VN Ren'Py Abandoned Fallen Roads [v0.2] [Boketto Games]

[TheYoungBuck]

Right!!! It tells us that she was in her right mind all along.

A drug addict saying they want to enjoy the drugs they just consumed...yeah, totally normal and stable behavior.

 

[TheYoungBuck]

Yeah, I agree with that last part. For me she subconsciously wanted "closure" with Bryce, the guy she's had a crush on and is now moving away. And I'm not talking about a goodbye... There's no other reason for her to be there. She could meet everyone else at a different and way less "tempting" environment instead of a party in her drug dealer's house...

If I made up a scenario in their past for arguments sake, let's say, Bryce saved her from being killed or something. Or provided her food or some other shit. Y'know, normal friend stuff that goes beyond him just being a drug dealer. Then that would indicate a higher level of trust with him. You wouldn't suspect a person like that to rape you.

 

[mr.AwesomeGameTaste]

I wholly agree with you, I just want to point out that there are jurisdictions even in the U.S., and around the world, were infidelity is considered a crime, that is why I decided to make that example. If you ever see or read a case in dose jurisdictions you will see it is a circus to say the least. A very complex topic indeed.

Well I knew that infidelity was considered a crime but I only heard of such cases in countries where law is massively influenced by religion,never heard of such laws in the US,I'm not from there and they never showed us any such cases in my law school.so thanks for telling me that,I'll look into it out of curiosity.

 

[v1900]

A drug addict saying they want to enjoy the drugs they just consumed...yeah, totally normal and stable behavior.

Mate, I will assume that you have read the thread and know that there are two camps. One says she was too drunk/high to know what she was doing, the other says she was not drunk/high enough to get away with it.

That dialogue tells us that she knew she was with Bryce and she knew they were going to have sex, until she magically remembers Leo/MC. Hence my comment. And she was not impaired when she decided to sleep there afterwards. She is just stupid.

 

[eddie987]

If I made up a scenario in their past for arguments sake, let's say, Bryce saved her from being killed or something. Or provided her food or some other shit. Y'know, normal friend stuff that goes beyond him just being a drug dealer. Then that would indicate a higher level of trust with him. You wouldn't suspect a person like that to rape you.

The part about the rape has nothing to do with what I said. Your hypothetical scenario actually fits perfect with my theory. She went there especially for him, since like I said she could see everyone else in a less tempting environment, having in the back of her mind that it's her last chance to sleep with him.

 

[clowns234]

This is an interesting topic, one that I have discussed in real life with some people. We can say that morally it is appalling for that to happen to a woman but on the topic of responsibility is when it all goes down the drain. If a woman is walking along and a man rapes her I agree that there is no responsibility on the woman, but if she knowingly puts herself in a position like Ava she has to carry with the responsibility too. I you will humor me consider this:

Spoiler: Accessory to a Crime

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Think of Ava as an accessory or a conspirator. She already agreed to the fact but midway through the sequence of events she regrets her participation and bails out. In any other scenario that it is not related to rape she would be held responsible along with the perpetrator. Consider this example:

Instead of cheating they were going to rob the MC. Just before they grab MC's valuables she remembers that she likes the MC so she tries to run out the door but Bryce being his usual self grabs her and beats her and knocks her out. When the police catches and arrest both of them, she will argue that she did not actually grabbed any valuable and she was knocked out. Tough luck she will never the less be charged with the crime.

Now we as members of society agree to make the exception in regards to rape because we like to protect our women. It is a measure that oversteps the boundaries of legal system, the morals of the society and the ethics of people with the sole purpose of guaranteeing that the fair sex is protected. But it should or does not magically erase any responsibility a woman might have in the events.

To reiterate, there is a difference between being a victim and playing Russian roulette.

Where in the U.S. is infidelity considered a crime - especially between two people who are not married?
I'm no lawyer but even in divorce court, infidelity has little bearing unless there is a prenuptial agreement.

 

[TheYoungBuck]

The part about the rape has nothing to do with what I said. Your hypothetical scenario actually fits perfect with my theory. She went there especially for him, since like I said she could see everyone else in a less tempting environment, having in the back of her mind that it's her last chance to sleep with him.

I thought I wouldn't need to clarify this, but my point was that she probably trusted him and looked at him as a friend. She said she missed natasha and sarah, and she didn't like bryce like that so I can only assume she still had a level of respect for him due to their past. But if you want to look at it differently, then that's alright.

 

[clowns234]

She went there especially for him, since like I said she could see everyone else in a less tempting environment, having in the back of her mind that it's her last chance to sleep with him.

Where in the game do you see proof of this? Can you point it out please?

 

[v1900]

Where in the U.S. is infidelity considered a crime - especially between two people who are not married?
I'm no lawyer but even in divorce court, infidelity has little bearing unless there is a prenuptial agreement.

You must be registered to see the links

Alabama, Arizona, Florida, Georgia, Idaho, Illinois, Kansas, Massachusetts, Michigan, Minnesota, Mississippi, New York, North Dakota, Oklahoma, South Carolina, Utah, Virginia and Wisconsin.
I am not sure how it applies to common law marriage (not real marriage) in the U.S. but it does apply in other countries.

 

[mr.AwesomeGameTaste]

Where in the U.S. is infidelity considered a crime - especially between two people who are not married?
I'm no lawyer but even in divorce court, infidelity has little bearing unless there is a prenuptial agreement.

I actually looked into it,
"Most states, New York included, regard adultery as minor wrongdoing. Nevertheless, in Oklahoma, Massachusetts, Wisconsin, and Idaho among others, infidelity is regarded as a felony crime that warrants up to 5yrs imprisonment in the state penitentiary, or huge fines. The reason behind is few politicians being willing to vocally oppose anti-infidelity laws. Besides, many Americans support the idea that these laws serve as a moral guide and must be followed to the latter."
Now It may look different in practice,I'm not familiar with US law that well,but that's what I've found

 

[eddie987]

Where in the game do you see proof of this? Can you point it out please?

It's right after that point where you got a sentence of my comment out of context conveniently leaving out the part where I said that's my theory.

 

[KingWeWuz]

I thought I wouldn't need to clarify this, but my point was that she probably trusted him and looked at him as a friend. She said she missed natasha and sarah, and she didn't like bryce like that so I can only assume she still had a level of respect for him due to their past. But if you want to look at it differently, then that's alright.

I mean, in the words of Stu from the hangover, "I'm sorry the drug dealer from the liquor store wasn't a straight shooter."

The fact that she trusted this ass, as well as all the other pricks who bullied the mc for years enough to party with them shows she wasn't bright. She should have ended all contact if she was serious about both the mc and staying sober.

She had enough baggage getting clean from drugs. She had much more when she was raped. Given the confession she gave she's probably got a mountain more now.

I think the Dev's goal was to make us hate her, then realize she wasn't in the wrong and have sympathy for her. But to guys like me... she 100% was. I assume the next arc was foreshadowed by her confession. I'm guessing there was Bryce whoring her and feeding her drugs then throwing her away when he won the lotto. I don't think there's a reason to have her redeemed. She's already dead to most of us anyway.

Idk why Annie is on her side right now, she could've been making everything up.

 

[v1900]

Where in the game do you see proof of this? Can you point it out please?

Taken from one of Canto Forte posts.

 

[v1900]

I mean, in the words of Stu from the hangover, "I'm sorry the drug dealer from the liquor store wasn't a straight shooter."

The fact that she trusted this ass, as well as all the other pricks who bullied the mc for years enough to party with them shows she wasn't bright. She should have ended all contact if she was serious about both the mc and staying sober.

She had enough baggage getting clean from drugs. She had much more when she was raped. Given the confession she gave she's probably got a mountain more now.

I think the Dev's goal was to make us hate her, then realize she wasn't in the wrong and have sympathy for her. But to guys like me... she 100% was. I assume the next arc was foreshadowed by her confession. I'm guessing there was Bryce whoring her and feeding her drugs then throwing her away when he won the lotto. I don't think there's a reason to have her redeemed. She's already dead to most of us anyway.

Idk why Annie is on her side right now, she could've been making everything up.

Fuck I ran out of reactions. I think you might be on to something there.

 

[clowns234]

You must be registered to see the links

Alabama, Arizona, Florida, Georgia, Idaho, Illinois, Kansas, Massachusetts, Michigan, Minnesota, Mississippi, New York, North Dakota, Oklahoma, South Carolina, Utah, Virginia and Wisconsin.
I am not sure how it applies to common law marriage (not real marriage) in the U.S. but it does apply in other countries.

We're probably getting into a topic that will get these comments deleted, but thanks for the link.

 

[eddie987]

I thought I wouldn't need to clarify this, but my point was that she probably trusted him and looked at him as a friend. She said she missed natasha and sarah, and she didn't like bryce like that so I can only assume she still had a level of respect for him due to their past. But if you want to look at it differently, then that's alright.

Trusting him as a friend has nothing to do with her staying at a party where everyone is drinking and doing drugs, while she's been clean for a while and supposedly wants to stay that way. That's why I said I believe she still wanted to bang him. Maybe subconsciously, maybe not, but like I said, I don't see any other reasons for her to risk her newly found sobriety. She could stay there for a few minutes, say her goodbyes, plan something with Natasha and Sarah if she missed them so much and leave. Hell, she could even drink a beer with them before leaving if she felt strong enough. ONE beer though, not a couple because "they won't hurt".

You said yourself it looks like there's another reason she went there, other than just saying goodbye to him. For me that reason was the feelings she still had for Bryce and the last chance she had to hook up with him. Maybe (and here comes the subconscious part) deep down she knew that if anything happens, she could always blame it on the alcohol and/or joints.

 

[clowns234]

View attachment 1453030 Taken from one of Canto Forte posts.

And how is this a declaration that she is going there to cheat?
On people's accusation that she hid the fact that she was going, where exactly is that here?
Here is the actual dialog:
mc "So, you’re going to that party tonight right?"
av "Yeah, Bryce is going to leave soon so I thought I might as well go. Final goodbyes and all that."
mc "I heard Natasha and Sarah are going to be there too."
av "Yeah…Is it bad that I kinda miss them?"
mc "No, of course not. Just remember to not go overboard."
av "Obviously."
mc "Good. I love you."
av "I love you too, dork."
"{i}You and Ava go in for a quick embrace.{i}"
mc "Stay safe, and don’t stay up too late."
av "Yeah yeah, {b}dad{/b}."


More dialog:
Not seeing where she had the chance to explain:

"It's not what it looks like. I can explain later."
Bryce talks shit.
Punches thrown.
MC - "It's over. Don't ever fucking talk to me again."
"Ava seems like she wants to say something but remains speechless."
Sarah tells them to stop.
MC still in a rage.
MC leaves
"Ava, in shock, says nothing."
Sarah - "I should call Dick..."
Ava - "Sorry, I should go."
End scene
[/QUOTE]

 

[KingWeWuz]

And how is this a declaration that she is going there to cheat?

Here is the actual dialog:
mc "So, you’re going to that party tonight right?"
av "Yeah, Bryce is going to leave soon so I thought I might as well go. Final goodbyes and all that."
mc "I heard Natasha and Sarah are going to be there too."
av "Yeah…Is it bad that I kinda miss them?"
mc "No, of course not. Just remember to not go overboard."
av "Obviously."
mc "Good. I love you."
av "I love you too, dork."
"{i}You and Ava go in for a quick embrace.{i}"
mc "Stay safe, and don’t stay up too late."
av "Yeah yeah, {b}dad{/b}."

On people's accusation that she hid the fact that she was going, where exactly is that here?

I believe she's going to the party for bryce and sarah and natasha.

I don't think she went there with the intent to cheat.

I think she asked "is it bad I miss them?" To the mc because she knows it would hurt the mc that she enjoys being friends with his bullies, including Bryce. She says she doesn't like bryce, she's saying that because she's not sexually into him, but still wants to be his friend.

The mc is trying to look mature and let her say her goodbyes under the impression she won't get fucked up by her friends. Again, he is trusting her to know where she's going and whether or not the people there are going to treat her well.

Regardless the game will still end with Bryce winning and the mc losing like it always fucking does so idk why I'm even here.

 

[v1900]

And how is this a declaration that she is going there to cheat?

Here is the actual dialog:
mc "So, you’re going to that party tonight right?"
av "Yeah, Bryce is going to leave soon so I thought I might as well go. Final goodbyes and all that."
mc "I heard Natasha and Sarah are going to be there too."
av "Yeah…Is it bad that I kinda miss them?"
mc "No, of course not. Just remember to not go overboard."
av "Obviously."
mc "Good. I love you."
av "I love you too, dork."
"{i}You and Ava go in for a quick embrace.{i}"
mc "Stay safe, and don’t stay up too late."
av "Yeah yeah, {b}dad{/b}."

So here is an impasse that stems from two different ways of judging people. At least that is how I see it.

• On one hand there are the users like you that see Ava reacting to the cues of the scene as best she can. I may be wrong, if I am please point it out.
• On the other hand there are users like me that see Ava acting as a goal-directed adult.

If we see Ava as a goal-directed adult we immediately assume that what she first said, "Yeah, Bryce is going to leave soon so I thought I might as well go. Final goodbyes and all that." is her true goal and the rest is a way of buttering up the situation with the MC. It is like sayin I intend to do A but hey I also intend to do B, it is a negotiation. It may sound like a sociopathic way of seeing things but remember that rhetoric and manipulation are the same thing just with different connotations. Consider this:

It is not necessary to read all of it because it delves into the technical side of things but the introduction describes what "Goal-Directed Behavior" is.

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It tells us that we as humans plan ahead, even if we say we do not we always have some sort of expectation. I do not know if you read a post I made a few days ago in which I argued that if I am invited to a party with a discrete set of variables, I need to have an outlined goal of what my expectations of fun in that environment are. So the argument is that she already had a plan and that plan was going as it should until she felt the guilt of cheating. The alternative is that she is so stupid that she would need to be considered borderline retarded.

 

[clowns234]

So here is an impasse that stems from two different ways of judging people. At least that is how I see it.

• On one hand there are the users like you that see Ava reacting to the cues of the scene as best she can. I may be wrong, if I am please point it out.
• On the other hand there are users like me that see Ava acting as a goal-directed adult.

If we see Ava as a goal-directed adult we immediately assume that what she first said, "Yeah, Bryce is going to leave soon so I thought I might as well go. Final goodbyes and all that." is her true goal and the rest is a way of buttering up the situation with the MC. It is like sayin I intend to do A but hey I also intend to do B, it is a negotiation. It may sound like a sociopathic way of seeing things but remember that rhetoric and manipulation are the same thing just with different connotations. Consider this:

It is not necessary to read all of it because it delves into the technical side of things but the introduction describes what "Goal-Directed Behavior" is.

You must be registered to see the links

It tells us that we as humans plan ahead, even if we say we do not we always have some sort of expectation. I do not know if you read a post I made a few days ago in which I argued that if I am invited to a party with a discrete set of variables, I need to have an outlined goal of what my expectations of fun in that environment are. So the argument is that she already had a plan and that plan was going as it should until she felt the guilt of cheating. The alternative is that she is so stupid that she would need to be considered borderline retarded.

In a court of law here in the U.S, you are innocent until proven guilty. If the state can't prove their case with evidence, the verdict comes down as not-guilty. In this case, Ava would be found to be not guilty of cheating. "She must have thought this" is not evidence.

Your position seems to be that she is guilty until she can prove she is innocent.