Comics Collection Melissa N. Collection [2024-06-18] [Melissa N.]

[Stevedore100]

Theory #1
James just showed off his international detective skills, so I'm doubling down on my undercover agent theory from my previous post.

Theory #2 - Everyone is going to hate this one.

Spoiler: Seriously, you shouldn't even read it.

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I got the feeling that Marina had told him where she was staying ("I told you not to come here") but maybe she just meant Athens, not the specific place. Nikos' hotel is supposedly the place to go, so depending on how much detail she gave him, it might not be that hard to find.
James is a mystery.

 

[Jackjons]

Dose anyone know ,is there any thread where I can found hanna23's comics

 

[misseva88]

I think it's perfectly reasonable for her to be angry here, James behavior is a bit creepy here. That doesn't rule out some one night stand between them in Crete. It's fairly obvious Marina thought her time with James, whatever it involved, is over, and popping up uninvited is not a good thing to do.

James' behaviour is creepy indeed, especially if all he and Marina did was talk after he helped her out with the perceived stalker in Crete. But why did she drop everything on the side of her husband when they're waiting to see a doctor to confront a creepy James? Sure she'll probably say that whatever happened in Crete meant nothing she loves Andrew very much, bla bla bla. But would simply not showing up give the same signal to James?

 

[LadyBoyJay]

Dose anyone know ,is there any thread where I can found hanna23's comics

No one has created one on F95 yet. A true dedicated fan should have that honor! If someone here would like to create one, I would be happy to help fill out the template and help you get it posted. Personally, I'm just not a big enough fan of Hanna23 to want to be responsible for her thread. I view it as a serious responsibility. She is a good artist, just not one of my favorites yet. I'm rooting for her to win me over with some future comic!

I'm also willing to help with other comic artists. Just be aware that if you create a thread, the proper etiquette is for you to keep it updated and maintained. You technically don't have to, but it is very appreciated if you do.

 

[rebirth095]

James' behaviour is creepy indeed, especially if all he and Marina did was talk after he helped her out with the perceived stalker in Crete. But why did she drop everything on the side of her husband when they're waiting to see a doctor to confront a creepy James? Sure she'll probably say that whatever happened in Crete meant nothing she loves Andrew very much, bla bla bla. But would simply not showing up give the same signal to James?

If a person you rejected followed you to another city, it's perfectly reasonable to not trust them to "get the message". Also, in general people like to feel like they have some amount of control over a situation, and confronting him in person might make sense in Marina's mind. But more importantly, she might be thinking that if he's going around calling himself her husband, she can do damage control if she's there, rather than letting him continue to make up whatever he wants.

Actually, that makes me wonder: Andrew and Marina were staying together at the hotel. When Marina left for Crete, she could have checked out, but since it's presumably a shared room, she wouldn't have needed to. So I'm assuming on Page251, when someone says "We called the hotel after her message. She left a few hours ago." the hotel staff is just confirming they saw her leave, not that she checked out. So... if James shows up saying at this hotel while claiming to be her husband, this has some possible different implications...

1) James is even more reckless than we thought. He knows Marina is married. And yet he's taking the risk of introducing himself as her husband and gambling that this isn't a horrible cover story. Because if Marina is traveling with her husband, then this will raise all sorts of questions at the reception desk (like, why don't you use your key?). Or having his cover blown immediately when the receptionist looks up the wife's check in info or asks for an ID and it doesn't match the check in info for Andrew and Marina. Or just accidentally bumping into Marina while she's with her husband.

2) The way that it's less reckless is if James does know that Andrew is "out of the picture". This could suggest that he's running some kind of investigation and followed Marina to Crete and now back, and is aware of the circumstances. Alternatively, Marina might have told him the truth as to what's happening with Andrew (imo, unlikely. It's not only a bizarre story, but also private and I'd think embarrassing to tell a stranger that her husband is masquerading as her aunt). The easiest explanation would be she's lying to James and that she told him she's traveling alone and doesn't mention the honeymoon. She only said she's married, not that she's here with her husband. So James assuming she's alone in Athens would make perfect sense in that case, and makes using the Husband cover make much more sense.

 

[LadyBoyJay]

All of the events in Aphrodite's Mirror have occurred with perfect timing. James, for example, was in the right place at the right time (bar + hotel), for him to get integrated into the story. Coincidence? Maybe or maybe not. Is Melissa using a simple yet classic MTF story plot of having a character transform through mere bad luck and a series of unfortunate coincidences? Maybe. Very possible! Could all of these events have perfect timing because they have all been planned by various people? Maybe. We do have lots of mysterious characters with unknown motives. It would take some brilliant writing to tie all of the various plot threads together in a believable way. Could everything be part of a divine plan? Maybe. It would be a very easy way to remove any plot holes.

 

[misseva88]

If a person you rejected followed you to another city, it's perfectly reasonable to not trust them to "get the message". Also, in general people like to feel like they have some amount of control over a situation, and confronting him in person might make sense in Marina's mind. But more importantly, she might be thinking that if he's going around calling himself her husband, she can do damage control if she's there, rather than letting him continue to make up whatever he wants.

What's the harm if James didn't get the message? Only just before the phone call happens, Marina talks about how 'they' ("we", I assume Marina and her two cousins) found out Nikos' house was bugged and the driver disappeared in thin air (page 471).

I don't see how a guy who can't handle 'no' for an answer is anywhere on her priority list at that moment if everything that happens is to be taken at face value. Marina wasn't intimidated, nor does she feel the need to put the bald stalker in his place. Why does she feel the need to do anything but ignore James?

Also, how does James know which exact hotel in Athens Marina is staying in? What are the odds he doesn't know and just randomly finds her hotel?

I think it's more likely more happened in Crete between James and Marina. She clearly doesn't want to talk about exactly transpired in Crete on page 442. If it was just some random fella pretending to be her man, why would she duck that question like she does?

Speaking of odds, how unlikely is it that Nikos and Joel (I assume we all interpret the legs we see on page 1135 to be theirs?) just happen to stumble into Marina and James?

I think James is a plant. I think he and Nikos work together to drive a wedge between Marina and Andrew. Nikos is the biggest winner if they're separated. His niece gets to date an other guy, who's more of a catch, and Elena is more likely to stay when Marina isn't there to desire Andrew.

 

[rebirth095]

All of the events in Aphrodite's Mirror have occurred with perfect timing. James, for example, was in the right place at the right time (bar + hotel), for him to get integrated into the story. Coincidence? Maybe or maybe not.

I don't think it's contrived that James is introduced in the story. It's a little bit coincidental that he latches onto a cover story of being the husband, but I don't think the timing is "too convenient". I mean, all stories have "perfect timing". Hell, even real life is "perfect timing" in hindsight. The story could only play out "that way" if "those events" happened in those moments in that order.

The evaluation on the quality of the story and the writing is whether or not it holds up under scrutiny. It really doesn't matter whether the explanation is scifi, realistic, or magic: once we know the full story, the question becomes did the scenes play out in a way consistent with the knowledge of what we know is the truth.

Is Melissa using a simple yet classic MTF story plot of having a character transform through mere bad luck and a series of unfortunate coincidences?

Generally, the problem with those types of story is that they don't hold up under scrutiny. Having events require further feminization might seem contrived but can hold up when analyzed if they're still consistent with the character's goals (or if our protagonist either grows to like their feminization, or gets brainwashed/mind controlled/conditioned). The problem is when it isn't consistent and makes the protagonist seem to have no agency and makes them come off as rather dumb.

I don't really think it's a matter of being a "classic" plot, as much as some stories simply don't hold up under scrutiny as the author prioritized eroticism over plot. But like in any porn, you're banking on the attractiveness of the actors and the hotness of the sex/scenario to distract from someone going "No, wait... This is dumb." And hey, often times that works.

 

[Thalantyr]

Also, how does James know which exact hotel in Athens Marina is staying in? What are the odds he doesn't know and just randomly finds her hotel?

I think it's more likely more happened in Crete between James and Marina. She clearly doesn't want to talk about exactly transpired in Crete on page 442. If it was just some random fella pretending to be her man, why would she duck that question like she does?

Exactly!

Speaking of odds, how unlikely is it that Nikos and Joel (I assume we all interpret the legs we see on page 1135 to be theirs?) just happen to stumble into Marina and James?

Eh, this doesn't seem out of the ordinary. All of them are staying in or working at Nikos' hotel, so the odds of various hotel guests bumping into each other in the lobby are pretty high.

I think James is a plant. I think he and Nikos work together to drive a wedge between Marina and Andrew. Nikos is the biggest winner if they're separated. His niece gets to date an other guy, who's more of a catch, and Elena is more likely to stay when Marina isn't there to desire Andrew.

This would follow if we prescribe to the "Nikos is evil" theory. I've been going back and forth on that, but currently I don't think he's evil.

 

[rebirth095]

What's the harm if James didn't get the message? Only just before the phone call happens, Marina talks about how 'they' ("we", I assume Marina and her two cousins) found out Nikos' house was bugged and the driver disappeared in thin air (page 471).

I don't see how a guy who can't handle 'no' for an answer is anywhere on her priority list at that moment if everything that happens is to be taken at face value. Marina wasn't intimidated, nor does she feel the need to put the bald stalker in his place. Why does she feel the need to do anything but ignore James?

Because James is the one going around openly calling himself her Husband. If you take everything at face value, there's a number of reasons why this would be upsetting for Marina.

1) If her family is in danger/under surveillance, she might not want to endanger the life of someone that's uninvolved.
2) She doesn't want Andrew to hear and think that she's been unfaithful.
3) She doesn't want the rest of her family to hear and again, invite questions of infidelity. One of the things we're told by Niko's daughters is that (supposedly) Marina values loyalty above all else. That was the justification for apparently them all insisting that Andrew honor the promise he doesn't remember making.

Also, how does James know which exact hotel in Athens Marina is staying in? What are the odds he doesn't know and just randomly finds her hotel?

See, I took that to be why she was so upset/surprised that James was in Athens; that she didn't tell him where she was staying, and he showed up and found her anyway (which would be offputting as hell). Honestly though, even if she did mention which hotel she's staying at, the fact that she's surprised he's here tells me that she didn't invite him to continue a fling. Seems more likely that the hotel information came up in casual conversation. ("I'm a journalist visiting family in Athens. What does my family do? Oh, my Uncle owns the BlaBla hotel...")

I think it's more likely more happened in Crete between James and Marina. She clearly doesn't want to talk about exactly transpired in Crete on page 442. If it was just some random fella pretending to be her man, why would she duck that question like she does?

I mean, she also doesn't mention being threatened with a gun (page 1117). You could argue she didn't mention James for the same reason she didn't mention the gun. Or, the same reason why a husband will say he's meeting an old college friend "Sam", and doesn't bother explaining that Sam is short for Samantha. Even if nothing happened or will happen, if you consider the situation "closed", you might not want to have to explain and defend yourself over a "non-issue". Especially if we're all saying that their relationship is in a rough patch.

This would follow if we prescribe to the "Nikos is evil" theory. I've been going back and forth on that, but currently I don't think he's evil.

I don't really know/care if it goes either direction other than whether it makes sense once we see the full picture. Right now, Nikos being a passive participant doesn't ring true to me. We've got very little characterization for him personality wise, but from a behavior stand point the one thing we have seen is that he seems awfully eager to be making out and fucking his niece's husband once femmed. That seems a bit beyond "lonely rich guy is eager to reconnect with someone and when the opportunity comes will leap on it" and more towards "seems like this guy wants something and seems willing to take things down his preferred direction." Going back to Page 68, him getting on one knee and proposing always felt weird to me. It wasn't done playfully, it was something Nikos intent on doing. Same with him making out with his niece's former husband in front of her. There's keeping up appearances, but then there's making a show of it. And often, his actions seem to lean on the later, in my interpretation.

 

[Stevedore100]

An interesting thing to find out is if James knows Elena is Andrew. Does Marina let him in on the whole thing? I think not - she needs to give him some reason for him to act as her husband, but I think she would come up with some cover story. For no other reason that it is a bizarre thing - " my new husband is pretending to be my uncle's wife" is not something one beats every day.

 

[Thalantyr]

I don't really know/care if it goes either direction other than whether it makes sense once we see the full picture. Right now, Nikos being a passive participant doesn't ring true to me. We've got very little characterization for him personality wise, but from a behavior stand point the one thing we have seen is that he seems awfully eager to be making out and fucking his niece's husband once femmed. That seems a bit beyond "lonely rich guy is eager to reconnect with someone and when the opportunity comes will leap on it" and more towards "seems like this guy wants something and seems willing to take things down his preferred direction." Going back to Page 68, him getting on one knee and proposing always felt weird to me. It wasn't done playfully, it was something Nikos intent on doing. Same with him making out with his niece's former husband in front of her. There's keeping up appearances, but then there's making a show of it. And often, his actions seem to lean on the later, in my interpretation.

I think this sequence is probably important in determining Nikos' motives:


The "But you were so... ah, nevermind!" is particularly intriguing to me. When I first read these pages, I was still in the "Nikos is evil" camp, and I thought he was pulling back because he was worried about breaking Elena's mental conditioning. This would mean he knows how the conditioning works, and he knows that she needs more time before she's fully under his spell. But now we know that it's likely that there is no mental conditioning and that this is a result of dissociative identity brought on by method acting, so there's no way Nikos could possibly know how that works, or is even aware of it at all. So now I interpret Nikos' words as him realizing that he may have misinterpreted Elena's advances, which makes me think that Elena has been coming on to him/leading him on during gaps in the timeline that we haven't seen. This probably includes the night of the dinner with Toska when Andrew wakes up in Nikos' bed wearing a nightgown, and could even go back to Andrew and Marina's first dinner with Nikos and the girls, after which Andrew wakes up with a hangover. Perhaps Andrew and Nikos ended up alone together at some point that night after the drinks and something happened between them. This would explain why Nikos is so enamored with Elena, even in private.

Of course, there's still a strong possibility that Nikos is evil. I'm just leaning away from that theory at the moment.

 

[Marschall1]

Aphrodite's Mirror (Chapter 21 Part 7):

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[rebirth095]

I think this sequence is probably important in determining Nikos' motives:
View attachment 3262866 View attachment 3262868 View attachment 3262870

The "But you were so... ah, nevermind!" is particularly intriguing to me. When I first read these pages, I was still in the "Nikos is evil" camp, and I thought he was pulling back because he was worried about breaking Elena's mental conditioning. This would mean he knows how the conditioning works, and he knows that she needs more time before she's fully under his spell. But now we know that it's likely that there is no mental conditioning and that this is a result of dissociative identity brought on by method acting, so there's no way Nikos could possibly know how that works, or is even aware of it at all. So now I interpret Nikos' words as him realizing that he may have misinterpreted Elena's advances, which makes me think that Elena has been coming on to him/leading him on during gaps in the timeline that we haven't seen. This probably includes the night of the dinner with Toska when Andrew wakes up in Nikos' bed wearing a nightgown, and could even go back to Andrew and Marina's first dinner with Nikos and the girls, after which Andrew wakes up with a hangover. Perhaps Andrew and Nikos ended up alone together at some point that night after the drinks and something happened between them. This would explain why Nikos is so enamored with Elena, even in private.

Of course, there's still a strong possibility that Nikos is evil. I'm just leaning away from that theory at the moment.

Yes, I'll agree that "Elena" being another identity couldn't possibly be something Nikos could have anticipated/counted on. Unless we're back to thinking that something like this happened in Andrew's past. And that somehow Nikos found out about and then decided to use to create an Elena persona, but that amount of 9D chess would give me an aneurysm.

I will say, I don't think this scene rules out Nikos being involved or even masterminding the feminization. Even if he didn't know about the disassociation, from his POV, he might think he's been successfully conditioning "Elena". Looking at it purely from his POV, if he has been drugging Andrew, as far as he knew, the "brainwashing" worked. From the general story point of view, maybe it's almost as if the "Elena" personality "protected" the Andrew personality, by having the people trying to femininze Andrew "stop early" on the mental part since they thought they were already done.

Maybe there's a scene that is "Elena" somehow convincing Nikos that this is what she always wanted... But I think I summed up my reservations before:

If someone came up to you and basically said: "hey, let me be your wife". No matter how hot they were, that would be an insane amount of red flags.

Now, this same person is your niece's husband. That's another red flag.

This same person is wanting to change their age and race. That's another dozen huge red flags.

These aren't the kinds of actions that an innocent person would find reasonable. For Nikos to accept these turns of events, I think he has to have some warped/selfish motivations. Like, I don't care how magical you believe your dick to be (or to put it less explicitly, how charming/of a catch Nikos believes himself to be): there's no world where a reasonable human being would look at those series of events and think "oh yeah, I'm such a stud, of course straight young men would undergo surgery to change their sex, age, and race just to be with me. And I have no issues saying yes to the kind of unstable person that would choose to do this WHILE STILL MARRIED" That's the attitude of a crazed narcissistic.

"Elena" would have had to be hella convincing in her story in wanting to transition, while simultaneously needing the blessing of Marina for Nikos to be "not the bad guy" in this situation. And even then, it sounds like bonkers thing to have happen. Keeping in mind, Nikos has know Andrew for... what... a month and a half?

 

[Thalantyr]

Yes, I'll agree that "Elena" being another identity couldn't possibly be something Nikos could have anticipated/counted on. Unless we're back to thinking that something like this happened in Andrew's past. And that somehow Nikos found out about and then decided to use to create an Elena persona, but that amount of 9D chess would give me an aneurysm.

I will say, I don't think this scene rules out Nikos being involved or even masterminding the feminization. Even if he didn't know about the disassociation, from his POV, he might think he's been successfully conditioning "Elena". Looking at it purely from his POV, if he has been drugging Andrew, as far as he knew, the "brainwashing" worked. From the general story point of view, maybe it's almost as if the "Elena" personality "protected" the Andrew personality, by having the people trying to femininze Andrew "stop early" on the mental part since they thought they were already done.

Maybe there's a scene that is "Elena" somehow convincing Nikos that this is what she always wanted... But I think I summed up my reservations before:



"Elena" would have had to be hella convincing in her story in wanting to transition, while simultaneously needing the blessing of Marina for Nikos to be "not the bad guy" in this situation. And even then, it sounds like bonkers thing to have happen. Keeping in mind, Nikos has know Andrew for... what... a month and a half?

You have valid points, but let's envision a scenario where Nikos already has a M2F fetish and/or he was in love with Giuseppe. The Giuseppe story seems rather out of place unless it's important, so let's assume it is. So something kept Giuseppe and Nikos apart- maybe he died, or he wasn't into men, or circumstances just caused them to drift away from each other. And Nikos has been single all these years because he's never been able to find anyone like Giuseppe... until now. Maybe Andrew resembles Giuseppe, or maybe "Elena" does, and he's coming on to Nikos every time he's drunk, they're pretending to be married, maybe Nikos already knows about the problems in Marina's marriage, Andrew is telling Nikos he wants to be exactly the person Nikos has been looking for all his life, and Nikos just... lets it happen. Yes, he'd feel guilty about betraying Marina, but desire wins out. I think that would be somewhat believable.

 

[Stevedore100]

I think this sequence is probably important in determining Nikos' motives:
View attachment 3262866 View attachment 3262868 View attachment 3262870

The "But you were so... ah, nevermind!" is particularly intriguing to me. When I first read these pages, I was still in the "Nikos is evil" camp, and I thought he was pulling back because he was worried about breaking Elena's mental conditioning. This would mean he knows how the conditioning works, and he knows that she needs more time before she's fully under his spell. But now we know that it's likely that there is no mental conditioning and that this is a result of dissociative identity brought on by method acting, so there's no way Nikos could possibly know how that works, or is even aware of it at all. So now I interpret Nikos' words as him realizing that he may have misinterpreted Elena's advances, which makes me think that Elena has been coming on to him/leading him on during gaps in the timeline that we haven't seen. This probably includes the night of the dinner with Toska when Andrew wakes up in Nikos' bed wearing a nightgown, and could even go back to Andrew and Marina's first dinner with Nikos and the girls, after which Andrew wakes up with a hangover. Perhaps Andrew and Nikos ended up alone together at some point that night after the drinks and something happened between them. This would explain why Nikos is so enamored with Elena, even in private.

Of course, there's still a strong possibility that Nikos is evil. I'm just leaning away from that theory at the moment.

Your idea about what happened that first night when Andrew wakes up in Ninos' bed is intriguing. My one thought again at it is, at that point, Nikos is still going along with the "this is all just pretend" version of things that morning.
He then disappears from the plot as all the other things happen, and it's only when returns that it's suddenly, "who is Andrew?" That's a weird plot point, the collective amnesia/evil plotting that has to be explained.
We're still getting fill in the blank time, so maybe we will see what occured after they returned from the dinner with Tośka.

 

[LadyBoyJay]

You have valid points, but let's envision a scenario where Nikos already has a M2F fetish and/or he was in love with Giuseppe. The Giuseppe story seems rather out of place unless it's important, so let's assume it is. So something kept Giuseppe and Nikos apart- maybe he died, or he wasn't into men, or circumstances just caused them to drift away from each other. And Nikos has been single all these years because he's never been able to find anyone like Giuseppe... until now. Maybe Andrew resembles Giuseppe, or maybe "Elena" does, and he's coming on to Nikos every time he's drunk, they're pretending to be married, maybe Nikos already knows about the problems in Marina's marriage, Andrew is telling Nikos he wants to be exactly the person Nikos has been looking for all his life, and Nikos just... lets it happen. Yes he'd feel guilty about betraying Marina, but desire wins out. I think that would be somewhat believable.

I'll play devil's advocate and theorize on this. I think something like this would need Marina's mom (the sister of Nikos) to be the evil mastermind. She could have despised the marriage (perhaps for Andrew's misdeed) and played matchmaker for her brother's desires, that she would plausibly be aware of. I don't like that story idea, but it could kind of work out plot wise.

 

[Thalantyr]

I'll play devil's advocate and theorize on this. I think something like this would need Marina's mom (the sister of Nikos) to be the mastermind. She could have despised the marriage (perhaps for Andrew's misdeed) and played matchmaker for her brother's desires that she would plausibly be aware of. I don't like that story idea, but it could kind of work out plot wise.

Oooooooooooooooh shit Marina's mom is Aphrodite confirmed.

But seriously, following this same thread, I think it would make more sense if Eva and Sofia are the ones playing matchmaker for exactly the same reasons you stated.

 

[LadyBoyJay]

Oooooooooooooooh shit Marina's mom is Aphrodite confirmed.

But seriously, following this same thread, I think it would make more sense if Eva and Sofia are the ones playing matchmaker for exactly the same reasons you stated.

They hadn't met Andrew before either. Marina's mom would have presumably known him very well and would probably have been the one describing him to Nikos, Eva, and Sofia. Plus, how would Marina even explain this whole situation to her mom?

 

[LadyBoyJay]

They hadn't met Andrew before either. Marina's mom would have presumably known him very well and would probably have been the one describing him to Nikos, Eva, and Sofia. Plus, how would Marina even explain this whole situation to her mom?

Hey mom, I'm back from my honeymoon. I uh, switched to a different husband. Also, um... you now have a sister-in-law, you technically have had one for decades now.