RenH

Active Member
Nov 5, 2020
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I am kind of curious. What would your guys ideal CoC2 Competitor be like? A lot of CoC-esque games usually die down really fast, so I was wondering - if they somehow didn't, how could they improve the issues CoC2 has?
Honestly? A much more fleshed out CoC with the look and UI of CoC2 would be the most ideal CoC2 competitor, imo. The story is simple and straightforward, yet it never feels underdeveloped. Nor does the combat feel bogged down or clunky despite the core focus being the delivery of a power fantasy and porn. There are fewer characters yet each one is distinct and memorable. Player agency is also respected as your actions and choices really do matter. Corruption actually matters. It's also okay to mod for. TFs actually have an impact on your character's stats instead of mere flavor text. Your kids with some NPCs aren't just bean counter numbers.

I could go on and on but I think that should get the point across.
 
Nov 24, 2020
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Honestly? A much more fleshed out CoC with the look and UI of CoC2 would be the most ideal CoC2 competitor, imo. The story is simple and straightforward, yet it never feels underdeveloped. Nor does the combat feel bogged down or clunky despite the core focus being the delivery of a power fantasy and porn. There are fewer characters yet each one is distinct and memorable. Player agency is also respected as your actions and choices really do matter. Corruption actually matters. It's also okay to mod for. TFs actually have an impact on your character's stats instead of mere flavor text. Your kids with some NPCs aren't just bean counter numbers.

I could go on and on but I think that should get the point across.
This is a good take, however, I am sort of curious about one point. If I am not wrong - the reason why TFs in CoC2 are purely cosmetic is related to the fact that CoC1 had a lot of players metagaming the TFs for combat benefits. People transformed not because they liked it, but because it makes the combat easier. I am wondering if you could balance something like this or if Savin and his team overestimated the amount of people who did that in CoC1 and removed it in 2.
 
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NODOGAN

Well-Known Member
Dec 11, 2017
1,393
2,169
Honestly? A much more fleshed out CoC with the look and UI of CoC2 would be the most ideal CoC2 competitor, imo. The story is simple and straightforward, yet it never feels underdeveloped. Nor does the combat feel bogged down or clunky despite the core focus being the delivery of a power fantasy and porn. There are fewer characters yet each one is distinct and memorable. Player agency is also respected as your actions and choices really do matter. Corruption actually matters. It's also okay to mod for. TFs actually have an impact on your character's stats instead of mere flavor text. Your kids with some NPCs aren't just bean counter numbers.

I could go on and on but I think that should get the point across.
Also if I remember correctly you could max your entire stats (further feeding the power fantasy) and you could adventure solo since combats were balanced to allow single characters to survive.
 

muschi26

Engaged Member
Jun 22, 2019
2,722
4,089
Yeah, I think the best thing a dev team coming up with a competitor to CoC2 could do is fully plan out the story (main and side), as well as (most) characters beforehand, instead of writing stuff piece by piece as they go along, when they feel like it.
 

MSGTNP

Member
Feb 5, 2020
406
355
Why even write that? Just being confrontational for no reason? It was a good question, that's what sometimes rarely happens in forums.


Are you so sure it's mediocre pussy? :unsure:
If you consider that confrontational than you haven't been on the internet long enough lol

In all seriousness though, basically everyone will tell you the same for the most part. Most individuals have the same issue's so really, it's just a matter of If enough people can come together to make a better product and stick with it.

Is playing the first game required to understand the sequel?
Doubt it but I'm sure there's probably a few references you notice If you played the original.

This is a good take, however, I am sort of curious about one point. If I am not wrong - the reason why TFs in CoC2 are purely cosmetic is related to the fact that CoC1 had a lot of players metagaming the TFs for combat benefits. People transformed not because they liked it, but because it makes the combat easier. I am wondering if you could balance something like this or if Savin and his team overestimated the amount of people who did that in CoC1 and removed it in 2.
I've only played Xania COC I but the combat was difficult in that when I was playing as a human fighter. I'm not really sure you can balance the two without making each race gravitate towards a specific archetype build. A system like Birth Signs from elder scrolls could help however to better balance between racial abilities and a build you want to run. I suppose you could combine that with the month zodiac system from final fantasy tactics where some of your base attributes can be raised and lowered depending on what month you were born in. Stacking a month debuff/buff + birth sign + racial abilities may be difficult to balance and I'm sure people would figure out how to exploit a specific setup.
 

Daken9

Active Member
Apr 28, 2017
628
4,445
Yeah, I think the best thing a dev team coming up with a competitor to CoC2 could do is fully plan out the story (main and side), as well as (most) characters beforehand, instead of writing stuff piece by piece as they go along, when they feel like it.
Also map out the main character's personality. Ideally it'd go hand in hand with more choices/agency, but even just a set of personality types would go a long way.

Granted, if the aim was to truly awe then i'd say go a step further and put a morality system, like this game's corruption, on top of that. Cause enough with good=nice(/pussy), it's 2022.
 

Skandranon

Well-Known Member
Nov 28, 2016
1,305
2,745
Also map out the main character's personality. Ideally it'd go hand in hand with more choices/agency, but even just a set of personality types would go a long way.

Granted, if the aim was to truly awe then i'd say go a step further and put a morality system, like this game's corruption, on top of that. Cause enough with good=nice(/pussy), it's 2022.
At this point, you're describing Mass Effect with porn.
 

Wrynn13

Active Member
Apr 11, 2018
973
3,444
This is a good take, however, I am sort of curious about one point. If I am not wrong - the reason why TFs in CoC2 are purely cosmetic is related to the fact that CoC1 had a lot of players metagaming the TFs for combat benefits. People transformed not because they liked it, but because it makes the combat easier. I am wondering if you could balance something like this or if Savin and his team overestimated the amount of people who did that in CoC1 and removed it in 2.
In a single player game who cares why they used what TFs? It's not like they are getting a advantage over other players. I don't see this needs balanced unless you introduce fights/situations that can't be done without specific TFs.
 
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muschi26

Engaged Member
Jun 22, 2019
2,722
4,089
In a single player game who cares why they used what TFs? It's not like they are getting a advantage over other players. I don't see this needs balanced unless you introduce fights/situations that can't be done without specific TFs.
Well, on one hand I understand. If players feel like they're forced to go certain TFs in order to stand a chance vs. the enemies, that can negatively impact player experience, which in turn has a negative impact on your game as a whole.

Besides making TFs have no impact on combat, however, another solution would be to make the game in its entirety easier. That way, players don't feel forced to min-max, but players who want to just for the fun of it still can.
 
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Wrynn13

Active Member
Apr 11, 2018
973
3,444
Well, on one hand I understand. If players feel like they're forced to go certain TFs in order to stand a chance vs. the enemies, that can negatively impact player experience, which in turn has a negative impact on your game as a whole.

Besides making TFs have no impact on combat, however, another solution would be to make the game in its entirety easier. That way, players don't feel forced to min-max, but players who want to just for the fun of it still can.
If players are forced into "optimal" transformations because of game difficulty then that's a problem in of itself, but the same could be said of optimal/suboptimal feat builds or stuff like forcing players to make a female character to get the fencing skill, which they did.
 

besomi

New Member
Mar 11, 2021
4
11
Honestly? A much more fleshed out CoC with the look and UI of CoC2 would be the most ideal CoC2 competitor, imo. The story is simple and straightforward, yet it never feels underdeveloped. Nor does the combat feel bogged down or clunky despite the core focus being the delivery of a power fantasy and porn. There are fewer characters yet each one is distinct and memorable. Player agency is also respected as your actions and choices really do matter. Corruption actually matters. It's also okay to mod for. TFs actually have an impact on your character's stats instead of mere flavor text. Your kids with some NPCs aren't just bean counter numbers.

I could go on and on but I think that should get the point across.
I've been writing my own mods for CoC and TiTs for a while and i've actually considered just going ahead and making a "remastered" version with pretty much the same content but on something like Unity and with more modular approach to make it easier to, say, load scenes from files to allow the people to write up custom content, the way you would load maps or scenarios in other games without having to rebuild the damn thing, but it would sadly take too much time to do for the attention and support it's likely to get, IMO.
 
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