VN Ren'Py Pale Carnations [Ch.4 Up.6 Public] [Mutt & Jeff]

[ename144]

Link a single comment of Suna's where he wants his "precious queen appreciated". Or shut the fuck up. " "

By your flexible-context use of words, a consensual night of BDSM between a sadistic dom and sub would be harmful and full of malice. Nobody but disingenuous clowns would use technical definitions like that there. For any "false equivalence" bullshit: the Carnations' participation is consensual.

One of the previous carnations is an actress and came back out with a movie, which is "ostensibly" what she wanted out of her exhibition. Maybe google "destroying", unless you're going the flexible-context route for every word you use.

Spoiler: Destruction.

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Spoiler: In Suna's context.

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Define "treating whores like whores".

Spoiler: Back to back pregnancies with clients with paternity betting?

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Spoiler: Belt + Bottle use leading to a month long recuperation?

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Spoiler: Unpaid, presumably undesired, sex?

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Spoiler: Someone choosing to whore isn't whoring because of disadvertisement?

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Spoiler: Fearing Chuck/Management. August's discipline, threatening to send Warren?

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Everything happens with August/Chuck's knowledge. August's share, and thus influence/responsibility in the club is presumably greater than Kathy's.

Spoiler: Click

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A whore willfully doing a donkey show in Mexico or some extreme fetish content has different metrics than a vanilla street hooker. Within the context of the exhibition's scope, which is "ostensibly" an allure for its members, Kathy's treating whores like whores. You're "willfully deluding yourself" if you think otherwise, or are fucking around with semantics.

Yes, we know all three owners are involved in running the Club. We also know the Club is a criminal enterprise. None of the three have their hands clean.

But Kathleen is the one who moves beyond mere crime and takes a sick interested in getting under the skin of everyone working for them. Combine that with the shit she pulls with her late sister's charity and it's easy to see why she's singled out for hate.

 

[slightchance]

Kathleen is an awesome and (obviously) polarizing character. She fits right in.

 

[The Senior Perv]

Kathleen is an awesome and (obviously) polarizing character. She fits right in.

Yeah, but don't worry. I can fix her...
Or more like she will destroy me.

 

[InsaneINC]

Well in the end I bet things gonna be much more mundane than we all think. But yeah that does not change my opinion on Kathleen. Personally I don't mind moving in the grey areas but she is on another level. All she cares about is hurting people for her entertainment. So yeah I still want sadist bitch dead.

 

[Khan merry]

Kathleen is an awesome and (obviously) polarizing character. She fits right in.

If evil why hot character, these mfs wouldn’t be running defense this hard for her if she didn’t look as attractive as she does.

 

[slightchance]

All she cares about is hurting people for her entertainment. So yeah I still want sadist bitch dead.

I don't think she's that one-dimensional or she wouldn't also enjoy switching roles with Edwin. She can be vindictive, even outside of the club's playground, which is one of her biggest character flaws, but I do believe she wouldn't excel in her job as mistress if she wasn't capable of empathy. She loves to poke holes in other people defenses to make them squeal under her boot but I believe she respects those who stop playing the victim and start embracing what this benevolent demon has to offer them. If you want to find out what your real limit is, she's your gal.

 

[InsaneINC]

I don't think she's that one-dimensional or she wouldn't also enjoy switching roles with Edwin. She can be vindictive, even outside of the club's playground, which is one of her biggest character flaws, but I do believe she wouldn't excel in her job as mistress if she wasn't capable of empathy. She loves to poke holes in other people defenses to make them squeal under her boot but I believe she respects those who stop playing the victim and start embracing what this benevolent demon has to offer them. If you want to find out what your real limit is, she's your gal.

Empathy !?? She have already corrupt you it seems. I am sure I would be fine with her if I liked playing totally depraved characters. But yeah I don't. I always try to play evil characters but always end up playing the good routes. I just cannot be evil. Not my style.

 

[Nulldev]

I don't think she's that one-dimensional or she wouldn't also enjoy switching roles with Edwin. She can be vindictive, even outside of the club's playground, which is one of her biggest character flaws, but I do believe she wouldn't excel in her job as mistress if she wasn't capable of empathy. She loves to poke holes in other people defenses to make them squeal under her boot but I believe she respects those who stop playing the victim and start embracing what this benevolent demon has to offer them. If you want to find out what your real limit is, she's your gal.

Firefly quote of course

[Book quotes warrior-poet and dictator Xiang Yu to Simon.]
Book: He said, "Live with a man forty years. Share his house, his meals… speak on every subject… then tie him up, and hold him over the volcano's edge. And on that day, you will finally meet the man."

 

[Turret]

I don't think she's that one-dimensional or she wouldn't also enjoy switching roles with Edwin. She can be vindictive, even outside of the club's playground, which is one of her biggest character flaws, but I do believe she wouldn't excel in her job as mistress if she wasn't capable of empathy. She loves to poke holes in other people defenses to make them squeal under her boot but I believe she respects those who stop playing the victim and start embracing what this benevolent demon has to offer them. If you want to find out what your real limit is, she's your gal.

Hi!
Sorry to tell you that you are on the woodway with Kath. There is not an unce of respect for those showing backbone, on the contrary, Kath tries even harder to destroy their lives. Look at Veronica and Felicia. With both it does not work like Kath had hoped and she is very much hellbent on destrying their lives now. Kath is not a flat characer, but her depth does not change the fact that she is a taint on humanity.

 

[Ottoeight]

Kathleen is an awesome and (obviously) polarizing character. She fits right in.

The only reason Kathleen is a polarising character is: she has a vagina. Auggie & Uncle Chuck don't have it.

Since this is not a gay-themed VN, no player is going to bang Auggie & Uncle Chuck, therefore no player is clutching at straws in order to defend their behaviour.

Same with Sophia.


How some players - with every AVN - are:

Can MC bang a character? well yeah she's great. Is a female character not "available"? well, this game sucks: Devs must amend and modify the story.

 

[Meabe37]

I can understand that people don't like Kathleen as a "LI" (I don't think she is a "real" Li anyway, at least how it usually is understood in AVNs, aka she will never be MC girlfriend, wife or whatever else and there is no future where they end up "together") or as a person all together. But to me she is one of, if not, the most interesting character of this game(and a really fun one too). I'm really interested and intrigued to see how it's gonna play out for her in the future, depending on our choices and our relationship with her.

Anyway i think her character is pivotal for this game to work and well...she is really hot (and personally, part of some of my favorite "sexy moments" of this game) But yeah, Rosalind and Mina are the one who gonna receive all my "love".

That being said, if we talk about bad and fucked up, Chuck seems just a bad to me. We just don't spend as much time with him as Kath ( and he seem to be hiding it, contrary to her) and like Otto just said, we are not intimate with him so it affect the players less lol

 

[Ozymandias037]

Empathy !?? She have already corrupt you it seems. I am sure I would be fine with her if I liked playing totally depraved characters. But yeah I don't. I always try to play evil characters but always end up playing the good routes. I just cannot be evil. Not my style.

Bizarrely, I think he backed into a good point. Kath does have some empathy -- she just uses it for evil. She has really good insight into how people's minds work and what levers she can push and pull to get what she wants. Empathy can be a weapon, and Kath uses it as one. After all, when you truly understand someone else... that's when you learn the best ways to break them. And if there's one thing Kath is good at, it's breaking people.

 

[labmouseblues]

Empathy is not a precise concept, but it's generally understood to be more than just the ability to correctly identify emotional states.

Kath isn't a complete social cripple, so yeah, she can tell when someone is distressed, ashamed or aroused. A machine can do that too, and no one would call it empathetic.

 

[Scarlet42]

We need to stop messing with Kathleen.
A story is better when its villains are of higher quality.

 

[ffive]

Link a single comment of Suna's where he wants his "precious queen appreciated". Or shut the fuck up. " "

If someone opts to tell others their negative comments about a character are "bitching and crying" they're getting back the same shit they dish out. If you don't like it buttercup, perhaps ask them to act more civil to begin with. Btw, it's funny how hot that got you under the collar. Struck too close to home, perhaps..?

By your flexible-context use of words, a consensual night of BDSM between a sadistic dom and sub would be harmful and full of malice. Nobody but disingenuous clowns would use technical definitions like that there. For any "false equivalence" bullshit: the Carnations' participation is consensual.

Consensual BDSM is largely codified, to the point where it's only a semblance of actual dynamics. But yes, at its core sadism is powered by intent to hurt/harm a person. That's what the sadist gets off on. Why do you think consensual BDSM has the safewords? It's so the sub/m can protect themselves from harm if they feel the sadist is going too far for their own desire to feel hurt to handle.

Speaking of disingenuous clowns, the "consent" of the Carnations is largely a stretch, given why they have agreed to participate in the first place. Sure, they can in theory quit at any point. Except this means they'd giving up on the very thing that made them consent. And the longer they let things continue, the more strongly sunk cost fallacy kicks in for them as well.

One of the previous carnations is an actress and came back out with a movie, which is "ostensibly" what she wanted out of her exhibition. Maybe google "destroying", unless you're going the flexible-context route for every word you use.

And what else do you think she came back out with, other than the movie? Also remind me, how many participants are in each exhibition? What did those others come back out with? Other than having their ordeals recorded for old wankers' pleasure?

Spoiler: Destruction.

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It's pretty funny you'd pick this picture to try to make your point. Do you notice something about the other contestant, the one on the left? She sure looks like she's glowing and really, really happy to be there, doesn't she? Thanks, Kat.

That "destruction" quote you tried so hard to be ironic about may be actually closer to truth than you ever accepted as possibility.

Everything happens with August/Chuck's knowledge. August's share, and thus influence/responsibility in the club is presumably greater than Kathy's.

It all happens with Kat's knowledge as well. For all the lip service about "velvet gloves" she sure doesn't seem to mind the girls handled through other means. In fact, in her own words and with your own quote:

Spoiler: In Suna's context.

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So let's not try to whitewash the "harmless old grandma" too much here, shall we?

A whore willfully doing a donkey show in Mexico or some extreme fetish content has different metrics than a vanilla street hooker. Within the context of the exhibition's scope, which is "ostensibly" an allure for its members, Kathy's treating whores like whores. You're "willfully deluding yourself" if you think otherwise, or are fucking around with semantics.

I'm afraid you were so busy digging up all those screenshots, you have missed the forest for the trees. My point was that Kat's actions extend far from just handing whores at the brothel. She is explicitly luring in and abusing people who weren't seeking to work in this profession, and she is doing it simply because she gets a sexual kick out of harming them. She even tells Edwin this much. So yes, if you choose to shut your eyes on that and pretend that Kat is only "treating whores like whores" that's nothing but willful self-delusion.

 

[ffive]

That being said, if we talk about bad and fucked up, Chuck seems just a bad to me. We just don't spend as much time with him as Kath ( and he seem to be hiding it, contrary to her) and like Otto just said, we are not intimate with him so it affect the players less lol

Pretty much. Kat garners hate easily because we get to see her a lot, and Edwin has all sorts of interactions with her, on top of her being pretty much the face of the exhibition. If Chuck or August had even half of screen time she gets and acted the way she does, they'd be getting the same scorn, just --like the others pointed out-- no stans to defend their old wrinkled assholes.

 

[Idontplay]

We already have sentenced that every character in this game is like a rotten apple and this is one of the reason why this game is so good. The only difference among them is how much they are rotten.

 

[Simpgor]

In addition, it's not a drug that lets you mind-control and I'm pretty certain that many people could resist it (Edwin could direct his desire to anyone he chose, he could even choose Kathleen or not choose her even though she was the closest, Kat was also holding rather well but being tied up prevented her from having many options).

Honest question: Do you read most of the text in game or just look at the renders? Or just read the sex scene dialog? Because you have multiple borderline fundamental misinterpretations

There is literally a whole scene (involving kathleen and sophie) where we see that both of them are visibly confused by the fact that Edwin can (potentially) resist the effects of the injection at all even though he literally has to remove himself from the room to hold back, Kathleen being surprised is less telling because she is not the creator but the Sophie (literal genius doctor) not expecting him to be able to resist shows that in no way in hell is "Viagra", this is only further proven by the fact that sophie admits that the reason chuck scares her is because he seemingly has no change even if under the effects of the drugs.

Please in plain text tell the class that you think "Sophie is afraid of anybody who has non treatable erectile dysfunction"

We dont even need to get into the weeds of is kathleen self deprecating is clearly not her normal thing even during sex (spoiler you are wrong on this count as well), however we dont need to get into messy opinions as in the last couple of messages youve been more confidently incorrect than anyone I can recall

 

[ffive]

kathleen self deprecating is clearly not her normal thing even during sex

The game's script makes it rather clear that instance is Kat weaving a spider web for Edwin to entrap him. What better way for a budding sadist to break through exhibitions and embrace the lifestyle, than get a rare treat like that.

 

[Simpgor]

The game's script makes it rather clear that instance is Kat weaving a spider web for Edwin to entrap him. What better way for a budding sadist to break through exhibitions and embrace the lifestyle, than get a rare treat like that.

In the most recent kath scene she starts talking to herself before Edwin makes it known he is still there doesnt she? Once she knows Edwin didnt leave the gears change to a more "entrappy" mood but before that (to me at least) it came off as geinune "putting herself down" even if it was only a few lines. It just came off as very diffrent to either version of her and Edwins previous scene where even if Edwin takes control she doesnt willingly give up much verbal ground.

Im not trying to make a point about Kathleen just wanted to further add to the idea that the drug is not some OTC boner pill you get on your last day in mexico but something that even just being under the effects for minutes is enough to make kathleen deprecate herself, (imo) before she knew Edwin had stayed which means that she was horny enough to "act slightly out of character"

Edit: If she knew Edwin never left why would him making any noise surprise her? Or was the surprise fake and its just another one of her 6D chess moves?