Others Corruption of Champions II [v0.7.14] [Savin/Salamander Studios]

[Wavering]

The problem with the Lusamine scene is that it was actually a lot less signposted before, and supposedly had to be rewritten (presumably Savin commissioned BubbeLord to rewrite the scene), because beforehand the PC would just be awkwardly standing outside while it all went down, just hearing the sounds -- literally doing nothing.

Additionally, the scene itself doesn't make much sense considering the location it takes place, Garth's tavern. Garth literally says (if you send Jael'yn to the tavern) that it's a tavern / bar, not a depraved sex den. Implying that he is not in favor of a bunch of depraved sexual activity from taking place in a generally public setting. Which is essentially what happens in the scene (and the Arona Gossip scene too, for that matter), regular tavern goers get roped in by Cait to "teach Lusamine a lesson". Seems Garth might just be as much of a simp for Cait as Savin is, because apparently she can get away with that... Or Garth is just hypocritical, and doesn't mind exposing the entire tavern to Cait's spiteful retribution, and possibly somewhat damaging the reputation of his tavern in the process...

Also, there should be an option to avoid certain Gossip topics / scenes with Lusamine, due to the nature of some of the scenes, such as the Cait scene, and the Arona scene. It's not a really valid defense to just say "stop spamming the Gossip button", because then one would have to save before each gossip, and then reload the save if they got a scene they didn't like. One should be able to disable certain scenes in her Gossip menu that they don't like, but that'll probably never happen.

Interestingly enough, she actually wasn't. Like most things in TiTs, that content wasn't finished. There are two pseudo cheating characters in TiTs (Beatrice and that one traveling doctor chick) and neither of them are actually cheating.

They were created specifically to give off that feeling without actually doing it, specifically to get around what we've been talking about here.

Hmm, where did you get that information?
With regards to Bianca, you'd be correct (future content, not going to spoil it), but not when it comes Beatrice. Have you actually done any of her content? Or are you just assuming you're right?

He'll, I'd like to see Brienne in more threesomes, or more companions in outside relationships like Azzy, but it's not gonna happen because the audience is kinda touchy about certain things.

Personally I vastly prefer NPC-NPC scenes to PC-NPC scenes anyway

Hmm, I'm beginning to see a pattern here...
So, please, do tell, why exactly are you seemingly almost talking down to people about things that they dislike, just because you happen to like what they dislike?
You're aware, at the very least, that people (the players of the game generally speaking, at least in reference to this thread) do not like such content, so why are you so adamant on dying on the hill of promoting and defending such content?
We get it, you like to be the nth wheel in a relationship, good for you.
Seems like the majority of people here don't though, so not sure why you'd spend your time arguing with them about whether xyz fits abc label or not, because you have a bias for it, and they have a bias against it. Meaning, it doesn't seem like there will be much of a conclusion from such conversations...
And having to click through multiple pages of back and forth of this is just vexing, to say the least.

Oh, and also, I noticed that you never replied to my post on page 673, curious as to why that is?

 

[mrttao]

Why would you be trying to seduce a woman you can already have sex with?

1.

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2.

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3.

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4. roleplaying
5. to see all her dialog (that you are interested in)

It's just not at all NTR situation, and it has to be dug deeply and repeatedly for by the player.

clicking on the gossip button and getting bad RNG is not "dug deeply". It is called the [gossip] button and not the [cuck] button.

You don't meet her in the bar. She's part of a pack of roving bandits ("mercenaries") who go around robbing and raping people. In fact, she continues to attempt to rob and rape you even after you guys meet in the bar, and makes clear she plans to continue doing so next time she catches you outside. She is not in any way your girlfriend.

A. You are conflating "meet" with "meet for the 1st time"
B. If someone wants to date a bandit rapist that is their prerogative
C. You regularly meet up at a bar and then go have sex. sounds like a girlfriend / friend with benefits to me.

 

[Daken9]

Checked things out for posterity's sake and wtf now Lusamine was my third favorite character (not enough to beat Brienne and Arona, sorry):



And to make things clear, yes, WAS, for all of 5 seconds, up until Cait's Sueness won out:



Won't map out the scene because frankly we all deserve better and also not even a reload was enough to wash away the cuckness from my poor Champion, so now if you'll excuse i'll have him impregnate Brienne for the umpteenth time so he gets back his mojo.

 

[Lord Kentus]

Why anyone would like trash like that is beyond me

 

[mrttao]

Checked things out for posterity's sake and wtf now Lusamine was my third favorite character (not enough to beat Brienne and Arona, sorry):

View attachment 1870642

And to make things clear, yes, WAS, for all of 5 seconds, up until Cait's Sueness won out:

View attachment 1870644

Won't map out the scene because frankly we all deserve better and also not even a reload was enough to wash away the cuckness from my poor Champion, so now if you'll excuse i'll have him impregnate Brienne for the umpteenth time so he gets back his mojo.

Wow that is some powerful

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scene.
it is a real shame that Cait is someone's SI and gets away with doing sue shit.
Poor Lusamine, trapped in such a shitty world.
just one more reason one should drop this game

also, thank you for looking it up so I don't have to. I am already feeling somewhat quezy and would probably have vomited.

 

[smithsmithsmith]

Also, there should be an option to avoid certain Gossip topics / scenes with Lusamine, due to the nature of some of the scenes, such as the Cait scene, and the Arona scene. It's not a really valid defense to just say "stop spamming the Gossip button", because then one would have to save before each gossip, and then reload the save if they got a scene they didn't like. One should be able to disable certain scenes in her Gossip menu that they don't like, but that'll probably never happen.

The thing is there's not much reason to be using the gossip option unless you want the cait scenes. The rest is minor trivia and the arona scenes are little more than a few lines of heavy petting. It's one thing if it was poorly signposted before but having literally just gone through the content that's no longer a problem.

 

[mrttao]

And to make things clear, WAS, for all of 5 seconds, up until Cait's Sueness won out:

There is no [participate] and no [stop it] options?
... so "it is going to happen no matter what. But you can either stand outside and listen or go inside and watch".

Yea, that is very cucked.

The thing is there's not much reason to be using the gossip option unless you want the cait scenes. The rest is minor trivia and the arona scenes are little more than a few lines of heavy petting. It's one thing if it was poorly signposted before but having literally just gone through the content that's no longer a problem.

... some people actually like minor trivia and heavy petting.

 

[muschi26]

... some people actually like minor trivia and heavy petting.

That heavy petting involves another one of your NPC companions, not the PC.

 

[Daken9]

... so "it is going to happen no matter what. But you can either stand outside and listen or go inside and watch".
There is no [participate] and no [stop it] options?
Yea, that is cucked.

Pretty much, either leave or watch. Also didn't screen all the rapey shit Cait got up to because frankly i was in a hurry to get the fuck outta here, but she impressed me tbh. Credit where credit due, i don't know of many characters who are skans, groomers and rapists all at the same time. More unique than rare, our pink ball of shit.

 

[Wavering]

The thing is there's not much reason to be using the gossip option unless you want the cait scenes. The rest is minor trivia and the arona scenes are little more than a few lines of heavy petting. It's one thing if it was poorly signposted before but having literally just gone through the content that's no longer a problem.

I disagree, as some of the lore about Tronarii is gated behind the Gossip scenes with her (other such lore is gained from talking to Jen). Until we can actually go to Tronarii ourselves, the only way to learn more about it is via interacting with her -- as well as getting some backstory on the mercenaries (again, some of the backstory on the mercenaries can also be gained from talking to Jen as well).

Oh, and some "minor trivia" about Tira too.

 

[Skandranon]

Also, there should be an option to avoid certain Gossip topics / scenes with Lusamine, due to the nature of some of the scenes, such as the Cait scene, and the Arona scene. It's not a really valid defense to just say "stop spamming the Gossip button", because then one would have to save before each gossip, and then reload the save if they got a scene they didn't like. One should be able to disable certain scenes in her Gossip menu that they don't like, but that'll probably never happen.

Eh, that might be fine. I could see them adding a "gossip about this specific thing” selector. Her conversations are divided into six topics, and being able to pick those sic specifically would both avoid that problem and let people who want to see those scenes get to them faster. Win-win.

Hmm, where did you get that information?
With regards to Bianca, you'd be correct (future content, not going to spoil it), but not when it comes Beatrice. Have you actually done any of her content? Or are you just assuming you're right?

I've done all of her content, and read the easily findable plans for her future on the forums.
Tacit (her author) has a forum for her expansion pack with her family in which it's made pretty clear that the "cheating fantasy" is a fantasy, and that her husband is 100% aware of the whole thing.

I don't know why you'd suggest I'm "assuming I'm right".

Hmm, I'm beginning to see a pattern here...
So, please, do tell, why exactly are you seemingly almost talking down to people about things that they dislike, just because you happen to like what they dislike?

You're both extrapolating things I never said, and misunderstanding the conversation.

I never said I like the scene. I also am not trying to convince anyone to like it...just that it isn't NTR. This conversation is about whether or not NTR exists in the game as is. I'm also not "talking down" to anyone, we're having what was(until now) a fairly polite discussion.

You're aware, at the very least, that people (the players of the game generally speaking, at least in reference to this thread) do not like such content, so why are you so adamant on dying on the hill of promoting and defending such content?

Again, misreading the conversation.

We get it, you like to be the nth wheel in a relationship, good for you.
Seems like the majority of people here don't though, so not sure why you'd spend your time arguing with them about whether xyz fits abc label or not, because you have a bias for it, and they have a bias against it. Meaning, it doesn't seem like there will be much of a conclusion from such conversations...

And now you're on the complete opposite side of where I'm at. This conversation started out talking about why there's NOT interference in established relationships (Gweyr and Garth), and I'm pretty firmly on the side that its better that way. My comments about liking NPC-NPC stuff were just an example of things I know aren't going to happen.

And having to click through multiple pages of back and forth of this is just vexing, to say the least.

"Having to?"
I'm sorry, was this conversation blocking the normal progression of this thread? Should we get back to talking about why Tobs sucks, or was there some other important topic that this conversation getting in the way of?

Oh, and also, I noticed that you never replied to my post on page 673, curious as to why that is?

No idea.

I have max posts per page, so we're on 149.

...why doesn't everyone have max posts per page?

 

[smithsmithsmith]

Pretty much, either leave or watch. Also didn't screen all the rapey shit Cait got up to because frankly i was in a hurry to get the fuck outta here, but she impressed me tbh. Credit where credit due, i don't know of many characters who are skans, groomers and rapists all at the same time. More unique than rare, our pink ball of shit.

Nah, nothing in those scenes was rape. Lusamine is pretty obviously being bratty to encourage her partners to be rough, multiple lines in the arona and cait scenes lean into this with no subtlety.

I disagree, as some of the lore about Tronarii is gated behind the Gossip scenes with her (other such lore is gained from talking to Jen).

It's like two lines about a place we can't visit that have next to no implications over the story as a whole, it's minor trivia.

 

[Wrynn13]

Did someone just say they want to talk about why Tobs sucks?!? Heh just kidding... Mostly.

 

[Wavering]

Eh, that might be fine. I could see them adding a "gossip about this specific thing” selector. Her conversations are divided into six topics, and being able to pick those sic specifically would both avoid that problem and let people who want to see those scenes get to them faster. Win-win.



I've done all of her content, and read the easily findable plans for her future on the forums.
Tacit (her author) has a forum for her expansion pack with her family in which it's made pretty clear that the "cheating fantasy" is a fantasy, and that her husband is 100% aware of the whole thing.

I don't know why you'd suggest I'm "assuming I'm right".



You're both extrapolating things I never said, and misunderstanding the conversation.

I never said I like the scene. I also am not trying to convince anyone to like it...just that it isn't NTR. This conversation is about whether or not NTR exists in the game as is. I'm also not "talking down" to anyone, we're having what was(until now) a fairly polite discussion.



Again, misreading the conversation.



And now you're on the complete opposite side of where I'm at. This conversation started out talking about why there's NOT interference in established relationships (Gweyr and Garth), and I'm pretty firmly on the side that its better that way. My comments about liking NPC-NPC stuff were just an example of things I know aren't going to happen.



"Having to?"
I'm sorry, was this conversation blocking the normal progression of this thread? Should we get back to talking about why Tobs sucks, or was there some other important topic that this conversation getting in the way of?



No idea.

I have max posts per page, so we're on 149.

...why doesn't everyone have max posts per page?

Eh, that might be fine. I could see them adding a "gossip about this specific thing” selector. Her conversations are divided into six topics, and being able to pick those sic specifically would both avoid that problem and let people who want to see those scenes get to them faster. Win-win.

Agreed.

I've done all of her content, and read the easily findable plans for her future on the forums.
Tacit (her author) has a forum for her expansion pack with her family in which it's made pretty clear that the "cheating fantasy" is a fantasy, and that her husband is 100% aware of the whole thing.

I don't know why you'd suggest I'm "assuming I'm right".

Hmm, not sure where Tacit has "made it clear" that it's a "fantasy". I've read the document for her, and that's not implied / mentioned anywhere in the document, and I've read the initial posts Tacit made about her (not reflected there either).

The only post I found on the forums that mentions that is

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:

Not only is it possible for you as the player to pretend, it's exactly what Beatrice is doing deliberately. Because while her heart belongs to one (doge)man, she still cares deeply about Steele Junior and their wishes. So as long as you don't mention your affair or ask one of the Reasners outright, you get to enjoy the 'cheating' fantasy. Additionally, my reading of the situations involves both Traven and Bea getting at least a little bit of a kick out of such arrangement.

And at that point, one would just be debating semantics.
You may not view it as "cheating", but others might. And I think it's fair for them to think of it as such. Because unlike Bianca's situation, this is literally what others would classify as such, at least in my opinion.
Hence why I'm mentioning the differences of opinion / perspective, and why this conversation will likely not see a conclusion.

You're both extrapolating things I never said, and misunderstanding the conversation.

I never said I like the scene. I also am not trying to convince anyone to like it...just that it isn't NTR. This conversation is about whether or not NTR exists in the game as is. I'm also not "talking down" to anyone, we're having what was(until now) a fairly polite discussion.

Again, misreading the conversation.

And now you're on the complete opposite side of where I'm at. This conversation started out talking about why there's NOT interference in established relationships (Gweyr and Garth), and I'm pretty firmly on the side that its better that way. My comments about liking NPC-NPC stuff were just an example of things I know aren't going to happen.

"Having to?"
I'm sorry, was this conversation blocking the normal progression of this thread? Should we get back to talking about why Tobs sucks, or was there some other important topic that this conversation getting in the way of?

I think you're misunderstanding. I'm not talking about any specific scenes when I reference this. I'm talking in a generalized sense (the conversation themes revolving around NPC/NPC content in general vs PC/NPC content).
You appear to have a different perspective on NPC/NPC content, and seem to not like PC/NPC content as much, something you literally said yourself. And so, you're replying to people who seemingly do not like NPC/NPC content (and seemingly like PC/NPC content), and debating labels on such content, without recognizing the biases at play, you seemingly being biased toward such content, and the people you're replying to seemingly being biased against such content.

That's the point I was making. In a generalized sense it seems that the conversation is reflecting a difference in opinion about the subject at hand. However, the opinions appear to be used as though they're fact, without accounting for differences in perspectives.
I'm not saying that that can't be done, but I don't see a conclusion being drawn from such conversations that are heavily opinion based, and thus the conversation seems like it will continue to spiral ad infinitum. At that point, it might be easier to conclude the differences of opinion and move on? Although, I'm not saying one has to.

No idea.

I have max posts per page, so we're on 149.

...why doesn't everyone have max posts per page?

Okay.
Just found it odd that you didn't reply to the post I made in reply to you, which contained a similar theme to this discussion.

-------

It's like two lines about a place we can't visit that have next to no implications over the story as a whole, it's minor trivia.

Okay. It's fine if you want to view it that way.
I just disagree that "there's not much reason to be using the gossip option unless you want the cait scenes", which is what you said.

 

[Skandranon]

And at that point, one would just be debating semantics.

I don't quite get how there are multiple ways to interpret "pretending".
Her and her husband have an open relationship, and she's pretending to be secretly cheating on her husband for your fantasy.
That's it.

I think you're misunderstanding. I'm not talking about any specific scenes when I reference this. I'm talking in a generalized sense (the conversation themes revolving around NPC/NPC content in general vs PC/NPC content).
You appear to have a different perspective on NPC/NPC content, and seem to not like PC/NPC content as much, something you literally said yourself. And so, you're replying to people who seemingly do not like NPC/NPC content (and seemingly like PC/NPC content), and debating labels on such content, without recognizing the biases at play, you seemingly being biased toward such content, and the people you're replying to seemingly being biased against such content.

That's the point I was making. In a generalized sense it seems that the conversation is reflecting a difference in opinion about the subject at hand. However, the opinions appear to be used as though they're fact, without accounting for differences in perspectives.
I'm not saying that that can't be done, but I don't see a conclusion being drawn from such conversations that are heavily opinion based, and thus the conversation seems like it will continue to spiral ad infinitum. At that point, it might be easier to conclude the differences of opinion and move on? Although, I'm not saying one has to.

And I'm saying nothing you're saying affects the actual conversation going on.

We were discussing the reasoning behind NTR in the wolves' relationship based on whether or not NTR is in the game. That's what this whole conversation was about. It is not at all about "PC/NPC vs NPC/NPC content". It's about whether or not certain content is or isn't already in the game as a basis for adding more of it. It's certainly not affected by whether or not I like the content in question (I don't; Bubbles' writing doesn't work for me).

Heck, when I say NPC/NPC content, I mean named NPCs. I like seeing multiple characters with interesting personalities/quirks/fetishes in a sex scene interacting with each other more than just one. The scene we're talking about doesn't even qualify.

Okay.
Just found it odd that you didn't reply to the post I made in reply to you, which contained a similar theme to this discussion.

I just realized...you're talking about in April?! Two months ago?
I don't remember anything I typed that far back.

Though I do note, looking at it, that I was both responding to a completely different person, and you don't seem to actually have asked a question for me to respond to.

 

[Wavering]

I don't quite get how there are multiple ways to interpret "pretending".
Her and her husband have an open relationship, and she's pretending to be secretly cheating on her husband for your fantasy.
That's it.




And I'm saying nothing you're saying affects the actual conversation going on.

We were discussing the reasoning behind NTR in the wolves' relationship based on whether or not NTR is in the game. That's what this whole conversation was about. It is not at all about "PC/NPC vs NPC/NPC content". It's about whether or not certain content is or isn't already in the game as a basis for adding more of it. It's certainly not affected by whether or not I like the content in question (I don't; Bubbles' writing doesn't work for me).

Heck, when I say NPC/NPC content, I mean named NPCs. I like seeing multiple characters with interesting personalities/quirks/fetishes in a sex scene interacting with each other more than just one. The scene we're talking about doesn't even qualify.





I just realized...you're talking about in April?! Two months ago?
I don't remember anything I typed that far back.

Though I do note, looking at it, that I was both responding to a completely different person, and you don't seem to actually have asked a question.

Okay.
I won't be replying further.

Good day.

 

[NaturalEnclave]

Honestly the whole Lusamine debate screams identity crisis more than anything else.
Cause it's not like it's a bad concept in theory. CoC2 is a bloody porn game - characters fuck all the time. I feel like the majority of players can fuck everything that moves, as long as it's design/character/fetishes align with theirs. I get that Cait gets a lot of hate, but honestly, her being the first companion sort of screams that "this is the game where everyone fucks and 99% of the time it has no consequences and is just for fun". It never felt like some kind of VN when you stick to one character and that's it.

I actually sort of like Cait punishing Lusamine. Not because of cucking, but because it actually makes the world and companions a bit more alive and reactive to whatever is going on. Heck, while Lusamine is cute, she is a comic-relief character. Your whole acquittance with her starts because you sort of rape her (like most other characters) after defeating her and that scene was honestly rather light-hearted. To unlock sex you have to tease her ears and embarrass her to the whole tavern, to the point where I am pretty sure she screams about wanting to be fucked by you to the whole place. Fucking and being fucked seems like a very casual day to day occurrence in the world of CoC2, with Garth's Tavern being the only bastion of purity where it only happens behind closed doors.

So that scene to me feels less like "OMG, my champion got cucked by a companion" and more like a very weird slapstick comedy where the punchline is gangbang, at least to me. Nobody is really hurt by this situation and it's just an evening gone awry thanks to Lusamine being Lusamine.

The issue is that the scene probably does not communicate the tone properly at all. Is CoC2 a fuck-fest where proper monogamy relationships cannot exist, or an actual romantic semi-VN where any character getting any sexual encounters without your permission should not be allowed? I am not going to deny that the Lusamine Cuck scene is trying to be some form of NTR and it's weird how suddenly Cait's punishment goes from some lesbian sex to a gang-bang by strangers, but I also feel like the player has to lean too heavily into the former category to truly feel like any form of NTR is happening. It's not "God, my cute deer sex-friend has been tainted and broken beyond repair by other cocks" and more like "God dammit, Lusamine said too much again and now I'll have to fuck her tomorrow, Cait stop cockblocking me, I'd rather join them".

 

[Lord Kentus]

Cait's groomer ass deserves to be thrown down a volcano

 

[Cricco]

So that scene to me feels less like "OMG, my champion got cucked by a companion"

I am not going to deny that the Lusamine Cuck scene is trying to be some form of NTR

 

[WazaQQXOXO]

Spoiler: Let's subvert NTR tropes.

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