In my last reply I did not see you already included man whore.
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We could add to that the aspect which term is used by whom - there are those who are used more when men speak about or to other men and there are those who are used by women speaking about men. There is (or used to be) a different kind of condemnation or reprobation or judgement involved dependent on who speaks. Player for example is used rather admiringly by men, whereas women see it more negatively. Fuck boy I have seldom heard used by men.
My experience with the terms "dog" and "man whore" are usually used by women in regard to men, but most men I know don't like being called those names. If you have a different experience, I would really like to know. I mean that sincerely, not sarcastically.
On this general topic for me, I would not care about Vivian's body count if she wasn't married, or if she and Hutch were swingers who were open and honest with each other. I would feel the same way if the roles were reversed, and Hutch was breaking Vivian's heart by lying to her and betraying her. I think the way that Hutch was crushed that first night is what drew a lot of people, myself included, into the story.
Another thing I can say is that if you switched the gender roles, you could have just as an interesting story as you have with this one (With hot sex scenes too). You could write a great story where an evil woman seduces a married man and then manipulates him and makes a fool out of him. You could also have the wife be crushed by her husband's infidelity, and see her begin to fall into despair over it. The cheating husband could be written to be just as selfish and insecure as Vivian, but just making the insecurities more male insecurities than female ones. Just like with Hutch, there are wives who suffer in silence knowing that their husband's are cheating on them, and that know that their husband's are obsessed with another woman.
This is not necessarily directed at you, it is just my thoughts as I am looking at all the discussions.
One of my favorite games on this forum is
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No, no, I agree with you, it was meant as an addition to your statements. Like probably you I think that there are gender specific judgements regarding men sleeping around. There is also intra-male criticism concerning that behavior but out of slightly different reasons - 1. if it results in serious harm of women, other men tend to intervene - serious meaning physical of course but also being irrresponsible with pregnanies etc. 2. but also if it is seen as a sign of having far to little self-control, of chasing too much, of neglecting other areas of life and duties in order to get laid - and, in the end, of being too fixated, too dependent on women. In one word, male criticism would argue not that you become a whore thereby, but a clown, that you are becoming ridiculous. Skirt chaser or philanderer are terms which are (or were) used at least as much by men judging other men as by women. And they aim at men hurting themselves or weakening themselves, not so much at women being hurt by that behaviour.
An interesting case would be Richard Gere's character in American Gigolo and how women and men see him.
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Saerwen
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I donno, it feels almost like we could have some intelligent conversation about the moral state of a woman in a porn game, mere image on a computer screen as she (it) is. Can an it have morality? It surprises me, why is this issue so motivating for players here?
For a little perspective, in BaD there is a college girl who fucks around a little more than average (all BaD characters fuck around including the profs) and even gives our hero group crabs (but not our hero). So guys kinda avoid her a little now. But nowhere do I see the triumph and joy of disparaging her among players. They kid about it some. There is a cute scene where the girls are at a picnic table discussing orgasm faces of the guys. The crabby girl proceeds to give the face of all the guys. Because she has seen them, right? The fun goes out of it for the other girls. Not my boyfriend too. Cute, that is why we are here. We like to see stuff like that.
Come on guys, this is pornland. Everybody fucks everybody married or not and normally players like that. We come here to see that. So howcum, yzzit?
NTR? No excuse. This game is deliberately, explicitly about ntr. Didn't you come here to see that?
I forgot to mention, in BaD there is a college girl run prostitution ring. It is kinda bad form for a player to take our hero to the prostitutes. But I have nothing against such people, so in my game our hero went. Regardless, nobody bothers to call them whores. Not once, not at all. If you are really nice, and maybe pay for it the first time, you can get it for free after that. DPC knows what I like.
Because, you see, in a fluid sexual environment like that, it is really kind of a compliment if you are willing to pay for it. Think about that. Things are not always what they seem. I donno. Maybe I am simply a soft hearted very old fucker.
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Totally agree with everything you said here. I couldn't care less if Viv wants to fuck someone, she's a sexy lady, as long as she wasn't married. I think people can be a little obsessed with labels, but for me, fuck as much as you can. If you are in a committed relationship, fuck them as much as you can! If not in a committed relationship, go for it, as long as you are not breaking some other couple up!
This is right on, man. This is why this game upsets me so much. It's because she's so hypocritical. She's saying with her mouth that she loves her husband, but with her body and her cheating actions she's saying that she doesn't care about hurting him at all. That is not love. She selfishly only cares about keeping the money coming in for her lifestyle. In essence, she cares much more for her lifestyle than her husband. She may be fond of her husband, but she doesn't really love him. People in love do not hurt their loved ones in this way.
In one sense the developer is doing a great job, because the story is so impactful. If it wasn't so well done, then it wouldn't create such emotional response.
Perhaps the story bothers you because you accept it at face value. It might be that, if the apparent situation is so strange, it is not what the dev will show you is really going on in the next chapters. This game is awash in strangeness that must not be what they seem.
The question I would ask is, why does discussion of this game so often turn to be a discussion about real life? The game is what it is. RL is very much more controversial and difficult to talk about objectively.
I would say that, if this game leads you to strong ethical questions about your own life, you should not play it. Really. But as always, as you please.
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as a girlfriend or wife? hell no. For a one night stand or casual sex. Wouldn't mind.
Don't think swingers would mind.
That much, for sure. But I give people the right to be different now than they have in the past. For love of themselves, not for love of my dick. Always remembering that change is very difficult, but always possible. And often personal dysfunctions have roots in childhood, which can be dealt with, if the person wants that bad enough. Even a sex addict.
How many times do you believe an addict who says they will come clean now? Answer from a recovered alcoholic I knew once upon a time, "As many as it takes." Because, that statement of intent did not come from nowhere and recovering is so very difficult. There is no greater testament to personal character than being a recovered addict.
That recovered addict told me that people have various responses to alcohol. Some like it, some, like me, simply want to puke way too soon. She said that she simply loves the feeling she gets when high, but she knows she cannot allow herself that pleasure. It is simply too destructive to what she wants in life.
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Best advice I can give to people like that is to move to a place where nobody knows you and you can start a new life.
Saerwen
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You still don't get it do you? The guy had a gf/wife like Vivian who dumped him and now he's projecting her onto Vivian. He's masohistic enough to play this game because it turns him on. You don't see him bitching about "sluts and whores" in any other game threads. In fact, he's cheering on female characters to cheat and is against loyal routes.
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Thanks for that. My response is that we have all been dumped one time or another for good reason or not. Sure project onto Wife if that makes you jolly. In return I get to say, Wife does not deserve that from you. And "its" cannot be criticized for their lack of morality, or excess of it. "Its" are not moral. "Its" do exactly what the perl file created by the dev tells them to do, and nothing else at all.
I think it would be uncaring of me to witness such projection and say nothing about it. Things can be better for you dude. Not that I can help you find that or anything else. But it doesn't hurt to say that much.
Sorry to bother, but why exactly does this consideration apply to the game we are here to talk about?
Like I said. No and excuses 1 and 2 are complete bs to me.
But don't take me wrong. She doesn't need to be a virgin. At a certain age everyone has a past and it's ok if it is within reason. Not what you describe there.