VN Ren'Py Being a DIK [v0.10.1] [DrPinkCake]

[mindern]

With respect, I think you're reading things into her words and actions that are not there. Josy didn't drop the MC until AFTER he stormed out on her.

Josy asked the MC to meet her in the bathroom, and the MC immediately implied she lied to him about her "boyfriend." In response, she said she wanted to explain when she got here and that it shouldn't make any difference if her SO was a boy or a girl. It's only when the MC insists she should have told him all the specific details (including some rather private ones) that she snaps at him. And even after that exchange, her ultimate response is still "What are we going to do...?" [Emphasis mine.]

Clearly she still saw the MC as more than a crutch to be discarded at that point. In comparison, Josy is fairly testy with Maya until they laugh over the diarrhea shit joke, and she still hasn't gotten close enough to tell her about the MC by the time of the library scene. Also, Josy is still trying to patch things up with the MC after that. Whatever Josy said in anger, she clearly cared about him to some extent.

As doing everything she could to encourage the MC's advances, I again disagree. At best, Josy took half the chances. It was Josy called an end to the first date, and she repeatedly poured cold water on things by bringing up her relationship or her own feelings of guilt. On those occasions, it was the MC who did everything he could to encourage her: begging her to stay on the line, letting him see her over the weekend, or saying she must be unhappy in her relationship while on the couch.

I'm certainly not exonerating Josy, but unlike felicemastronzo, I do see the blame split rather equally here. To me, it seems like both Josy and MC liked each other enough that they did things in the heat of the moment that they later felt guilty about. When the whole situation exploded, they both trouble processing that and occasionally took it out on each other.

That's more or less what the game will eventually explain, and IMHO it fits well. YMMV of course, but I don't think there's any evidence to support an interpretation that Josy was deliberately using the MC.

I agree with your overarching point but there's one element you missed. Her decision to live with Maya. She called the MC and asked if she could stay with him and when he turns her down she goes straight to living with Maya. Granted her choices were limited but she clearly had a foot in both camps long before the MC snapped at her.

Like you said, both to blame but if we’re discussing exactly when Josy “dropped” the MC I would argue it’s ambiguous whether the MC storming out forced her hand or if she was leaning towards staying with Maya anyways.

Her first choice was the MC. Living with a guy would kinda be a big fuck you to her girlfriend and be tricky to walk back. Conversely living with her partner is a fairly big indication she didn’t intend to leave Maya quite yet.

It all tracks (in my opinion) with exactly what Josy herself says if you choose to be friends after her conversation with her dad. She had loving feelings for two people and went back and forth on who she wanted to be with. They were all confused and handled it poorly. Josy knew she could be happy with both of them but was afraid so MC walking away in a huff gave her an out. Forced her hand on a decision she wasn’t willing to make. She never used him, she was in two minds and he forced her hand.

still a cheater, and I’m not opening that can of worms again, but that’s a separate issue to her using the MC.

 

[felicemastronzo]

You somehow, Missing the whole Quinn's restaurant, Free tuition plot storyline. Regardless of your involvement with Maya, that is a storyline She is connected to it, so She calling MC after She finally find out its a lie, is a main storyline element, dont you think?
Yeah we could slice this down too, Why MC actually never tell Her what he knows. But it is what it is. But it was about time to have a conclusion to that storyline. I wonder where her journey lead from this

but what does the restaurant have to do with Josy's call?

Maya doesn't talk about it, and she doesn't know anything about it. MC going there continues to know what he knew before.
that the free tuition was little more than a chat everyone knew, Josy is forced to remind Maya

what changes in the overall storyline that MC runs there to ask Maya for the umpteenth time to be honest with him and Maya for the umpteenth time tell us how bad and unreliable her father is?

what use is the presence of MC there for girls? Josy is Maya's girlfriend but she has to call MC otherwise she doesn't know what to do

it is evident that it only serves to bring MC to Maya's father (or at least to make us think that it could happen), to involve him again in a problem not his own.

and you want me to compare this situation to the forced stay at Bella's house?

 

[Deleted member 3006697]

Yes she does not have one because there is no story of her own .

imfaooo why the denial though , i dont get it

Ultimately, I just want my choices to matter and equality between LIs.

However, DPC has other plans like forcing us to go study with M&J at the library, forcing us to play D&G (these 2 have nothing to do with their relationship or the overall story and we are still forced into it), forcing a DIK MC to be buthurt and sad in ep4 etc. (Have in mind that these are views of a Full DIK player) Concluding:

View attachment 960822

I reached my reactions limit for today
Have a reply instead.

 

[Holy Bacchus]

Ultimately, I just want my choices to matter and equality between LIs.

However, DPC has other plans like forcing us to go study with M&J at the library, forcing us to play D&G (these 2 have nothing to do with their relationship or the overall story and we are still forced into it), forcing a DIK MC to be buthurt and sad in ep4 etc. (Have in mind that these are views of a Full DIK player) Concluding:

View attachment 960822

The forced moments are fine so long as aspects of them better reflect the choices made, i.e. dialogue and scene variations. The problem is that certain moments don't have this and they end up creating this feeling of inconsistent and inexplicable behaviour from certain characters involved in them.

come on...

MC goes to Bella to talk to Cathe for the sake of the DIKs, Bella and Jill have nothing to do with it, they just welcome him.

instead then at the end of the sixth chapter you have to run to Maya, called by Josy, to hear the story of the father's ultimatum for the umpteenth time (the details on the loan were of interest to anyone?)

Jill has a problem, a problem that MC has generated, and she is facing it herself (for now)

But some players who have largely avoided both might not have wanted to spend the night with Bella and Jill, so is this not also a forced element? Just because the MC went there of his own volition doesn't mean it's any less forced than going to see M&J after Josy called him, especially if you weren't able to stay with Bella in Ep 4. By the logic of this anti-M&J brigade, the MC should have been able to decide if he went to Bella's or not since the problem they seem to have is that they don't have total control over what the MC does.

In the very beginning of Ep 6, when you are talking with Tommy, right before the major choice, the conversation seems to randomly cut to Vinny for a few lines and then returns to you and Tommy. Is this supposed to play out like this or does my game somehow have a glitch?

Ummmm, no. It's Tommy remembering Vinny doing something similar to what the MC is doing.

Now I'm definitely sure that we are playing different games

Someone here once did literally complain about why their MC went to play the guitar for Jill in Ep 3 when they didn't want to do that because they hadn't been friendly with Jill.

That was a forced element because, NEWSFLASH, this game is majority forced elements, that's what a VN generally is. Just because you don't like forced elements with certain characters doesn't mean that they shouldn't be forced. It's like that way for a reason, namely that it's important for the overal story, so you'd better just suck it up and accept that.

 

[Old&Useless]

I agree with your overarching point but there's one element you missed. Her decision to live with Maya. She called the MC and asked if she could stay with him and when he turns her down she goes straight to living with Maya. Granted her choices were limited but she clearly had a foot in both camps long before the MC snapped at her.

But Josy was assigned that dorm room and would've had no idea who she was sharing with until she arrived there.

 

[Deleted member 3006697]

That was a forced element because, NEWSFLASH, this game is majority forced elements, that's what a VN generally is. Just because you don't like forced elements with certain characters doesn't mean that they shouldn't be forced. It's like that way for a reason, namely that it's important for the overal story, so you'd better just suck it up and accept that.

I'm not even gonna try to explain anything dude...
Banging my head on a wall would be more productive than this

 

[mindern]

But Josy was assigned that dorm room and would've had no idea who she was sharing with until she arrived there.

Josy says she knew Maya didn’t have a room mate and Maya specifically didn’t want the uni to know her room mate didn’t turn up so she got the place to herself.

Josy chose to live there and it would be made official after. She wasn’t assigned it she was just legitimately living there after choosing to do so. Unless I’m missing something.

EDIT: I was wrong. She was assigned it. Misremembered that one.

 

[Holy Bacchus]

I'm not even gonna try to explain anything dude...
Banging my head on a wall would be more productive than this

You don't like M&J and don't want anything to do with them, but this game won't let you do that and you don't like that.
Seems like a fairly simple explanation to me.

 

[ChipLecsap]

but what does the restaurant have to do with Josy's call?

Maya doesn't talk about it, and she doesn't know anything about it. MC going there continues to know what he knew before.
that the free tuition was little more than a chat everyone knew, Josy is forced to remind Maya

what changes in the overall storyline that MC runs there to ask Maya for the umpteenth time to be honest with him and Maya for the umpteenth time tell us how bad and unreliable her father is?

what use is the presence of MC there for girls? Josy is Maya's girlfriend but she has to call MC otherwise she doesn't know what to do

it is evident that it only serves to bring MC to Maya's father (or at least to make us think that it could happen), to involve him again in a problem not his.

and you want me to compare this situation to the forced stay at Bella's house?

I'm sorry , MY english reached its limit. I' have to admit, I lost the track, I don't know what the Fuck you talking about. .
You say MC going talk to Maya and Josy, at the end of ep 6 is forced event, but him going to talk to Caty because he doing it for Diks. , and then spending the night there is not forced event, because its part of the storyline.
I really don't understand where you wanna go with this. its my lack of intelligence probably. but the Whole Hot's scavenger hunt was as much of part of the storyline as much of the Hell week. MC goes and check on Maya has as much of sense as him goind to go to talk to Caty, regardless if you swyp her up or not.
MY point is, you can't call one forced, while the other not forced. lets say its the linear storyline events.
But, I lost the track, sorry , I'm out of this conversation . You right I'm probably wrong , I move on.

 

[ename144]

Well, we can say this as an undeveloped storytelling. This scenario truly only works if MC is indeed involved with Josy and Maya the way it meant to be. In that Case he is also responsible for his own action, like it or not.
if you avoid them completely, then we have some plot holes, on the other hand, those peoples who not care about them, should not bitch about it , just let it drop, they are greatly rewarded, wiht Quinn, Jade and with others .

I do have to admit, I hesitant to call this whole Josy Maya thing to a fiasco. Because after a year and half, this is still one of the most talking controversial topic, if that not good writing I don't know what it is, I mean nobody talk about GoT anymore, after season 8

After playing through the Kira/Robin threesome path in Leap of Faith, I'm inclined to agree with you. I adore LoF, but the relationship between Kira and Robin comes across as extremely shallow, probably to justify the MC being able to either join in or pick either individually without feeling like a homewrecker.

For all its faults, I felt BaDIK did a much better job selling me on M&J's relationship, both in how much it really matters to them, and in how fractured it had become. Allowing the MC to build up a genuine connection with each girl individually when their own relationship was at its weakest and then revealing the whole tangled mess is certainly high on drama. But it does make me buy into the confusion all three parties feel, and thus I can potentially believe that all three people might decide to try for a very unorthodox relationship.

Shame DPC couldn't stick the landing...

Exactly. The perception of these 2 is very much based on how you play it but it is also based on the lack of variation that DPC put in Ep 4 depending on how players approached these 2 characters. I'd also say that the reason it gets talked about so much isn't because of good writing but because of bad writing because almost all the issues some people have with these 2 could have been solved if they had been written better.

I think it's the juxtaposition of extremely good writing in the build-up and extremely week writing in the climax. As I said, I think DPC really sold the MC's interest in each girl, and their interest in him. Plus, by letting us control exactly how far those relationships go while making it clear there ARE feelings no matter what, the player can tailor the situation to best suit their own impression of the girls. Add in the Episode 4 flashback, which nicely demonstrated Maya & Josy's interest in each other, and we had a very effective crisis.

Sadly, the payoff turns most of those strengths against themselves. The MC's reaction is a bit extreme even if he slept with both girls, but it's positively ludicrous if deliberately avoided going to far. The final outcome is focused solely on getting the two girls to apologize to each other, ignoring any the wrongs to (or by) MC entirely and thus making his petulance even more awkward in retrospect. To top things off, the girls can wind up flatly rejecting the MC based on very poorly communicated logic, in which case they will immediately start making out without a second thought as the MC walks away, ensuring the rejection will feel as spiteful as possible.

So yeah, having a decline in quality that sharp in such a short span is always going to draw a response.

you divide the blame equally between them, but what MC says are bullshit, while what Josy says is a very human response ...

You don't consider bullshit a human response on occasion?

If I was unclear, I put it that bluntly to illustrate it from Josy's POV; the MC is obsessed over minor details that shouldn't matter to him (Josy being in a same-sex relationship), or blaming her for not somehow knowing the MC knew Maya. I definitely get why the MC was feeling so hurt in the moment and I don't hold it against him any more than I do Josy's anger (or Maya hiding her relationship, for that matter). Sorry if it seemed otherwise.

(Well, that assuming the MC slept with both of them, that is. As I said above, if the MC chose to respect Josy's relationship, and didn't make advances on Maya (as she originally asked him not to), then I really do think his histrionics are utterly uncalled for.)

 

[Holy Bacchus]

Josy says she knew Maya didn’t have a room mate and Maya specifically didn’t want the uni to know her room mate didn’t turn up so she got the place to herself.

Josy chose to live there and it would be made official after. She wasn’t assigned it she was just legitimately living there after choosing to do so. Unless I’m missing something.

I don't recall Josy ever saying that. In Ep 4 she says that the receptionist told her there was a room with a spare bed because the person who had been assigned it hadn't shown up, but I don't remember it ever being said that Josy knew who was in the room or that Maya had no roommate.

She did choose to stay in that room, yes, but what else was she going to do? There was nowhere else for her to go and she technically had been assigned it by way of this other student not showing up and the receptionist presumably assigning Josy's name to it on the system.

 

[anonymoussposter]

I'm not even gonna try to explain anything dude...
Banging my head on a wall would be more productive than this

for some it is all about one character and her story . fuck mc ,josy her story etc. , fuck logic

jeez why even have her as a LI when you have to make her maya's side bitch

it is not too hard to understand
if she is a LI then give her a story of her own . Her character was affiliated to DIK path according to choices and her points . and now you cant even have her on that path . it just does not make any sense . ofcourse it can change in future update but for now it is what it is

 

[mindern]

I don't recall Josy ever saying that. In Ep 4 she says that the receptionist told her there was a room with a spare bed because the person who had been assigned it hadn't shown up, but I don't remember it ever being said that Josy knew who was in the room or that Maya had no roommate.

She did choose to stay in that room, yes, but what else was she going to do? There was nowhere else for her to go and she technically had been assigned it by way of this other student not showing up and the receptionist presumably assigning Josy's name to it on the system.

I checked, i was wrong she was assigned it. She also said she didn't plan to live together. I was entirely misremembering it.

 

[ename144]

Josy says she knew Maya didn’t have a room mate and Maya specifically didn’t want the uni to know her room mate didn’t turn up so she got the place to herself.

Josy chose to live there and it would be made official after. She wasn’t assigned it she was just legitimately living there after choosing to do so. Unless I’m missing something.

That's not correct. Josy asked the MC for his room number and he declined. Josy then got assigned a room randomly when she arrived, which turned out to be Maya's.

I suppose you could say Josy is lying, but there's no proof to support that. Given that Josy had no reason to seek out Maya at that time and was clearly surprised by both Maya and the MC, I take see this as pretty clear cut.

 

[ChipLecsap]

for some it is all about one character and her story . fuck mc ,josy her story etc. , fuck logic

jeez why even have her as a LI when you have to make her maya's side bitch

it is not too hard to understand
if she is a LI then give her a story of her own . Her character was affiliated to DIK path according to choices and her points . and now you cant even have her on that path . it just does not make any sense . ofcourse it can change in future update but for now it is what it is

The only dik points she liked was the nasty joke, and the dicks draw on steve face. but if you had Dik status during the date, and try to flirt with her, She calls you out that you act like Steve, minus relationship point.
Still ,there is not set in stone that you won't have solo route with her. as of right now, She does lack of her own content, no disagreement on that part.

 

[ename144]

Ah shit.
Never selected the throuple option.
But nice scene tho. I love it.

You don't need to be on the M&J path for Josy to kick Tommy, you just need to not fight him. (That said, you'll never get the explanation as friends. Tommy will just have an ice pack on his groin during the birthday party, and that's the end of it. Even funnier, in a way!)

How do allocate this? I put randomly to everyone? Make it even?
Is there a tutorial on how to work this in the best way?

View attachment 960718

It's too soon to know for sure, but the quick explanation is that you want to get the DIKs as many points as you can as fast as possible. The best way to do that is to start out with them working on the mansion in three-man groups, and ideally you want them to finish whatever room the group it working on. So find rooms that can be completed and then use the points you have to let each group finish a room with as few wasted points as possible.

It's unclear whether you're better off distributing the points or concentrating them. I favor concentrating, since I think that will make it easier to transition a few DIKs to high paying jobs in the later rounds. But for now, I'd suggest playing around and seeing what works.

If you want more details, fakitap did a lot of work on this, as did BadAssPutin here (and follow-up).

 

[scarp1]

Ultimately, I just want my choices to matter and equality between LIs.

However, DPC has other plans like forcing us to go study with M&J at the library, forcing us to play D&G (these 2 have nothing to do with their relationship or the overall story and we are still forced into it), forcing a DIK MC to be buthurt and sad in ep4 etc. (Have in mind that these are views of a Full DIK player) Concluding:

View attachment 960822

The majority of the story will be what DPC wants, it's his project, story, it his ideas.

How is the library or D&G bit forcing anything on you if your not on Maya & Josy path? The D&G part is something DPC wants in the game, part of the Nerds I guess as they have limited involvement. Doesn't effect your LI path in anyway, doesn't force you into anything at all, its just a part of the game.

Same with the library part, just a small study session, so yes its part of the overall story as we are in a school and do studies and it just leads up to the free roam part where you talk to various characters to progress other parts of the story.

The Maya bit when you talk to her in the library only happens on her route, you aren't forced into it, just doesn't happen if you aren't on her route.

If you take out parts of the game like you say then the game will be extremely short, plus DPC can't just write it how you may want it as you aren't the only one playing it.
If you were forced into a Josy & Maya plus the rest of the library gangbang then yes, its forced, a small study session isn't forcing anything, just part of school life really.
Small bits like that add to the overall game, otherwise its just, make a few choices, sex, make a few choices sex, repeat until the next update, then the same again.

 

[Holy Bacchus]

I think it's the juxtaposition of extremely good writing in the build-up and extremely week writing in the climax. As I said, I think DPC really sold the MC's interest in each girl, and their interest in him. Plus, by letting us control exactly how far those relationships go while making it clear there ARE feelings no matter what, the player can tailor the situation to best suit their own impression of the girls. Add in the Episode 4 flashback, which nicely demonstrated Maya & Josy's interest in each other, and we had a very effective crisis.

Sadly, the payoff turns most of those strengths against themselves. The MC's reaction is a bit extreme even if he slept with both girls, but it's positively ludicrous if deliberately avoided going to far. The final outcome is focused solely on getting the two girls to apologize to each other, ignoring any the wrongs to (or by) MC entirely and thus making his petulance even more awkward in retrospect. To top things off, the girls can wind up flatly rejecting the MC based on very poorly communicated logic, in which case they will immediately start making out without a second thought as the MC walks away, ensuring the rejection will feel as spiteful as possible.

So yeah, having a decline in quality that sharp in such a short span is always going to draw a response.

I think it's the fact that, by allowing the MC to choose how far he goes with each girl, having it play out exactly the same way no matter what you did is where it went wrong and I also think it wasn't made clear what the MC was feeling towards these 2 girls.

In Ep 6, we get the MC doing some inner reflection on his womanising if he goes on the date with Jill, but we can only assume what he was feeling about Josy and Maya before Josy shows up, particularly if he went as far as he could with each of them prior to the end scene of Ep 3. Having a bit more introspection in that episode would have been good, specifically after his call with Josy because now he knows she's coming, he knows he's going have to make some choices and to see what he thought about each of them would have helped here. There could have been different reactions, but I feel like he did like both of them and so hearing this about them was too much for him so he justifiably had to get out of there. Perhaps, some of what he said could have been different, but his reaction was somewhat OK.

The end of Ep 4 is the part that really should have reflected better how far he went with them and the fact that they kiss and make up so easily regardless of if you did everything or nothing is what will always be wrong with this scene. That and them rejecting him on the DIK if he did everything with them because in that case it would have been better if he automatically chose friendship as that seems much more in-line with what a DIK MC would do.

for some it is all about one character and her story . fuck mc ,josy her story etc. , fuck logic

jeez why even have her as a LI when you have to make her maya's side bitch

it is not too hard to understand
if she is a LI then give her a story of her own . Her character was affiliated to DIK path according to choices and her points . and now you cant even have her on that path . it just does not make any sense . ofcourse it can change in future update but for now it is what it is

LIs don't always have to be separate entities. There are games where a LI is the friend of another LI and the friend's interactions with the MC come almost entirely through their connection to the other LI, and there are also games like this where 2 LIs are linked because they're already in a relationship. The latter obviously applies to Josy but it doesn't make her less of a LI or make her anyone's "side bitch", it just means that she and Maya are a package deal that may be separately pursuable later on, but for now they're not.

You don't need to be on the M&J path for Josy to kick Tommy, you just need to not fight him. (That said, you'll never get the explanation as friends. Tommy will just have an ice pack on his groin during the birthday party, and that's the end of it. Even funnier, in a way!)

Really wish we got that scene even if you did fight him because he threw the first punch after all, so I could still see Josy wanting to kick his balls for starting the fight.

 

[Hurensohn Heigl]

How do allocate this? I put randomly to everyone? Make it even?
Is there a tutorial on how to work this in the best way?

View attachment 960718

You don't need to be on the M&J path for Josy to kick Tommy, you just need to not fight him. (That said, you'll never get the explanation as friends. Tommy will just have an ice pack on his groin during the birthday party, and that's the end of it. Even funnier, in a way!)



It's too soon to know for sure, but the quick explanation is that you want to get the DIKs as many points as you can as fast as possible. The best way to do that is to start out with them working on the mansion in three-man groups, and ideally you want them to finish whatever room the group it working on. So find rooms that can be completed and then use the points you have to let each group finish a room with as few wasted points as possible.

It's unclear whether you're better off distributing the points or concentrating them. I favor concentrating, since I think that will make it easier to transition a few DIKs to high paying jobs in the later rounds. But for now, I'd suggest playing around and seeing what works.

If you want more details, fakitap did a lot of work on this, as did BadAssPutin here (and follow-up).

Thanks ename144 for not forgetting about me
Indeed, I haven't forgotten about that task as well and am still working on a brute force of the task.
Long story short: a most suitable allocation plan should follow within this week as I figured out a way to brute force this task. I have three paths in the close selection and will post another giant (and extremely boring) post once the best one has cleared out. Feel free to question and debate my methodology once I have dropped the new post.
[Of course, I have included the insights of ename144 and fakitap]

TheReDeeMeR and others: I have simplified the excel template that I have attached to this post to make it very quick to react to any story driven changes or your personal game play style (DIK, CHICK, Neutral). Please find it here.
View attachment Mansion Work Optimization F95.7z
It is for Excel and unfortunately NOT compatible with any other Office Software due to the check boxes...
Explanation in the previous post. Main differences:
- Dropbown Menue for DUMPSTER with two options: Dumpster full or not at all. Bonus includes base points of 1000 for each task being worked on.
- Stats of DIKs for next turn is calculated automatically, just copy it into the first tab (copy values only)
- XP available in next turn is calculated automatically
- Added three restrictions: No Singles, No Doubles and No Triples. If you want to restrict your choicing towards only groups of 3 (like it is superior to do in the first round after the tutorial), you can tick both other restrictions and only groups of three's are selected.

Any questions, please let me know. More information when I have more time and hopefully finished my next pseudo-research

 

[Razrback16]

how do you "know" him? Please, indulge us. P L E A S E. All you did was, just like almost everyone here, play Acting Lessons. Do you live in the same house with him? Are you his friend? Do you even know his name and age? Did you have a discussion with him about his vision in writing?

Let me guess : No. For the love of sweet god, please stop acting like you know everything about a writer because you are aware of his ONE previous work. When he explicitly stated this game will have a light theme. Someone dying by overdose/murder/suicide is not very light, don't you think? There are other ways of making the reader feel bad/sad/sorry without killing a character off. Hoping for something to happen and trying to create a sensible context for it ain't gonna work either. Sorry.

First, don't be a jerk. We're all fans of the game and enjoy chatting about it. I'm sure you can act like an adult and have a friendly discussion even in disagreement on a given topic.

Second, all we have to go off of is his first game (which consisted of some pretty emotionally devastating content) and the disclaimer at the beginning of this game asks specifically if you're familiar with his previous work and later notes that he wants you to know what you're getting into, which indicates that we may want to use the author's previous work, as well as the events as they are unfolding so far in this game (which include significant crime such as heavy drug use, dealing, prostitution, coercion, etc.) as reasonable points of reference on what to expect.

No one knows what's going to happen, not me, and not you, but I wouldn't be shocked if something bad happens to Quinn or other characters, even though I don't want it to happen. Hopefully this one WILL be lighter, but so far it's not on that trajectory. AL didn't seem dark at all to me, relatively light-hearted up until the back end of the game where the shit hit the proverbial fan. But because of AL, and the disclaimer at the beginning of BaD, you're going to see people make hyperbolic comments and jokes about where things may head for certain characters.