VN Ren'Py Pale Carnations [Ch.4 Up.6 Public] [Mutt & Jeff]

[UmbralKnight]

exactly
i love veronica and liked that fact that they're chatting regularly sharing things about eachother
on it's own it's a good scene nothing to complain about
but the episode began with edwin wondering about his mother
sure a few minutes of early morning self reflection alone is great
but chatting with a girl when he should be with his mother felt underwhelming

one more example is when Ian and Edwin finally discuss what to do about grace

Not sure if the timing was right and if it would have been better to push the scene to the end of the game instead. It's a complex topic, something the game might not be able to resolve properly.

I must admit it's quite funny though how fast both Ian and Edwin forget what roles they play in the club when they talk about a possible way to get back at Ian's mother.

why would you do that in middle of the club ?
but even if we go with the exact flow of conversation
Ian was potentially willing to turn back on his mother ,chuck for the love he had for vicky and edwin
he was determined to go against his own flesh and blood for vicky and edwin but the moment kathy arrived and ian gets verbally put down for talking back to kathy
he just lies down like a dog and accepts it

what happened to the guy who was full of bravery just a few seconds ago ?
you were willing to throw away your relationship with your biological mother just a moment ago and all it took was one word from kathy and now you just give up
you don't even tell kathy to fuck off or tell her that you will be there in a few minutes
instead both edwin and ian just fold like a pack of cards
It deflates you emotionally seeing them just fall in and pretend as if they both didn't make one of the biggest decisions in their lives just before kathy walked in

 

[TD1900]

exactly
i love veronica and liked that fact that they're chatting regularly sharing things about eachother
on it's own it's a good scene nothing to complain about
but the episode began with wondering about his mother
sure few minutes of early morning self reflection alone is great
but chatting with a girl when he should be with his mother felt underwhelming

I was hoping the catharsis was Edwin putting Vicky to bed without it needing to be said. They all hug, cry, and Edwin reassures his mother that no matter what he loves her. Leaving it unsaid there emphasizes that point, and when they pick up where they left off the next morning, it's like the feeling after a good cry. Post-catharsis. Awkward, but more level-headed.

 

[Idontplay]

I was hoping the catharsis was Edwin putting Vicky to bed without it needing to be said. They all hug, cry, and Edwin reassures his mother that no matter what he loves her. Leaving it unsaid there emphasizes that point, and when they pick up where they left off the next morning, it's like the feeling after a good cry. Post-catharsis. Awkward, but more level-headed.

Sometime you need to write on a door: «This is a door.»

 

[Paarl]

doesnt the cheat work anymore?

 

[UmbralKnight]

I was hoping the catharsis was Edwin putting Vicky to bed without it needing to be said. They all hug, cry, and Edwin reassures his mother that no matter what he loves her. Leaving it unsaid there emphasizes that point, and when they pick up where they left off the next morning, it's like the feeling after a good cry. Post-catharsis. Awkward, but more level-headed.

it's a great scene
Ian finally getting the family bonding experience that he always wanted
him crying out loud and being consoled by vicky was PERFECT no qualms over that
from Ians perspective THAT moment is his peak emotional high
just the night before his friend loved and trusted him enough to share his and his mother's most vulnerable secret and the very next day he gets a call from his "brother" ,his best friend asking for Ians help consoling his mother
and from Ians PoV vicky loved him enough that to finally share her secret to him and they all hug it out and cry their hearts out

very emotionally touching scene from Ians perspective
but edwin is anything but level headed at that point
clearly he hasn't reached that level of emotional stability yet he is still going through some stuff internally
he gets so upset at one point that scene where he ends up hurting himself
i would say edwin is definitely not fully level headed yet and he is still feeling raw emotionally about vicky getting blackmailed by grace

sure i get that he thought he put everything to rest last night and when he gets up he is HOPING for something positive

and Ians weak moment comes later during the club
as i said before
he kind of folds when kathy tells him to get back to work immediately


I am not trying to be argumentative or pull down your vision for the game
I am just explaining how i felt during these scenes and how i view these scenes

 

[TD1900]

I am not trying to be argumentative or pull down your vision for the game
I am just explaining how i felt during these scenes and how i view these scenes

Oh, I know. At first I was trying to understand your criticism, but I also just like talking about our work. I genuinely appreciate your perspective and you taking the time to share it.

 

[HDussen]

Just something of a clarification. It's not like Elias denied Felicia "whenever" she asked him of something. It's one specific instance that happened to be very important to her, something he didn't really get. Felicia isn't exactly wanting for things in her marriage. This is the marriage is of convenience for both of them, not just Elias.

Yes, "whenever" is not a good word to use here. However, I would not put much stock in the things Elias does pay for either, as those (that we know about) are just part of the expenses of having a trophy wife. I mean, once you get yourself one of those, you are not going to keep her locked up at home wearing rags. So all of Felicia's extravagant life style; the fancy clothes, the fancy dinners, being seen around town doing fancy things; that is as much, if not more, for Elias' benefit as for Felicia's.

As soon as she asked for something that fell outside the scope of Trophy Wife Maintenance, he shut her down hard.

 

[Turret]

very emotionally touching scene from Ians perspective
but edwin is anything but level headed at that point
clearly he hasn't reached that level of emotional stability yet he is still going through some stuff internally
he gets so upset at one point that scene where he ends up hurting himself
i would say edwin is definitely not fully level headed yet and he is still feeling raw emotionally about vicky getting blackmailed by grace

sure i get that he thought he put everything to rest last night and when he gets up he is HOPING for something positive

and Ians weak moment comes later during the club
as i said before
he kind of folds when kathy tells him to get back to work immediately

Hi!
I think you underestimate the situation under which Edwin "folds", according to you. Kath made it clear early in the evening that she wants no or abides no kind of distraction of the "main event". Coupled with the fact that we learn a lot more about the VIP club behind the facade and what can happen if you cross them, is surely a fence post telling you to put your family troubles on the backburner until the day is over.
Our hero is no dummy.

 

[DarkLords00]

Hi!
I think you underestimate the situation under which Edwin "folds", according to you. Kath made it clear early in the evening that she wants no or abides no kind of distraction of the "main event". Coupled with the fact that we learn a lot more about the VIP club behind the facade and what can happen if you cross them, is surely a fence post telling you to put your family troubles on the backburner until the day is over.
Our hero is no dummy.

Hero is... a word I would not use to describe our protagonist Regardless of how we influnce him with our possible choices.

what happened to the guy who was full of bravery just a few seconds ago ?
you were willing to throw away your relationship with your biological mother just a moment ago and all it took was one word from kathy and now you just give up
you don't even tell kathy to fuck off or tell her that you will be there in a few minutes
instead both edwin and ian just fold like a pack of cards
It deflates you emotionally seeing them just fall in and pretend as if they both didn't make one of the biggest decisions in their lives just before kathy walked in

I could see Ian's reaction feel a bit surprising/contradictory considering that he had already stood up to Kathleen when she wanted to record the fake porn video with Edwin and Rose if you choose to have him refuse initially and that was a much more daring moment since it was in the middle of an exhibition, so it's strange but you could chalk it up to him still dealing with the aftermath of both, finding the lenghts his biological mother would go to control him, and, ALSO finding out that his surrogate and best friend's mother was a porn actress which he sees and has been conditioned to see in a less than favuoringly manner let's just say.

Anyways It has taken me quite a while to catch up with the thread and to play most of the update (I'm still missing 2 scenes) , and although I do not share exactly the same gripes with the update as UmbralKnight , it still left me with conflicted feelings leaning more towards being the first update of the game to leave me unsatisfied for some reason I'm still trying to put into words. It's a damn shame because it's the biggest update yet and the quality I still believe is as good as ever but for some strange resason it was the first time the game didn't leave me with a feeling of wanting more.

It's partly the reason why I didn't bother to write my experience with the update this time because I think most of the things I like where already expressed and the problems I have with it are mostly if not all subjective so I didn't see the point.

Regardless, I still enjoyed it and all the work put into it can be seen by any player so kudos to the devs!

 

[Turret]

Hero is... a word I would not use to describe our protagonist Regardless of how we influnce him with our possible choices.

Hi!
I would and do, since the times of the must be lilywhite heroes is well in the past. For those playing Edwin like a white or grey hat, he is something of a hero. Naturally those playing him like as a... do not have a hero Edwin. Antihero at best.

 

[UmbralKnight]

Hi!
I think you underestimate the situation under which Edwin "folds", according to you. Kath made it clear early in the evening that she wants no or abides no kind of distraction of the "main event". Coupled with the fact that we learn a lot more about the VIP club behind the facade and what can happen if you cross them, is surely a fence post telling you to put your family troubles on the backburner until the day is over.
Our hero is no dummy.

I was referring to "Ian" folding not Edwin
while your point about them standing up to kathy makes sense but even within this dialogue
if you picked the non "revenge" option Ian actually stands up to kathy or atleast tries to

Revenge Option





Non-Revenge Option




what does this mean idk ?
Idk

but Ian in the past has stood upto Kathy in few occasions
so him suddenly folding after talking about getting revenge on his own mother seems weird

 

[Turret]

View attachment 5349085
I was referring to "Ian" folding not Edwin
while your point about them standing up to kathy makes sense but even within this dialogue
if you picked the non "revenge" option Ian actually stands up to kathy or atleast tries to

Revenge Option

View attachment 5349091
View attachment 5349094
View attachment 5349095

Non-Revenge Option
View attachment 5349098
View attachment 5349107
View attachment 5349109

what does this mean idk ?
Idk

but Ian in the past has stood upto Kathy in few occasions
so him suddenly folding after talking about getting revenge on his own mother seems weird

Hi again!
Be it Edwin or Ian, I think we agree that both of them not raising a fuss with Kath and "folding" quickly, is the wiser decision under the circumstances. The problem with Grace´s blackmail attempt will come into focus again after the Carnation weekend is over. Grace, Chuck and Kath have to fall, that cannot be planned between door and hinges.

 

[ruby_rubicon]

... She could be one of the very few carnations who would love to participate again but is also aware that this quest is rather hopeless....

Allison seems bored with Elias, outright disgusted by the other patrons, and is very reluctant to recall her experiences as a carnation... So no?

 

[Darreau91]

Hi!
I would and do, since the times of the must be lilywhite heroes is well in the past. For those playing Edwin like a white or grey hat, he is something of a hero. Naturally those playing him like as a... do not have a hero Edwin. Antihero at best.

Edwin Wolfgang having standing sex with the mad glitchy flesh light genius that is in the process of creating the male date rape perfume is hardly what one would call a heroic act... Even Wolfgang's dick head was in a moral contemplation hide and seek during that scene because its shame was on the verge of bursting.

 

[Turret]

Edwin Wolfgang having standing sex with the mad glitchy flesh light genius that is in the process of creating the male date rape perfume is hardly what one would call a heroic act... Even Wolfgang's dick head was in a moral contemplation hide and seek during that scene because its shame was on the verge of bursting.

Hi!
We definitely need a headshake emoji among the reactions. You will see that our hero and Sophia will save Morehead Hills and the state from the club Kath and Chuck created!

 

[NoobMaster30678]

how to get these three?
The other is Lucy's

 

[FRVN]

how to get these three? View attachment 5349716
The other is Lucy's

For Lucy, you need to have kissed her at Felicia's Art Exhibition date, and then at the end of the free roam, talk to her and sit with her. This will end the free roam.

For the two Kathleen scenes:

You need to seek advice from Kathleen after the second exhibition, and then later on, the "Progress through the story" scene comes up (as long as you choose to give it your all). For the second scene, at the end of the free roam at the end of the new update, you'll see Kathleen in the lobby with the police commissioner. Choose to catch the tiger by the tail. Just keep in mind that you cannot get the scenes with Hana/Lucy/Felicia during the free roam, as they, along with the scene with Kathleen, are exclusive and will end the free roam. Important to note that you need to have the first scene to unlock the second.

 

[Gary Busey Pet Detective]

For Lucy, you need to have kissed her at Felicia's Art Exhibition date, and then at the end of the free roam, talk to her and sit with her. This will end the free roam.

For the two Kathleen scenes:

Is the second scene a proper lewd scene?

 

[FRVN]

Is the second scene a proper lewd scene?

No, just kissing/fondling.

 

[ename144]

I was hoping the catharsis was Edwin putting Vicky to bed without it needing to be said. They all hug, cry, and Edwin reassures his mother that no matter what he loves her. Leaving it unsaid there emphasizes that point, and when they pick up where they left off the next morning, it's like the feeling after a good cry. Post-catharsis. Awkward, but more level-headed.

I'd say the MC putting his mom to bed was partially cathartic, but only partially given that the issue was clearly unresolved - both for the character (what had driven his mom to her drunken near-confession) and for the player (how did Chuck fit into the narrative).

Personally the partial resolution did enough to defuse the situation that the intervening scenes with Veronica and Sophia in Update 6 built anticipation back up rather than being an unwelcome intrusion (the Mina/Hana tease in Update 5 was more along those lines in my book). But I can see where others might like those scenes less, and I'm glad the game didn't delay talking to Victoria any longer.

I could see Ian's reaction feel a bit surprising/contradictory considering that he had already stood up to Kathleen when she wanted to record the fake porn video with Edwin and Rose if you choose to have him refuse initially and that was a much more daring moment since it was in the middle of an exhibition, so it's strange but you could chalk it up to him still dealing with the aftermath of both, finding the lenghts his biological mother would go to control him, and, ALSO finding out that his surrogate and best friend's mother was a porn actress which he sees and has been conditioned to see in a less than favuoringly manner let's just say.

Anyways It has taken me quite a while to catch up with the thread and to play most of the update (I'm still missing 2 scenes) , and although I do not share exactly the same gripes with the update as UmbralKnight , it still left me with conflicted feelings leaning more towards being the first update of the game to leave me unsatisfied for some reason I'm still trying to put into words. It's a damn shame because it's the biggest update yet and the quality I still believe is as good as ever but for some strange resason it was the first time the game didn't leave me with a feeling of wanting more.

It's partly the reason why I didn't bother to write my experience with the update this time because I think most of the things I like where already expressed and the problems I have with it are mostly if not all subjective so I didn't see the point.

Regardless, I still enjoyed it and all the work put into it can be seen by any player so kudos to the devs!

I think I felt something similar. In my review I attributed it to a sense that we didn't really get to serve in our usual role as angel/devil on the MC's shoulder. We got to decide how he spent his time at various points, but there was very little pontificating about the larger implications of those choices or even the increasingly outrageous environment in which he made them. The result was sometimes interesting and definitely well crafted, but it wasn't much fun for me.

That may just be my tastes clashing with the needs of the story at this point. The more I think about it, though, the more I wonder how much this was compounded by the event being cut in half. There are some clear payoffs that are left hanging (Hana's 'date,' for example), so it's possible things like Dalia taking the bullet for us, buddying up to Elias (surprisingly hard to do, BTW!), or asking WTF is going on with Sophia will likewise be revisited in Update 7 in a way that feels more consequential.

Maybe the idea was to lay out the facts without comment, THEN let the MC draw conclusion and act on them as the night reached a crescendo. If so, I think the idea suffered a bit by postponing the climax; something should have been added to foreshadow the eventual reckonings. But this is pure speculation on my part and I don't want to jump to any conclusions before we've seen how the second half plays out. So we'll just have to wait and see.