what he said from my understanding. Whether he does or the farm does the mistakes will be there. That's what he needs to minimize with his experience.

And the point is that not every render he makes can have mistakes. The guy is doing rendering for 4 yrs now. Maybe 30-40 can have errors in a batch of 500. But he atleast gets 460 renders completed. He can sit and tweak the 40 himself. The work still gets faster.

Perhaps I do not understand something correctly. It is human nature to make mistakes. Perhaps my belief in the L&P is also a mistake. I don’t know, the time will show.

Anyway, I wish all of us all the best, as well as the L&P.

 

[Sabertooth__]

If you want to tag someone, use the @ symbol and then type their name, like Sabertooth__

Be careful though, there's a ton of users on this forum so you have to get the name exact.

Thankyou so much gingersweetgirl

 

[Talcum Powder]

Perhaps I do not understand something correctly. It is human nature to make mistakes. Perhaps my belief in the L&P is also a mistake. I don’t know, the time will show.

Anyway, I wish all of us all the best, as well as the L&P.

The point being made is that a render farm can't "make mistakes", it's just a bit of hardware you borrow.

Another way of thinking about it: If you borrow a hammer you can't blame the hammer if a nail bends when it hits a knot in the wood. If you drive a thousand nails it doesn't matter how good a carpenter you are or whose hammer you use, you're going to hit a few knots along the way.

 

[Talcum Powder]

Why don't the fan art devs unite and create an alternative version of the scenes that are coming in the next updates, to put pressure on L&P to do the updates faster?

Yes! Any volunteers for the full day spent at the ranch?! Required Asset

 

[GingerSweetGirl]

Perhaps I do not understand something correctly. It is human nature to make mistakes. Perhaps my belief in the L&P is also a mistake. I don’t know, the time will show.

Anyway, I wish all of us all the best, as well as the L&P.

I think there is a persistent language barrier in this conversation. I get the impression that Bane reads L&P (and us) very literally, while I (and many native English speakers) infer more things from L&P. So I don't really know how to help this conversation.

Here's what I'll say though Bane: Yes everyone makes mistakes, but when it comes to L&P we're talking about "mistakes". L&P strikes me as the kind of guy who looks at his renders, and then looks at them longer, and then looks at them even longer until he finds a "mistake". I put "mistake" in quotes because I don't know how serious to take his ideas of mistakes. I seriously doubt he has deep flaws in any of his images that he renders- but I can totally see him obsessing over the smallest detail and calling it a "mistake". This process almost certainly costs him days for each render that he obsesses over.

This leads me to the render farm. He uses the excuse that he can't use the render farm because of mistakes- but remember, those are "mistakes" in the eyes of someone who is obsessive. In truth, I just don't think L&P wants to give up any control, and is afraid that using a render farm will result in the loss of some control. He would absolutely save time using a render farm, but because of his obsession I don't think he's thinking about it purely logically. I mean this without judgement, but L&P is probably a guy who deals with anxiety (like many of us) and the idea of turning his game over to a render farm is just too much for him. It would explain why every single idea proposed to him has been rejected. Not a single one has been accepted, even partially, it's always "No, this won't work for me." I'm not calling him a liar, I think he's seeing the world very differently than most of us are and is not able to be flexible. I sometimes think that removing the Dylan twist must have been really difficult for him.

 

[Bane71]

The point being made is that a render farm can't "make mistakes", it's just a bit of hardware you borrow.

Another way of thinking about it: If you borrow a hammer you can't blame the hammer if a nail bends when it hits a knot in the wood. If you drive a thousand nails it doesn't matter how good a carpenter you are or whose hammer you use, you're going to hit a few knots along the way.

Thank you, thanks to your explanation, I understand the complaint better.
But that doesn't change my attitude towards L&P. I do not consider it necessary to insist that he turn to this resource.

 

[ashitanojoe]

I'm not in the first 15
but thankfully Bane71 shared his copy with me
View attachment 1199621

Why don't you form a team with other fan art devs and create scenes of the upcomming events? Like a fan AWAM's unofficial version? So, we enjoy AWAM twice. Something similar to what people do with Dragon Ball, there are a lot of fan series between releases.

 

[Talcum Powder]

Thank you, thanks to your explanation, I understand the complaint better.
But that doesn't change my attitude towards L&P. I do not consider it necessary to insist that he turn to this resource.

All good sir, and of course, your attitude towards L&P is well understood.

 

[Bane71]

I think there is a persistent language barrier in this conversation. I get the impression that Bane reads L&P (and us) very literally, while I (and many native English speakers) infer more things from L&P. So I don't really know how to help this conversation.

Here's what I'll say though Bane: Yes everyone makes mistakes, but when it comes to L&P we're talking about "mistakes". L&P strikes me as the kind of guy who looks at his renders, and then looks at them longer, and then looks at them even longer until he finds a "mistake". I put "mistake" in quotes because I don't know how serious to take his ideas of mistakes. I seriously doubt he has deep flaws in any of his images that he renders- but I can totally see him obsessing over the smallest detail and calling it a "mistake". This process almost certainly costs him days for each render that he obsesses over.

This leads me to the render farm. He uses the excuse that he can't use the render farm because of mistakes- but remember, those are "mistakes" in the eyes of someone who is obsessive. In truth, I just don't think L&P wants to give up any control, and is afraid that using a render farm will result in the loss of some control. He would absolutely save time using a render farm, but because of his obsession I don't think he's thinking about it purely logically. I mean this without judgement, but L&P is probably a guy who deals with anxiety (like many of us) and the idea of turning his game over to a render farm is just too much for him. It would explain why every single idea proposed to him has been rejected. Not a single one has been accepted, even partially, it's always "No, this won't work for me." I'm not calling him a liar, I think he's seeing the world very differently than most of us are and is not able to be flexible. I sometimes think that removing the Dylan twist must have been really difficult for him.

Thanks, I really liked this post.

 

[Alley_Cat]

Why don't you form a team with other fan art devs and create scenes of the upcomming events? Like a fan AWAM's unofficial version? So, we enjoy AWAM twice. Something similar to what people do with Dragon Ball, there are a lot of fan series between releases.

The problem with that is that there aren't enough of us working on asset identification in order to do something as simple as Sophia walking down the top floor hallway, or walking into the living room. Or the front lawn

All the assets required for her bedroom haven't even been entirely identified. To my knowledge none of the things on her vanity are known.

 

[BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM]

And yet, viper6, I have no desire to upset you in any way. I hope my electronic translation is good enough for you to understand.

My friend I think you're mixing up some concepts here. A render farm does not create scenes, it only renders them, that's all.
It's quite useful because you can render quickly while your own machine can keep creating scenes (in 1080p any big scene renders in 5-8 min max).

Doesn't really matter as L&P as said he won't use any render farm but I thought I should clear that up.

 

[GingerSweetGirl]

Thank you, thanks to your explanation, I understand the complaint better.
But that doesn't change my attitude towards L&P. I do not consider it necessary to insist that he turn to this resource.

One of the reasons that people are insistent is that L&P has never really given a valid explanation as to why it won't work. He's gone into great detail about the issue with "mistakes", but that's not really a great reason. Any "mistakes" would originate from his work so he can't in good-faith blame the render farm (which it feels like he has tired to do). Secondly, if he has 1,000 renders and 10% of them have a "mistake" that's still 900 renders that came through quickly- he would save boatloads of time even if he needs to tweak the 10% that had a mistake.

So I feel like you're reading his explanation very literally, and it sounds reasonable if you do. But to me, I hear his reasons and they don't answer the question. To me, it sounds like a guy trying to find an excuse because he can't admit that he doesn't want to loosen his grip on the game. I think he really enjoys the tinkering.

At its most fundamental, I think most of us just doubt that his images are really that flawed to begin with. I would like to see some of his drafts/rejected images to see the difference. But if it's anything like the comparison he gave us between 1080 and 720, I think most of us would struggle to see the difference.

L&P could be a great artist. He could have a real future doing CG artwork. I don't know if that skillset translates into making a full VN.

 

[ashitanojoe]

The problem with that is that there aren't enough of us working on asset identification in order to do something as simple as Sophia walking down the top floor hallway, or walking into the living room. Or the front lawn

All the assets required for her bedroom haven't even been entirely identified. To my knowledge none of the things on her vanity are known.

Well, in a fan series not everything needs to look exactly the same, it could be something approximated.