VN Ren'Py Being a DIK [v0.11.1] [DrPinkCake]

[shazba]

But tehnically that is NOT true. Solo Jill chick MC who pursued only her and had Sage only as a friend will be dumped. That is the crux of this particular game design problem.

How is it a game design problem when you don't have to make the wrong choice?

I'd understand it if you were on both paths, Sage rang first, mc commits to visit her, Jill shows up and the mc says outright, with no player input, "Sorry, got prior arrangements."

But you can choose. So choose the outcome you want. But you don't get to blow Jill off at that moment and have sex with her later.

 

[Kellermann]

Sage isn't dying

At the time, we don't know that. She could have monkeypox for all we know.

I have to laugh at the number of people who are like, "He promised Sage...!" He "promised" her? "Promised"? What are we, fucking primary school children? His exact words, "Of course. I'll be over in a bit."

You're not thinking about this from the perspective of a pure Chick MC as I was playing it. A word is given, and the word is to be honoured. On an evil DIK playthrough on the other hand, I wouldn't even call Sage back to cancel, I'd just ghost her and go try to get some picnic pussy. Actually, my evil MC wouldn't help a sick friend in the first place.

But going back to the heart of the matter, it's not bad design for DPC to do this. People are 100% hung up on believing it's a Chick thing to tell Jill to fuck off and go hang with a sick (girl)friend, and therefore chick-loving Jill should accept it and there shouldn't be a bump in their relationship.

That is not exactly how it went down. As previously stated, on my playthrough I dated no one else, I wasn't playing the field and there was no expectation of sex from anyone (sick Sage or virgin Jill). So you're not telling Jill to fuck off while you "hang with a sick girlfriend." Moreover, you are not rejecting Jill, you are just informing her of a prior commitment at a specific time. If this were any kind of realistic scenario, you would say, "sure a picnic sounds nice. I just have to check in on my sick friend who just called me for help and I'll meet you at your vehicle at 4pm. In fact, you can come along if you want...I know how much you like to help the helpless riiiiight?"

That's how normal people handle schedule conflicts. You don't ditch your sick friend and you also don't tell your girl of interest to fuck off. A normal human response from Jill would be, "great, see you at 4pm." Done. That is how dates are made. It usually goes...hey let's have dinner on Friday, 7pm at Dorsia, sound good to you? Oh? You're waxing your caterpillar eyebrows and that monster bush right then? Ok, how about Saturday? Yeah? Cool, can't wait to see you then. Ciao.

I wonder if Jill pulled any of this shit with my bro Rusty. She deserves whatever she got on that date with him.

The mc's exact response when hit with the dilemma:

mc: "(I told Sage I'd come take care of her... Fuck.)"​

mc: "(Now I feel bad... Who am I gonna let down?)"​

On the one hand, he'd made plans with Sage first, so, first in best dressed.

On the other hand, Jill was all excited and had gone to some effort to do something nice for him, so she would likely be hurt more if he let her down.

Yeah? And I was all excited to get a blowjob in the sauna on my Bella playthrough until I got cockblocked by a certain prude. Well shit happens...or doesn't in this case.

Regarding the mc saving Jill's bacon at the concert, while that was a fucking awesome thing for him to do for her, it was 100% not expected of him (of course we expected it, but none of the characters would have dreamed of him doing such a thing). If Jill fails spectacularly, it's not the mc's fault and no one in the game would even consider to hold him accountable.

Precisely because it wasn't expected is why it should be all the more endearing to Jill.

So just because he does save her ass, should it change all her previous feelings for him? At that point he'd missed the picnic, the run, the dinner date, their relationship had only gone down by that point. At the back of her mind are red flags that she'd already accumulated - his getting into fights, breaking into the mansion, setting off the sprinklers (imagine if he'd fucked up her piano), egging the preps...

Yes, exactly she should. Throwing pebbles and climbing Jill's balcony may be the most romantic, but the concert is something close to Jill's heart and MC doing what he did shows all the qualities Jill is looking for in a love (at least more than picnic): knight in shining armour to pick her up when she falls, considerate because MC knows her music is important so he practices that mindnumbing song, romantic because they share a duet on stage, and finally destiny...all the stars and everything aligned on that very magical night; The concert itself, MC being there ready to guitar, Jill starting her ovulation, Felice sending me his nudes, Lost&Damned fighting me 1v1 irl...etc.

The picnic is it for Jill, nothing else listed after that takes any precedence. All of those red flags you listed are also present for an MC who attends the picnic and completely overlooked, so it is the picnic which is the only deciding factor. We can't deny the way DPC coded it.

So of course DPC is human, and he has made mistakes in the game, but I don't accept this is one of them. And I definitely refute that he is "like the rest of us". If that were the case, this game would be the norm, not the exception.

I don't think it is that much of a mistake; it was intentional...and stupid. DPC was running out of time (Crossroads on the horizon) and needed a single decision point with Jill. His preferred method is to have the two women involved, so he threw this picnic together and there we have it. Same thing with dumbass Cathy taking her panties off to give a blowjob (and leaving them in car). The hour was getting late and DPC needed a quick decisive moment to break off the playboys from the true Bella believers.

Essentially, everything comes down to Crossroads. Things needed to happen as they did so the ep. 8 choice could be made so the ep. 9 temptations could begin. ep. 10 cheating is revealed. ep. 11 the breakup. ep. 12 the reuniting.

 

[Geralt From Rivia]

I just dont get it how you dont get it??? And you are smart dude! And gosh darnit, I agree with the gist of what you are saying. I truly do. I actually love the way you break the game's characters, their motivations and shit in your long worded posts. But ... the simple truth is this: DPC designed the game in a way where you can actually play like a DIK and still get Jill. Without mods or cheating you can balance the game to have a solid amount of sex with other girls, you can beat the shit out of other people, humiliate them even, hell you can even choose to NOT help Jill during one the most important moments in her life (Concert). And Jill ignores all that and accepts you as a boyfriend, has sex with you. All you had to do was be a major DIK to a sick friend and little Jillybean is happy. It feels out of character.

That picnic variable has to much power. On the other hand you can devote your entire playthrough to her, max the chick stats, be her knight in shining armor during the concert, but god forbid you choose to take care of your sick friend, then Jillybean moans that you were not there for her more often. It just bad game design for that particular choice. Period.

I mean you can stan some more for DPC instead admitting that he is just a human being like the rest of us capable of making mistakes. Burning mistakes actually.

Unless... you are DPC!
View attachment 1913142

Or Jill AI herself that somehow became conscious and is now spending her time on porn forum where it all began.
View attachment 1913150

Anyway, hope you see what Kellerman and I tried to communicate. Peace.

You steel need to be a CHICK or Neutral when Jill makes her decision in episode 7. If after you leave the mansion she doesn't masturbate to the Tremolo pic, that's it, that's the end. It's just not possible if you have DIK status. Jill's way... it's just hell, you just have to balance on everything... Really the hardest of the major LIs. I was able to get through it only by downloading the guide. After that, I don’t really like the fastidious princess.

 

[NebulousShooter]

Ok, new fighting topic. Do you think MC loves Jill the most(when you're pursuing her, obv), or why do you think she is the only LI that auto cockblocks you, like missing out on mommy Nicole and the crackhead with glorious breasts threesome?

 

[godkingxerxes]

You steel need to be a CHICK or Neutral when Jill makes her decision in episode 7. If after you leave the mansion she doesn't masturbate to the Tremolo pic, that's it, that's the end. It's just not possible if you have DIK status. Jill's way... it's just hell, you just have to balance on everything... Really the hardest of the major LIs. I was able to get through it only by downloading the guide. After that, I don’t really like the fastidious princess.

DIK status is OK, DIK affinity is not.

My Jill run is DIK status, and Neutral affinity. And a more DIK leaning Neutral at that, but I don't believe that will factor in anytime soon.

 

[dalli_x]

You are supposed to visit me for this feeling.



I used to think it a design mistake such as forgetting to add in a failsafe variable, but it is clear to me now that DPC wanted it this way with Jill from the beginning. He does the same thing with other girls (one false selection and you're out). A good example is with Bella and the Cathy blowjob. It is one of the most critical decisions you can make with Bella's route. That one, however, is completely reasonable and understandable. Of course Bella is not going to want to have a relationship with you if you are getting sucked off by rival MILfs. I receive exactly what I deserve with that choice.

Getting back to Jill, however, it is not so much the picnic itself that irritates me, as it is the concert. That concert is long established as one of Jill's primary personal concerns (the other being: helping those in need, *ahem* you know, like an appointment to a sick person!). And I practiced that stupid fucking song for an entire season. It is the concert, not a spur of the moment picnic that can be thrown together in 10 minutes, that should be the critical decision in Jill's path. If a woman can't love you after being her personal saviour at her moment of greatest need in a romantic concert setting then she is incapable of love. (#INowStandWithRusty, #RustyDidNothingWrong). But then to callously cast MC aside after his noble display at said concert is a Quinn level of non-broccoli pure evil.
An evil Jill might be nice to have now that I think about it.
As long as she does anal.

But why then did DPC not use the concert as the defining moment? Well because there is not enough drama in that decision. it is too easy. It needed to be something juicer, in particular a choice between two women (a favoured tactic of DPC). And that is why he made the picnic and not concert the watershed moment in Jill's route.

I assume so that the concert is another crucial moment for the BaDIK and MC story and Jill is only the secondary priority.

Primary will be so that he helped Jill. In doing so, he will be seen by several people. Amelia and probably the daughters of Miranda and Vivian. The guy with the ring could be Geoff. The MC, for example, also has more reactions than Jill to Rooster.

In my opinion, preventing the Jill and Tybalt date would have been the perfect time. But DPC probably wanted the shock moment for the players here.

 

[Geralt From Rivia]

Ok, new fighting topic. Do you think MC loves Jill the most(when you're pursuing her, obv), or why do you think she is the only LI that auto cockblocks you, like missing out on mommy Nicole and the crackhead with glorious breasts threesome?

Then I'll start. Why is Jill leaving Tremolo? I turn to psychology. Let's remember that Jill is a perfectionist. Everything has to be perfect for her. Her performance must be perfect, she notices that she missed a couple of notes. No one in the audience will understand this, but it is important for her and she is afraid of embarrassing herself, she has developed stage fright. The first sex should be perfect, like in a love soap opera. These were examples, they show Jill's personality.
This is how her family raised her, this is how Royce should be - an ideal, exemplary royal family. And Princess Royce has to be perfect.
Tremolo should be perfect in her understanding - a well-mannered young man who pleases her in everything, will pay all attention to his princess. He should be with her at her first request. Gone to help a sick friend? All game over. Unfortunately, Jill's rebellious ego, although there is, is very weak. Only at the end of the second season does she open it, breaking Tybalt's game. But it is too weak to accept a guy who plays by his own rules, who does not idolize her and does not please her in everything. She is not Lana, who would accept Tremolo-DIK with joy. This is still a Disney princess who needs a decent prince, even a poor one.
And it's sad. I would love to see rebel Jill smoking weed, hanging out with Tremolo at a DIK's party, playing dildo spins and dressing like her sister. I would love to see her break out of Royce's oppression and become free and independent, to hell with all the rules.

 

[dalli_x]

She having a flu, All she need is a handkerchief and coldrex , and she is in a place with full of friends around her.
The only thing that is annoying about this, is that MC automatically tell her, he gonna visit her.
I don't know why folks make it this to be bigger than what it is. Girl you like show, up, ask you out on a date, you reject her, and she took it as you are not interested in her, simple.

If it was Mc's father who is sick, and Jill not understanding, I total get you point, but Sage is just a random girl , MC dating with multiple girls, Jill know this. She might simply not belive this and see it as an exuse.

And I know, it's not only unheard but it never even ever happened, that someone cancels a previous plan, over a better opportunity.

There may be another way of looking at it. Jill reproaches Tybalt in EP8 so that he wants to control her and also wants to tell her which friends she is allowed to have.

The MC helps his friend Sage when she is sick in bed and Jill takes distance from the MC. I wonder if Jill wants to control which friends the MC is allowed to have?

Personally, I would not let that be dictated to me.

 

[dalli_x]

as we discussed this like a million times. The picnic date itself is the turning point, the things that happens there what makes MC important to Jill. - If we of course forget the Stupid affinity thing - .
It is really not that hard, to see this. All the little things you do, is simply the build up, for her to invite MC to the picnic, and then what happens there is the deciding factor, But if that not happens, then Jill does not get a confirmation from her heart, so to speak.
Jill is conflicted with her feeling toward MC, and Tybalt's shenanigans not helping to dismiss the insecurity. You are assuming that MC is already someone special for Jill, when he actually became someone special to her after the picnick and not before.

It may be that the picnic makes the MC important to Jill, but then I have to wonder why she wants to have a picnic with the MC, because he wasn't important enough to Jill before the picnic.

According to this, Jill wanted to use the picnic to find out if the MC had feelings for her. But she could have found that out at a later time (picnic). And here is the problem.

Either the MC wasn't that important to Jill or Jill is a hypocrite because she always acts like she wants the best for people, but only for those who are worthy in her eyes, and Sage is not one of them. Jill has a double standard, she only cares about her tape measure and she doesn't care about the other tape measure.

I personally have a problem with that and that's why Jill only becomes a good friend to my MC.

 

[sixart]

The MC helps his friend Sage when she is sick in bed and Jill takes distance from the MC. I wonder if Jill wants to control which friends the MC is allowed to have?

And what if she does ? There are types that won't stand by as you are piece by piece put together a harem in the background... This whole bullshit starts with a lie from you the player... you were asked if you wanted to fight for Jill and you must have clicked yes... later when a dumb bimbo in her depressed state sat outside in heavy rain ( you even warn her she might catch a cold possibly ) and face the consequences gettick sick ( common cold which is also a type of the corona family ) you run to HER instead of staying with who you wanted to fight for ??? What sorta bullshit is this ?! And I read above monkeypox as well... JFC

Game theory mind and real life don't mesh well and as it shows this causes this easy situation to become this complicated for the masses

 

[sixart]

According to this, Jill wanted to use the picnic to find out if the MC had feelings for her. But she could have found that out at a later time (picnic). And here is the problem.

Either the MC wasn't that important to Jill or Jill is a hypocrite because she always acts like she wants the best for people, but only for those who are worthy in her eyes, and Sage is not one of them. Jill has a double standard, she only cares about her tape measure and she doesn't care about the other tape measure.

Seriously... have you met a flesh and blood woman ?!

 

[NebulousShooter]

The only thing that is annoying about this, is that MC automatically tell her, he gonna visit her.

later when a dumb bimbo in her depressed state sat outside in heavy rain ( you even warn her she might catch a cold possibly )

Say that again to my face!

 

[NebulousShooter]

My argument is based on a rare kind of selfishness I think she is displaying. This is not the usual egotistical selfishness of the nasty kind thats common in media but its the reverse one. The goodhearted one thats rare... whats the word... childlike? guileless? whatever. A selfishness that doesnt consider consequences, unknown circumstances or hidden feelings of others but acts for something greater in life. To Jill life is straightforward "Act for the greater good, I bring forth the greater good, and all will be good." She just doesnt think the middle part of that sentence, shes not even aware of it. Shes compelled to act and follow dEsTiNy over reality imo.

Jill reminds me of those self proclaimed empaths on twitter.

 

[dalli_x]

Seriously... have you met a flesh and blood woman ?!

Seriously! I have fucked in my Sturm und Drang phase more than others have pissed. But I differentiated women based on whether I just wanted to fuck them or wanted a relationship with them.

The Jill character implies to me that a relationship with the MC will only result in the MC having sex on a date basis. Jill's tape measure is used.

Jill: "MC honey, we still need to plan our monthly coitus."
MC: "Yeah, okay, how about Saturday?"
Jill: "Honey, we can't on Saturday because we've been invited to B&R DnG 3."
MC: "Sunday then?"
Jill: "Sorry Dear. But then we're invited to my parents' house for dinner."
MC: "When then?"
Jill: "If nothing comes up, I can reserve another hour for us at the end of the month."
MC: "Then give me the date."

Spoiler

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Josy, on the other hand, is the right girl, which is what I want for my MC, because that's how I imagine a relationship to be. The MC grabs Josy's hot ass and they both just get horny for each other. So a relationship must be for me.

 

[sixart]

Seriously! I have fucked in my Sturm und Drang phase more than others have pissed. But I differentiated women based on whether I just wanted to fuck them or wanted a relationship with them.

See ? This is where you took the wrong turn too ! The question wasn't aimed at how many have you fucked or considered as a possible relationship material... Ehh whatever I see this will drag on years after the game is actually completed...

 

[sixart]

View attachment 1913934

Say that again to my face!

later when a dumb bimbo in her depressed state sat outside in heavy rain ( you even warn her she might catch a cold possibly

 

[dalli_x]

See ? This is where you took the wrong turn too ! The question wasn't aimed at how many have you fucked or considered as a possible relationship material... Ehh whatever I see this will drag on years after the game is actually completed...

The translator has translated your initial question into the garammatic past tense. Ergo, I answered with the experiences of my past.

But to satisfy your curiosity, I am in a relationship with a woman and at work I meet more women of any age than I care to.

No I am not a porn actor.

 

[mommysboiii]

In Season 3 now that MC has a girlfriend it would be a great time to add NTR.

This game will never have realism sorry mate. I mean from a render, music and story perspective this game is a 11/10 but it all goes into the garbage if you look at the gameworld compared too our red string,long story short or where it all began look for example at all (partys) you can take a loot at the hots party and switch the cheracters with the nerds you would not notice it and thats bad for the cheracter identity or take girls like quinn or sage that would normally be competly different than bella for example but they all act very simmular and this destroys the game world for me I understand why the dev does this thinks for the harem fantasy and blablabla but I think the dev destroys his own game world and the immersion with this and he is trying hard with music and all that stuff too make the game more immersive which I dont understand too be honest.

 

[lipe2410]

This game will never have realism sorry mate. I mean from a render, music and story perspective this game is a 11/10 but it all goes into the garbage if you look at the gameworld compared too our red string,long story short or where it all began look for example at all (partys) you can take a loot at the hots party and switch the cheracters with the nerds you would not notice it and thats bad for the cheracter identity or take girls like quinn or sage that would normally be competly different than bella for example but they all act very simmular and this destroys the game world for me I understand why the dev does this thinks for the harem fantasy and blablabla but I think the dev destroys his own game world and the immersion with this and he is trying hard with music and all that stuff too make the game more immersive which I dont understand too be honest.

>Realism
>Porn/Adult AVNs

Choose one.

 

[Geralt From Rivia]

This game will never have realism sorry mate. I mean from a render, music and story perspective this game is a 11/10 but it all goes into the garbage if you look at the gameworld compared too our red string,long story short or where it all began look for example at all (partys) you can take a loot at the hots party and switch the cheracters with the nerds you would not notice it and thats bad for the cheracter identity or take girls like quinn or sage that would normally be competly different than bella for example but they all act very simmular and this destroys the game world for me I understand why the dev does this thinks for the harem fantasy and blablabla but I think the dev destroys his own game world and the immersion with this and he is trying hard with music and all that stuff too make the game more immersive which I dont understand too be honest.

Take it easy. This is an alternate reality where things work differently than in our world. And it's a very well-written reality. A world that you want to escape to while looking at the madness of 2022. Really, this is a very good pocket universe in which to hide.