VN Ren'Py Our Red String [Ch. 12 Full] [Eva Kiss]

[dontcarewhateverno]

Wade is the quitessential protagonist of those movies from the 80s where the loser nerd gets the hot girl in the end. Eva certainly knows what she is doing when creating these characters as the popular writing archetypes.

If you ever read *Ready Player One*, the protagonist of the book starts off as an out of shape gamer who over the course of the game loses the weight and gets a hot girlfriend.

It's pretty similar to Wade.

Yep. I have that same impression of Wade... well, except for the loser nerd part. "Loser nerd" in the same way Holly would've played "ugly girl" in the same movie until the ending when she ditches the glasses. Wade as underdog protag? Absolutely. But he's got more of a Bruce Campbell vibe to me, or Jeremy Piven in PCU, albeit in a different situation where he's in a true life slump. I mean, he had his shit together when he met Cindy, at least. And IMO, I detect him as being a generally cool guy who is just overcast in attitude based on the slump he's in. Likely from something or other that happened off-screen before game start to get him that way. Although he's clearly based on an otherwise attractive model too, despite the current beer-belly and generally out-of-shape body. He has more attitude basically, where Ian seems more base-character Micky Mouse to me, regardless of how you play him to pose as someone else.

 

[Antera]

Can Ian bang Ivy ?

 

[Chemish]

Can Ian bang Ivy ?

Not yet.

 

[JoJoPool]

The issue with Ian when it comes to "rough sex" is his appearance. Even if he can have it with Lena, like the others have mentioned, he lacks the physique for it. I mentioned few months ago that Ian is designed to be "the most average man alive" to encompass the broadest range of the player base.

He is the average height (5' 8), he is white, 20-something, has brown hair, neither skinny nor fat nor muscular; and while you can play the game to make him a "Chad" he still lacks the appearance that people usually associate with Chads. That's why Axel, Mike and Jeremy are more appropriate since they are either muscular or muscular and tall.

It would be nice if Ian could eventually become more muscular if you make him train enough but that would mean every sex scene he is in would need to be drawn twice (one with regular Ian and one with muscular Ian) and I think we all know that means just more work for the Dev.

Then again, GGGB had Ashley change her appearance a lot throughout the game so I wouldn't count this opportunity out. I would definitely like to see it implemented in the game. Would definitely raise my interest in Ian's scenes by a lot.

Ian's not so bad to be honest he's got a solid personality, If i were a girl I'd consider a serious relationship with him.. he just needs to work on his look and style, and maybe it will happen... Ashley's appearance changed (for the worse) in GGGB you said so yourself.

 

[JohnnyKiss]

Ian's not so bad to be honest he's got a solid personality, If i were a girl I'd consider a serious relationship with him.. he just needs to work on his look and style, and maybe it will happen... Ashley's appearance changed (for the worse) in GGGB you said so yourself.

It's not about personality or whatnot, It's just that Ian doesn't fulfil the (physical) image people have about Chads.

Also, Ian's personality depends on the player. He can be whatever you want him to be.

 

[Bishop Robert]

Anyways let's get more scenes besides the typical hot dudes for Lena yeah?

 

[JoJoPool]

It's not about personality or whatnot, It's just that Ian doesn't fulfil the (physical) image people have about Chads.

Also, Ian's personality depends on the player. He can be whatever you want him to be.

You're right, I forgot that Ian's type of character depends on the player... I was focused on "my" Ian.

 

[JoJoPool]

Anyways let's get more scenes besides the typical hot dudes for Lena yeah?

Amen ! I wish Stan gets a piece of Lena in the upcoming update.

 

[JohnnyKiss]

You're right, I forgot that Ian's type of character depends on the player... I was focused on "my" Ian.

A lot of people seem to make that mistake

 

[dobzzz]

The issue with Ian when it comes to "rough sex" is his appearance. Even if he can have it with Lena, like the others have mentioned, he lacks the physique for it. I mentioned few months ago that Ian is designed to be "the most average man alive" to encompass the broadest range of the player base.

He is the average height (5' 8), he is white, 20-something, has brown hair, neither skinny nor fat nor muscular; and while you can play the game to make him a "Chad" he still lacks the appearance that people usually associate with Chads. That's why Axel, Mike and Jeremy are more appropriate since they are either muscular or muscular and tall.

It would be nice if Ian could eventually become more muscular if you make him train enough but that would mean every sex scene he is in would need to be drawn twice (one with regular Ian and one with muscular Ian) and I think we all know that means just more work for the Dev.

Then again, GGGB had Ashley change her appearance a lot throughout the game so I wouldn't count this opportunity out. I would definitely like to see it implemented in the game. Would definitely raise my interest in Ian's scenes by a lot.

I agree with physical appearance butWhat does ones height have to do with them being Chad thou he is 5'9 and is bigger than most people in-game so he can be Chad

 

[aris666]

It would be nice if Ian could eventually become more muscular if you make him train enough but that would mean every sex scene he is in would need to be drawn twice (one with regular Ian and one with muscular Ian) and I think we all know that means just more work for the Dev.

A bit more muscular Ian (depending on stats) - would be amazing and quite reasonable

 

[Doppelgang]

IMO, it's the main thing that handicaps ORS from being more popular than it is. Lena & Ian are too average, too vanilla, and too close to real life. Especially Ian. Players who like to self-insert as the protagonists in smut games love characters that are 'bigger than life.' Swap Ian with Axel or Jeremy and maybe Lena with Cindy as the main characters, and I bet this game takes off to the next level. You can probably argue that even the fucking bouncer at the club, with some bare-bones character development, would be a better pick than Ian as the main character in a porn game in the eyes of the average smut connoisseur.

Personally I’m glad the game isn’t written to necessarily fit the preferences of “the average smut connoisseur”. As long as every game does that (and to be honest, that’s what most games on here already seem to do), we’ll end up with a bunch of similar games, and creators who don’t write what they want or are good at.

I get the fascination with the “larger than life” protagonist. But for me it’s exactly their averageness that makes them interesting to control. Ian is insecure after his recent breakup and feels he’s going nowhere in his career, but he’s also a smart, creative, empathic, ambitious guy, who so far is also getting some rave reviews from the female cast for his skills in bed.

So we can go for a safe option like Holly, who’s already hopelessly in love with him. Or someone like Cindy: She’s far more high maintenance, which demands that we make sure Ian steps up his game and follows his dreams and ambitions. Or we can just go all in and try to have sex with as many women as possible, while potentially establishing a successful career as a writer or MMA fighter in the process.

I suspect having Axel as a protagonist would feel a lot more straightforward. He's meant to be incredibly attractive, he's got a natural, immediate charisma, and he's a hot shot photographer who owns a gigantic apartment, giving him an extremely easy way to get attractive women to come back to his apartment and strip down. As a protagonist he would've gotten some more character depth, but still. When we make a choice for Ian, it feels like we're choosing between two impulses that already exist in him as a character. With Axel I think it would be different—“have sex with as many women as possible” would already be the standard option before we'd start forming him through our choices. Which to be fair also sounds fun, but still something it's not difficult to find other games that do.

 

[bauman]

Personally I’m glad the game isn’t written to necessarily fit the preferences of “the average smut connoisseur”.

Writing-wise, ORS is as stereotypical as it gets because it shares many of the same character archetypes as GGGB and most smut games:

- the fat nerd: check
- the black guy with a big cock: check
- the blue-eyed ubermensch with a cold personality: check
- the bitchy pumpkin spice frappuccino-drinking blonde: check
- the shy girl: check
- Pauly D from Jersey Shore: check
- the boomer degenerate: check
etc.

I suspect having Axel as a protagonist would feel a lot more straightforward. He's meant to be incredibly attractive, he's got a natural, immediate charisma, and he's a hot shot photographer who owns a gigantic apartment, giving him an extremely easy way to get attractive women to come back to his apartment and strip down.

That's not how you set up memorable characters, though. Give Ian Axel's model and explore his struggles, personal problems, and insecurities despite his attractive physical attributes and superficial successes. Explore his frustrations of being unable to talk to girls despite his looks, driving a BMW, and being a perfect gentleman. Make Jeremy cry himself to sleep because he's feeling objectified by these drunk horny white girls who constantly try to get the pipe. After all, they know all black guys are packing and are willing to do anything. Or have Perry be a successful poonhound despite being an overweight, annoying alcoholic.

 

[JohnnyKiss]

Personally I’m glad the game isn’t written to necessarily fit the preferences of “the average smut connoisseur”. As long as every game does that (and to be honest, that’s what most games on here already seem to do), we’ll end up with a bunch of similar games, and creators who don’t write what they want or are good at.

I get the fascination with the “larger than life” protagonist. But for me it’s exactly their averageness that makes them interesting to control. Ian is insecure after his recent breakup and feels he’s going nowhere in his career, but he’s also a smart, creative, empathic, ambitious guy, who so far is also getting some rave reviews from the female cast for his skills in bed.

So we can go for a safe option like Holly, who’s already hopelessly in love with him. Or someone like Cindy: She’s far more high maintenance, which demands that we make sure Ian steps up his game and follows his dreams and ambitions. Or we can just go all in and try to have sex with as many women as possible, while potentially establishing a successful career as a writer or MMA fighter in the process.

I suspect having Axel as a protagonist would feel a lot more straightforward. He's meant to be incredibly attractive, he's got a natural, immediate charisma, and he's a hot shot photographer who owns a gigantic apartment, giving him an extremely easy way to get attractive women to come back to his apartment and strip down. As a protagonist he would've gotten some more character depth, but still. When we make a choice for Ian, it feels like we're choosing between two impulses that already exist in him as a character. With Axel I think it would be different—“have sex with as many women as possible” would already be the standard option before we'd start forming him through our choices. Which to be fair also sounds fun, but still something it's not difficult to find other games that do.

Guys... Lena and Ian are playable characters... They don't have set personalities; they are whatever you want them to be.

The point was about the way Ian looks, not how he acts because he acts depending on how the player controls him.

The issue was that you can play Ian as a Chad who has rough sex but his appearance wouldn't reflect that archetype/stereotype which lessens the impact.

 

[Samuel Hidayat]

A bit more muscular Ian (depending on stats) - would be amazing and quite reasonable

We might get muscular Ian during the MMA tournament.

Would be cool if Ian can choose to get "natty" muscular or "chicken and broccoli" muscular.

 

[JohnnyKiss]

or "chicken and broccoli" muscular.

I've never felt more called out in my life

 

[Samuel Hidayat]

I've never felt more called out in my life

So you're not a natty?

Hope you know what you're doing.

 

[JohnnyKiss]

So you're not a natty?

Hope you know what you're doing.

I am but whenever I tell people that they give me the "chicken and broccoli" line.

 

[Samuel Hidayat]

I am but whenever I tell people that they give me the "chicken and broccoli" line.

Don't forget horsemeat diet.

 

[Doppelgang]

Writing-wise, ORS is as stereotypical as it gets because it shares many of the same character archetypes as GGGB and most smut games:

- the fat nerd: check
- the black guy with a big cock: check
- the blue-eyed ubermensch with a cold personality: check
- the bitchy pumpkin spice frappuccino-drinking blonde: check
- the shy girl: check
- Pauly D from Jersey Shore: check
- the boomer degenerate: check
etc.



That's not how you set up memorable characters, though. Give Ian Axel's model and explore his struggles, personal problems, and insecurities despite his attractive physical attributes and superficial successes. Explore his frustrations of being unable to talk to girls despite his looks, driving a BMW, and being a perfect gentleman. Make Jeremy cry himself to sleep because he's feeling objectified by these drunk horny white girls who constantly try to get the pipe. After all, they know all black guys are packing and are willing to do anything. Or have Perry be a successful poonhound despite being an overweight, annoying alcoholic.

Sure, the whole cast is based on very easily identifiable tropes that we also see in other games and everywhere in popular culture as a whole. But there's a difference between writing completely one-dimensional archetypes and basing the characters on those archetypes and then expand on them. That's the thing I think Eva does better than most other comparable developers (not that the competition is particularly tough). Even the most one-dimensional of them all, Jeremy, offers something more because of how Eva ties the paths together and puts him in the middle of it. They're archetypes, but with some extra flavour, and they become more interesting because they're put in situations that are less straightforward than “click this button to go to sex scene” / “click this button to skip sex scene”.

And either way it's exactly Axel's blue-eyed übermensch-ness that in my view makes him less interesting in the role as a protagonist. Though I agree that an Axel with Ian's insecurities would be an interesting character, because he wouldn't be one-dimensional. If we're just starting with Axel's physics, and create a new character from that, it's true he could've become more suited as a protagonist.

Also, hot dudes can obviously struggle just as much as not-so-hot dudes can; but with the limits that exist in the archetype based universes of smut games, I think it would be hard to write a version of Axel that didn't in some way feel destined for success. I think Ian is above average in most respects, but he is close enough to average that it feels like the direction he’s taking is actually in his/our hands.

Guys... Lena and Ian are playable characters... They don't have set personalities; they are whatever you want them to be.

The point was about the way Ian looks, not how he acts because he acts depending on how the player controls him.

The issue was that you can play Ian as a Chad who has rough sex but his appearance wouldn't reflect that archetype/stereotype which lessens the impact.

I disagree that they're whatever we want them to be. Ashley in GGGB was a blank slate, and could be whatever we wanted. Lena and Ian can only be it step by step and within the limits their starting characters allow.

It's completely fair to ideally want an Ian who's more of an alpha archetype. That's just personal preferences. My point is that in general, irrespective if it's about their character or their looks, it's good that the characters aren't just a representation of one specific trope. And I think that’s especially valid when it comes to something like sexual preferences. Within smut game archetypes it’s one particular type of man who enjoys rough sex. In real life it can be anyone. His appearance doesn’t fit with the dominant sexual man archetype, but it’s certainly believable if we think of Ian as a person, not just an archetype.