- Nov 22, 2020
- 1,549
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Just played that last update, I really enjoyed, but yea, I guess it was a little bit short, but that's ok. It is really an awesome game.
- Thread starter monroe
- Start date
- Aug 27, 2020
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Lots of good stuff.
So in support of the name Artemis as Vision Girl's name, we have the historical mythology of the real world which had Calisto being tied to the major goddess Artemis. That gave the earlier theories a good deal of legitimacy. So some Greek mythology which may be every bit as influential as WoD materials. I am going to cover up what I am vomiting out under spoiler protection, in case anyone new comes in and might get scared off by the verbose nature of my post!
So in support of the name Artemis as Vision Girl's name, we have the historical mythology of the real world which had Calisto being tied to the major goddess Artemis. That gave the earlier theories a good deal of legitimacy. So some Greek mythology which may be every bit as influential as WoD materials. I am going to cover up what I am vomiting out under spoiler protection, in case anyone new comes in and might get scared off by the verbose nature of my post!
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- Aug 1, 2018
- 1,061
- 4,543
Agreed that would be suicide for Calisto. Instead of going to a buffet the buffet comes to you. She is powerfull But i don't think she controlls everything in city.
- May 9, 2019
- 4,889
- 16,247
Nympho?
Hopefully, not for long!
That son of a bitch! Oh well... mommy is mine now!
You gotta love some godly cat fight!
ohh yes... the way of the gods is to fuck your family... so f95 is, in the end, a religious site!
(very bad, almost embarrassing) jokes aside, that was very interesting reading! Thank you for that... can't wait to see how it continues and what ends up being the case! At this point you may have thought about it more than the writer himself.
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- Aug 27, 2020
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One last tidbit-
for those who want a vampire story with sex-I unfortunately found one -Bloodshift. I can not recommend quality, as I was unable to watch/read more than a few minutes in before I was just utterly disinterested. But it does have sex and vampires for those who want that sort of thing.
for those who want a vampire story with sex-I unfortunately found one -Bloodshift. I can not recommend quality, as I was unable to watch/read more than a few minutes in before I was just utterly disinterested. But it does have sex and vampires for those who want that sort of thing.
She doesn't have to control everything in the city. She's likely had over 2,000 years to master numerous vampire disciplines to levels that younger vampires, including most elders, don't even know exist. Look at the powers her childe the MC has been able to develop in just a few weeks. Now imagine 2,000 years. Everything the MC can do, she almost certainly can do much, much better. That said, she likely has a rival, who may well be her match, and just might be hungering for her blood. If there's a threat, that's where it lies. Ancient vampires tend to suffer from eunni, and there is nothing like a blood feud with an old (or possibly new) rival to motivate their jaded existences.
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I really want romance and love between mc n best friend they always had a lil something from before it, looks like there blood attachment is pushing her more but I still want them to be closer without the slavery blood thing than again I still want her to be part of the romance.
- Jan 16, 2020
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If not everything then pretty damn close to. We clearly see her level of influence is no joke, to the point to where she can have the Princeps appoint Archon status to a young, relatively inexperienced, nobody like Sharon. We don't know if any of the Princeps know who she truly is outside of her inner-circle.
On top of all that based on her words about the Greek gods and giving up a church that was founded or ended (I think) many hundreds of years ago she's definitely the oldest Vampire we the players have been introduced to so far. Older than Virgil, Fabian, Marcuis, Carius and any other elder.
- Nov 23, 2017
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I don't think it'll be suicide for her due to just how terrifyingly powerful she most likely is, to where her going would be to get some entertainment value. Also being around for a few thousand years could easily warrant her to want to get back into politics just to enjoy the thrill from watching the insignificant insects who deem themselves important plot and try to backstab one another.
- May 18, 2020
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In the inspirational material, a vampire would still have the same amount of blood in their system as a mortal. Once it enters their system though, it is condensed and becomes much thicker than normal blood and is transformed into vitae. The key difference is it isn't pumped through their system anymore. The thickness has been described in some cases as syrupy but in the case of elders almost non newtonian liquid in consistency.
- Mar 23, 2020
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in the forbidden lore material....there's a 4th gen vampire going by the name of Artemis... she was worshiped as a goddess in sparta... sounds familiar? this Artemis helped with the destruction of Carthago, an event the Brujah still resent... what if there are some brujah around still resenting Calisto (if she's Artemis's childre)
perhaps Calisto introduces herself to the princeps in a manner that leaves an impression on them and they would rather not talk about her.
this would be unavoidable if Calisto was a ventrue... and while Arigon pointed out that MC doesn't have a blood preference, we have to admit that MC is often dissatisfied with what he's drinking. almost as if he had to spend a will point.
From the wiki for the inspirational mateial:
Artemis Orthia was a
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of the
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who ruled over ancient Sparta. She led the Ventrue to victories, playing a role in the Clan's influence over ancient
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. Her impulsive desire to clash with foes pushed her to doom, as she led the charge against
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. Her destruction or torpor occurred within the first minutes of battle.Hmm...if she wasn't destroyed but instead fell into a torpor because of severe injuries from the battle and her childe Calisto spirited her sleeping body away to somewhere safe.....
Now she doesn't have to be the exact same Artemis Orthia. Likesblondes likely has put his own spin on the vampire revered as a goddess in ancient Sparta, which opens up both the Sparta vs Persia and Sparta vs Athens rivalries, in addition to Rome(Ventrue) vs Carthage(Brujah), or maybe he's using Artemis Ephesia for whom one of the 7 Wonders of the Ancient World was built instead. The two great temples of Artemis and their associated cults may even have both been run by her followers. Heck, instead of being a vampire who came along and masqueraded as Artemis, taking over one of her major temples, our dreamgirl just might have been the original Artemis who the ancient Greeks worshipped as a goddess, and whom all of the various temples served. That would make her very ancient indeed.
As an almost certainly 2,000-3,000 year old ancient vampire Calisto is powerful enough to do whatever she wants and bored enough to potentially show up at Sharon's investiture if she's in the mood for some entertainment. I wouldn't put it past her to intentionally stir the pot for her own amusement (or at Artemis's telepathic urging), either behind the scenes or in person.
It's possible. Likesblondes probably has taken elements from the clans published in the inspirational material, and aside from the Nos, has likely remixed them to form his own clans for Rebirth.
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- Aug 27, 2020
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Artemis traits are currently unknown except for Auspex to some obscene degree.
Calisto traits are presumably mirrored by the MC at a minimum, and the MC has exhibited a number explicitly which appear to be bloodline traits and has exhibited some implicitly which are fairly generic for vampires.
Whispers- Not a presence power, though in the night club our MC exerts presence to cause the red head local to look his way. Whispers also is not domination which Sharon has. It is partial mind reading, and partial suggestion as well as a strong charm. Note that when Sharon uses her Domination power, her eyes become green and slit pupil. I refrain from reading into that for a Set like trait, as domination could well have that as a side effect in this Rebirth of WoD
Invisibility- by itself not a special power, though it is exclusive to certain bloodlines, it could be explained away, but since it comes so easily to the MC I will guess it is a bloodline trait. This fits a hunter, which Artemis was depicted as in Greek mythology, and could be part of her legacy.
Claws- these have been ruled out by Markus as the Protean power of claws with little c. Bigger, Badder, could belong to the Bear curse of Hera on Calisto perhaps, or might be Artemis legacy, but is almost certainly a bloodline trait.
MC implicitly has Presence as mentioned above. He is also faster than normal, and while BigStuffedTiger pointed out that pumping up the dex attribute would make you faster, Sharon can presumably do this, and he is faster than her. In fact when she is assaulted, the MC rushes to her, and the terrain is a blur. That my friends is Celerity.
MC implicitly has a higher level of Auspex than Sharon, who definitely has heightened senses. He was able to intuit and or sniff out Astrid in the morgue.
MC was able to stop the hunter from staking him if you develop his prowess, which could imply potence or simply just better fighting skills, but he catches the axe Andrew tosses, and jams the axe in the feral nos' mouth, as well as simply is physically capable of reversing positions on her to put her against the wall.
Marcius- hot blooded, fast, strong, with a presence. I believe he and his thug boys are domesticated but not True Brujah as in the separate bloodline, but are Brujah that are in the society of polite company of the city. He does not have Sharon's gift of Domination but he wants it, as he expresses when saying he wants her eyes... She comes back very cleverly with they are attached lol.
Sharon- Domination and Presence for sure. To survive the beast attack Fortitude. Some suggested that instead of fortitude she survived due to the MC blood, which is true, but to survive the several minutes between the attack and the feeding of his blood, she demonstrated fortitude. She also points out she is more durable to Andrew on a couple of occasions. I think that Sharon is a Ventrue as I stated before.
Calisto has who knows how many disciplines, but given her MC's traits, which she presumably shares, she is not Ventrue. The MC does notice the difference between bottled blood, vampire blood, and human blood, which all vampires would notice. Sharon's use of bottled blood implies that she keeps a supply of her preferred type on hand.
Markus and company-Nos, they do not even bother to really change the name here. Obfuscate, potence and animalism.
Fabian-Thaumaturge equals Tremere in WoD but could also be Giovanni, Assamite, Settite, or Tzimisce Koldunic Sorcerers. Going with Tremere but with a more legitimate bloodline through Apollo>Hecate>Fabian.
Astrid- well we know, I think she is mysterious and beguiling, and hiding her true bloodline. I think she is Tzimisce Fleshcrafter. Others believe Toreador but of the darker flavor.
Crap I can not remember the vampire's name that teaches fighting, but she is a hound, and Ventrue, and Sharon claims kinship with her.
Vampires, Ghouls, and Blood.
Purely mechanical discussion of the lore.
Humans have 10 blood points of blood in them. Draining this, and giving them a single point of vampire blood will, with moderately regular success grant the human vampire status of the bloodline that killed them and fed them the blood.
Sabbat have a nasty habit of Vampiric Darwinism in which they mass embrace a bunch of humans, sometimes even mixing the blood up in a big ol' cup and pouring it down their throats. Then they stuff the newly turned vampire into the dirt. If they have the strength to rise, and the other traits necessary to survive their blood frenzied attack on the target city, they Might become Sabbat, or they more than likely become Catiff (clanless) vampires without any affiliation.
Camarilla are usually more careful, as are some of the other unaffiliated bloodlines, in that they study their prey and chosen potential childe before embracing, sometimes requiring years to decide.
Calisto may have acted on her own ennui and embraced the MC on a whim, but Fabian's comments later make me think Calisto did it without realizing she was directed to do so by Artemis.
So humans have 10 blood points, spoo vampires have 10, ghouls have 10. The more blood that is vitae-thicker more potent blood, in the vampire and ghoul, the more powerful they are. As the vampire gets closer to the founder, their blood thickens and condenses. They are able to fit more, and use more at one time in combat. There are lines of delineation of power with vampires, and with ghouls for that matter. With Ghouls, the longer they are on the vitae, the less humanity they tend to retain, but the more powerful, and addicted they become. They eventually will become old enough that if they are out of the blood, they will turn to dust, but up to that point they age more quickly based on age. If relatively young, they simply resume aging. If ancient, dust city.
Vampires who run out of blood, enter a state called Torpor. There are numerous reasons to enter torpor, but running dry, grievous but not quite enough damage to kill them is another, and of course there is voluntary torpor to fight the ennui of time.
So anything above the 13th generation (12 steps removed from the original vampire) is considered weak blooded/thin blooded in modern nights. 13th generation used to be considered that at one time, further back 11th, still further 8th generation. However- in modern nights, anything lower than 13th generation is considered to be of stronger blood. They increase the amount of blood they can hold, and at certain points, how much they can expend at one time in combat or to heal at one time. 8th generation used to be considered the top of the food chain of the run of the mill vampire society. They had more blood (15) and could spend 3 points in combat per turn. Very bad assed compared to the average 12-13th generation vampire. 8th generation had a normal cap on what degree of mastery of discipline they could learn as well (5th level) Their max attributes for physical and mental traits were human max.
7th generation and below, become startlingly more rare and more powerful. They hold a lot more vampire blood, spend a lot more, and they develop specialized applications of their blood traits. They become super human in their normal attributes and knowledges.
This is just a quick primer for those unfamiliar with the basics of the inspirational lore.
In another 3 weeks or so we should have the climax of the second chapter, and the set up for chapter 3. I am genuinely excited, and am glad to see more interest in the thread.
Peace Y'all!
Calisto traits are presumably mirrored by the MC at a minimum, and the MC has exhibited a number explicitly which appear to be bloodline traits and has exhibited some implicitly which are fairly generic for vampires.
Whispers- Not a presence power, though in the night club our MC exerts presence to cause the red head local to look his way. Whispers also is not domination which Sharon has. It is partial mind reading, and partial suggestion as well as a strong charm. Note that when Sharon uses her Domination power, her eyes become green and slit pupil. I refrain from reading into that for a Set like trait, as domination could well have that as a side effect in this Rebirth of WoD
Invisibility- by itself not a special power, though it is exclusive to certain bloodlines, it could be explained away, but since it comes so easily to the MC I will guess it is a bloodline trait. This fits a hunter, which Artemis was depicted as in Greek mythology, and could be part of her legacy.
Claws- these have been ruled out by Markus as the Protean power of claws with little c. Bigger, Badder, could belong to the Bear curse of Hera on Calisto perhaps, or might be Artemis legacy, but is almost certainly a bloodline trait.
MC implicitly has Presence as mentioned above. He is also faster than normal, and while BigStuffedTiger pointed out that pumping up the dex attribute would make you faster, Sharon can presumably do this, and he is faster than her. In fact when she is assaulted, the MC rushes to her, and the terrain is a blur. That my friends is Celerity.
MC implicitly has a higher level of Auspex than Sharon, who definitely has heightened senses. He was able to intuit and or sniff out Astrid in the morgue.
MC was able to stop the hunter from staking him if you develop his prowess, which could imply potence or simply just better fighting skills, but he catches the axe Andrew tosses, and jams the axe in the feral nos' mouth, as well as simply is physically capable of reversing positions on her to put her against the wall.
Marcius- hot blooded, fast, strong, with a presence. I believe he and his thug boys are domesticated but not True Brujah as in the separate bloodline, but are Brujah that are in the society of polite company of the city. He does not have Sharon's gift of Domination but he wants it, as he expresses when saying he wants her eyes... She comes back very cleverly with they are attached lol.
Sharon- Domination and Presence for sure. To survive the beast attack Fortitude. Some suggested that instead of fortitude she survived due to the MC blood, which is true, but to survive the several minutes between the attack and the feeding of his blood, she demonstrated fortitude. She also points out she is more durable to Andrew on a couple of occasions. I think that Sharon is a Ventrue as I stated before.
Calisto has who knows how many disciplines, but given her MC's traits, which she presumably shares, she is not Ventrue. The MC does notice the difference between bottled blood, vampire blood, and human blood, which all vampires would notice. Sharon's use of bottled blood implies that she keeps a supply of her preferred type on hand.
Markus and company-Nos, they do not even bother to really change the name here. Obfuscate, potence and animalism.
Fabian-Thaumaturge equals Tremere in WoD but could also be Giovanni, Assamite, Settite, or Tzimisce Koldunic Sorcerers. Going with Tremere but with a more legitimate bloodline through Apollo>Hecate>Fabian.
Astrid- well we know, I think she is mysterious and beguiling, and hiding her true bloodline. I think she is Tzimisce Fleshcrafter. Others believe Toreador but of the darker flavor.
Crap I can not remember the vampire's name that teaches fighting, but she is a hound, and Ventrue, and Sharon claims kinship with her.
Vampires, Ghouls, and Blood.
Purely mechanical discussion of the lore.
Humans have 10 blood points of blood in them. Draining this, and giving them a single point of vampire blood will, with moderately regular success grant the human vampire status of the bloodline that killed them and fed them the blood.
Sabbat have a nasty habit of Vampiric Darwinism in which they mass embrace a bunch of humans, sometimes even mixing the blood up in a big ol' cup and pouring it down their throats. Then they stuff the newly turned vampire into the dirt. If they have the strength to rise, and the other traits necessary to survive their blood frenzied attack on the target city, they Might become Sabbat, or they more than likely become Catiff (clanless) vampires without any affiliation.
Camarilla are usually more careful, as are some of the other unaffiliated bloodlines, in that they study their prey and chosen potential childe before embracing, sometimes requiring years to decide.
Calisto may have acted on her own ennui and embraced the MC on a whim, but Fabian's comments later make me think Calisto did it without realizing she was directed to do so by Artemis.
So humans have 10 blood points, spoo vampires have 10, ghouls have 10. The more blood that is vitae-thicker more potent blood, in the vampire and ghoul, the more powerful they are. As the vampire gets closer to the founder, their blood thickens and condenses. They are able to fit more, and use more at one time in combat. There are lines of delineation of power with vampires, and with ghouls for that matter. With Ghouls, the longer they are on the vitae, the less humanity they tend to retain, but the more powerful, and addicted they become. They eventually will become old enough that if they are out of the blood, they will turn to dust, but up to that point they age more quickly based on age. If relatively young, they simply resume aging. If ancient, dust city.
Vampires who run out of blood, enter a state called Torpor. There are numerous reasons to enter torpor, but running dry, grievous but not quite enough damage to kill them is another, and of course there is voluntary torpor to fight the ennui of time.
So anything above the 13th generation (12 steps removed from the original vampire) is considered weak blooded/thin blooded in modern nights. 13th generation used to be considered that at one time, further back 11th, still further 8th generation. However- in modern nights, anything lower than 13th generation is considered to be of stronger blood. They increase the amount of blood they can hold, and at certain points, how much they can expend at one time in combat or to heal at one time. 8th generation used to be considered the top of the food chain of the run of the mill vampire society. They had more blood (15) and could spend 3 points in combat per turn. Very bad assed compared to the average 12-13th generation vampire. 8th generation had a normal cap on what degree of mastery of discipline they could learn as well (5th level) Their max attributes for physical and mental traits were human max.
7th generation and below, become startlingly more rare and more powerful. They hold a lot more vampire blood, spend a lot more, and they develop specialized applications of their blood traits. They become super human in their normal attributes and knowledges.
This is just a quick primer for those unfamiliar with the basics of the inspirational lore.
In another 3 weeks or so we should have the climax of the second chapter, and the set up for chapter 3. I am genuinely excited, and am glad to see more interest in the thread.
Peace Y'all!
- Aug 27, 2020
- 2,296
- 4,535
****Late Edition*****
Calisto, if she is as powerful as we all believe she is, can simply tell the Princep that this is how it will be, make it so. If she is 4th or 5th generation, and thousands of years old, she is a Methuselah. Only things that can really smack them are clan founders. If Calisto has an ounce of the spunk I think she has, she will definitely be at the investiture, and will ensure she has enough allies present that no matter how bad it goes, she will be safe. Ennui does cause a vampire to seek a thrill, even if that thrill is courting final death.
Put in perspective...
Calisto-deadly claws, invisible, able to command enemies to be friends, attacking 7-8-9 different foes at a time with her claws, she could clear the throne room herself. She would only be threatened if there were a similarly aged and low generation vampire that opposes her. Then she has her childe to sacrifice as well as any number of other potential allies or thralls.
She will be at the investiture for sure, and she will stir shit up!
Calisto, if she is as powerful as we all believe she is, can simply tell the Princep that this is how it will be, make it so. If she is 4th or 5th generation, and thousands of years old, she is a Methuselah. Only things that can really smack them are clan founders. If Calisto has an ounce of the spunk I think she has, she will definitely be at the investiture, and will ensure she has enough allies present that no matter how bad it goes, she will be safe. Ennui does cause a vampire to seek a thrill, even if that thrill is courting final death.
Put in perspective...
Calisto-deadly claws, invisible, able to command enemies to be friends, attacking 7-8-9 different foes at a time with her claws, she could clear the throne room herself. She would only be threatened if there were a similarly aged and low generation vampire that opposes her. Then she has her childe to sacrifice as well as any number of other potential allies or thralls.
She will be at the investiture for sure, and she will stir shit up!
- Jun 2, 2020
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To give a sense of perspective on the vampire "generations" we often estimate for the characters in Rebirth, when we estimate Artemis as a 4th gen methusalah its's because in the inspirational material, 1st - 3rd gen vamps don't gets stats, they're purely plot devices and the stuff of legends. No 1st or 2nd gen vamps have ever appeared in a published story or adventure aside from the much criticized Gehenna which terminated the product line, where the legendary original vampire Caine makes an appearance in one optional scenario. The 3rd gens are the clan founders, aka the antedeluvians, because they were born before the great flood mentioned in the Biblical book of Genesis and other ancient texts. Pretty much all of them are in torpor, although the two youngest, Tremere and Giovanni (they're not originals, they drank the originals dry) do awaken occasionally for short periods and give orders to their descendants during these brief periods of wakefulness.
As a likely 4th gen Methuselah, Artemis is as high as you can go and still have stats. Calisto is very likely her childe and thus a step below in power at 5th gen. Using typical stats from the inspirational material, The typical young vampire is 13th gen. Sharon is probably around 11th or 12th gen. The typical elder is around 8th or 9th gen and 200-500 years old. So as Arigon has pointed out, Calisto could probably clear the throne room herself as she's likely more than a match for a group of vampires whose ages collectively don't add up to hers. 8th and 9th gen vampires have their stats, skills and powers capped at 5 dots, 5th gens can have their stats, skills & powers go up to 8 dots, and that's a big power differential, especially when you've had thousands of years to develop your stats and skills to superhuman level, and your vampire powers to levels most other vampires can only imagine.
As a likely 4th gen Methuselah, Artemis is as high as you can go and still have stats. Calisto is very likely her childe and thus a step below in power at 5th gen. Using typical stats from the inspirational material, The typical young vampire is 13th gen. Sharon is probably around 11th or 12th gen. The typical elder is around 8th or 9th gen and 200-500 years old. So as Arigon has pointed out, Calisto could probably clear the throne room herself as she's likely more than a match for a group of vampires whose ages collectively don't add up to hers. 8th and 9th gen vampires have their stats, skills and powers capped at 5 dots, 5th gens can have their stats, skills & powers go up to 8 dots, and that's a big power differential, especially when you've had thousands of years to develop your stats and skills to superhuman level, and your vampire powers to levels most other vampires can only imagine.
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- May 9, 2019
- 4,889
- 16,247
Only one correction. Cain appears in bloodlines 1.
You mean the cab driver? The IP owner didn't care because they were terminating the line and replacing it with Requiem, and the computer game's creators at Troika had a lot of fun teasing that cameo...
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- May 9, 2019
- 4,889
- 16,247
Yeah, he was totally Cain haha!! It is awesome what they did.. everybody is sure he is Cain, yet they can deny it if necessary.You mean the cab driver? The IP owner didn't care because they were terminating the line and replacing it with Requiem, and the computer game's creators at Troika had a lot of fun teasing that cameo...
- Aug 27, 2020
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Actually if you look at the coding, they can't deny it. He IS Caine. LOL!!!!!
And it is so awesome that he is the cabbie, and that last discussion with him is on par with how awesomely they did Beckett. I love that game.. hokey graphics and all.