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somebodynobody

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May 11, 2017
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I'll need to do more extensive testing on this before I roll it into the main-line, but here's the AI-enabled poker-game. I actually spent longer uploading than I did building this AI (though it benefits from basically being derived from the old enemy AI code(.

bb1111 : if you want to have a look, you can enable the auto-playing AI from Settings.
I will give the autoplay a run through. So you can have a few people's opinions.

Oh I remember reading you were building a grammar checker link to work in your game, did that ever happen?

Do any of the text choices change future text choices/statements? If so, it would be easier to have a large text file of who says what to check against what happens in the game.
 

Droid Productions

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I will give the autoplay a run through. So you can have a few people's opinions.

Oh I remember reading you were building a grammar checker link to work in your game, did that ever happen?
1576754921911.png


That's the Grammarbot. It's a bit too slow to do WYSIWYG style text-parsing, unfortunately. I can however click on it if I want it's feedback. I also build a system that would spit it all out to a text file (Tab Separated Values, with a GUID + Text String). I thought about running that through grammarly or something like that that. I haven't gotten around to building the system for pulling it back in again, but it's on the list of things to do.



Do any of the text choices change future text choices/statements? If so, it would be easier to have a large text file of who says what to check against what happens in the game.
That dialog (early in Act II) is quite simple / linear. If you look at something like the StripMMA, though, it's not just branching, but also recursive:

1576755179243.png
 

somebodynobody

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View attachment 490919


That's the Grammarbot. It's a bit too slow to do WYSIWYG style text-parsing, unfortunately. I can however click on it if I want it's feedback. I also build a system that would spit it all out to a text file (Tab Separated Values, with a GUID + Text String). I thought about running that through grammarly or something like that that. I haven't gotten around to building the system for pulling it back in again, but it's on the list of things to do.





That dialog (early in Act II) is quite simple / linear. If you look at something like the StripMMA, though, it's not just branching, but also recursive:

View attachment 490920
Nice setup.

My asking about if the dialogue was branching was mainly for a "final pass" looking at the text for typos before Act 2. Is easier to check linear text then have to replay the game 80 times. Like hey you said nice things to your mom oh now incest exists, you were mean to your mom now Chloe has a hate boner for you being mean to her friend. etc.
 
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somebodynobody

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This coming from a complete noob, but wouldn't making an auto win button way simpler for both you and that one person who hates poker?
Like Droid mentioned, there is story relevant talking during the fights. So an auto-win would make that person not get the info. So an AI to play it out, allowing the text to play is the better solution.
 

Memorin

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Like Droid mentioned, there is story relevant talking during the fights. So an auto-win would make that person not get the info. So an AI to play it out, allowing the text to play is the better solution.
That's where you're wrong. Why the hell should the dev make an autoplay feature for the person who doesn't even want to touch the core gameplay in the first place? They're the ones who chose to skip it, so missing some in-battle dialogue is only a matter of course. Plus, not many dialogue take place during the poker game anyway, one or two missed lines isn't going to kill your whole experience. Also, what if the auto play Poker game drags on to 30 minutes because the AIs on both sides are a dumbass? Even ten minutes is a pain already because the player is required to do NOTHING during that period! That in my opinion is what truly ruins the experience!

Seriously, it's the dev's choice but making an auto play feature is ridiculous in my opinion.
 

somebodynobody

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Yeah, I can dump the text to Google docs easily, for example
The porn games on the computer, please make it a showy patreon link instead of auto-opening a browser. No one likes having their browser opened, and especially a non-private tab when linking to porn things.

Auto play seems to work fine. On average under 2 minutes to finish.

That's where you're wrong. Why the hell should the dev make an autoplay feature for the person who doesn't even want to touch the core gameplay in the first place? They're the ones who chose to skip it, so missing some in-battle dialogue is only a matter of course. Plus, not many dialogue take place during the poker game anyway, one or two missed lines isn't going to kill your whole experience. Also, what if the auto play Poker game drags on to 30 minutes because the AIs on both sides are a dumbass? Even ten minutes is a pain already because the player is required to do NOTHING during that period! That in my opinion is what truly ruins the experience!

Seriously, it's the dev's choice but making an auto play feature is ridiculous in my opinion.
I assume he would make it so people could enjoy the game, the game itself isn't the poker. The poker is just a portion of the game which leans much closer to a rpg visual novel with sandbox elements. You are also only considering what exists right now, however he may add a ton of information in battles where it would be missed with auto-win. The AI plays it just like the player would, going for good damage, unless you think the AI going for a 4 of a kind is a stupid move.

Where are you getting 30 minutes or 10 minutes to play the poker mini-game?

He did already post the version where you can turn on auto-battle, you can try it before disliking it.
 

Droid Productions

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That's where you're wrong. Why the hell should the dev make an autoplay feature for the person who doesn't even want to touch the core gameplay in the first place? They're the ones who chose to skip it, so missing some in-battle dialogue is only a matter of course. Plus, not many dialogue take place during the poker game anyway, one or two missed lines isn't going to kill your whole experience. Also, what if the auto play Poker game drags on to 30 minutes because the AIs on both sides are a dumbass? Even ten minutes is a pain already because the player is required to do NOTHING during that period! That in my opinion is what truly ruins the experience!

Seriously, it's the dev's choice but making an auto play feature is ridiculous in my opinion.
The auto-play functionality was thankfully simple enough to make; one thing I do need to do is guard optional dialog from the allies (for example, Dylan will reference undead dogs the first time you use him.... that would be bad if the player autoplays / doesn't click him, and the next time you're facing a defiler. So I need that system anyway.

I can't just *skip* the dialog, unfortunately (well, I could, but we'd end up with all kinds of continuity issues down the road). For example, on the first combat, Emily speaks to you three times (one on round 2, one when you drop below 1/2 health, one when youi win). If I just auto-advanced, those dialog segments would either have to be discarded somehow, or they'd play back-to-back once the combat ended, which would sound/look weird.

One thing the AI doesn't (currently) do is use the allies. Since they become an increasingly central part of the game in Act II, I need a way around that. I could make "do something" be a button you pressed, which would allow you to use your allied powers as well. I could try to auto-use allies, but while Dylan and Katie are trivial (heal ME, fireball THE OTHER DUDE) once you start adding sorcery into the mix, the logic required will become non-trivial fast.

It's been a common refrain that a substantial portion of the userbase hates subgames... it makes me a little sad, since I obviously spent hours and hours making the poker minigame, but I also don't want people to just turn off the game because they hate poker. Maybe one easy solution is to have a "help me" button somewhere that , if clicked, will just do whatever the AI thinks the best move will be.
 
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somebodynobody

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It's been a common refrain that a substantial portion of the userbase hates subgames... it makes me a little sad, since I obviously spent hours and hours making the poker minigame, but I also don't want people to just turn off the game because they hate poker. Maybe one easy solution is to have a "help me" button somewhere that , if clicked, will just do whatever the AI thinks the best move will be.
Maybe a better idea would be to follow what the connect 3+ type games do and after a little time has passed without a move do a little flash of the best cards and best placing for them. So the person can still play/learn even if they are bad, or like you mentioned a "suggest" but that could also have one of the allies say "use me" of course with more dialogue.
 
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Droid Productions

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Maybe a better idea would be to follow what the connect 3+ type games do and after a little time has passed without a move do a little flash of the best cards and best placing for them. So the person can still play/learn even if they are bad, or like you mentioned a "suggest" but that could also have one of the allies say "use me" of course with more dialogue.
I think that one's a good suggestion anyway. Working out the best move is computationally trivial... I could just do that automatically and flash the cards/destinations if you haven't done anything in 10 seconds.

It won't fix the problem of "I hate poker"; this is actually not triggered by bb1111, but rather from watching Gooshi streaming it. She clearly enjoyed *playing* the game. But hated the poker game enough to discover several new bugs trying to escape it. I *personally* hope the poker game will be fun enough that people play it because they want to, not because I force them to do so. But I'm frequently wrong, and lean towards the permissive side of the scale when it comes to users (this is why I include the cheat menu). I just want people to have fun and enjoy the game.... if they don't want to see particular parts of the game (but enjoy most of it), I'll try to compensate as much as a lone dev can do.
 

somebodynobody

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I think that one's a good suggestion anyway. Working out the best move is computationally trivial... I could just do that automatically and flash the cards/destinations if you haven't done anything in 10 seconds.

It won't fix the problem of "I hate poker"; this is actually not triggered by bb1111, but rather from watching Gooshi streaming it. She clearly enjoyed *playing* the game. But hated the poker game enough to discover several new bugs trying to escape it. I *personally* hope the poker game will be fun enough that people play it because they want to, not because I force them to do so. But I'm frequently wrong, and lean towards the permissive side of the scale when it comes to users (this is why I include the cheat menu). I just want people to have fun and enjoy the game.... if they don't want to see particular parts of the game (but enjoy most of it), I'll try to compensate as much as a lone dev can do.
I am unsure if the poker game will ever become good. Not that it isn't a nice mini-game every now and then. However as of now it still falls in the mini-game concept, and it is weighted down by the "poker" branding, so people who hate poker might dislike it just because it is named poker even if it is a very different poker variant.

Like how you mentioned slay the spire earlier for the map of elsewhere. StS is an amazing game and is that because it is a well balanced and extremely variable deck building game so the player can choose their way to play, and the deck grows/shrinks/changes throughout the run. This helps keep the player interested.

The allies are nice for the poker variant, and the gems to make the combat look a bit different, but as far as I can tell it will always play out in a similar way each enemy.

This will be hard to keep it enjoyable over the long run.

Especially since the player/story/intro image, all push the poker as a large story concept, it really needs to be kind of an great game to tie everything together well.

Oh since you mentioned StS, you might like "Nowhere prophet", "Trials of fire", "Neoverse", "Deck of ashes", "SteamWorld quest: Hand of gilgamech"
 

RoadWulf

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I love the story of this game. I guess I would like it better on the Ren'Py engine, but every engine has it's faults.

That said:
I got stuck after the 2nd study date with Emily. The naked one. Went to the coffee shop the next day to read my CHR/INT book and my character model was naked and couldn't be clicked on.
 
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Droid Productions

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I love the story of this game. I guess I would like it better on the Ren'Py engine, but every engine has it's faults.

That said:
I got stuck after the 2nd study date with Emily. The naked one. Went to the coffee shop the next day to read my CHR/INT book and my character model was naked and couldn't be clicked on.
Was this with the latest 0.1.24 build? I thought I fixed a bug directly relate to that. If it is, let me know and I'll keep hunting for it.
 

Droid Productions

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The Android version cannot be installed, I have this problem
A bit of google translate, and the error message seems our old friend "Parse Error: There was a problem parsing the package"

here are some suggested ways of getting around it:


Are you able to download other android games from F95 okay?
 

Droid Productions

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The porn games on the computer, please make it a showy patreon link instead of auto-opening a browser. No one likes having their browser opened, and especially a non-private tab when linking to porn things.
That's a good point. I can't open up an incognito window, sadly. I can however signpost it better.

Updated the text to make it clear that it's accessing an external link.
View attachment 2019-12-20 08-58-20.mp4
 
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