VN Ren'Py Summer's Gone [S1 Steam + DLC] [Oceanlab]

[Doomyk]

Interesting,are Helen,Dylan,Scarlet still alive?

 

[AlexFXR]

Ok, I have been gracious enough to reply to you repeatedly with quotations from game dialogues to repute the points you're trying to make.

Kindly extend me the same courtesy by taking the time to post scenes/dialogue quotes from the game to back up your $200k specialists salary and $50k house arguments. Otherwise, you're just expressing your interpretations/opinions... PS - I already know you cannot back up your arguments in such a way.

Where I live, the average annual salary for a doctor is is around US$97k. The average house price is around US$532k.

It's not about "not liking" your words and "arguing", it's about making you own your words by getting you to back them up with evidence rather than your personal opinion.

Are you starting to argue again? Why can I afford to buy a 2nd floor house that is much larger than Nojiko’s and I have 2 cars, although the salary is the same as that of an ordinary doctor? If you don’t know how to go to the healthcare website and see all the information, you don’t know the prices, you don’t know the salary, you don’t know the standard of living, explain how you can have a dialogue with you on this topic? I'm not interested in arguments and meaningless conversations.

 

[KekWGgWP]

Are you starting to argue again? Why can I afford to buy a 2nd floor house that is much larger than Nojiko’s and I have 2 cars, although the salary is the same as that of an ordinary doctor? If you don’t know how to go to the healthcare website and see all the information, you don’t know the prices, you don’t know the salary, you don’t know the standard of living, explain how you can have a dialogue with you on this topic? I'm not interested in arguments and meaningless conversations.

Why don't you address that to Ocean himself this topic? you have his Discord published and Patreon too if you are donating to him, ask him about that.

I think that he is the one who can give you a determinant answer if you aren't satisfied with other users answers.

 

[yossa999]

TLDR warning - but necessary in the interests of discussion and explanation, and now - into the breach...


You and I tend to disagree on a number of areas surrounding Summers gone - and there is nothing wrong with disagreeing and being an adult about it - but I believe that these discussions are better when you leave name calling and other personal attacks at the door.

You wanted to talk about trolls, so I defined what I saw as examples of troll behavior - and some of what I listed is included by some of the trolls as their reasons for rating Summers Gone poorly.

(FYI - If someone posted today that they love the way Bella gave the MC a BJ - 5 stars for the best animations they had ever seen, and I saw the post, I would call them out on this thread - misinformation and misleading for those who are new to the thread and don't know better.)

I felt I needed to make the point about the ability of one or several people who don't like what a dev is doing to mischaracterize an AVN or go all in, and review bomb the dev.

Spoiler: My heavy-handed scenario to prove my point about trolls and manipulating the AVN rating system

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I did this to demonstrate what an aggressive troll could do and establish the boundaries for our discussion. (This behavior can occur on F95, but it would certainly be disingenuous and a disservice to Any dev who was on the receiving end of it.)

If we had no agreement on what should be outside the bounds of even bad troll behavior - a reasonable discussion becomes much more difficult.

Now, we have established that we agree the troll behavior I used for examples in my prior post Is troll behavior, not just a difference of opinions held by you and me.

You then said:

The issue is there is plenty of fair criticism to the game that you specifically and others like you have been dismissing for years.

I don't know which of my posts you have read versus those you have not, and you also said:

I don't care enough to keep receipts or look through people's post history to call them out on it.


So let me recap what I have shared over many posts (without going too much further into the TLDR zone).

I have never claimed that Ocean is perfect.

I have commented that Ocean needs to have a Very good review and update of his verbiage and grammar (punctuation could use some help but it is not a showstopper for me) - and this becomes even more critical ahead of the Steam release.

I support Ocean - if he says that creating two AVNs concurrently helps him to better manage stress - I believe him. I will not tell another person that they Must use my preferred means to manage stress - I recognize that each of us is different.

Is Ocean Very ambitious with his goal to create 30 + chapters of Summers Gone - ABSOLUTELY!! He is The most ambitious of the creators whom I support with my $.

Is there a danger that Ocean will not be able to complete SG? - Yes

Ocean could be hit by a bus tomorrow and Summers Gone, at least his version of Summers Gone, would die.

A parent, mom or dad, could be hit by a bus and Their most important work (IMO) - raising their children - would be taken out of their hands.

So - Should we stop living, limit the scope of our ambitions out of the fear of what Might happen - like Ocean creating Summers Gone - or dreams - like a parent wanting to raise their children and always be there for them as they grow into adults?

I believe that limiting our hopes and dreams - What we aspire to create or Who we aspire to help grow into adulthood, is a tragedy and one I Cannot subscribe to.

We can disagree about the way Ocean does things (rework needed for Steam release for ex.) or the level of resourcing Ocean needs to continue to create Summers Gone the way He envisions it. There is nothing wrong with a considered 'agree to disagree' where both people have laid out their positions and thoughts and the only bridge between them is:

Agree to Disagree.

I am happy to risk My $, My time and My passion for this AVN in the hopes that Ocean can go the distance, tell this story His way and breathe life into Summers Gone in a way few other devs have brought their creations to life for me.

The pragmatist in me says: This will be a long, tough Journey!

The optimist in me says: Damn - will this Journey be worth it!

Cheers!!

This example of discussion is above the average level that prevails in the thread. Just like the story in SG grew out of the framework of a typical average porn game on the site. I have nothing more to add on this topic.

As for the 2-stars reviews, it's funny. I mean, some of them are understandable and expected. When you see a review from a person who basically hangs out on the BaD thread and argues there about which girl has the hottest porn scene, it's obvious what their opinion will be on the latest chapter of SG. This is absolutely honest, natural and fair. A person saw a game with a high rating, thought it was something like BaD, tried it and was dissatisfied. And there have been quite a lot of such reviews lately, which is absolutely normal and natural; many people don’t like slow-burn adult games.

But there are also plenty of reviews from accounts with zero or almost zero activity, hidden profiles and a single review about SG. Come on guys, you don't even trying. Did you know that all your posts can be found through the search? Some of them don't even hide profiles and it makes me giggle, account created in 2018 and the only activity listed is a 1-star review of SG in 2023. This guy is a stoic critic, he's been waiting for five years before strike down upon this game with great vengeance and furious anger.

I think a lower rating will benefit, it would be another filter for quick-fap people who look for something in the game that was never there and then leave disappointed and angry.

 

[Bombmaster]

Depends what you call fair criticism, what you or anyone consider fair criticism can be considered unfair by others, we talk about personal opinions here and we all thinking from a subjecting point of view.

And from what i seen from your complains in here about the game in the last days, personally i don't find much of it valid or fair criticism, you also have a tendency to insult people for no real reason when someone argues your opinions and you tend to generalize things.

Which i see it as very childish and not a good argument.

What i see by fair criticism is what majority of the people agree on something, for example when 100 people play a game and 90 of them criticize the game for good reasons and they all agree on common ideas, than that is fair criticism, pretty much everyone agrees on the bad points of a game.

I don't know how much Ocean actually cares about the reviews on F95, considering he doesn't even spent time in here, he may come through here from time to time but that's pretty much it.

Now I know that Ocean listens to the people who gives him advice, he changed things in the game that people didn't like and listened to their demands, so he takes in consideration criticism.

Personally i tend to take in consideration the reviews about the games when i play, and most of the time the reviews are on point, there were instances where i felt deceived by them thinking i actually play a good game to my standards but that happen once or twice since i'm a user here, overall i'm fine with the review system.

Sure there are trolls in every popular game that try to alter the review system in their favor but that is a small percent of the actual players who have a genuine opinion about the game.

Moderators also monitorizes reviews too and you can actually spot troll reviews by reading them, someone who played the game and is interested in leaving a review they do it in a professional and subjective way, they give a much more detailed review eventually with examples and all that, they give good arguments and make convicing points, usually this are the kind of reviews you want to take in consideration the most.

This game for example had 5 star reviews since the beginning i started to play (i play it before rework) and i decided to see if the game is as good as people say, and it actually was and now after rework is even better than it used to be, it improved in every single aspect and i like it more than i used to.

Nevertheless i consider something pointless complaining about the amount of trolls that leave reviews, trying to defend and justify which sides of the reviews are more genuine and all that.

As a side note, I'm looking forward to see your review about the game, i'm genuinely curios what kind of review you will have.

Reviews are flawed.

This game is far ahead in some aspects but the way it works ratings they are meaningless.

You give 5 and rate other games accordingly. And get into a situation people rating bad games high and burner accounts.


The number of posts and high level of discussion is a more accurate metric.

 

[KekWGgWP]

Reviews are flawed.

This game is far ahead in some aspects but the way it works ratings they are meaningless.

You give 5 and rate other games accordingly. And get into a situation people rating bad games high and burner accounts.


The number of posts and high level of discussion is a more accurate metric.

They are flawed since i experienced that myself, but i didn't actually felt like it was a general rule, most of the time that i took reviews in consideration, it turned out true and i know to be cautious.

Of course i'm talking from personal point of view.

 

[diamondlover]

I didn't read the reviews, I discovered this VN some time ago on the updates page and decided to try it.

From the first moment I loved the renderings, the animations (even if I think they are a little slow and there are too many transitions), and the story that slowly unfolded as we progressed.
I can't wait to get even further with the story, I think it's beautiful so far.
I wish Ocean to be able to continue his project and I wish him all the best.

 

[Bombmaster]

They are flawed since i experienced that myself, but i didn't actually felt like it was a general rule, most of the time that i took reviews in consideration, it turned out true and i know to be cautious.

Of course i'm talking from personal point of view.

The best review for me is reading my peers talking about them into their threads, and the signatures.

You can find gems by following the rabbit role from people you pay attention.

What turns me away from games is having a trope I dislike.
If people would day what they dislike most about SG would be lack of sex.

A simple one. Barring only the perpetually horny.

 

[AlexFXR]

That she is very, very, very, very poor. And if we point out that Nojiko has more money than they say in the game, and we point out as a clue that they are in that (elite) university, Mila would be a plot hole (unless there are additional explanations, quite a few).

As far as I remember the plot, Nojiko’s children study at a regular university. Bella's neighbor and those who offended Mila study at an elite university.

 

[John972]

Are you starting to argue again? Why can I afford to buy a 2nd floor house that is much larger than Nojiko’s and I have 2 cars, although the salary is the same as that of an ordinary doctor? If you don’t know how to go to the healthcare website and see all the information, you don’t know the prices, you don’t know the salary, you don’t know the standard of living, explain how you can have a dialogue with you on this topic? I'm not interested in arguments and meaningless conversations.

Don't light a match while you are gaslighting...

It's not about me. I asked you to backup what you claim are specific plotholes with actual game scenes and/or dialogue. You can't because you are imposing your unsubstantiated opinion... so you GASLIGHT to deflect!

To be honest, who gives a flying fuck what you can afford to buy in your particular part of the world. It's totally irrelevant. Other parts of the world have really expensive housing in sizeable cities, even housing stock built in the 40s-70s.

Hey, I drive on the opposite side of the road to SG, but you don't see me bitchin' or moaning about it, claiming it's a game plothole.

To reiterate: YOU CANNOT SUBSTANTIATE NOJIKO IS A MEDICAL SPECIALIST EARNING $200,000, WHO LIVES IN A HOUSE WORTH $50,000.

Bye...

 

[KekWGgWP]

The best review for me is reading my peers talking about them into their threads, and the signatures.

You can find gems by following the rabbit role from people you pay attention.

What turns me away from games is having a trope I dislike.
If people would day what they dislike most about SG would be lack of sex.

A simple one. Barring only the perpetually horny.

Literally me

 

[Bombmaster]

Don't light a match while you are gaslighting...

It's not about me. I asked you to backup what you claim are specific plotholes with actual game scenes and/or dialogue. You can't because you are imposing your unsubstantiated opinion... so you GASLIGHT to deflect!

To be honest, who gives a flying fuck what you can afford to buy in your particular part of the world. It's totally irrelevant.

Hey, I drive on the opposite side of the road to SG, but you don't see me bitchin' or moaning about it, claiming it's a game plothole.

To reiterate: YOU CANNOT SUBSTANTIATE NOJIKO IS A MEDICAL SPECIALIST EARNING $200,000, WHO LIVES IN A HOUSE WORTH $50,000.

Bye...

This discussion is ongoing so I'm just ask shamelessly. Is the house Nika live rented? Or Nojiko owns it.

The money is on the land deed if the house is old and battered don't matter.

 

[Acsuka]

I didn't read the reviews, I discovered this VN some time ago on the updates page and decided to try it.

From the first moment I loved the renderings, the animations (even if I think they are a little slow and there are too many transitions), and the story that slowly unfolded as we progressed.
I can't wait to get even further with the story, I think it's beautiful so far.
I wish Ocean to be able to continue his project and I wish him all the best.

And hopefully you're young, because this amazing story will be around for many years before it ends...
If you believe in miracles, this is your place...

 

[Doomyk]

A little theory about the situation with Amber. It may be that was no big secret and Najiko simply did not want Nika to know about their acquaintance, so that he could be comfortable and as honest as possible with Amber during therapy and nothing else. However, it’s ironic, but this is exactly what triggered and alerted Nika and now he can really find something that Naji is really trying to hide.

 

[RNasc4444]

As far as I remember the plot, Nojiko’s children study at a regular university. Bella's neighbor and those who offended Mila study at an elite university.

This is actually a plot point that needs to be explained eventually. As far as I understood you are right, the Uni our main characters are attending is a regular one. Why would the children of powerful, influential and rich families such as Ayua, Bella and Zara be attending a regular college when they could be attending an elite one? And why does the major ZPR sponsorship happen in that particular college and in the same year the main cast is starting their college life?

 

[Doomyk]

This is actually a plot point that needs to be explained eventually. As far as I understood you are right, the Uni our main characters are attending is a regular one. Why would the children of powerful, influential and rich families such as Ayua, Bella and Zara be attending a regular college when they could be attending an elite one? And why does the major ZPR sponsorship happen in that particular college and in the same year the main cast is starting their college life?

Cause Ayua-Zane,Sasha-Petrova. Why is it weird that they go to a college that belongs to their clan? It would be stranger if they went to a rival college.

 

[John972]

vaguely

This is actually a plot point that needs to be explained eventually. As far as I understood you are right, the Uni our main characters are attending is a regular one. Why would the children of powerful, influential and rich families such as Ayua, Bella and Zara be attending a regular college when they could be attending an elite one? And why does the major ZPR sponsorship happen in that particular college and in the same year the main cast is starting their college life?

Although not fully clarified yet in the game, there's another college seemingly more elite than ZPR - Jackson & Schwartz College.

Vanessa, Mario Holgerson, Antony Reus, and Melanie Ceril go there. Zara told the MC: "Have you ever heard of the Jackson & Schwartz college? My sister and her boyfriend go there and you need some serious money to be accepted."

 

[RNasc4444]

Cause Ayua-Zane,Sasha-Petrova. Why is it weird that they go to a college that belongs to their clan? It would be stranger if they went to a rival college.

Maybe I'm missing something but like I said the ZPR sponsorship is new. They mention it multiple times right? Was there any previous link between that college and their families? I've never played WiAB so there is plenty of lore I don't know about.

 

[AlexFXR]

Why don't you address that to Ocean himself this topic? you have his Discord published and Patreon too if you are donating to him, ask him about that.

I think that he is the one who can give you a determinant answer if you aren't satisfied with other users answers.

He's developing 2 games at the same time, and I don't believe he can finish them. And I’m not going to wait 25 years for the games to be ready. If Ocean develops only one game at a time, he will immediately receive money from me.

 

[KekWGgWP]

He's developing 2 games at the same time, and I don't believe he can finish them. And I’m not going to wait 25 years for the games to be ready. If Ocean develops only one game at a time, he will immediately receive money from me.

Uh i think you misunderstood me, i didn't told you to donate to him if you don't want to, i offered you his Patreon as a way of communication in case you already donate to him so you can ask him about Noji's financial situation.