VN Ren'Py Eruption Imminent [v0.5.1] [MorriganRae]

[Ciaran8023]

I feel like one of the few misteps in the game is not making the stakes of being a Duplo as dire as it should be. In a world with lesbian dickgirls dicking one another, it doesn't really make much narrative sense that there would be some massive stigma with having one extra piece of equipment. The one thing they brought up was that one pop star that self-deletes due to shame, but that doesn't seem to be suffient motivation.

I feel like it would make much more sense if we saw roaming gangs of Duplo-phobes berating and assaulting (or worse) any Duplo they could find. Or you could have there be some sort of government/institutional discrimination against Duplo that makes life significant worse if they are exposed. This could also give the horny cop more to do than just make drug busts.

Honestly, it makes a lot more sense if you view it from the perspective of Ashe.
She's basically anxiety embodied into a nervous wreck of a human being, even slight persecution of what she is might be more than she would ever be willing to bear, on top of the fact that it's a secret she's been guarding from a very young age, even if it would have been a minor secret, due to the length of which she's been hiding it from people will inevitably have a large emotional impact on her.

We haven't really gotten much information outside of duplos being persecuted because they're viewed as basically sexual beasts with no control, that could manifest in some pretty severe persecution or it might not have, we simply don't know as the dev hasn't shown us or told us yet. That being said, the dev did say that they weren't that interested in making some sort of social commentary so we might not get much info on how severe it might be.
Regardless though, it's important enough for Ashe herself due to how she is as a person.

 

[Brine_Basilisk]

maybe i'm thinking of something else, but didn't it say duplos were kinda shunned because their lust makes them, like, mindless beasts or something?

Yeah they did say that at the beginning. I just wish it wasn't so vague. Fiona doesn't make much of a big deal about it so it hard to figure out what the actual normal societal baseline is.

Honestly, it makes a lot more sense if you view it from the perspective of Ashe.
She's basically anxiety embodied into a nervous wreck of a human being, even slight persecution of what she is might be more than she would ever be willing to bear, on top of the fact that it's a secret she's been guarding from a very young age, even if it would have been a minor secret, due to the length of which she's been hiding it from people will inevitably have a large emotional impact on her.

We haven't really gotten much information outside of duplos being persecuted because they're viewed as basically sexual beasts with no control, that could manifest in some pretty severe persecution or it might not have, we simply don't know as the dev hasn't shown us or told us yet. That being said, the dev did say that they weren't that interested in making some sort of social commentary so we might not get much info on how severe it might be.
Regardless though, it's important enough for Ashe herself due to how she is as a person.

That's a fair explanation for it. It would be interesting if a lot of anxiety about being exposed as a Duplo is mostly all in Ashe's head and not the actual objective reality of her society. I guess it'll just stay ambigious.

 

[Lord Kentus]

Every time I see Duplo I think of the Blocks tbh

 

[xeivous]

it doesn't really make much narrative sense that there would be some massive stigma with having one extra piece of equipment.

It's almost as if discrimination is as baseless and dumb as it is harmful.

 

[Ciaran8023]

That's a fair explanation for it. It would be interesting if a lot of anxiety about being exposed as a Duplo is mostly all in Ashe's head and not the actual objective reality of her society. I guess it'll just stay ambigious.

Yeah, it'll likely stay ambiguous. We only ever get Ashe's view on things and brief glimpses on how she feels about this so that's mainly what I'm basing my theory upon, and as you noted, Fiona didn't make a big deal out of it but she's also very much a laidback "dude-bro" type of personality so it's nearly impossible to glean anything from that.
I think the only better insight we get is if Vanessa's mother somehow makes remarks about duplos or someone around that level of societal influence.

But yeah, even so, what's inside Ashe's head is what counts for her, hence why I believe she's so incredibly fearful of people knowing about it.

 

[MheaScD]

Yeah they did say that at the beginning. I just wish it wasn't so vague. Fiona doesn't make much of a big deal about it so it hard to figure out what the actual normal societal baseline is.


That's a fair explanation for it. It would be interesting if a lot of anxiety about being exposed as a Duplo is mostly all in Ashe's head and not the actual objective reality of her society. I guess it'll just stay ambigious.

it would make sense that she's scared of people bullying her for being "stupid" or something because she can only think with her loins, like with what you said in your spoiler. She could also be scared that someone could make a fake accusation against her, and she would be shunned a lot more because everyone would assume it's true given her duplo-ness.

 

[Lord Kentus]

It's almost as if discrimination is as baseless and dumb as it is harmful.

Not for a condition that has historic precedence throughout presumably human history, there would be about as many takes on it as you find on any gender in antiquity, it would be silly to assume they were all negative. So yeah ultimately I do agree, you might find fringe nonsense(probably mostly online like it is our modern world), but actual society wide discrimination? From all corners? Nah.

It isn't very comparable to really anything we have in our current world in terms of societal upheaval I admit, its an additional gender but by that same metric, I am also taking the reasonable leap of logic by that by the turn of the modern age, that stuff would mostly be regulated to petty personal cruelties from the typical corners.

 

[Ciaran8023]

it would make sense that she's scared of people bullying her for being "stupid" or something because she can only think with her loins, like with what you said in your spoiler. She could also be scared that someone could make a fake accusation against her, and she would be shunned a lot more because everyone would assume it's true given her duplo-ness.

Well, not just that, body image is a very powerful thing. Having a skewed body image can lead to an extreme amount of serious mental illnesses for example, so being 'different' in terms of your body can be a huge source of shame.

A close friend of mine took nearly 20 years to tell people that he was born with a third nipple. It's innocuous and most people wouldn't really realize unless they looked close, but nonetheless he was scared shitless that he would be treated worse or different because of it.

 

[Lord Kentus]

A close friend of mine took nearly 20 years to tell people that he was born with a third nipple.

The man with the golden gun!

 

[Birdnman993]

I'm surprised how many people still believe Delilah is the blackmailer, I think if there's one thing we can take away from this episode it's that it's not her, if anything she's being manipulated like with Ashe, first of all she didn't know that Ashe is a Duplo until after the sleepover, and secondly all the clues pointing to her are so blatantly obvious, it's like Dev is waving shiny keys around with one hand for us to see while flashing his middle finger with the other.

And you might wonder what the blackmailer has on Delilah to blackmail her, Delilah may be childish, but not stupid, imagine that the person she loves will be exposed to the world like the outcasts that Duplos are in this universe, obviously she would do anything to keep the secret of the person she loves even do whatever the blackmailer wants, probably that's why she so desperately needed to go to the party because she was ordered to for the blackmailer's plan.

 

[Ciaran8023]

And you might wonder what the blackmailer has on Delilah to blackmail her, Delilah may be childish, but not stupid, imagine that the person she loves will be exposed to the world like the outcasts that Duplos are in this universe, obviously she would do anything to keep the secret of the person she loves even do whatever the blackmailer wants, probably that's why she so desperately needed to go to the party because she was ordered to for the blackmailer's plan.

.. Unless she believes that she can be the "knight in shining armour" for Ashe. 'Even if the world turns against you, I won't, so just trust me'.
It's one of the theories I have about her behaviour, if she's the one either doing the blackmailing or having hired someone to do it, it would explain why she blurted out her knowledge of Ashe being a duplo on the bus, as an attempt to assuage Ashe's fears. It would also tie in with her romanticization of Ashe and her overall naivety, believing that what she's doing is the right thing for Ashe.

Of course, we're all just dealing with theories, but there are credible theories that point towards Delilah, so I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss them.

 

[MheaScD]

I'm surprised how many people still believe Delilah is the blackmailer, I think if there's one thing we can take away from this episode it's that it's not her, if anything she's being manipulated like with Ashe, first of all she didn't know that Ashe is a Duplo until after the sleepover, and secondly all the clues pointing to her are so blatantly obvious, it's like Dev is waving shiny keys around with one hand for us to see while flashing his middle finger with the other.

And you might wonder what the blackmailer has on Delilah to blackmail her, Delilah may be childish, but not stupid, imagine that the person she loves will be exposed to the world like the outcasts that Duplos are in this universe, obviously she would do anything to keep the secret of the person she loves even do whatever the blackmailer wants, probably that's why she so desperately needed to go to the party because she was ordered to for the blackmailer's plan.

wasn't the first message after the sleepover as well? And her "source" for how she learned about Ashe was a lie, she could have possibly known for a while. She also somehow knew Ashe told Fiona.

 

[Dessolos]

I'm surprised how many people still believe Delilah is the blackmailer, I think if there's one thing we can take away from this episode it's that it's not her, if anything she's being manipulated like with Ashe, first of all she didn't know that Ashe is a Duplo until after the sleepover, and secondly all the clues pointing to her are so blatantly obvious, it's like Dev is waving shiny keys around with one hand for us to see while flashing his middle finger with the other.

And you might wonder what the blackmailer has on Delilah to blackmail her, Delilah may be childish, but not stupid, imagine that the person she loves will be exposed to the world like the outcasts that Duplos are in this universe, obviously she would do anything to keep the secret of the person she loves even do whatever the blackmailer wants, probably that's why she so desperately needed to go to the party because she was ordered to for the blackmailer's plan.

Honestly I was 50 / 50 on Delilah being the blackmailer still am actually. But reading this post made me think of something just now. It's a theory with no proof or anything to back it up just a wild theory. But could the blackmailer be Delilah's boss. If I recall correctly she is working as an intern as a journalist and she spilled coffee on her boss. Could be her boss is using her to help with blackmailing Ashe as leverage for her to get the job.

The main question is why would the boss want to blackmail Ashe or know she is a duplo. Well I can see maybe she wants to run a story, wasn't that other duplo that killed herself outed in the media? So maybe she just wants to expose her like with that other duplo but the main question for me with this wild tin hat theory is how would she find out and who is the boss?

I haven't read the dialogue on the cuckpath but could it be possible the boss is Stella maybe? as I recall she went out on a date with the mother and maybe she used that as a way to get close to Ashe?

Now i do admit one thing with this wild theory makes no sense if the black mailer just wants to expose Ashe why the blackmail. My thinking is maybe the blackmailer knows but doesn't have the proof just yet and plans to expose her either way?

( I didn't give the blackmailer the photo of Ashe in the update so unsure how that scenes plays out if the photo is good enough proof or not, I assume it is)

So yeah there are flaws in my theory but I think it could be closer to the truth maybe if Delilah is being forced.

 

[Birdnman993]

It's one of the theories I have about her behaviour, if she's the one either doing the blackmailing or having hired someone to do it, it would explain why she blurted out her knowledge of Ashe being a duplo on the bus, as an attempt to assuage Ashe's fears.

wasn't the first message after the sleepover as well? And her "source" for how she learned about Ashe was a lie, she could have possibly known for a while. She also somehow knew Ashe told Fiona.

She blurted it out on the bus because something happened between when she went to her interview that caused her to discover Ashe's identity, probably from the blackmailer, and if that was the case, that means she couldn't have sent those messages on the night of the sleepover, she didn't know that until that moment, so in conclusion, it's not her.

 

[xeivous]

Not for a condition that has historic precedence throughout presumably human history, there would be about as many takes on it as you find on any gender in antiquity, it would be silly to assume they were all negative. So yeah ultimately I do agree, you might find fringe nonsense(probably mostly online like it is our modern world), but actual society wide discrimination? From all corners? Nah.

It isn't very comparable to really anything we have in our current world in terms of societal upheaval I admit, its an additional gender but by that same metric, I am also taking the reasonable leap of logic by that by the turn of the modern age, that stuff would mostly be regulated to petty personal cruelties from the typical corners.

Is there actual precedence that the worldbuilding puts up? Like actual science and not religion or "common knowledge" or anything. I might have to do a replay but what I recall on the subject is the one celebrity being outed and that ending tragically, Ashe's general issues that can be attributed to her being pretty mentally unwell for various reasons, and her getting some comfort from her mom about the whole thing. I think that the degree to which people care might be exaggerated in Ashe's mind thanks to her issues and the media but dismissing the possibility that such discrimination is so widespread seems naive to me.

Also I do think that the general theme of discrimination for something one can't be tied to the plot here. Even if it's a bit clunky. I think some comments have made comparisons to trans folks but also recall something about the dev being against that comparison. Don't really remember such stuff too well.

 

[Ciaran8023]

She blurted it out on the bus because something happened between when she went to her interview that caused her to discover Ashe's identity, probably from the blackmailer, and if that was the case, that means she couldn't have sent those messages on the night of the sleepover, she didn't know that until that moment, so in conclusion, it's not her.

That's not a given. She could have been told about Ashe's identity from whomever she decided to work with, and if she has an accomplice then it wouldn't even need to be her to send the messages.
That accomplice could also have their own agenda that they're working with for example, and figured that Delilah's little 'play' would be the best opportunity for it.

Basically, there's nothing pointing towards Delilah's innocence, she's definitely involved, but there's also nothing pointing towards to which extent and how she's involved. Simply saying "nah it ain't her, full stop" is a bit disingenuous.

 

[MheaScD]

She blurted it out on the bus because something happened between when she went to her interview that caused her to discover Ashe's identity, probably from the blackmailer, and if that was the case, that means she couldn't have sent those messages on the night of the sleepover, she didn't know that until that moment, so in conclusion, it's not her.

it still seems like she knew Ashe told Fiona, she coulda bugged Fiona's phone or something. Maybe that doesn't make her the blackmailer, but i still don't get how she would have known those 2 talked about it.

 

[pitao]

Red path Ashe should just outright go with your suggestion of rejecting any blackmailing and deal with the consequences.

Yep, Siren Ashe should just own it and deal with the consequences if gets public that she is a duplo. That is why this whole blackmail shit is unnerving, specially in that route. I was waiting and waiting for a choice to Ashe just say "Fuck it, just do what ever the hell you want. Expose me but once I find who you are I will also make your life miserable." But it was just wishful thinking, I know that Ashe isn't there yet in behavior/personality wise, she still needs to grow more confident, but the dev better make her get there or will disappoint those who want a more assertive Ashe in that route.

 

[Birdnman993]

That's not a given. She could have been told about Ashe's identity from whomever she decided to work with, and if she has an accomplice then it wouldn't even need to be her to send the messages.
That accomplice could also have their own agenda that they're working with for example, and figured that Delilah's little 'play' would be the best opportunity for it.

Basically, there's nothing pointing towards Delilah's innocence, she's definitely involved, but there's also nothing pointing towards to which extent and how she's involved. Simply saying "nah it ain't her, full stop" is a bit disingenuous.

That sounds like far-fetched theories to me rather than anything with any basis, anyway it will be a very long few months until the next update.

it still seems like she knew Ashe told Fiona, she coulda bugged Fiona's phone or something. Maybe that doesn't make her the blackmailer, but i still don't get how she would have known those 2 talked about it.

Delilah didn't know that Fiona knew that Ashe was a Duplo, she only said that excuse because Ashe mentioned it first, if Delilah had mentioned it before Ashe said it I would agree with you, but that's not the case.

 

[Ciaran8023]

That sounds like far-fetched theories to me rather than anything with any basis, anyway it will be a very long few months until the next update.

It's more likely than her being completely removed from the scenario atleast, her behaviour is far too on the nose and the fact that it changed a fair bit right after Ashe started getting blackmailed.
There are just too many threads tied to her for her to be innocent.

But yeah, it'll probably be 12 - 15 months for next update or something like that.