VN Ren'Py Kingdom of Deception [v0.14.2.1] [Hreinn Games]

[Negativpro0]

Oh I don't hate their writing, it just became so bad over the past years that by now it's irrelevant if you read all lines or skip most of them. And with bad I mean uninspired, boring and in some cases even illogical or just plain dumb.

Was it ever good? - Yes
Do they write too much? too little? - Yes
What are other games you've played that have better writing? - Games by SierraLee or Akabur for example.

Do you value quality writing in adult games or not really?
( I commonly see posters on F95 say the story in "adult games" just gets in the way)

It depends. Of course there are plenty of games where the story is just there to set the theme and they are fine the way they are,
because they focus on what they want to achieve. But for me, a game has to be more than just a variety of different pics. The rule34 sites have literally hundreds of thousands of pics so I don't need a game to spice up my imagination. What I want is stories and characters, in a self-contained world that is believable in their own sets of rules.
An exaggerated example: Jacksons Lord of the Rings works, The Rings of Power............. not.

The lotr comparison completely out of nowhere does not help my guy. Just mention Princess Trainer from Akabur or Gorepete games.

 

[Skarfaze]

I often find something to be displeased about with each update, but with the "latest" one I am most pissed off at the dev for them checking off Ylva's quest as "finished". No it fucking hasn't been finished, you can't just tease Ylva's and Ornshakar's confrontation like that and just hold it off for another three years. You want to focus on ending quests, alright, but don't end one on a fucking CLIFFHANGER and say "ight this quest's done, let's get on to another one"
Also yes, I do play Subia under Ornshakar's influence and wanted to see Ylva completely broken, fite me

Based and correct route

 

[aaaaaaaaaaaaaa1]

I just want to see boobies

 

[bitchass92]

Why is it lazy?

What constructive criticisms have you raised?
(Is there a post that sums them up? If you already wrote this I don't expect you to write it again, you can just link it.. or point me to it.)

What do you mean every scene is a "rapefest" - how is that different from Noxian Night scenes when you take certain story routes?

What would you consider "back on track" ?

You mean how Orcs accents and language rules change to an extremely blocky text that basically just repeats? "Dul say shut the fuck up cum rag" "Cum rug, Dul say shut the fuck up" Basically that's all the dialogue is anymore. If you look hard enough you'll see more than just the top three posts of people breaking down why the dialogue AND the story has gotten very off track, with ZERO branches... remember you could CHOOSE Dajrab or Independent Sabia and they basically have no real bearing on the story at all. Not to mention... I mean fuck it man I'm not gonna justify why we feel it's bad. Play the beginning segments. Then play the later segments. Everything from feature creep, to pacing, to believability. If the game started by not taking itself seriously, I don't think we would either.

But it did and it presented itself as a really immersive experience for a porn game. Instead it became the anime level ridiculousness that's common in many games like that without the polish.

 

[bitchass92]

Since this topic started, I already made a kind of re-estructure of the story and some gameplay changes. Its a lot to read BUT, I made this in, idk, an hour? I think this is a good way to shape the story back on track

"Rework of the dom/sub system + More ways to make lundils
The dom/sub number system is kinda forgot, so, we need to use it, but not for achieve hentai scenes in the main or sub quests, the grind of the numbers shouldn't reflect an impact in how good or bad an scene can be. Then, for what do we use it? To relax the main story part of the game, we need something to the player who doesn't want to read today and just want a relaxed jerk off and also to gain lundils in the game. In the Grok og Dar (the orc town) we could use
-Waitress (Tips for some gropping, and eventually sex, nudity, and also include de slutty outfit to the bar)
-Stores (Clothing store, Sabia shows outfit, gets groped, ripped the clothes, etc. For the others stores I need to think more, especifically the equipment store)
-Hellhound kennels (I need to say it? Lol)
-Maid service in the orc's tents (I mean, we already had a barmaid outfit and also repetitive scenes in orc tents, soooo *wink wink*)
-Tents because there is NO FUCKING WAY we can't use this in a porn game, I know originally Sierra think this was a good idea, and as much I respect her as fucking good writter, this is a bad decision
For the human town, for my surprise, there is a LOT of content to do, the slums and the bar already have scenes, but we can do more, as we already now
-Stables (Riven + Kat flashbacks, Sabia + Kat incoming PLEASE NOMO DO IT)
-Temple (Nun, we already saw Sabia as a nun, so, yeah, not a crazy idea)
-Training grounds (Sabia lose=Fuck, no need to complicate things)

Improve the captains influence in the orc town

At this point, Groknar is better dead (It was that his name? Can't even remember) so its time to make the vote about who will be the next leader of the orc town, depending on who will be, the story could warp one way or another

-Rockgrid -> We wil go to explore more human towns (Carchedon, we could continue the route of Barrin, influence in the Lundarian towns)
-Dajrab -> This option is, kinda complicated to schedule, I want to make it more of a free roam style but... I have already decided the free roam route, so, I thinked this route as a orc centred route, with the shamans with more influence than Dajrab itself, were we could see the impact of the Ornshaktar alliance or Ylva, it depending on your choices, with this I'm not saying that the routes of Rockgrid or Tekrok won't have shamans influence, just that THIS especifically route would have the shamans pushing for power as they see Dajrab a neutral leader, with no powerful allies except Sabia.
-Tekrok -> Ah, the CAOS option, with this one we will explore everything besides Lundar, we will prepare the scenario of a WAR. We will visit Catgirls campaments around the lands, to the Elves tribes and, of fuckign course, we will see the minotaurs, Naltan, where they have human slaves, yeah, this will be a FANTASTIC choice for Subia
-Sabia -> Well, this is a route than Sabia ALWAYS should be able to choose, why? Even if she takes the sub path, SHE IS A COMMANDER, fuck, she is the daugther of a powerfull mage and a fucking general of the army, the girl has it, she can liderate orcs, we already saw that when she trained her troops, well, now we can make it better with town management, where do you want more influence? Tents? Bar? Training Grounds? Who will you choose to be your allies? The captains who want power now that YOU are their leader? Neve? Jadk? This will be the literally description of free will, you can negotiate with force or sex, use your influence to win money, power or get laid, negotiate with foreign lands, try to make your allies and liderate this little orc town to get revenge or to find answers, as I said, is the player choice.


With this schedule, you can pretty much advance in the main quest to almost the finale, you can always put one or two sub quest to this advance but you need to see where the story is going to star moving to SOMEWHERE. As always, feedback is always welcome, in any way, if you say is shit, its okay, I won't be mad, if you want to change, contribute in something, always welcome and if you think its fantastic/good/awesome, then thank you very much"

I love this hand have had some similar thoughts. But I think it's fair to note this: Myself included, people payed Hrein money for a quality product. It began to decline sharply in quality AND IN COMMUNICATION WITH it's customers. When they were offered and are offered constructive criticism it is perceived to be the opposite and ignored.

Why should I contribute to this anymore instead of just go make a porn game myself?

 

[kailina55]

I guess it was naive of me to actually expect more consistent content releases after they promised more consistent content releases, huh?

 

[souldead341]

I guess it was naive of me to actually expect more consistent content releases after they promised more consistent content releases, huh?

Yeah, seeing as that's basically the same promise they've been making for years, with no increases in update speed / consistency.

 

[BootLicking Appreciator]

I don't understand that though. Noxian Nights heavily featured it.
Wasn't the original beginning of the game a "Non-Con" orc scene? Was that axed because of Nomo, Sierra or Patreon?

That was the chosen beginning of the game while Sierra was working on it - right?

EDIT:
Maybe I am misremembering KoD.. but I don't feel like Non-Con is really featured that much more than NN did..

The difference is I feel like non con in KOD feels like actual non con whilst in noxian nights it didn't. Riven never really acted like the sex was the problem or that she didn't like it, that's why you could repeat almost any scene. And it differs in KOD because in KOD sabia supposedly does it to get ahead easier and quicker whilst in noxian nights riven just gave blow jobs for fun and had sex for fun too, all out in the open. Sure the bad end where riven gets defeated by a boss are for sure non con but it's never made a big deal out of, even the ones where she gets overwhelmed by the ghoul and dog is non con, but when she wakes up she doesn't even bring it up and is completely fine with it. Katarina later on also develops a taste for giant cock thanks to the minotaurs.

 

[DreamingAway]

The difference is I feel like non con in KOD feels like actual non con whilst in noxian nights it didn't. Riven never really acted like the sex was the problem or that she didn't like it, that's why you could repeat almost any scene. And it differs in KOD because in KOD sabia supposedly does it to get ahead easier and quicker whilst in noxian nights riven just gave blow jobs for fun and had sex for fun too, all out in the open. Sure the bad end where riven gets defeated by a boss are for sure non con but it's never made a big deal out of, even the ones where she gets overwhelmed by the ghoul and dog is non con, but when she wakes up she doesn't even bring it up and is completely fine with it. Katarina later on also develops a taste for giant cock thanks to the minotaurs.

This feels like a bit of a stretch...

The guy who your forced to service to sleep in his house (which is 100% not even avoidable, you have zero agency as a player to avoid this in NN) feels far more non-con than choosing to go down a submissive route, purposefully shacking up with tekrok.. then using your submissive stat to sleep around. (You actually have a ton of player choice around being submissively sexual or not in KoD)

Reminder that Riven can go back and kill that guy as revenge.. why are you seeking revenge on him if it was "just for fun" from Riven's perspective?

I know this has gone completely down a rabbit hole, but I'm still not buying it..

 

[..a..]

would you re-upload the link please?

pw Ghnjv67ur

You must be registered to see the links

 

[FatDick McSwingin]

pw Ghnjv67ur

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Thank you!

 

[nyqz]

Since this topic started, I already made a kind of re-estructure of the story and some gameplay changes. Its a lot to read BUT, I made this in, idk, an hour? I think this is a good way to shape the story back on track

"Rework of the dom/sub system + More ways to make lundils
The dom/sub number system is kinda forgot, so, we need to use it, but not for achieve hentai scenes in the main or sub quests, the grind of the numbers shouldn't reflect an impact in how good or bad an scene can be. Then, for what do we use it? To relax the main story part of the game, we need something to the player who doesn't want to read today and just want a relaxed jerk off and also to gain lundils in the game. In the Grok og Dar (the orc town) we could use
-Waitress (Tips for some gropping, and eventually sex, nudity, and also include de slutty outfit to the bar)
-Stores (Clothing store, Sabia shows outfit, gets groped, ripped the clothes, etc. For the others stores I need to think more, especifically the equipment store)
-Hellhound kennels (I need to say it? Lol)
-Maid service in the orc's tents (I mean, we already had a barmaid outfit and also repetitive scenes in orc tents, soooo *wink wink*)
-Tents because there is NO FUCKING WAY we can't use this in a porn game, I know originally Sierra think this was a good idea, and as much I respect her as fucking good writter, this is a bad decision
For the human town, for my surprise, there is a LOT of content to do, the slums and the bar already have scenes, but we can do more, as we already now
-Stables (Riven + Kat flashbacks, Sabia + Kat incoming PLEASE NOMO DO IT)
-Temple (Nun, we already saw Sabia as a nun, so, yeah, not a crazy idea)
-Training grounds (Sabia lose=Fuck, no need to complicate things)

All great ideas, most of which could be implemented with existing assets. I'd probably also add some kind of money-sink to the game (maybe you have to pay out some money to your troops every now and then to keep them loyal/improve their training) because the last couple of updates I've been stacking up money with nowhere to spend it.

Improve the captains influence in the orc town

At this point, Groknar is better dead (It was that his name? Can't even remember) so its time to make the vote about who will be the next leader of the orc town, depending on who will be, the story could warp one way or another

-Rockgrid -> We wil go to explore more human towns (Carchedon, we could continue the route of Barrin, influence in the Lundarian towns)
-Dajrab -> This option is, kinda complicated to schedule, I want to make it more of a free roam style but... I have already decided the free roam route, so, I thinked this route as a orc centred route, with the shamans with more influence than Dajrab itself, were we could see the impact of the Ornshaktar alliance or Ylva, it depending on your choices, with this I'm not saying that the routes of Rockgrid or Tekrok won't have shamans influence, just that THIS especifically route would have the shamans pushing for power as they see Dajrab a neutral leader, with no powerful allies except Sabia.
-Tekrok -> Ah, the CAOS option, with this one we will explore everything besides Lundar, we will prepare the scenario of a WAR. We will visit Catgirls campaments around the lands, to the Elves tribes and, of fuckign course, we will see the minotaurs, Naltan, where they have human slaves, yeah, this will be a FANTASTIC choice for Subia
-Sabia -> Well, this is a route than Sabia ALWAYS should be able to choose, why? Even if she takes the sub path, SHE IS A COMMANDER, fuck, she is the daugther of a powerfull mage and a fucking general of the army, the girl has it, she can liderate orcs, we already saw that when she trained her troops, well, now we can make it better with town management, where do you want more influence? Tents? Bar? Training Grounds? Who will you choose to be your allies? The captains who want power now that YOU are their leader? Neve? Jadk? This will be the literally description of free will, you can negotiate with force or sex, use your influence to win money, power or get laid, negotiate with foreign lands, try to make your allies and liderate this little orc town to get revenge or to find answers, as I said, is the player choice.

Kind of appealing, but also way too much work. Hrienn was struggling to juggle the branching factions even when updates were way more frequent and plot focused, implementing it in some sort of mod would be even less realistic.
IMO the captains would be improved if being allied to one of them didn't lock you out of any interaction with the others. For example if Sabia allies with Tekrok maybe he could send her off to make peace with Rockgrid because he doesn't want a feud at base camp distracting from his other plans. I do think giving Sabia more small quests around the camp to build up influence is a good idea. There were a fair number of those in the early patches, and they gave everything a lot more life. Adding some repeatable scenes associated with each faction would also be a pretty easy way to make them seem less lifeless.

 

[BootLicking Appreciator]

This feels like a bit of a stretch...

The guy who your forced to service to sleep in his house (which is 100% not even avoidable, you have zero agency as a player to avoid this in NN) feels far more non-con than choosing to go down a submissive route, purposefully shacking up with tekrok.. then using your submissive stat to sleep around. (You actually have a ton of player choice around being submissively sexual or not in KoD)

Reminder that Riven can go back and kill that guy as revenge.. why are you seeking revenge on him if it was "just for fun" from Riven's perspective?

I know this has gone completely down a rabbit hole, but I'm still not buying it..

LOL I literally forgot you can kill that guy later on (I never did personally) . I felt the same at the beginning (that it's heavy non con) but later on because you can repeat it infinitely and riven starts to like it more and more I changed my mind. But anyway I just wanted to say my opinion, I like riven as a protagonist way more and NN is a much better game than KOD currently.

 

[rockon123]

Reading this thread.. I see the major 2 categories of complaints are:

• Updates have significantly slowed down
• Art quality has degraded
  • The character's design changed
  • Scenes are only a single still image
  • Art reuse is rampant

Is this the reason that the community has largely turned on the game?
Are there any other hot topic issues people have?

I am very curious where the hate comes from. I often see people criticize the story but they are never specific 'why' the story / writing is bad. Usually they name drop Sierra Lee as the source of this games good writing and leave it at that.

Out of curiosity I sometimes follow up with those posters to see if they've also reviewed or posted in Sierra's other game threads (mainly once ever after which also seems to have gained some community critcism) and I don't usually find anything..

Genuinely curious on people's opinions around this game and why it's garnered so much hatred.

I honestly don't expect much dialogues and plots from a porn game.
Only concerned with theupdates ffrequency and content

 

[BootLicking Appreciator]

I am wondering where the story stands in terms of progression like middle or nearly to complete and how many updates till it is completed they took like 6 years and I feel the game is no near to be completed

The story is nowhere lol. We don't know how many more updates it'll take (better that way cuz the dev will lie anyway) and yes you're right, it's nowhere near being finished. My prediction is this game won't be finished but rather abandoned OR given a bad end to just end it quickly, when the money dries up of course.

 

[Deleted member 4110908]

Any hero for the latest bonus extras?

 

[BootLicking Appreciator]

This game was good or at least playable until the "whatever the hell happened" to chief from that point you don't know what the hell you are doing
Another thing I hated about "Sabia" is in the dom route she still accepts to be fucked and being taken advantage of they poorly written that route like she doesn't think that she is a warrior
For the ends( if there will be ones)I assume it will be copy paste from noxian nights ends

The dom/sub thing is completely dead and it doesn't rlly make any difference. She isn't a true Dom or true sub in either. As for the ending, they'll make 1 end IF they get to that point. Noxian nights had like 6-7 endings iirc and that was back when they weren't extremely lazy and a actual team. Plus riven was a whore, sabia isn't portrayed like that, it's always non con with her.

 

[DreamingAway]

BootLicking Appreciator
Spanking ajajjss

Do you think this game would of been better in RPGMaker like Noxian Nights?
Do you generally prefer RPGMaker or Renpy games?

 

[BootLicking Appreciator]

BootLicking Appreciator
Spanking ajajjss

Do you think this game would of been better in RPGMaker like Noxian Nights?
Do you generally prefer RPGMaker or Renpy games?

Well I personally prefer RPGMaker because I played a few games on that so that's why, but I don't think it would've turned out any different than it already is. It's all about the devs.

 

[DreamingAway]

Well I personally prefer RPGMaker because I played a few games on that so that's why

Is that the only reason?

If I stretched your arm back, could you give any reasons you prefer one over the other?

I do wonder if KoD is scrutinized more on it's writing / artworking because there is literally nothing else to judge it on.