- Nov 14, 2017
- 66,793
- 33,657
well no1 would believe that, if said it costs 20k then some would believe it.
- Thread starter BaasB
- Start date
- Sep 3, 2016
- 1,210
- 2,543
First of all I wouldn't go as far as saying it's a personal vendettaWell well well ...
We haven't had any complaints and/or negative responses from any of our supporters. All rections were positive, and we managed to"cast at least a smile on their face". Even some of the ones who admitted they got fooled had a laugh afterwards.
This is the type of community, we want to interact with, and for these we want to create stuff.
Those, who can't take an April's Fool joke, are not the people we actually want to have - so if we pissed them off, then we have mission accomplished.
Those, who still live in a bubble to believe DMD is still alive, and compare all and everything to DMD, a game which has been finished way too late and should have been done much earlier, and all those, who can't let go ..... yes - to piss off all of those, who unsubscribed some time ago or even never were supporters in the first place, is a goal, which is putting a big smile on our face every single time.
And the fact, that you took your time, to comment our prank over here - (like you do with everything we release) shows that we have "mission accomplished"
We know about your personal vendetta to trash everything we release or everything we do - everybody knows about that - but it's really funny to piss you off over and over again (same goes for all others like you)
But I wouldn't express some amount of anger if I didn't give a shit about it, I would just ignore it like countless other games I don't care about.I just have the feeling that you had something special with this game and this character, something that could be the Ero-game equivalent of a big IP like StarWars or some Marvel stuff but for some reason you (the team, not YOU specifically) don't see it.
It all started to go to shit when the guy with the fox avatar (sorry don't remember his name) left the writing team.
I can understand creators being tired of doing the same thing, but it stills feels like a waste. Just like current Starwars and Marvel
And you could add to that the fact that apprently most of your customers don't want anything but games with MC being the only guy to have sex, so you just did that in all of your other games. Of course it's how business works, why make something that only 5% of customers will like ? I get it.
But still it's all boring and predictable, for me and others like me who've seen too much porn to be excited by repetitive MF or at best MFF scenes. It's like watching softcore porn made for 16yo guys or Church-approved porn almost. It's fucking lame. Not even age difference, all girls look like fit 20-35yo women, MC looks like handsome 20-something. Somehow this generation of customers (for your games and other teams) managed to create porn without perversion. Unsurprisingly, it's as exciting as alcohol-free beer.
I understand why (more or less), but it doesn't change the fact that I find it sad. And I know there's nothing better coming on the horizon, seeing previews for your next game which I instantly forgot.
- Jun 30, 2018
- 3,092
- 8,335
The guy which name you can't remember is "Jeff Steel". He had to leave because of personal reason which had nothing to do with any game related stuff, nor about anything team related (not even NSFW topic). Yes, he was a creative part of the team who came up with new ideas and how to flesh out the scenes, BUT: the big change you may have noticed wasn't because he left, even it happened at the same time around, it was mainly because of the demands/wishes from the majority of our supporters combined with the ban on patreon, where MrDots nearly lost his complete account. After that "incident" we are way more cautious about what we include in our games and what not.First of all I wouldn't go as far as saying it's a personal vendetta
I just have the feeling that you had something special with this game and this character, something that could be the Ero-game equivalent of a big IP like StarWars or some Marvel stuff but for some reason you (the team, not YOU specifically) don't see it.
It all started to go to shit when the guy with the fox avatar (sorry don't remember his name) left the writing team.
I can understand creators being tired of doing the same thing, but it stills feels like a waste. Just like current Starwars and Marvel
And you could add to that the fact that apprently most of your customers don't want anything but games with MC being the only guy to have sex, so you just did that in all of your other games. Of course it's how business works, why make something that only 5% of customers will like ? I get it.
But still it's all boring and predictable, for me and others like me who've seen too much porn to be excited by repetitive MF or at best MFF scenes. It's like watching softcore porn made for 16yo guys or Church-approved porn almost. It's fucking lame. Not even age difference, all girls look like fit 20-35yo women, MC looks like handsome 20-something. Somehow this generation of customers (for your games and other teams) managed to create porn without perversion. Unsurprisingly, it's as exciting as alcohol-free beer.
I understand why (more or less), but it doesn't change the fact that I find it sad. And I know there's nothing better coming on the horizon, seeing previews for your next game which I instantly forgot.
And as for fantasy update: yes, we lost more vanilla supporters than we gained new during fantasy update - not even for a single month numbers were at least constant, not to talk about raising. We thought, at least for that one month of release, we could get a few subscribers (they even may leave again after downloading for gods sake). But no - not even that. So we actually lost more supporters overall just because we made DMD fantasy update to be honest. Some quitting supporters reported that the reason to leave has been becasue we "waste our time for something like this, rather than creating a game". So instead of raising supporters or at least to hold the numbers, we actually LOST supports because of DMD FS1.
Sidenote: If all these, who actually demanded such content would have subscribed, it may be another topic - but they rather grabbed it over here for free, but still they wonder why we don't do such content anymore. Nothing is for free.
So fantasy update part2 maybe will or will not be released - we don't know for now.
All scenes are already written - and some renders already done, but that's it. For now all the work on DMD FS2 is on hold, and we focus on our new game. There are 4 people actually living from income of supporters. So of course it's all about business.
For Thief of Hearts, there won't be any extreme kinks (patreon reason). Even incest will not be in there by default (some relationships will be customized by players input). Patreon, Paypal, (particulary also Subscribestar) and even more important, STEAM, are very strict by refusing games based on the content. They all changed policy and recently banned a huge bunch of developers as you might know. So please don't wonder when games will be way more vanilla than some people want them to be - our games are no fun projects, they actually pay our bills, so we have to be careful what we release and what not - our existence depends on that.
I really feel sad for you not being able to get any fun or satisfaction out of games, because you played/saw too much in the past. Yes, i even kinda feel with you. But that doesn't change anything about the financial reason why our games have to be like they are. It's all about business.
I know, there are some devs out there doing a better job (at least based on the opinion of some people) - but let's be honest - they all are most likely a one time wonder and then you never heared about them, or at least their new games don't get that much attention as their previous one (if they are even able to complete a game at all). Some "famous" developers kind of "avoid" these problems, as they simply release only 2 updates per year (and people fall for these milking habits), so they don't "need" to create that much content.
On the other side: MrDots is in business FULLTIME (even with employees) since 2016. Name me more than a handful develeopers who achieved that too (there are a very few). So even we might not reach all of the players (nobody can do), but i guess we have done something right - right? At least we finished 3 complete games, where others don't even finish their first one - still people complain. But i guess, that's life - we have to go back to what's best for business and stop listening to what non-supporters like to see. This business is kinda starving - so we need to focus to hold our actual supporters rather than trying to get new ones on cost to lose the ones we have.
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- Jun 30, 2018
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i know - i said that not with intention to change anything (even though that would be really nice) - it was more to explain the reason why we have to stay more vanilla rather than "kinky". Be assured, if we could do as we actually want to do (without any restrictions from the platforms), we would create our games/stories another way contentwise.
- Nov 14, 2017
- 66,793
- 33,657
well you could copy scamdrop (gumdrop) and start your own "patreon".
- Jun 30, 2018
- 3,092
- 8,335
OR .... people could subscribe 100$ tier, so we can afford to buy patreon
- Sep 3, 2016
- 1,210
- 2,543
I completely agree that it's far from being 100% your team's fault if the game is too much Vanilla. Hell, I think you even convinced me that the team might be responsible for 20% tops of what I'm complaining about. The rest is just the world becoming shittier and shittier and business being business.
I get that incest, loli and bestiality are frowned upon by platforms who won't let you make money with it because you didn't ask for the consent of pixels.
Then there's a large part of the audience, who sees cuckholding/NTR everywhere and who won't buy your product unless they know in advance exactly what they can expect from it.
Which is another sad thing devs are not guilty of. Being surprised by something in a fictionnal story has always been a good thing until now. Whether it was porn or a mainstream movie, "Damn ! I didn't expect that !" was something the audience liked. But not so much these days.
Seems like super-basic market strategy took control now, aka "just give customers what they want", which is good for most products : if you buy an orange, you don't want it to taste like cheese.
But it's no good for cultural items. It should always be "I'm gonna give the audience what they didn't know they wanted" imho. Like some creators still do : Tarantino, even Nolan that I'm not a fan of, you have to give him that nobody asked for something like Oppenheimer and he did it anyways. But before gaining this freedom, he had to make some comic book movies, just like your team had huge success with DmD and Melody (and probably SL wasn't all bad financially speaking).
But to go back to the topic of this team instead of a general "what is wrong with today's culture" rant, the 20% the team might be responsible for is probably not trying to push a bit more for less basic/predictable stuff. Within what's allowed by platforms of course, so probably no incest, loli and beastiality, but more group sex, sharing, age difference, ugly fat old men, even more stuff I'm not into like futa, whatever.
Anything the team wants to do but feel they can't because of business. And sure, I know people have to live with the earnings of the team. But as one of the most successful teams in this business, I think you could afford to do a bit more of what you really want to do and care a bit less about strictly adhering to what the audience supposedly wants. Not saying you should not give a shit, but a larger space for "experimental" stuff wouldn't hurt, even if you spend 5% of the time on it. It's better than 0.
Even if you make stuff I don't care about : in the long run, a real creator will get tired and uninspired (which I think already happened several times in the past) if he has to force himself to only make stuff dictated by "The Market". I'm sure the whole point of doing this instead of being a trader or a random salesman was to have some fun creating stuff he likes.
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- Jun 30, 2018
- 3,092
- 8,335
Glad that we finally get along.
I never even had any personal grudges against you in person at all right from the start.
All i ever wanted, is a tiny little bit of understanding for the reason we we have to decide one way or another in certain situations. I never expected anyone to take our opinion as their own - all we want is respect and understanding that we do things as we do - no one has to like it, but respect it - these are still 2 pair of shoes.
And that's what it Should be about, respecting the devs and the process it takes to create what you want, Not about catering to every psychopath and bitching whiner who Can't create or are too lazy to do one of their own.
lol, I was with you until this:
When people want to be surprise and show things they didn't expect, its should still make sense to the overall story but more importantly be within the same vein as what they signed up for. Like if you're watching an epic sad romance movie, and then suddenly the director turned the movie into a romantic comedy in the middle, people would be pissed. The movie had serious characters, tones, and dialogue then suddenly everything is a joke?
Certain genres just do not mix with one another. In this case, sharing/NTR is radioactive to harem/vanilla. I'm sorry, its just the way it is. Vanilla/harem fans do not like even the existence of that kink in their game and see it as a waste of time when the Dev could be advancing the story and give more vanilla/harem content. On the other side, NTR/sharing fans would see the vanilla content as boring and want more and more extreme NTR/sharing content. (as evidence of the comments in this thread) In this scenario, no one is happy.
This is not a new phenomenon. I don't see the point in trying to make it work. People do not want to waste time and money on games they did not signed up for. That's just how it is.
- Jun 30, 2018
- 3,092
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100% agree - and i couldn't find better words.
But you missed out 1 more fact, but i guess nonetheless the most important one:
To write a good story and to set up a scene perfectly, you need to be able to "feel" the story, to be able to identify with the story, if you want to create a very good game at the end.
But in MrDots team, we are all within the non-ntr fraction. Even if we tried, we probably couldn't create a good ntr content. If you like what you are doing, it can become great - but if you hate what you are doing, it will be worse, or mediocre in best case.
And fact is, that we absolutely HATE NTR (we could bare with avoidable swinging, as this would be players choice and with players consent, but past has shown that it will not benefit the game - neither for NTR lovers, nor NTR haters. So overall, even sharing is no option at all)
- Dec 12, 2020
- 1,333
- 2,472
You are absolutely right. But that's not MrDots' problem. This developer has made massively bad decisions in the past that are now falling on his feet.
It starts with the game DMD. This game, even if many people don't want to hear it to this day, was not originally planned to be the pure vanilla game that it ended up becoming. Rather, it is planned with many routes that should also include sharing content. The vanilla stuff was just planned as one route of many. To this day I still know exactly what tags it was once labeled with: MMF, MFF, sharing, swinging. In fact, that was the reason I was interested in this game in the first place: the prospect of variety. And it wasn't just me. The development took forever and almost only vanilla was made. Of course the fans asked. and they were told crap. It was always said that the vanilla focus would be the first step in order to create the basic foundation. everything else would come later, later, later. Then came the interruption in development, Melody was created. A great game that I still appreciate to this day, by the way. In the meantime, the chatting fans have withdrawn more and more from DMD because they have simply lost patience. Instead, militant vanilla fanboys appoached and there were more and more of them. and they put a lot of pressure on them to drop all the other plans. with success. DMD original plans were changed. And over the years the psiel has been bent, more badly than rightly, into the direction it is today. Until years ago there was a huge dispute in the discord, with the result that MrDots finally decided for the vanilla fans. I was there too. I actually decided back then to join the forum and convince MrDots not to make this mistake. I can still remember the conversations with Jeff Steel very well. Who knows, you might even find the late comments here in the threat if they haven't been deleted. Of course I wasn't successful. With the consequence that the sharing fanbase, the original fnabase, has graciously turned its back on MrDots. and since this day all threats to all MrDots games are virtually dead. About as much is written there in a year as is written in 1 day in threats to money, successful games. which is a disaster. Consider that MrDots once had several thousand patreons. So DMD has been altered beyond recognition. And the fairy tale is still told today that the game was supposedly always planned that way. But that's what it really is: a fairy tale. The game was planned differently, it had a completely different fan base. Back then, MrDots alienated and drove away their original fan base. Many people still haven't forgiven him for that. But okay, so be it. It's the past. You can't change it.
MrDots finally decided on vanilla. So far so good. As I said back then, this is a hopelessly oversaturated market with strong competition. In order to be able to assert itself here, a developer must score points with outstanding quality in order to be successful in the long term. If not, he'll just get lost in the crowd. But in the end, did he deliver? No he did`not! And that's the crux of the matter, which is why fans are now running away from him. This is exactly the situation I warned Jeff Steel about years ago. What happened?
Let's take a look at DMD in detail:
The game is full of dialogues where the player's ear is literally chewed off. Dialogue, dialogues, text walls that hardly ever come to an end. These make up what feels like 80% of the entire game. The team simply has a terrible writer who is unable to keep texts concise, to the point and interesting. MrDots once promised to focus on content featuring all female LIs, at the expense of other content that was once planned but never produced. Did he deliver at the end? Not really. No matter which route you play, 90% of the time you only see the same content: scenes with D and father. The rest feels like side content. No matter which route you play, you almost only see D/F. It's the only route that is really worth playing. When you play Georgia, soon you realize that you still mostly only see the same scenes. Then play the other LI. Things are getting worse rather than better. The individual routes have such minimal differences that it's simply not worth going through these text walls again.
The next bis problem is plagiarism. This started from part 2, but from part 3 it reached its peak. And I won't even mention part 4. I don't know if that was the first scene. But at some point of the game you saw doggy sex between Graham and Olivia on the beach. A great scene, really. But almost without exception, every doggy scene later in the game is a copy of this very scene! Only the woman and the camera angle were changed. The posture was always the same, as were facial expressions and animation. And the same applies to other scenes in the game. And so it goes on practically until the end of the game. From part 3 onwards, the vast majority of all lewd scenes were mere copies of scenes that had already been shown. There were hardly any great, truly unique scenes left.
Last but not least, various story elements that were mentioned at the end of part 2 were no longer taken up at all. For example, D never finished school. The relationship with Graham, because of which they both moved in the first place, wasn't even mentioned later. These are just examples. The game ended with tons of story holes.
What I want to say is:
the game was never developed with the varied routes that it was actually planned with. That's probably MrDots the biggest mistake. But it also never become a really good vanilla either. Because a lot of story content was never fully developed and the focus was exclusively on D/F content, but this almost only consists of copies of already existing scenes, at the expense of all other LI that were neglected. This way a game is garbage. That's right, the game is garbage. People download it because it's so big. They are amazed with anticipation: "This must be something great". It is partly true, even as long as you play the D/F route only. Players start this route and are thrilled. Next they restart and try the Georgina Route. And see over 80, more like 90% or more, of the same content. They are surprised and try out the other LI. And things are getting worse there, not better. Then they are so disappointed that they drop the game. Anticipation disappointed, the game is more illusion than reality. That's sad but true.
Now let's get to sunshine love:
First of all, SL suffered greatly from the DMD failure. On the day DMD threat start to run downhill, it also took SL with him. Although SL is a much higher quality game, it has received relatively little attention. The threat is just as dead as DMD's has been for many years. Updates haven't changed much about that.
Nevertheless, I gave the game a chance at some point. and at first I was really excited. Actually I can't say much negative here. Here the text walls are not as bad as in DMD. Yes, there is a lot of chatter, but much more to the point. The story is largely well told. And all LI got story and lewd scene content, mostly from unique scenes. Of course it could have been more. But it's good as it is. Fact is: the game is wolrds better than DMD. Really! Here the developer seems to have learned something from the mistakes of the past. The game scored points almost everywhere where DMD massively disappointed me. I liked it so much that I even considered joining MrDots' patreon again. So far so good.
But then part 3 came. And here I really thought I was suddenly playing a completely different game. First of all, the part is quite short, compared to part 2. The point for the cut is not well taken. Part 3 hardly has any content. But the disaster is the endings. An ending should actually be the climax of a game. They usually are supposed to be amazed and make the player think, “It was worth it.” But that's not how it is. The endings are played with short, succinct text. And the little existing sex there are is short, boring scenes that aren't even animated. These endings are nothing, neither sexy nor dreamy. You think to yourself, "is that it?". And suddenly I felt like I had DMD. SL, which was a really great, varied game before part 3, suffered a huge drop in quality in part 3.
Get to the point. MrDots ruined his first game, DMD, with massive poor decisions, listened to the wrong guys thus alienating his original fanbase, and also did not satisfy his new fansbase that he had decided on, because in the end a run-of-the-mill game came out that disappears without a word in the mass. and then disappointed all with SL, which also couldn't maintain its great quality at the beginning until the end. And now the team is surprised that their patreons are running away? And on top of this, we are now presented with the Fantasy collection, with dialogues and story, as well as unique sex scenes that are really well done and come across better than almost all of DMD's content combined, which proves that taboo content is MrDot's true talent, exactly what DMD should have been originally. However, with vanilla he clearly reached his limits, as that is not his true talent. Now this team is really trying to win back the fan base that was alienated years ago, in order to fill the gaps left with his last 2 games, which ended up being disappointing, because of which his fans completely rightly left him? It's clear that this doesn't work
Rather, MrDots should finally leave his Generation Z filter bubble and face the truth: he made the wrong decision back then and only chose vanilla for economic reasons, but therefore for a genre that doesn't really suit him, where he cannot maintain the quality until the end. Then he should create a new team, under a new name, and finally start to develop games with content that really suits him and his team. That's what he has to do if he's going to take this path. because he will not be forgiven for the decision of the past. He completely destroyed his reputation among sharing fans years ago. And he won't get it back under the same name.
Or he finally gets new people in his team who really like vanilla and know how to do it right, especially sensible writers. And finally delivers a game that impresses with its quality from start to finish.
But it doesn't matter which path he takes, his goal is the same: In the end he has to finally deliver quality. He would have had to do that with SL after the disappointment with DMD. But he doesn't, part 3 is garbage that drags the game down. It's no wonder fans are running away from him. If he doesn't manage to impress with quality in his next game and stick to it until the end, he will lose the rest of his fans too.
- Jun 30, 2018
- 3,092
- 8,335
You only talk about DMD and Sunshine Love - You forgot about Melody, which isn't that popular as DMD over here, but in fact, based on subscribers, feedback and comments on official platforms, Melody is the most popular game of these 3. Actually Melody brought us more subscribers and income than DMD.You are absolutely right. But that's not MrDots' problem. This developer has made massively bad decisions in the past that are now falling on his feet.
It starts with the game DMD. This game, even if many people don't want to hear it to this day, was not originally planned to be the pure vanilla game that it ended up becoming. Rather, it is planned with many routes that should also include sharing content. The vanilla stuff was just planned as one route of many. To this day I still know exactly what tags it was once labeled with: MMF, MFF, sharing, swinging. In fact, that was the reason I was interested in this game in the first place: the prospect of variety. And it wasn't just me. The development took forever and almost only vanilla was made. Of course the fans asked. and they were told crap. It was always said that the vanilla focus would be the first step in order to create the basic foundation. everything else would come later, later, later. Then came the interruption in development, Melody was created. A great game that I still appreciate to this day, by the way. In the meantime, the chatting fans have withdrawn more and more from DMD because they have simply lost patience. Instead, militant vanilla fanboys appoached and there were more and more of them. and they put a lot of pressure on them to drop all the other plans. with success. DMD original plans were changed. And over the years the psiel has been bent, more badly than rightly, into the direction it is today. Until years ago there was a huge dispute in the discord, with the result that MrDots finally decided for the vanilla fans. I was there too. I actually decided back then to join the forum and convince MrDots not to make this mistake. I can still remember the conversations with Jeff Steel very well. Who knows, you might even find the late comments here in the threat if they haven't been deleted. Of course I wasn't successful. With the consequence that the sharing fanbase, the original fnabase, has graciously turned its back on MrDots. and since this day all threats to all MrDots games are virtually dead. About as much is written there in a year as is written in 1 day in threats to money, successful games. which is a disaster. Consider that MrDots once had several thousand patreons. So DMD has been altered beyond recognition. And the fairy tale is still told today that the game was supposedly always planned that way. But that's what it really is: a fairy tale. The game was planned differently, it had a completely different fan base. Back then, MrDots alienated and drove away their original fan base. Many people still haven't forgiven him for that. But okay, so be it. It's the past. You can't change it.
MrDots finally decided on vanilla. So far so good. As I said back then, this is a hopelessly oversaturated market with strong competition. In order to be able to assert itself here, a developer must score points with outstanding quality in order to be successful in the long term. If not, he'll just get lost in the crowd. But in the end, did he deliver? No he did`not! And that's the crux of the matter, which is why fans are now running away from him. This is exactly the situation I warned Jeff Steel about years ago. What happened?
Let's take a look at DMD in detail:
The game is full of dialogues where the player's ear is literally chewed off. Dialogue, dialogues, text walls that hardly ever come to an end. These make up what feels like 80% of the entire game. The team simply has a terrible writer who is unable to keep texts concise, to the point and interesting. MrDots once promised to focus on content featuring all female LIs, at the expense of other content that was once planned but never produced. Did he deliver at the end? Not really. No matter which route you play, 90% of the time you only see the same content: scenes with D and father. The rest feels like side content. No matter which route you play, you almost only see D/F. It's the only route that is really worth playing. When you play Georgia, soon you realize that you still mostly only see the same scenes. Then play the other LI. Things are getting worse rather than better. The individual routes have such minimal differences that it's simply not worth going through these text walls again.
The next bis problem is plagiarism. This started from part 2, but from part 3 it reached its peak. And I won't even mention part 4. I don't know if that was the first scene. But at some point of the game you saw doggy sex between Graham and Olivia on the beach. A great scene, really. But almost without exception, every doggy scene later in the game is a copy of this very scene! Only the woman and the camera angle were changed. The posture was always the same, as were facial expressions and animation. And the same applies to other scenes in the game. And so it goes on practically until the end of the game. From part 3 onwards, the vast majority of all lewd scenes were mere copies of scenes that had already been shown. There were hardly any great, truly unique scenes left.
Last but not least, various story elements that were mentioned at the end of part 2 were no longer taken up at all. For example, D never finished school. The relationship with Graham, because of which they both moved in the first place, wasn't even mentioned later. These are just examples. The game ended with tons of story holes.
What I want to say is:
the game was never developed with the varied routes that it was actually planned with. That's probably MrDots the biggest mistake. But it also never become a really good vanilla either. Because a lot of story content was never fully developed and the focus was exclusively on D/F content, but this almost only consists of copies of already existing scenes, at the expense of all other LI that were neglected. This way a game is garbage. That's right, the game is garbage. People download it because it's so big. They are amazed with anticipation: "This must be something great". It is partly true, even as long as you play the D/F route only. Players start this route and are thrilled. Next they restart and try the Georgina Route. And see over 80, more like 90% or more, of the same content. They are surprised and try out the other LI. And things are getting worse there, not better. Then they are so disappointed that they drop the game. Anticipation disappointed, the game is more illusion than reality. That's sad but true.
Now let's get to sunshine love:
First of all, SL suffered greatly from the DMD failure. On the day DMD threat start to run downhill, it also took SL with him. Although SL is a much higher quality game, it has received relatively little attention. The threat is just as dead as DMD's has been for many years. Updates haven't changed much about that.
Nevertheless, I gave the game a chance at some point. and at first I was really excited. Actually I can't say much negative here. Here the text walls are not as bad as in DMD. Yes, there is a lot of chatter, but much more to the point. The story is largely well told. And all LI got story and lewd scene content, mostly from unique scenes. Of course it could have been more. But it's good as it is. Fact is: the game is wolrds better than DMD. Really! Here the developer seems to have learned something from the mistakes of the past. The game scored points almost everywhere where DMD massively disappointed me. I liked it so much that I even considered joining MrDots' patreon again. So far so good.
But then part 3 came. And here I really thought I was suddenly playing a completely different game. First of all, the part is quite short, compared to part 2. The point for the cut is not well taken. Part 3 hardly has any content. But the disaster is the endings. An ending should actually be the climax of a game. They usually are supposed to be amazed and make the player think, “It was worth it.” But that's not how it is. The endings are played with short, succinct text. And the little existing sex there are is short, boring scenes that aren't even animated. These endings are nothing, neither sexy nor dreamy. You think to yourself, "is that it?". And suddenly I felt like I had DMD. SL, which was a really great, varied game before part 3, suffered a huge drop in quality in part 3.
Get to the point. MrDots ruined his first game, DMD, with massive poor decisions, listened to the wrong guys thus alienating his original fanbase, and also did not satisfy his new fansbase that he had decided on, because in the end a run-of-the-mill game came out that disappears without a word in the mass. and then disappointed all with SL, which also couldn't maintain its great quality at the beginning until the end. And now the team is surprised that their patreons are running away? And on top of this, we are now presented with the Fantasy collection, with dialogues and story, as well as unique sex scenes that are really well done and come across better than almost all of DMD's content combined, which proves that taboo content is MrDot's true talent, exactly what DMD should have been originally. However, with vanilla he clearly reached his limits, as that is not his true talent. Now this team is really trying to win back the fan base that was alienated years ago, in order to fill the gaps left with his last 2 games, which ended up being disappointing, because of which his fans completely rightly left him? It's clear that this doesn't work
Rather, MrDots should finally leave his Generation Z filter bubble and face the truth: he made the wrong decision back then and only chose vanilla for economic reasons, but therefore for a genre that doesn't really suit him, where he cannot maintain the quality until the end. Then he should create a new team, under a new name, and finally start to develop games with content that really suits him and his team. That's what he has to do if he's going to take this path. because he will not be forgiven for the decision of the past. He completely destroyed his reputation among sharing fans years ago. And he won't get it back under the same name.
Or he finally gets new people in his team who really like vanilla and know how to do it right, especially sensible writers. And finally delivers a game that impresses with its quality from start to finish.
But it doesn't matter which path he takes, his goal is the same: In the end he has to finally deliver quality. He would have had to do that with SL after the disappointment with DMD. But he doesn't, part 3 is garbage that drags the game down. It's no wonder fans are running away from him. If he doesn't manage to impress with quality in his next game and stick to it until the end, he will lose the rest of his fans too.
People on F95 should finally start to understand that they are not THAT important at all. They might have the biggest audience, but most of them are pure pirates and not subscribers. Pirates aren't what a developer needs to survive. The majority of our subscribers aren't even over here to be honest.
Also chapter 3 of SL you mentionned to be short:
Yes, as there is no real chapter 3. SL basically is finished after chapter 2. We just needed to pack the endings into a new chapter to keep the download size below 2 GB, which is the limit for android.
Last edited:
- Mar 19, 2020
- 1,304
- 2,445
Melody was good because it fulfilled its role as a stop gap between the transition of DMD to SS and the advent of SL.
Melody delivered what it promised and never promised anything out of bounds for Patreon. It is a straight forward romantic adult visual novel, audiences for which abound.
As exazubi says above DMD set out to appeal to a very different audience than what it changed to cater for, despite moving to a more lenient crowd funding platform; threads like this are an indication that there is still a hankering for its original vision. For the record I have attached a copy of MrDots introduction to DMD on 2016-09-26.
I can't really say much about SL as I tried to play it at least 3 times and got very bored, it hinted at there being a potential but delivered nothing to match the promise of DMD nor the succinct focus of Melody.
- Mar 26, 2023
- 572
- 398
It's refreshing to read a critique from a Day 1, foundational, fan. So many other critiques that you see here and in other threads, start out critical but wind up being just personal gripes. Nice to read about the nuances of the games changing, the suggestion meetings, and the fan following analysis. Thanks for your POV and well done.You are absolutely right. But that's not MrDots' problem. This developer has made massively bad decisions in the past that are now falling on his feet.
It starts with the game DMD. This game, even if many people don't want to hear it to this day, was not originally planned to be the pure vanilla game that it ended up becoming. Rather, it is planned with many routes that should also include sharing content. The vanilla stuff was just planned as one route of many. To this day I still know exactly what tags it was once labeled with: MMF, MFF, sharing, swinging. In fact, that was the reason I was interested in this game in the first place: the prospect of variety. And it wasn't just me. The development took forever and almost only vanilla was made. Of course the fans asked. and they were told crap. It was always said that the vanilla focus would be the first step in order to create the basic foundation. everything else would come later, later, later. Then came the interruption in development, Melody was created. A great game that I still appreciate to this day, by the way. In the meantime, the chatting fans have withdrawn more and more from DMD because they have simply lost patience. Instead, militant vanilla fanboys appoached and there were more and more of them. and they put a lot of pressure on them to drop all the other plans. with success. DMD original plans were changed. And over the years the psiel has been bent, more badly than rightly, into the direction it is today. Until years ago there was a huge dispute in the discord, with the result that MrDots finally decided for the vanilla fans. I was there too. I actually decided back then to join the forum and convince MrDots not to make this mistake. I can still remember the conversations with Jeff Steel very well. Who knows, you might even find the late comments here in the threat if they haven't been deleted. Of course I wasn't successful. With the consequence that the sharing fanbase, the original fnabase, has graciously turned its back on MrDots. and since this day all threats to all MrDots games are virtually dead. About as much is written there in a year as is written in 1 day in threats to money, successful games. which is a disaster. Consider that MrDots once had several thousand patreons. So DMD has been altered beyond recognition. And the fairy tale is still told today that the game was supposedly always planned that way. But that's what it really is: a fairy tale. The game was planned differently, it had a completely different fan base. Back then, MrDots alienated and drove away their original fan base. Many people still haven't forgiven him for that. But okay, so be it. It's the past. You can't change it.
MrDots finally decided on vanilla. So far so good. As I said back then, this is a hopelessly oversaturated market with strong competition. In order to be able to assert itself here, a developer must score points with outstanding quality in order to be successful in the long term. If not, he'll just get lost in the crowd. But in the end, did he deliver? No he did`not! And that's the crux of the matter, which is why fans are now running away from him. This is exactly the situation I warned Jeff Steel about years ago. What happened?
Let's take a look at DMD in detail:
The game is full of dialogues where the player's ear is literally chewed off. Dialogue, dialogues, text walls that hardly ever come to an end. These make up what feels like 80% of the entire game. The team simply has a terrible writer who is unable to keep texts concise, to the point and interesting. MrDots once promised to focus on content featuring all female LIs, at the expense of other content that was once planned but never produced. Did he deliver at the end? Not really. No matter which route you play, 90% of the time you only see the same content: scenes with D and father. The rest feels like side content. No matter which route you play, you almost only see D/F. It's the only route that is really worth playing. When you play Georgia, soon you realize that you still mostly only see the same scenes. Then play the other LI. Things are getting worse rather than better. The individual routes have such minimal differences that it's simply not worth going through these text walls again.
The next bis problem is plagiarism. This started from part 2, but from part 3 it reached its peak. And I won't even mention part 4. I don't know if that was the first scene. But at some point of the game you saw doggy sex between Graham and Olivia on the beach. A great scene, really. But almost without exception, every doggy scene later in the game is a copy of this very scene! Only the woman and the camera angle were changed. The posture was always the same, as were facial expressions and animation. And the same applies to other scenes in the game. And so it goes on practically until the end of the game. From part 3 onwards, the vast majority of all lewd scenes were mere copies of scenes that had already been shown. There were hardly any great, truly unique scenes left.
Last but not least, various story elements that were mentioned at the end of part 2 were no longer taken up at all. For example, D never finished school. The relationship with Graham, because of which they both moved in the first place, wasn't even mentioned later. These are just examples. The game ended with tons of story holes.
What I want to say is:
the game was never developed with the varied routes that it was actually planned with. That's probably MrDots the biggest mistake. But it also never become a really good vanilla either. Because a lot of story content was never fully developed and the focus was exclusively on D/F content, but this almost only consists of copies of already existing scenes, at the expense of all other LI that were neglected. This way a game is garbage. That's right, the game is garbage. People download it because it's so big. They are amazed with anticipation: "This must be something great". It is partly true, even as long as you play the D/F route only. Players start this route and are thrilled. Next they restart and try the Georgina Route. And see over 80, more like 90% or more, of the same content. They are surprised and try out the other LI. And things are getting worse there, not better. Then they are so disappointed that they drop the game. Anticipation disappointed, the game is more illusion than reality. That's sad but true.
Now let's get to sunshine love:
First of all, SL suffered greatly from the DMD failure. On the day DMD threat start to run downhill, it also took SL with him. Although SL is a much higher quality game, it has received relatively little attention. The threat is just as dead as DMD's has been for many years. Updates haven't changed much about that.
Nevertheless, I gave the game a chance at some point. and at first I was really excited. Actually I can't say much negative here. Here the text walls are not as bad as in DMD. Yes, there is a lot of chatter, but much more to the point. The story is largely well told. And all LI got story and lewd scene content, mostly from unique scenes. Of course it could have been more. But it's good as it is. Fact is: the game is wolrds better than DMD. Really! Here the developer seems to have learned something from the mistakes of the past. The game scored points almost everywhere where DMD massively disappointed me. I liked it so much that I even considered joining MrDots' patreon again. So far so good.
But then part 3 came. And here I really thought I was suddenly playing a completely different game. First of all, the part is quite short, compared to part 2. The point for the cut is not well taken. Part 3 hardly has any content. But the disaster is the endings. An ending should actually be the climax of a game. They usually are supposed to be amazed and make the player think, “It was worth it.” But that's not how it is. The endings are played with short, succinct text. And the little existing sex there are is short, boring scenes that aren't even animated. These endings are nothing, neither sexy nor dreamy. You think to yourself, "is that it?". And suddenly I felt like I had DMD. SL, which was a really great, varied game before part 3, suffered a huge drop in quality in part 3.
Get to the point. MrDots ruined his first game, DMD, with massive poor decisions, listened to the wrong guys thus alienating his original fanbase, and also did not satisfy his new fansbase that he had decided on, because in the end a run-of-the-mill game came out that disappears without a word in the mass. and then disappointed all with SL, which also couldn't maintain its great quality at the beginning until the end. And now the team is surprised that their patreons are running away? And on top of this, we are now presented with the Fantasy collection, with dialogues and story, as well as unique sex scenes that are really well done and come across better than almost all of DMD's content combined, which proves that taboo content is MrDot's true talent, exactly what DMD should have been originally. However, with vanilla he clearly reached his limits, as that is not his true talent. Now this team is really trying to win back the fan base that was alienated years ago, in order to fill the gaps left with his last 2 games, which ended up being disappointing, because of which his fans completely rightly left him? It's clear that this doesn't work
Rather, MrDots should finally leave his Generation Z filter bubble and face the truth: he made the wrong decision back then and only chose vanilla for economic reasons, but therefore for a genre that doesn't really suit him, where he cannot maintain the quality until the end. Then he should create a new team, under a new name, and finally start to develop games with content that really suits him and his team. That's what he has to do if he's going to take this path. because he will not be forgiven for the decision of the past. He completely destroyed his reputation among sharing fans years ago. And he won't get it back under the same name.
Or he finally gets new people in his team who really like vanilla and know how to do it right, especially sensible writers. And finally delivers a game that impresses with its quality from start to finish.
But it doesn't matter which path he takes, his goal is the same: In the end he has to finally deliver quality. He would have had to do that with SL after the disappointment with DMD. But he doesn't, part 3 is garbage that drags the game down. It's no wonder fans are running away from him. If he doesn't manage to impress with quality in his next game and stick to it until the end, he will lose the rest of his fans too.
- Jun 30, 2018
- 3,092
- 8,335
that has been 2016 - and time can change many things
no need for violence - it's enough for me if you go to exile
- Mar 26, 2023
- 572
- 398
talking about you.that has been 2016 - and time can change many things
no need for violence - it's enough for me if you go to exile
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