This is... Absolutely not the case... Everything you say is false for me: My pages never screamed anything about the content (I want as a proof that by making a little Ctrl+F I didn't find the word incest in any of my 2017 posts). The only thing I screamed was about what WASN'T in my games (as it's all consensual, I've always claimed that rape and stuff were not present)Sorry to say, but the devs have exactly what they deserve. Their front page practically screamed "incest", "rape", "loli", etc. When you are doing adult games you don't need this type of description on your Patreon site, because 99.9 percent of your patrons know about your game from places like f95, porn sites, etc.
And when you're doing this type of game, when you start earning big money on this game, it is in your own interest to stay "underground". It is your own interest to keep the Patreon site "crystal-clear". At least publicly accessible part of your site.
But if the devs wanted people to find their sites using Google, that's exactly what happened. People found their sites. People from PayPal, Visa, Mastercard
Patreon specifically exempts Game of Thrones which has everything they supposedly hate (rape, sexual violence to minors, breast feeding dragons, slavery, incest, etc.) Patreon is the inconsistent hypocrite in this scenario, period. What this boils down to is if the Trust and Safety drone you get is a raging SJW or not. Arbitrary and capricious is the name of the game.I hate this whole thing makes it that either you're with Patreon or you have to be accepting of games depicting sexual violence towards minors and animals.
Their intend behind the exemption is to make a difference between "art" and "pornography". A difference needed since they've so many artists on their site. So technically, and in their own mind, they are neither inconsistent nor hypocrite.Patreon specifically exempts Game of Thrones which has everything they supposedly hate (rape, sexual violence to minors, breast feeding dragons, slavery, incest, etc.) Patreon is the inconsistent hypocrite in this scenario, period. What this boils down to is if the Trust and Safety drone you get is a raging SJW or not. Arbitrary and capricious is the name of the game.
I totally agree with you but what bothering me is that for these last years, we're actually regressing what we made so many years to build. If people ended up seeing Lolita or l'Origine du monde as pieces of art (what they are) is because people evolved. But now, they're back to square one. I mean, that exemple of l'origine du monde couldn't be truer. A year or two ago, a University teacher gave a test to his students on this painting. To avoid making useless printings, he simply uploaded the pic on his facebook account telling his students to check it. It provoked such a ruckus here that Facebook litterally banned his account and some parents asked for him to be fired!! The guy is a FUCKING UNIVERSITY teacher and he can't even teach a famous painting just because it features a goddamn pussy! He had to make public excuses etc... When I saw that I knew we were not heading in the right direction.Their intend behind the exemption is to make a difference between "art" and "pornography". A difference needed since they've so many artists on their site. So technically, and in their own mind, they are neither inconsistent nor hypocrite.
But you are right, in the end it will only depend of who will review the game. What is now seen as art, like "Lolita" which they take as other example, was mostly censored in the past. Same for things like "You must be registered to see the links" from Gustave Courbet, which was seen as pornographic before it become a world wide knew piece of art. And what to say about paintings depicting Pan, which are seen as art, but are also part bestiality...
And, here, they become hypocrites, because "pornography" and "art" share the same ambiguity and have both a blurred definition. A definition which not only evolve with the time, but also change depending of the persons. But their main hypocrisy is that, when asked to remove any blur in their guidelines, by defining what "pornography" is, they answered with : Is pornography whatever is not art.
This mean that they just don't answered at all. Alright, we now know what is pornography, so now can they please define what is "art" ? And if possible not as whatever is not pornography.
I apologize but somehow I felt compelled to change that a bit.***snip*** What this boils down to is if the Trust and Safety drone you get is a raging SJW ornotan ultra-conservative or a sociopath or simply an asshole or... ***snip***
I'm more balanced. But it's because I live in a country (France) more opened to this kind of art and, more globally, on eroticism and pornography. It doesn't mean that we don't have moral problems, but before censoring "Lolita", we also were the ones who published it for the first time. We also we're the first to make erotic and pornographic photographies (and probably also movies somewhere in a cave). Somehow, our view on the "pornography versus art" debate is that it's art until too many people say otherwise. And even in this case, it must be people who matter, not just some angry mothers.I totally agree with you but what bothering me is that for these last years, we're actually regressing what we made so many years to build.
I agree with lots of what you write. Though, like @Caligula writes it might just as well be a christian conservative. After all, this is after all a company based in the same country as Ted Cruz who refuses to eat in the same room as women he's not married to or in family with. Cause he's afraid he can't control himself. America, on both sides of the aisle has some weird sexual hangups that seem weird to us across the pond.Patreon specifically exempts Game of Thrones which has everything they supposedly hate (rape, sexual violence to minors, breast feeding dragons, slavery, incest, etc.) Patreon is the inconsistent hypocrite in this scenario, period. What this boils down to is if the Trust and Safety drone you get is a raging SJW or not. Arbitrary and capricious is the name of the game.
Patreon is not a large company (you can correct me if I'm wrong). So a handful of people in the right positions are enough to change things drastically. In addition I didn't mention any religion and gave a couple of possibilities where it doesn't matter what political stance you have, if you follow a religion or happen to be an atheist.You guys really think there is a secret cabal of fundamentalist Christians pulling the strings at Patreon? Patreon being based in SAN FRANCISCO... LOL! Look I get people being unfamiliar with the U.S. but that's tantamount to saying there is a colony of polar bears selling ice in the Sahara desert. Whew.
It doesn't only happen in America by the way. Seems to be global problem to me but unfortunately it's much worse in the USA.***snip*** The point is that America's sexual repression isn't just a liberal thing. It's a fullscale thing. ***snip***
You don't need to support stuff you don't like, but why not simply tolerate it? When it's safe to say that no living being was harmed while making it (and that's true for drawings, renders, ...), then where's the problem? Be disgusted by it if you want, but that's not good enough reason to join or start witch hunts.My main point though, was that even though I support porn, porn games and fiction that portrays sex between consenting adults, even those related, I don't support anything people are meant to fap to that includes people that are underage or animals. And I feel like some of the discussions on this topic on this forum have been "either you're a SJW and support patreon" or you gotta support that content and be okay with it being posted on a white supremacist web site.
That's the ironic thing. The alt right is traditionalist. They think porn is degenerate. The fact that Hatreon is open to porn means that the founder is not alt right, just a free speech absolutist just like it says on the website. I find this labeling of Hatreon as the alt right Patreon frustrating. Patreon is the alt right Patreon folks, the alt right still has many content creators there.And I actually like the last part. When you hear "white supremacist web site", open mindedness, sense of humour and similar things are not associations that pop up in anyone's head. Who knows, maybe hosting an underage incest bestiality games there might do something good for those guys, and I don't mean their cut of money.
I suppose you're right. I'm very uneasy with sexualization of minors though. But I suppose it's better that the people into that whack it to porn games than actually live out their fantasies.You don't need to support stuff you don't like, but why not simply tolerate it? When it's safe to say that no living being was harmed while making it (and that's true for drawings, renders, ...), then where's the problem? Be disgusted by it if you want, but that's not good enough reason to join or start witch hunts.
And I actually like the last part. When you hear "white supremacist web site", open mindedness, sense of humour and similar things are not associations that pop up in anyone's head. Who knows, maybe hosting an underage incest bestiality games there might do something good for those guys, and I don't mean their cut of money.