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slightchance

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Mar 25, 2018
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Being manipulative for women is just natural, they're evolutionary and biologically wired to do that.
"The way I see it, Rosalind doesn't have any agency since she is, as god is my witness, a woman. She's compelled by nature to do what she does because of her chromosomes. As such, she's only a victim of her circumstance, your honor. We plead not guilty."
"I see. I concur that a specimen, especially one with such a large bosom, attracts all sorts of hoodlums that will make it difficult for her to stay on the righteous path. Case dismissed."
 

GamingSavant

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Jun 11, 2017
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We can debate Edwin's mommy issues all day, but it's a fact that Rosalind targets Edwin because she percieves him to be soft and naive. She knows Ian would've told her to kick rocks, and she only approaches Edwin if he doesn't take advantage of her at the "audition", or if he apologizes after the fact. In fact, the only way to access the Full Deal route is to display weakness at the start and not go full asshole, despite Full Deal being one of the darker routes in the game.

So she's not just begging for help from anyone who will listen, she exclusively targets Edwin if she thinks she can manipulate him with her sob story and sex. I'm not calling her a bad person, but she doesn't try to pull this shit with anyone else, because she knows it wouldn't fly. If she thought she could've gotten Ian to give her a leg up, she would've tried.

It just so happens that Edwin's own mommy issues and past struggles make him susceptible to Rose's tactics, and extremely sympathetic to her plight, which is a mirror to his and Vicky's struggles.
After moving forward a bit in the story, I agree with this take. Rosalinde isn't a bad person, but she's in a shitty situation and she's looking for any sympathy card to help her out that she can get, even if that's someone like Edwin. Edwin's deal with her fits the entire subtitle of the game about the "motherly vibe"; his issues stemming from seeing his mother in porn to make ends meet for him and the resulting guilt and pent up lust gives way to some magnetism towards Rosalinde, but that's only if you the player pursue it. You can also just, very clearly, make Edwin a cold-hearted asshole who becomes vindicative if people try to embarrass or humiliate him.
 
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GamingSavant

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Question, does picking to accept Rosalinde's deal lock you to her content? Or just siding with her for Carnation-related stuff and still have options for other girls (besides the Carnations) down the line?
 

GamingSavant

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You know... I actually find Netorare/Netori kinky a good portion of the time (women becoming degenerate due to lust and affection for another man, and all that), but this is one of the few netori situations with Mina that makes me feel a bit guilty. Like, Killian probably would forget losing Mina after a week considering how open he is about treating her like a trophy, but the harm it would do to find out his best friend who he considers to be like a brother stole her? That would feel like a stab to the heart.
 

The Senior Perv

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May 4, 2022
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You know... I actually find Netorare/Netori kinky a good portion of the time (women becoming degenerate due to lust and affection for another man, and all that), but this is one of the few netori situations with Mina that makes me feel a bit guilty. Like, Killian probably would forget losing Mina after a week considering how open he is about treating her like a trophy, but the harm it would do to find out his best friend who he considers to be like a brother stole her? That would feel like a stab to the heart.
You can always choose to NOT engage in anything sexual with Mina until she breaks up with Ian... if that makes you feel less guilty.
 
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GamingSavant

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You can always choose to NOT engage in anything sexual with Mina until she breaks up with Ian... if that makes you feel less guilty.
it definitely does, but then you're the guy who acted as a rebound for your best friend's ex, which socially hasn't been a norm since the 50's (as in the classical declaration that you're gonna steal your friend's girl if he ain't serious about her)

EDIT: Not to say I'm totally against the situation, mind you. That kind of forbidden fruit scenario is hot in it's own way; the pang of guilt hidden by lust.
 

ffive

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Jun 19, 2022
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EDIT: Not to say I'm totally against the situation, mind you. That kind of forbidden fruit scenario is hot in it's own way; the pang of guilt hidden by lust.
I imagine that's largely the point. Also, there's no obligation for Edwin to think of Ian as his actual best friend -- the game allows some early choices which set it up in a manner Edwin has clearly had enough of Ian's bullshit in the past and is now distancing himself from him. Ian acting like Ian (bringing a girl to bang to what's now Edwin's flat and cheating on Mina at every opportunity) makes it even easier to disregard any sort of the bullshit "bro code" with him.

Finally, Edwin doesn't really "steal" anything from Ian, much less Mina. She is the person who makes the active choices to move on from Ian. Edwin is more of a (potentially willing) accessory to it, than the instigator.
 
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GamingSavant

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I imagine that's largely the point. Also, there's no obligation for Edwin to think of Ian as his actual best friend -- the game allows some early choices which set it up in a manner Edwin has clearly had enough of Ian's bullshit in the past and is now distancing himself from him. Ian acting like Ian (bringing a girl to bang to what's now Edwin's flat and cheating on Mina at every opportunity) makes it even easier to disregard any sort of the bullshit "bro code" with him.

Finally, Edwin doesn't really "steal" anything from Ian, much less Mina. She is the person who makes the active choices to move on from Ian. Edwin is more of a (potentially willing) accessory to it, than the instigator.
That checks out, and I didn't know you could deteriorate their friendship *that* badly; there were a few occasions to call him an asshole or be annoyed with his shit, but they still seemed like they were still tight (something about a line Edwin has where he says Killian's an asshole, but he's his asshole)
 

ffive

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That checks out, and I didn't know you could deteriorate their friendship *that* badly; there were a few occasions to call him an asshole or be annoyed with his shit, but they still seemed like they were still tight (something about a line Edwin has where he says Killian's an asshole, but he's his asshole)
I mean, it's not like you burn the bridges entirely with Ian. But if you drop the friendship score to around zero then they're more of "former best friends" (and Edwin would rather not interact much if he can help it) than actual best friends.
 
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Meiri

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Nov 1, 2019
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it definitely does, but then you're the guy who acted as a rebound for your best friend's ex, which socially hasn't been a norm since the 50's (as in the classical declaration that you're gonna steal your friend's girl if he ain't serious about her)

EDIT: Not to say I'm totally against the situation, mind you. That kind of forbidden fruit scenario is hot in it's own way; the pang of guilt hidden by lust.
Tbf I always feel bad pursuing Mina for that reason, even if her relationship was doomed to fail but Ian is a good friend even if clearly a bad match for any girl right now.
 
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GamingSavant

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Tbf I always feel bad pursuing Mina for that reason, even if her relationship was doomed to fail but Ian is a good friend even if clearly a bad match for any girl right now.
Well, I do think there is some fun irony in the fact that Mina always hated that she played Juliet in 'Romeo and Juliet' because of how boring and spontaneous she was for falling for Romeo, but falls so quickly in love with Edwin and seemingly the only excuse to keep her from pouncing him sooner was Killian.
 

Turret

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Jun 23, 2017
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I mean, it's not like you burn the bridges entirely with Ian. But if you drop the friendship score to around zero then they're more of "former best friends" (and Edwin would rather not interact much if he can help it) than actual best friends.
While an option, I consider this shooting yourself in the knee. Ian has big flaws, but it clear pretty early on he is also a fracking great friend to have. I have a bromance with him in my playthroughs, it already shows and will bear fruits in the game future. "My" Ian went contemplative, is starting to turn around his life and even Hana is warming up to him a bit. Ian/Mina still have 5-6 romance points at this time in the game, a rekindling of their relationship might happen.
 

ffive

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Ian/Mina still have 5-6 romance points at this time in the game, a rekindling of their relationship might happen.
I've made sure they have 0 at this point in my play through. :whistle:

I really don't see why Ian would deserve to be let anywhere near Mina, much less trying to convince her to "give him a chance" or whatever after all the bullshit he pulled and how he's treated her in their relationship. Sentiment for your best friend is one thing, but indulging him to such extent goes well beyond rose glasses.

He's made his bed and he can now sleep in it, alone. Or more realistically, railing his former nanny there and whatever other girl he's hit on that is willing to put up with him.

(btw, Hana warms up to any Ian, it doesn't depend on his change thing)
 

GamingSavant

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honestly after going down the route, breaking up with Mina might be what's best for Ian cuz it lets you have a more earnest talk with him about what he truly wants in life besides philandering with his family's money, without judging his life style, forcing him to think for himself instead of go with a pessimistic flow that has him in his current rut.

On the opposite side of things, Mina was clearly unhappy with their relationship; hanging out with Edwin made her more open than she was with anyone else; her brother confirms it when he says the way she acts around Edwin isn't how she typically acts, and Ian never really listened to her or gave her any meaningful input on things she asked for input on, literally saying she talks too much. Even if Edwin doesn't ultimately want a permanent thing with her, his influence on her proved Mina can do better than Ian (as he is currently).
 
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Alexx88

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Aug 1, 2024
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This may be an unpopular opinion, but I'm not really a fan of Minas hair style. I think it's too, I don't know, "cutetsy" maybe? To me, it's somewhat distracting from her cute face. Her straight hair in some scenes is a little better. I personally think she'd look great wearing a simple pony tail. This is all just my opinion of course. A minor nitpick. I love this game, and I'd never actually suggest the dev's change anything. They're doing a great job with this! (y)(y):D
 
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