VN Ren'Py Harem Hotel [v0.17.2] [Runey]

[Runey]

As a writer you see your story from different perspective. You have things planned ahead, so there is nothing to worry about.
But as a player I had mixed experience.

Early game:
- I've got a hotel, a cute elf. I expect bright future ahead with sexy girls. It seems like a free-roam no risk corruption game, where every step is rewarding. Like, unlocking a brother is a relaxing and joyful experiience. Same goes for early game events with girls: over time they open to more sexy actions, wear new outfits. There is nothing to worry about.

Endgame:
- It doesnt feel safe to *Talk* with a girl anymore. After I lost Maria, I grinded to buy sanctuary and all the rebeling elves, because I didnt know what to do. She didnt appear in my PC like other slaves. So I had a few month selling nudes and grinding money. Only to discover that Kali's father will give me 10.000 later in her questline. So now I have a ton of money and nothing to do with them...
- Story events become depressing. Walk with Sylvia and get a 200$ fine because she's not on a leash. Visit church and see how some guy cuts himself. Sit in a prison with your team for a few days without any control over situation. Have criminals and corrupt cops at your hotel putting everyone in danger. Visit an Owl village and look how some raiders enslave naked defenseless woman. Look at a bleeding elf android... Story events are not entertaining anymore. Every talk is about rape or slavery.

So my choice is simple: having most of the sex scenes and interactions unlocked I can enjoy my sandbox or I have to read through more and more depressing story and risk to stop at some cliffhanger, because its unfinished.

Oh, so you haven't even finished the story? Most of that stuff happened in the middle of the current story, not the end game.

It's quite strange to me to review a product you haven't finished, but it's not like that in every event after. Though if you think Sylvia getting fined and ritualistic flagellation is depressing, maybe it is? "Depressing" isn't the word I would use here at all, but you will see why this world needs to be changed, yes. It's not a good one. Slavery exists after all. I gave you all the reasons you needed to hate this world, but protect its people. Now MC and the girls are starting to do something about it.

What you're seeing is called exposition. An explanation on how this world works. Slaves who don't wear a collar get fined. That is supposed to make you dislike that, that's the point. You're meant to want to protect these people, but start with very little power or will to do so. Things like this only need to happen once, because the point of it is to make you aware of it, and dislike it.

Harem Hotel isn't a story about inconveniences. It's a story about changing the world. Though I think you might just want a game where you hang out and fuck around with cute girls. That's fine, but that's not harem hotel. It also doesn't make this game depressing though.

The first floor characters are beginning to enter the stage in their story where they actually start to make changes. They start to effect the world more and more. This will be a very bumpy ride, but it is one step above being in a situation with no power and not fighting back. I don't want to give away too many spoilers, but Lin and Ashley specifically in v0.17 will make a mark in this world. Harem Hotel's story as a whole is probably only 60% done.

 

[NeonSelf]

What you're seeing is called exposition. An explanation on how this world works. Slaves who don't wear a collar get fined. That is supposed to make you dislike that, that's the point. You're meant to want to protect these people, but start with very little power or will to do so.

It also doesn't make this game depressing though.

If having to watch how everything around is fucked up is not depressing, I dunno what to say.
You know about plot armor. But I have no clue, if the next story event will end up with MC in some shithole with his rights over hotel and slaves suspended or with some insane fine above that.

If you haven't caught on yet, Harem Hotel isn't a story about inconveniences. It's a story about changing the world. Though I suspect you don't want a story at all, and just want a game where you hang out and fuck around with cute girls.

Nope. There is enough sex scenes already. I've played a ton of great games without any sex scenes. But I hate it when I have to eat shit for no reason except story telling. In HH MC is getting fucked up on every corner. But he never goes to gym to increase his stats, he doesnt buy guns\armor, he doesnt go on vigilante missions at night to reduce crime levels. He just rolls with the story with no contol on the outcome.

Every time MC gets in a shitty situatation I have a feeling that I was not prepared enough, that I should have done something. Well, in good games my decisions define the outcome. But in HH all decisions I have is who I will *Talk* to next, and its never an informed decision and never changes the outcome.

If the purpose of this VN was to feed me with some bad experience then I dont see a reason why I should keep reading it.

 

[Runey]

If having to watch how everything around is fucked up is not depressing, I dunno what to say.
You know about plot armor. But I have no clue, if the next story event will end up with MC in some shithole with his rights over hotel and slaves suspended or with some insane fine above that.

I can see where you're coming from, but you need to understand that things happen in stories for very specific reasons. There are no coincidences in stories, and when there are, they are specifically placed to throw you off. When bad things happen in HH, it should be with the implication that "this needs to change."

Nope. There is enough sex scenes already. I've played a ton of great games without any sex scenes. But I hate it when I have to eat shit for no reason except story telling. In HH MC is getting fucked up on every corner. But he never goes to gym to increase his stats, he doesnt buy guns\armor, he doesnt go on vigilante missions at night to reduce crime levels. He just rolls with the story with no contol on the outcome.

Every time MC gets in a shitty situatation I have a feeling that I was not prepared enough, that I should have done something. Well, in good games my decisions define the outcome. But in HH all decisions I have is who I will *Talk* to next, and its never an informed decision and never changes the outcome.

If the purpose of this VN was to feed me with some bad experience then I dont see a reason why I should keep reading it.

MC is no hero, but he's the last one getting fucked. He's the one helping everyone who gets fucked. I've even developed an event in v0.17 already where MC saves the day. He's the protector, and he does that job well. It is currently under threat, and MC is very aware of this. I would love to hear suggestions that would help fix this issue for you, because your understanding of HH is not what I've intended HH to be.

But again, Harem Hotel is not a sandbox. You said in your review that it was a pure sandbox with management elements, but this could not be further from the truth. Harem Hotel is designed to be a story. It certainly has those elements, but they are not the purpose of this game's existence. The purpose of sandbox and management elements is to gain side content only. MC going to the gym to gain stats makes no sense because it wouldn't have any impact on the story. He's not a fighter, he's the protector. Nia is the fighter.

Your decisions will never define the outcome of HH, because it is not a sandbox, it is a linear story.

You don't have to keep reading it. I am simply correcting some things you've said, and trying to understand your point of view. I did say thank you for the review after all. I literally said in the comment you responded to "It's a story about changing the world. ", not one trying to feed you with bad experiences.

 

[NeonSelf]

Your decisions will never define the outcome of HH, because it is not a sandbox, it is a linear story.

I've developed different standards for sandbox in my gaming experience. And I feel like HH is more sandbox than alot of other games on this site. Even Minecraft has linear story: start in overworld - get to nether - conquer stronghold - open portal to the end - kill the dragon.

As for HH, it already has features, that define sandbox for me.
- you decide when to progress the story further
- you have no time restrictions
- you are free to unlock and repeatedly experience new content, not related to the main story.
- you can customize your game experience to your liking (change outfits, ignore secondary girls storylines)
- you have more than one way of achieving the same goal. (earn money by hotel upgrades\deliveries\selling nudes etc)

The main difference between HH and other sandbox games is that HH story progress is not defined by your stats.
While in minecraft you have to craft good armor and potions to kill the dragon and there is a great chance of failed attempt, in HH you just have to keep talking to your girls. But in both games the end result is predetermined.

PS: Changed my review to "Almost sandbox".

 

[Runey]

I've developed different standards for sandbox in my gaming experience. And I feel like HH is more sandbox than alot of other games on this site. Even Minecraft has linear story: start in overworld - get to nether - conquer stronghold - open portal to the end - kill the dragon.

As for HH, it already has features, that define sandbox for me.
- you decide when to progress the story further
- you have no time restrictions
- you are free to unlock and repeatedly experience new content, not related to the main story.
- you can customize your game experience to your liking (change outfits, ignore secondary girls storylines)
- you have more than one way of achieving the same goal. (earn money by hotel upgrades\deliveries\selling nudes etc)

The main difference between HH and other sandbox games is that HH story progress is not defined by your stats.
While in minecraft you have to craft good armor and potions to kill the dragon and there is a great chance of failed attempt, in HH you just have to keep talking to your girls. But in both games the end result is predetermined.

Yes, I'm not saying HH doesn't have sandbox elements in it. I'm saying it's not PURELY sandbox, which is what you mentioned in the review. It also does have time restrictions, all the sandbox elements are only for the side content and choosing when the story starts. The main purpose of the game is the story, not the side content. I don't think this is an issue that needs to be repeated at all, but that's what I'm talking about. It is certainly fine to see the sandbox elements in the game, but that is not all the game is, nor is it the primary purpose. That's all I'm trying to say in this regard. Opinions aside, this is how Harem Hotel is developed. It is not created as a pure sandbox, but as a visual novel.

Harem Hotel and Minecraft could not be further genres from each other. Minecraft has more in common with call of duty. Comparing Minecraft to HH is so strange to me. Harem Hotel is closer to Persona 5, which is also a visual novel with sandbox elements and JRPG combat.

Regardless though, my main gripe is leaving readers of your review with the impression that this game is a pure sandbox, which is not what I intend to develop. Story is the main aspect of Harem Hotel, and is what gets the most attention. Sorry if this isn't a conversation you want to have, you don't have to change it if you don't want to. I just thought I would share.

A new review just showed up calling HH a sandbox, which I see no issue with. Because in many regards it is both a sandbox and a visual novel. But I don't want players to expect a sandbox, because I mainly develop HH as a visual novel. That's where most of the content is, so that's what people should expect.

 

[NeonSelf]

Harem Hotel and Minecraft could no be further genres from each other. Comparing them is so strange. Harem Hotel is closer to Persona 5, which is also a visual novel with sandbox elements.

I've changed review to "Almost sandbox", hope you like it.

Honestly, almost every game I've played has a linear story. They are designed with end goal in mind. HH just happens to have more dialogs. I've never played Persona games, sorry. But you can take a look at any other game to see the picture: FarCry games have linear story but free world to explore, Starcraft has linear story but sandbox gameplay, GTA has main storyline, Need For Speed has linear story but you can finish it with any car...

Ofcourse there are some exceptions, where you have to choose one possible ending, like in Fallout or DeusEx. But those games are so few that I consider them minority.

 

[Runey]

I've changed review to "Almost sandbox", hope you like it.

Honestly, almost every game I've played has a linear story. They are designed with end goal in mind. HH just happens to have more dialogs. I've never played Persona games, sorry. But you can take a look at any other game to see the picture: FarCry games have linear story but free world to explore, Starcraft has linear story but sandbox gameplay, GTA has main storyline, Need For Speed has linear story but you can finish it with any car...

Ofcourse there are some exceptions, where you have to choose one possible ending, like in Fallout or DeusEx. But those games are so few that I consider them minority.

It's a small thing, but I appreciate that!

Yeah, genres have no real set definitions I think. It's all a blurry line and it often crosses with other genres. Like a "Dramedy" (Drama Comedy) which can be really hard to pull off. But it all helps with expectations. (you may also want to update the money making section? There's deliveries, and the bar gives you a ton of income, with more on the way!)

 

[NeonSelf]

(you may also want to update the money making section? There's deliveries, and the bar gives you a ton of income, with more on the way!)

Considering the price of building and fully upgrading the bar... It gives like $500-600 a week, which is close to $80 a day. While I can have a photoshoot with F&E for $100-125 per session and it costs basically nothing?

I wouldnt even consider grinding money in the first place, if I knew beforehand that I will get 10000 from Kali's father. But it was my experience in this version, when I needed sanctuary and elves, because some online guide said that I can get Maria back this way. The total cost of sanctuary+3 elves is 13000, it takes 160 days to earn them with fully upgraded bar, without selling nude pictures. Thats a very long time. And I didn have a fully upgraded bar at that moment, its pretty expensive and takes time to buy all upgrades.

I dont think its fair to say there is no money grind. Or there is some smart way to avoid my "mistake" of prefering to progress with different girl than Kali. While writing "Progress with Kali to build sanctuary" in review seems like a major spoiler.

 

[shadowtempered]

Runey the last 3-4 pages are discussion on NeonSelf 's post, others chiming in and making suggestions. Not sure how far you've gotten but there might be something useful in the suggestions.

One suggestion was gatekeeping Sanctuary. I know you've commented on not having players grind and in Neon's specific instance, he did (as he mentioned above) mostly because he wasn't interested in Kali (heathen! /s). It's a legit gripe from a new player perspective. Another was adjusting the front page description to match the ITCH.io description. It calls the game a VN, but here it does not.

I'm not sure if you've had time to dig through the recent history or not, but there are some comments from newer players and older alike trying to come up with a bit of a "middle" ground.

 

[c3p0]

Considering the price of building and fully upgrading the bar... It gives like $500-600 a week, which is close to $80 a day. While I can have a photoshoot with F&E for $100-125 per session and it costs basically nothing?

Don't have the precisice number around, but the bar generate a lot of income and that fully passive. The whole comercials gives you usually 100-200$ alone (well I will make notes and update this post).
But the baseline is, the bar is, at the moment, the only thing you need to buy once and then it generate money. So that means, you can fully update the bar (including sport and training) and then have photoshoots the whole day.
Also the photoshoots doesn't cost nothing, it cost time.

E/
So, progress report of a fully upgraded bar:
390 + 250 + 100 + 75 + 10 - 20 = 805

Spoiler: Pics

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[Uthuriel]

Question which of the two routes of the elves is better?

Depends on what you want.
I'd say story wise the love path makes more sense than the slave path.

So ask yourself. Do you want to be mean to your elves or do you want to love them?

 

[Runey]

Runey the last 3-4 pages are discussion on NeonSelf 's post, others chiming in and making suggestions. Not sure how far you've gotten but there might be something useful in the suggestions.

One suggestion was gatekeeping Sanctuary. I know you've commented on not having players grind and in Neon's specific instance, he did (as he mentioned above) mostly because he wasn't interested in Kali (heathen! /s). It's a legit gripe from a new player perspective. Another was adjusting the front page description to match the ITCH.io description. It calls the game a VN, but here it does not.

I'm not sure if you've had time to dig through the recent history or not, but there are some comments from newer players and older alike trying to come up with a bit of a "middle" ground.

Oh I'm sorry, I guess I missed all of that!

 

[Craigdon97]

how do i order supplies for nia?

 

[torresm]

how do i order supplies for nia?

Your PC on your room, same menu you used to order a new hard drive for Kali once.

 

[Hentai1987]

Oh I'm sorry, I guess I missed all of that!

I had that strange situation where I wanted to continue the story of character A (i think i was Lin) but for that, i needed to have enough friendship with character B (i think it was the Android) but to have enough friendship with character B i needed enough friendship with character C. That can be a little bit annoying. My suggestion would be that you can buy every week a gift for a character and increase the friendship that way

 

[Craigdon97]

Your PC on your room, same menu you used to order a new hard drive for Kali once.

ah thanks

 

[torresm]

Don't have the precisice number around, but the bar generate a lot of income and that fully passive. The whole comercials gives you usually 100-200$ alone (well I will make notes and update this post).
But the baseline is, the bar is, at the moment, the only thing you need to buy once and then it generate money. So that means, you can fully update the bar (including sport and training) and then have photoshoots the whole day.
Also the photoshoots doesn't cost nothing, it cost time.

E/
So, progress report of a fully upgraded bar:
390 + 250 + 100 + 75 + 10 - 20 = 805

Spoiler: Pics

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I like your choice of background image.

 

[NeonSelf]

I had that strange situation where I wanted to continue the story of character A (i think i was Lin) but for that, i needed to have enough friendship with character B (i think it was the Android) but to have enough friendship with character B i needed enough friendship with character C. That can be a little bit annoying. My suggestion would be that you can buy every week a gift for a character and increase the friendship that way

Friendship means relationship level, not affection. You have to go through a storyline with that character.

 

[Hentai1987]

Friendship means relationship level, not affection. You have to go through a storyline with that character.

Then it must have been the affection. I could not continue the story of the character Lin because of reasons obove. I think it happend before Lin wanted to visit the High Elf Queen

 

[DigDug69]

I had that strange situation where I wanted to continue the story of character A (i think i was Lin) but for that, i needed to have enough friendship with character B (i think it was the Android) but to have enough friendship with character B i needed enough friendship with character C. That can be a little bit annoying. My suggestion would be that you can buy every week a gift for a character and increase the friendship that way

Not sure how that would work out, because you sometimes learn important things about other characters during events.
So, it pays in the long run to spend time with the others too, because they help you trigger other events that you might be interested in.
I'm not into Ellen, but I still make a point of spending some time with her, at least once a week, just to cover my bases.