VN Ren'Py Eternum [v0.9.4] [Caribdis]

[walker188]

Been bracing for it since the "sacrifice" talk with the Founder at the beginning of 0.5, which then got reinforced by the Syndicate Member in the Valley of Kings mentioning something about the death of Orion's loved ones. Either it's going to be some sort of fucked up vision in the future, or the girls die for realsies but then get revived thanks to Orion making the right choices in the end.

I don't think Caribdis has the stones to kill off any girl either (or even the MC)*, but man I would respect the hell out of him if he did.

The thing is, a 'sacrifice' in a game hits very, very differently from a sacrifice in any other media.

In a film/novel/comic you are watching the MC go about his journey. In the game, you ARE the MC. His choices are yours, and thus it becomes very easy to make the player feel forced or railroaded. While a sacrifice ending can make sense and be rather authentic in other media, in a game many players often end up feeling unfulfilled (I personally believe this tendency to self insert is why so many players are so sensitive toward any sort of male competition in their games).

For instance, in the game Mass Effect 3 which- quality issues aside -had a notoriously downer ending, many players were immensely disappointed for the lack of a simple 'happy' ending. Contrast that with Game of Thrones, which had a similar lack of polish, but was also critiqued for the lack of protagonists death and/or causalities.

I'm not sure how to resolve this issue. Frankly the best way I've seen it done would be Dragon Age 1 and Fallout 3 WITH the expansion pack that modifies the game to allow player choice in their sacrifice scenes. Players must feel the weight of their choices, but also be given real, meaningful options either way.

*Of course, that may be out of the scope of the AVN genre. Let's be honest, porn is the Hallmark channel level depth in terms of character and story. Even stories with the potential for more depth, such as this one typically avoid it (as seen here in the latest episode, where there absolutely NO consequences for Orion's choices or actions).

 

[briansanders]

I don't think any of the LI's will die or will be in danger for that matter as it would definitely not sit well with the majority of the audience(including me). You spend around 5-6 years playing this game, full engrossed with it and suddenly one of the LI's dying will definitely not be nice

But at the same time I feel that something might happen to Calypso in the future. In one of the cliffhangers for a future update we might see Calypso gravely injured or on the verge of death where Orion comes and saves her

 

[Mutation8888]

I don't think any of the LI's will die or will be in danger for that matter as it would definitely not sit well with the majority of the audience(including me). You spend around 5-6 years playing this game, full engrossed with it and suddenly one of the LI's dying will definitely not be nice

But at the same time I feel that something might happen to Calypso in the future. In one of the cliffhangers for a future update we might see Calypso gravely injured or on the verge of death where Orion comes and saves her

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[briansanders]

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Yeah this makes sense. sacrifice here may not mean a life but sacrificing immortality/powers to be with your loved ones

 

[torpedogoat]

Here's another idea for what the sacrifice might be:

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[Mutation8888]

Yeah this makes sense. sacrifice here may not mean a life but sacrificing immortality/powers to be with your loved ones

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[mike12013]

I personally feel like he will be given a choice, choose one girl, or fight for them all.

 

[briansanders]

I personally feel like he will be given a choice, choose one girl, or fight for them all.

It's not even a choice, fight for them all.

Also, just the fact that you take 1 girl and sacrifice all others is kinda disturbing

 

[hzjujk]

Here's another idea for what the sacrifice might be:

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That would be a really different ending for a porn game with a harem that is unattainable for the hero (except for Calypso). The hero can fuck all the girls in the virtual world, but in the real world other men make the girls' babies. NTR as the last, ultimate victim.
I think if that happens, this thread will explode and Cari will have no future as a game developer.

 

[minibaer12]

That would be a really different ending for a porn game with a harem that is unattainable for the hero (except for Calypso). The hero can fuck all the girls in the virtual world, but in the real world other men make the girls' babies. NTR as the last, ultimate victim.
I think if that happens, this thread will explode and Cari will have no future as a game developer.

I'm playing both extremes, the harem route (all of them) and the eunuch route (none). So far, I'm at the same end of EP 8 with both routes. The difference is drastic; in the eunuch route, I have much less content and some gaps, while in the harem route, I get to see everything. From the moment the haremspath variable is set, a lot of text changes. This is clearly visible in the code. Let the girls level up to 6 hearts, then the team spirit takes on a whole new dimension.

Regarding your point, NTR: why would he include that??? The girls love/like Orion too much.

 

[agrdtcwa]

I don't think Caribdis has the stones to kill off any girl either (or even the MC)*, but man I would respect the hell out of him if he did.

The thing is, a 'sacrifice' in a game hits very, very differently from a sacrifice in any other media.

In a film/novel/comic you are watching the MC go about his journey. In the game, you ARE the MC. His choices are yours, and thus it becomes very easy to make the player feel forced or railroaded. While a sacrifice ending can make sense and be rather authentic in other media, in a game many players often end up feeling unfulfilled (I personally believe this tendency to self insert is why so many players are so sensitive toward any sort of male competition in their games).

For instance, in the game Mass Effect 3 which- quality issues aside -had a notoriously downer ending, many players were immensely disappointed for the lack of a simple 'happy' ending. Contrast that with Game of Thrones, which had a similar lack of polish, but was also critiqued for the lack of protagonists death and/or causalities.

I'm not sure how to resolve this issue. Frankly the best way I've seen it done would be Dragon Age 1 and Fallout 3 WITH the expansion pack that modifies the game to allow player choice in their sacrifice scenes. Players must feel the weight of their choices, but also be given real, meaningful options either way.

*Of course, that may be out of the scope of the AVN genre. Let's be honest, porn is the Hallmark channel level depth in terms of character and story. Even stories with the potential for more depth, such as this one typically avoid it (as seen here in the latest episode, where there absolutely NO consequences for Orion's choices or actions).

I dont think this is an issue in the first place. Different pieces of media aim to do different things. This game is not trying to be Fallout 3 or Dragon Age Origins. Nor should it try to imitate them. I think this game knows what it wants to be - it is a fun, lighthearted and heartwarming anime-esque harem romp and it executes that incredibly well. And I think that is more than enough. In terms of the 'sacrifice' if it will even be included, I think it will just be something quite cheesy like the mc sacrificing himself for the girls then magically getting revived or something. And there is nothing wrong with that - I think something like that fits the tone of the game perfectly fine.

I dont think every game should try to be realistic or have downer routes. Sure some games may want to do that but I dont think this is the developer's vision at least for this specific game. So worrying about how to shoehorn darker routes into the game is like trying to fix a problem nobody has - not the developer since I doubt it is part of his vision nor a large majority of the playerbase.

 

[briansanders]

I dont think this is an issue in the first place. Different pieces of media aim to do different things. This game is not trying to be Fallout 3 or Dragon Age Origins. Nor should it try to imitate them. I think this game knows what it wants to be - it is a fun, lighthearted and heartwarming anime-esque harem romp and it executes that incredibly well. And I think that is more than enough. In terms of the 'sacrifice' if it will even be included, I think it will just be something quite cheesy like the mc sacrificing himself for the girls then magically getting revived or something. And there is nothing wrong with that - I think something like that fits the tone of the game perfectly fine.

I dont think every game should try to be realistic or have downer routes. Sure some games may want to do that but I dont think this is the developer's vision at least for this specific game. So worrying about how to shoehorn darker routes into the game is like trying to fix a problem nobody has - not the developer since I doubt it is part of his vision nor a large majority of the playerbase.

Yeah forget about sacrifice and think about which girls are gonna have a sex scene in the next update and enjoy the game as it goes

 

[e6mill]

Yeah forget about sacrifice

Well, I'm popping cherries (thus making them non-virgins, unsuitable for sacrificing) as rapidly as I can here...

 

[briansanders]

Well, I'm popping cherries (thus making them non-virgins, unsuitable for sacrificing) as rapidly as I can here...

only Luna is left. We need to pop her cherry asap then

 

[sexypeanut]

only Luna is left. We need to pop her cherry asap then

Caly is most likely a virgin, too

 

[torpedogoat]

That would be a really different ending for a porn game with a harem that is unattainable for the hero (except for Calypso). The hero can fuck all the girls in the virtual world, but in the real world other men make the girls' babies. NTR as the last, ultimate victim.
I think if that happens, this thread will explode and Cari will have no future as a game developer.

If you think my ending isn't compatible with a happy end with a full pregnant harem, then I think you have missed something about the mechanics of Orion moving between the worlds. Don't forget that he can take girls with him to Eternum. No doubt if he does that, they can get pregnant and give birth there.

 

[MAGO-DAG]

but man I would respect the hell out of him if he did.

Forum too much of the games, for things like dark scenes or main characters dying because of bad endings. But for Cari to focus on "sacrifice" someone from LI sounds stupid.

This man is right agrdtcwa , not all games have to be dark (unless you count the bad endings for the variety of which is non-canon.) And Eternum is primarily a dramatic Sci-Fi VN, with a touch of comedy and romance.
Cari can't just flip a harem game into a darker one with deaths lol some people had enough of a couple of bad scenes in his first game

 

[briansanders]

Caly is most likely a virgin, too

Not most likely, she is definitely a virgin with 0 sexual experience. Can't leave the princess alone. We have to help her by taking her virginity

 

[169ccjc]

When someone calls you a monster, you should act like one—make them suffer. Don’t just wallow in self-blame. Pfft, being called a monster means you’ve got power, and I’m all about that.

 

[jarisi]

I don't know if it has already been mentioned or not; I've searched for it but found nothing. But what if William is actually proud of Alex to a certain extent? I'm replaying the game, and yes, the guy is an asshole who has made his daughter's life impossible. He even slapped her in front of us, and I'm sure it's not the first time, but thinking about it coldly, maybe inside his twisted mind, he feels some pride for Alex. She's strong, independent, resourceful, and she doesn't stop at anything or anyone to get what she wants. She even has enough talent, and I imagine mental strength, to have a shot at going to the Olympics. Those are qualities that someone like William should appreciate.

Yes, all of this clashes with his worldview where he is in control and his children must do what he says, when he says it, and how he says it, but still, he should have a certain sense of pride fot her. Alex is infinitely better than his brother, who is useless and only knows how to rely on his last name to get things, and if he inherits everything from William, it will take him a couple of months to ruin it all. And I'm sure that's not good for the Bardot name. And anyone can see that, not to mention someone like William.

In summary, yes, he's a jerk, yes, he imposes things and feels no love for his daughter, but that doesn’t mean he is so stupid as not to see how his daughter really is and to appreciate the many qualities she has, which he himself promotes.