Others Corruption of Champions II [v0.7.27] [Savin/Salamander Studios]

[Lord Kentus]

Damn he really hates mods
didn't think it was that bad tho
Thanks for the info

Yeah sad to say but the dev team is basically just pure cancer that has to be dealt with due to them unfortunately being the producers of the game.

...Kinda like EA

 

[Skandranon]

Champ-centric characters forgo their privilege for other partners, which is their choice. There's nothing wrong with not being into them because of that, people have different fetishes, but I find it incorrect to consider it to be pathologically worse than someone who pursues multiple partners. They have different requirements and expectations from a relationship than the PC, and they feel the PC fulfills what they require.

You're talking theoretically, I'm talking practically. How many porn games have you played where the needs of the person is such a relationship are actually adequately explored? Generally, from what I've seen, the party that "doesn't mind" and consents to such a relationship just sends your character off with a thumbs up and a smile, and no actual addressing of this lack of need ever happens. It pretty much always comes of as a concession to the player and their desire to see as many scenes possible and not in service to the actual character's motivations.

This is what I mean by the whole thing being harmful to the story. Harem games rarely, if ever, explore any motivation for the haremettes for consenting to being in said harem, beyond liking the PC a lot. Given what we know about human nature by default, and the fact that such relationships are vanishingly small in the real world, making such a relationship feel "real" needs more work than the opposite, and such work just doesn't often happen.

While the PC doesn't require champ-centric characters to be monogamous, they are effectively. Their characterization determines that they don't wish to pursue that. Characterization is static unless their is a specific character arc. Generally, switching a character from champ-centric to not would involve corruption content in CoC1 (Amily, JoJo), although corruption has been changed in CoC2 to mean they just might become more champ-centric.

Well, yeah, this is what I said. Monogamy by personal preference, not by character enforcement. My point is simply that all the relationships are written this way for ease of use.

CoC1 had jealousy. Marble/Amily, Amily/Urta. Generally, pure characters were less open about sex, although that changed as the game progressed.

Eh, CoC1 had a very few targeted instances of jealousy that were really only there to segue into threesomes that immediately superseded said jealousy. And much less of it in general as the game went on. CoC1 was largely a learning experience for future games as well.

Patreons generally don't care for group sex or threesomes, bad ends, post-combat scenes, or male NPC sex partners. They do like pregnancy, corruption, monstergirls, futanari, transformations, and female NPC sex partners. They also do not like post-combat scenes that feature their companions.

So there seems to be a general lack of interest in multiple partner sex scenes or even voyuer/cucking (post combat are the most likely to be those type), so I don't think its a "couple of leaps" to extrapolate that they prefer PC on NPC focused content. Maybe they don't mind the fact that in the background NPC x NPC content canonically exists. They don't seem to be interested in looking at the PC x NPC x NPC sex scenes in a porn game.

We were talking about "monogamy" in this context, not "pc on npc content". My point is that those polls don't indicate a strong preference for monogamous relationships. None of the things you are talking about are incompatible with monogamous relationships.

When it comes to companion preferences, it could be that pregnancy is the deciding factor. It is possible patrons prefer pregnancy characters that also have NPC x NPC content.

Unfortunately, they didn't put options in the polls that could narrow down the information further.

If pregnancy is the primary deciding factor, it does mean that Cait should be able to take the first place spot if Savin implemented pregnancy content.

You're not considering what I'd consider the most important factor: quality of writing. Hitting fetish checkboxes is not an immediate straight line to the top of everyone's lists.

And regardless of all of this, I don't think any of those polls are necessarily as indicative of anything as you'd think. Fetish games like this tend to cultivate their own audiences. The strong preference for futa, for instance, is almost certainly not reflected in the wider realm of porn gamers; it exists here because the game itself attracted and developed the audience. I can speak to this personally, as a side anecdote, because I've been playing Fen games for over a decade some of my tastes have changed towards the stuff they include.

One of the polls even says as much, that they don't use the polls to determine future content because they have noticed that tastes tend to change in accordance with produced content as opposed to vice versa.

A much harder sell that a person would be okay with not pursing other partners but being okay with their partner doing so? Characters can have different libidos, emotional requirements, and social requirements. Is it a harder sell for a character to have a low sex drive and social drive, even one on one? Enough so that only a single partner is enough to fulfill those needs?

Yes, certainly a harder sell. The writing would have to support these characteristics, and it usually doesn't.
Does Brienne strike you as having a low sex drive? In point of fact, she says the exact opposite: her sex drive is the same as ever, just all focused on you. She also feels more strongly towards you than she did before.

Those attributes should tend towards wanting to monopolize significantly more of your time and affection, story wise - but they don't. Because this time of behavior usually isn't actually character driven, it's player driven.

Let's consider made up characters Mike, Cassy, and Jeff. Mike is has multiple relationships with other people, including Cassy, but not Jeff. Cassy is in a relationship only with Mike and Jeff. Jeff is only in a relationship with Cassy.

Cassy has 2 relationships.
Jeff has 1.
Mike has 3 or more.

Jeff is happy with his relationship with Cassy. He doesn't need a lot of intimate interaction, and can get most of the rest of his social interaction from his friends.
Cassy doesn't really want any additional partners in the same way.

Is Cassy taking advantage of Jeff, who has less partners?
Is Mike taking advantage of Cassy, who has less partners?
If Cassy didn't exist in the relationship, and it was Mike to Jeff, would Mike be taking advantage of Jeff.

We are assuming in this case jealousy is not a concern.

If no, then why would Brienne be creepy for choosing to be champ centric?
If yes, then a polyamorous or open relationship must always be perfectly balanced, otherwise someone is taking advantage of someone else, with potentially the greater imbalance being more taking advantage of?

The thing is, you are describing pod people. This does not mesh with what we know about human behavior. People very rarely are just okay with not a lot of intimate reaction from romantic partners, and if you're going to create a character that behaves in a inhuman way, it needs more setup and explanation to be believable.

Romance leans heavily on what we know about feelings - how people act towards one another, common behaviors, actions that we consider romantic. A plausible romantic relationship takes more work to establish than a plausible sexual relationship, because in the latter all we really care about is the end result, whereas with the former, we're invested in the journey also.

But to consider your example anyway, I'd say the problem isn't really about numbers, as long as each partner is in some way taking advantage of the relationship in general. A person sitting at home being totally satisfied while their partner is out gallivanting around just doesn't track for me. Having other people to share their time with, whether one or more, feels a little more authentic.

I don't want you to think I'm saying you shouldn't feel about Brienne how you do. I'm really just curious about what makes the difference between an effective harem (where the enforcement isn't required by the PC, but by the characters) vs a polyamorous relationship.

Practically, writing.

Harems usually don't or barely bother justifying themselves.

Poly relationships, comparatively, more often try to establish narrative justification.

Dilution of affection, as in the total possible affection a person could potentially give should be focused largely, if not all, on that one person? Even if that affection would be significantly too much for the person receiving it? Part of the reason other people (not necessarily you) dislike Brienne is because they give the PC too much affection.

Perhaps the theoretical PC I've suggested could tone down the possible potential affection to what the receiving party wants, but that would mean they would be actively throwing away any additional affection that they could be giving to someone else.

If this theoretical PC gave this one person their all, it would be an overinvestment into the relationship, meaning the receiver would be underinvesting even though they were putting all their investment on the theoretical PC. How would that be solved? Should the PC abandon them, because the relationship is unequal, even if they love them?

We're not talking about what the PC wants here, we're talking about my (or the player's) preferences. How the PC feels isn't the deciding factor.

Unequal relationships are a trope across all media. From the yandere, to the stalker, to the inattentive partner, the overly needy girl/boyfriend, etc. One side of the relationship being out of sync with the other side is the cornerstone of most romantic drama. The default to romantic relationships is to give your all to one person. If one person is giving and the other isn't, it creates tension, either because one person seems to be taking advantage of the other, or because one person has dramatically overextended themself into the relationship.

This being a porn game, a player is going to seek as much porn as possible. A character that is absolutely devoted towards you while you are out doing such a thing runs the possibility easily engender feelings of either guilt or annoyance on a player's part, because of previously stated expectations.

This, of course, isn't a problem for everyone - some people care way more about the porn than the story, as you can see in this thread from a bunch of requests that don't really fit the plot. Lots of people just want as many waifu as possible, and don't care about the story implications. Lots of games aren't trying to have a story that isn't just an excuse for porn.

But in a game like this, which is at least making an attempt at being a believable RPG with a plot to some degree, things that bend for the sake of the porn side of the game are all the more noticeable.

 

[DoctorSargePep]

Here are all the polls.

You must be registered to see the links

Patreons generally don't care for group sex or threesomes, bad ends, post-combat scenes, or male NPC sex partners. They do like pregnancy, corruption, monster-girls, futanari, transformations, and female NPC sex partners. They also do not like post-combat scenes that feature their companions.
So there seems to be a general lack of interest in multiple partner sex scenes or even voyeur/cucking (post combat are the most likely to be those type), so I don't think its a "couple of leaps" to extrapolate that they prefer PC on NPC focused content. Maybe they don't mind the fact that in the background NPC x NPC content canonically exists. They don't seem to be interested in looking at the PC x NPC x NPC sex scenes in a porn game.
When it comes to companion preferences, it could be that pregnancy is the deciding factor. It is possible patrons prefer pregnancy characters that also have NPC x NPC content.
Unfortunately, they didn't put options in the polls that could narrow down the information further.
If pregnancy is the primary deciding factor, it does mean that Cait should be able to take the first place spot if Savin implemented pregnancy content.
I don't think its fair to say its a couple leaps to extrapolate that. The only leap required, and some would argue its not a leap, is that pregnancy is correlated with player centric.

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From my look at the linked polls they line up with my likes,which is surprising;but as well prove that they're writing scenes then making polls to see how they will be received,if they need to be changed and/or pushed through,so the polls seem to show that people aren't in to being with/in acting with homo male,cuckold,or overly submissive scenes.

I don't want you to think I'm saying you shouldn't feel about Brienne how you do. I'm really just curious about what makes the difference between an effective harem (where the enforcement isn't required by the PC, but by the characters) vs a polyamorous relationship.
Dilution of affection, as in the total possible affection a person could potentially give should be focused largely, if not all, on that one person? Even if that affection would be significantly too much for the person receiving it? Part of the reason other people (not necessarily you) dislike Brienne is because they give the PC too much affection.

for me the Brienne thing is that we cannot adjust its levels
Plus polyamory is stupid/idiotic.

 

[menatv]

Hope this next update will have a decent amount of new material. Usually they have the public version out by the 15th of the month.

But as of this moment that I am typing this, they still haven't put out a public update yet. Hope it means there is some decent amount of content to be added.

(though I ain't holding my breath on that either)

 

[Raf-Raf]

Hope this next update will have a decent amount of new material. Usually they have the public version out by the 15th of the month.

But as of this moment that I am typing this, they still haven't put out a public update yet. Hope it means there is some decent amount of content to be added.

(though I ain't holding my breath on that either)

Give me some of that copium too bruh.

The only decent amount that will be added are more word walls that I'll skip anyway.

 

[Ssato243]

when the mod will come cant wait

 

[TravissPastrami]

Spider-man was just in the right place at the right time.

I thought that was one of your issues with our character, is that the only reason they matter was because they were at the portal and the explosion made our soul "special."

If a character is introduced in a sexual way in a porn game, then they should be focused on the player character. I don't think it follows that because in a normal RPG a shift of focus at times to another character can be good means that it is a good idea to shift the focus to another character having sex unless the intention is voyeur, cucking, open, or polyamorous relationship.

Stroking the player's ego isn't a bad goal for a porn game. I have different expectations for a porn game. An ignore button is the easy way for the writer to not write a path they aren't interested is doing, which isn't a bad thing. If there are characters that are intended for polyamorous, open, voyeur, or cucking content then that should be made clear early on so that a player is able to invest as little time in them as possible if they aren't interested in it.

This was my entire issue with Azzy. She was introduced as a generally affectionate character, with no indications of her being polyamorous throughout her entire quest. And then after investing so much time into her character, she drops a bomb on you at the tavern that she wants to be a thing with Liaden on the side, which I could have ignored or even been ok with, if the player character would have been allowed to be involved. But if you are a male character you are straight up excluded, and I'm pretty sure female characters only get like a scene or two. And my personal preference is for the porn in my porn game to be player-centric, so this was a huge turnoff for her character and I haven't interacted with her since.

Hope this next update will have a decent amount of new material. Usually they have the public version out by the 15th of the month.

But as of this moment that I am typing this, they still haven't put out a public update yet. Hope it means there is some decent amount of content to be added.

(though I ain't holding my breath on that either)

I wouldn't advise holding your breath, you would most certainly end up suffocating. I would almost be willing to bet that the update is going to just be all the backer-content we have gotten so far this month, with like 2 lines of added new stuff for the public release, if we are lucky.

I completely checked out of this thread/everything CoC2 related after that lackluster update we got on the 7th. Bunch of my feelings for the game and how they have been handling it over the past few months had been compiling and I wanted to take a break. Came back here and had like 10 pages to read, of surprisingly good discussions. I'm all for the hate-boners every once in a while, but it is nice to see genuine heated debates about the game even if I don't agree with some of the points made by people.

 

[Gizmogobum]

Monthly reminder that Wsan thinks so little of his customers that he would rather lie to you and hope you forget rather than curb his incessant need to force his fringe fetish into the game instead of giving his customers what they want.

You must be registered to see the links

"Is a submissive path planned?"

In these cases it can be your solemn duty to inform them "no, but I'll make it in an expansion!" and then rely on their 3-day memory to make your proverbial escape, your promise falling by the wayside in pursuit of greener pastures. Seriously though go reread the bit I wrote about project burnout and scope creep. This is HANDS DOWN the easiest way to kill your fun of writing: doing what other people want instead of what you want.

Tldr: he does not even respect you enough to give you a straight answer.

 

[TravissPastrami]

Monthly reminder that Wsan thinks so little of his customers that he would rather lie to you and hope you forget rather than curb his incessant need to force his fringe fetish into the game instead of giving his customers what they want.

You must be registered to see the links

"Is a submissive path planned?"

In these cases it can be your solemn duty to inform them "no, but I'll make it in an expansion!" and then rely on their 3-day memory to make your proverbial escape, your promise falling by the wayside in pursuit of greener pastures. Seriously though go reread the bit I wrote about project burnout and scope creep. This is HANDS DOWN the easiest way to kill your fun of writing: doing what other people want instead of what you want.

Tldr: he does not even respect you enough to give you a straight answer.

I've seen Savin insult people over making suggestions/critiques or asking questions about content, so I mean comparatively I don't think this is as bad. I think we can all agree that most of the dev team doesn't respect the playerbase, it's just about how they all individually handle it is the issue.

 

[Coaxmetal]

Monthly reminder that Wsan thinks so little of his customers that he would rather lie to you and hope you forget rather than curb his incessant need to force his fringe fetish into the game instead of giving his customers what they want.

That was a tip for beginner writers on how not to burn out on their submitted content....

 

[Skandranon]

I thought that was one of your issues with our character, is that the only reason they matter was because they were at the portal and the explosion made our soul "special."

I dont have an issue with that, more of an observation, as opposed to our protag being super duper awesome just because.

 

[TheVegnar]

........ I have a question, how many rule violations can there be? cause if this crap keeps up, it is going to be *EXACTLY* like fen forums. Any negative critizim is a #1 violation or w/e.

 

[Deleted member 1660801]

I'm guessing you had some comments deleted? because some of my had been deleted in this forum

 

[Raf-Raf]

........ I have a question, how many rule violations can there be? cause if this crap keeps up, it is going to be *EXACTLY* like fen forums. Any negative critizim is a #1 violation or w/e.

Ah, looks like the mods have finally noticed your presence and started a purge.

 

[Konstantinus]

Ah, looks like the mods have finally noticed your presence and started a purge.

Though even my post got delated where I answered to Skandron about Harem games with Releationship exploration with the reason of thread cleanup from delated upstream posts while Skandrons original post is still there.
Seems like Vegnar is on a lead here.

 

[Raf-Raf]

Though even my post got delated where I answered to Skandron about Harem games with Releationship exploration with the reason of thread cleanup from delated upstream posts while Skandrons original post is still there.
Seems like Vegnar is on a lead here.

Suspicion levels are rising.
Eh, I'm not sure about that one.

Comment gets purged -> "Must've been the wind."

 

[Skandranon]

I do hate when stuff gets deleted and there's no way to tell what, because I don't even notice anything missing.

There's no "message deleted" post or anything?

 

[Raf-Raf]

I do hate when stuff gets deleted and there's no way to tell what, because I don't even notice anything missing.

There's no "message deleted" post or anything?

Sadly no, they don't do that stuff in 'ere afaik.
It only gets sent to the one who sent the message via notifs.

 

[TheVegnar]

I'm guessing you had some comments deleted? because some of my had been deleted in this forum

I have had like probably around 15-20 comments deleted so far, all from this thread Only, Since I ever made an account. No other negative crap or (Truthful remark) has ever been removed. ;/ I am very disappointed if these mods began unsavory actions -_-

 

[Mrbeez]

Spider-man was just in the right place at the right time.

That argument makes zero sense I can say that about almost every character like the flash happened to get struck by lightning at the right time or goku happened to be on planet vegeta at the right time to be sent to earth