Gomly1980

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Jul 4, 2017
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Would Carmen let someone take her prisoner just so she could find their boss and kill them? Yes. If we're to believe her story about the Orc Pirates then she's done exactly that before, and even had the figurative balls to tell Roman about it. Or maybe the story was completely made up, and she's trying to psych Roman into thinking that she set him up.
And that's why she's such a good character.

We've all seen shows, films and read books with plot lines so predictable you can see where it's going pretty quickly.

The thing with characters like that is you are kept guessing. It's great writing. We don't know what's true and what isn't all we know is she is powerful, she's confident in her position and she's certainly not scared. Is she telling the truth?

It doesn't matter. Putting ourselves in Roman's position knowing she has the reputation she has even if we didn't believe every single word there is still the flicker that maybe there is some truth there. She got to where she is for a reason.

Crow's a character I don't know why I like. Normally i'm not a fan of those that are in it just for the sex but she's just finding out about her Orc side and she is quite endearing. Something about how she's written makes me like her.

This is why it would be a shame if you had abandoned it. A few more updates and people see it's progressing and you've got a really good story on your hands.
 

ponyguy

Engaged Member
Respected User
Feb 12, 2017
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"Crow is precious to me. A rare beauty which best finds freedom in servitude. So long as one of us ties her to a bed when all this is settled she'll be satisfied."
Now we're talking! Carmen, you're speaking my language! :evilsmile:
 

Dusky Hallows

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Aug 6, 2017
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And that's why she's such a good character.

We've all seen shows, films and read books with plot lines so predictable you can see where it's going pretty quickly.

The thing with characters like that is you are kept guessing. It's great writing. We don't know what's true and what isn't all we know is she is powerful, she's confident in her position and she's certainly not scared. Is she telling the truth?

It doesn't matter. Putting ourselves in Roman's position knowing she has the reputation she has even if we didn't believe every single word there is still the flicker that maybe there is some truth there. She got to where she is for a reason.

Crow's a character I don't know why I like. Normally i'm not a fan of those that are in it just for the sex but she's just finding out about her Orc side and she is quite endearing. Something about how she's written makes me like her.

This is why it would be a shame if you had abandoned it. A few more updates and people see it's progressing and you've got a really good story on your hands.
I'm glad you enjoy the characters/writing. It's an interesting process with me and Duski, because while I do most of the writing, she comes out with the best ideas. My greatest shame is that the original concept for Sanguine Rose didn't have Crow, and then Duski suggested a second half-orc who's super submissive and I was very much against the idea. Now she's a crowd favourite and I adore her so the moral of the story is to listen to Duski. I totally get where you're coming from with Crow and Carmen, which is maybe weird to say since I wrote most of their dialogue but I almost don't feel like I did at times. All the characters have a life of their own and if I didn't have Duski reigning me in then they'd all just talk bollocks for seven hours and the porn wouldn't happen. But yeah, Carmen is an incredibly reactive character. If you play a ballsy hardheaded merc, she tries to embarrass you and one up you. If you're easy going then she'll tease you. If you're hands on, she slaps your wrist, but if you're chaste then she'll start seducing you. She finds your element and pulls you out of it. It goes into her backstory a lot, which is probably something which won't ever come out in the game, but suffice to say that Carmen was a very manipulative child. Crow is kind of the opposite, someone who's just discovering who she is. Impressionable, naive, but not stupid. I think of all the mercs she's the one in the best position to say "Well, that's enough for me." and just walk away. Luckily for us, she's a little bit of a thrill seeker, and the dangerous alure of this situation is both terrifying and intoxicating.

Now we're talking! Carmen, you're speaking my language! :evilsmile:
Damn straight. I need Carmen quotes framed and hung up in my house.
 

Gomly1980

Forum Fanatic
Jul 4, 2017
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the moral of the story is to listen to Duski.
Sounds like my marriage.

Carmen is an incredibly reactive character. If you play a ballsy hardheaded merc, she tries to embarrass you and one up you. If you're easy going then she'll tease you. If you're hands on, she slaps your wrist, but if you're chaste then she'll start seducing you. She finds your element and pulls you out of it.
I went through a few dialogue choices with her and it looks like there is no right answer, it's trying to speak without giving too much away so she can't sink her fingers in too deep.

It goes into her backstory a lot, which is probably something which won't ever come out in the game, but suffice to say that Carmen was a very manipulative child.
Personally, I think that's the best choice.

While it would be nice to find out her back story I think it would remove the mystery she has for this game. It adds a bit of something extra if we don't know what makes her tick.
 
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Dusky Hallows

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Personally, I think that's the best choice.

While it would be nice to find out her back story I think it would remove the mystery she has for this game. It adds a bit of something extra if we don't know what makes her tick.
Yeah, definitely. We spent a lot of time making sure every character has a lot going on in their backstories, and some of it will come out and some of it won't, but the important thing was establishing that every character had a life before they ended up in this situation together. They're all confused and wondering about each other's motivations, and letting the player be a part of that mystery was certainly intentional.
 

twofish

New Member
Oct 26, 2017
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It's kinda a tired cliche. A villian that always know what's going on, always have the right answers and the 'heroes/mc/good guys' can only ever react. The 'fog of war' if you will, only ever exist for the mc... I guess, since this is porn, it's less of a cliche. That and porn games almost always lock you into a 'fetish path' early on.

Great art and i'm looking forward to the next release
 
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zazzaro

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Jun 5, 2017
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It's kinda a tired cliche. A villian that always know what's going on, always have the right answers and the 'heroes/mc/good guys' can only ever react. The 'fog of war' if you will, only ever exist for the mc... I guess, since this is porn, it's less of a cliche. That and porn games almost always lock you into a 'fetish path' early on.

Great art and i'm looking forward to the next release
It might be cliche, but it's rarely done well.
 
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Dusky Hallows

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It's kinda a tired cliche. A villian that always know what's going on, always have the right answers and the 'heroes/mc/good guys' can only ever react. The 'fog of war' if you will, only ever exist for the mc... I guess, since this is porn, it's less of a cliche. That and porn games almost always lock you into a 'fetish path' early on.

Great art and i'm looking forward to the next release
I see where you're coming from, and I'd agree it's a cliche, although it's more shorthand than anything. From a narrative perspective, it's not good enough to tell the player that Carmen is capable, intelligent, and able to outwit her opponents, we have to demonstrate it. The most straight forward way to do that is to show her being all of those things, even if it comes at the expense of Roman and the other mercs. It's worth noting that for all she can embarrass Roman in Day 1, and for all she claims she can escape, she doesn't. Carmen is projecting an air of superiority, and it's effective given that most people think it's a given that she will manage to escape. In the subsequent days of the game you can attempt to challenge that superiority, or you can acquiesce to it, but the premise of the game does depend on Carmen appearing to take the lead out of the gate. If it's any consolation, taking advantage of Carmen's blindspots, using the fog of war, is an element of at least one major fork in the story that comes up in day 2.
 

revan335

Member
Aug 5, 2016
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It's good to hear that the MC take eventually end up challenging her superiority. Her position is not a great one and the MC should capitalize. If he doesn't submit to her, but she is still intrigued by him, I wonder what kind of relationship they will have. Also I hope there will be a Glasha and Roman ending.
 
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N1K17Y

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Jun 12, 2017
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Yeah, definitely. We spent a lot of time making sure every character has a lot going on in their backstories, and some of it will come out and some of it won't, but the important thing was establishing that every character had a life before they ended up in this situation together. They're all confused and wondering about each other's motivations, and letting the player be a part of that mystery was certainly intentional.
i played the game like 2-3 months ago so i forget some stuff and i dont think it was mentioned but still gona ask. do we (yet) as players know how long ago the characters formed their gang and how that happened ?
your comment made me think of reservoir dogs, hateful eight (im like tarantino stuff) the good the bad the ugly, you know stuff where characters dont trust each other and you never know can happen 10 seconds later.
 
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Dusky Hallows

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i played the game like 2-3 months ago so i forget some stuff and i dont think it was mentioned but still gona ask. do we (yet) as players know how long ago the characters formed their gang and how that happened ?
your comment made me think of reservoir dogs, hateful eight (im like tarantino stuff) the good the bad the ugly, you know stuff where characters dont trust each other and you never know can happen 10 seconds later.
It's not explicit in the game how long the team has been together, since I haven't really seen an opportunity to fit that kind of exposition into the dialogue smoothly, but there are a few scenes where it's possible to piece it together. Glasha and Roman have known each other for years and form the core team. Roman was approached with the job, and he brought Glasha in since they almost always work together. Markus was also hired by their employer, and Roman doesn't know him very well at all. Finally Crow was hired purely as a guide to the region, to make sure they didn't end up lost in the woods, so she's also more or less a stranger. There's layers to it which mean the whole thing can go south, because every single merc is in this job for a different reason, but I won't spoil the fun by going into it all here.

I'm mostly responding because i think it's the polite thing to do, not because i have anything noteworthy to add.

First, thanks for answering my critique/open air mutterings. Secondly with your explanation, of your usage of 'show don't tell', and with the glance at the content to come. You have persuaded me off the invalidity of my initial post. I can only reiterate part of the post. I'm looking forward to the next release.
Hey I love answering feedback. Constructive criticism is always appreciated, and I'll admit that if we didn't switch up the dynamic as the game progresses then you would be totally right. Hopefully future content can deliver on your expectations.

Also I hope there will be a Glasha and Roman ending.
Glasha/Roman content is actually the hardest to write because of the stuff I mentioned above. They go way back, so it's kind of hard to make them fuck. Duski and I are constantly tossing scene ideas around for these two to make it work, and nothing has stuck yet (we came close with a very dominating Carmen/Roman/Glasha threeway, but it bordered on noncon and we didn't want to risk it with Patreon's new rules). Then again, we originally had no intention of letting Crow be dominating in any route, but after pitching some ideas there is now a route where that's possible.

So the short answer is, if you want Glasha/Roman endings, pitch us some scene ideas that would make two long time allies end up fucking. Any that I like I can put to a vote and we'll see what sticks.
 

zazzaro

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Jun 5, 2017
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Why does it go against Patreon rules? I thought the new stuff was just about incest?
 

Gomly1980

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Jul 4, 2017
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Why does it go against Patreon rules? I thought the new stuff was just about incest?
No, that was one that got talked about most because that's what the "biggest" games contained that Patreon hit first.

Non consensual stuff like mind control, rape etc is also banned on patreon as is underage stuff and a few others.

Pretty much all that's allowed is vanilla sex stuff with some minor kinks.
 

Dusky Hallows

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Aug 6, 2017
207
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REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE




(just tried the game tho and i like it)
Glad you enjoyed it!

I think you can't have stuff related to 'sexual violence' either.
Pretty much this. Patreon is fairly lax about it, all things considered. Usually if they have a problem they contact you and give you time to work shit out. We have a scene where Roman slaps Carmen but no one's bugged us about that yet. We might just not be on their radar so to speak, though, and if we can avoid crossing any lines we'd prefer to. It's a little bit of a contentious issue, but I don't really see Patreon being the morality police here so much as they probably have contractual obligations to Paypal and such about what kinds of content they can allow. It sucks, but from the people I've talked to about it who had their pages flagged, Patreon normally helps you skirt the rules as much as possible. I can't speak for every Creator or project though, there might be examples which go completely against what I've seen.
 
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