huh... so yeah, that's why it didn't bother me the first time w/o the incest patch... although I do remember that I didn't quite get the whole thing with Summer... like at first I thought the 3 of them were together in the same orphanage or something...
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- Dec 24, 2018
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Nami meets Summer somewhere, but later on they're both at a girl's camp, so I guess we assume Summer was met at a camp:
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right... well it seems he could easily make it so the three of them were in the system early on and met in an orphanage or something like that and not be related at all without much issue, if he decides to permanently remove the incest...
although I really don't see the point to it considering the other game... that one just wouldn't work without it.
although I really don't see the point to it considering the other game... that one just wouldn't work without it.
- Dec 24, 2018
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I've posted it a lot here, because since this devlog, it's really hard to decide what is actually the case until the next WiaB update comes out. If an SG update comes out before, we'll probably be able to second guess some of how the change will work in practice, obviously a bigger effect in WiaB, but there will be flow through to SG.
- Aug 16, 2022
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The thing is there are multiple instances of dialogue that make no sense whatsoever in any other context. The example I always provide because it stands out is Mila and Zara asking the MC why Nami is a redhead. Why in the fuck would they EVER ask that if they weren't related? There is no reason to. Makes no logical sense to.
If you pay little to no attention to what is said then I would understand how the unpatched version makes sense to you but otherwise...
- May 20, 2022
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Let's not forget that it is very important that two unrelated roommates do not copulate, It's a real taboo
This could be easily explained with Zara and Mila thinking they are related, and then they clarifying that they are just roommates. The problem is why Mc and Nami is so taboo, why the "Race of Impossible Odds" choices why they could not kiss at Vic's, I don't know how Ocean will explain it.
He wants to move away from it because he needs to eat and financial security, but how he will make sense of the story I don't know. Is not like he can keep the ambiguiness for long either. I just can not think of a solution that fits it.
Moving forward I don't think that we can expect this type of content on either game, regardless of how much sense it makes or not.
- Jan 17, 2021
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And if they are ralated at the end? Maybe both lost their parents in a car accident because they are siblings and for some reason someone don´t want them to know so they have been raised as roomates
- Aug 16, 2022
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Even if my brain could ignore the inconsistencies of them asking why she's red, there is no way I can make up excuses for the "Race of Impossible odds" like you mentioned, or Nojiko being so concerned about their "weird" relationship or the fact that them, two completely unrelated people, could not make out in front of Vic and Mila, or the subsequent conversation before getting to the pizza place.
It just doesn't add up. I'm sorry but as it stands, I have to reiterate. There is only one way the dialogue makes any sense. On this hill I would die. Any day of the week.
- May 20, 2022
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At this point we're like in Kung Pow: Nojiko raised them badly on purpose, as a jokeAnd if they are ralated at the end? Maybe both lost their parents in a car accident because they are siblings and for some reason someone don´t want them to know so they have been raised as roomates
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I don't understand why not change some dialogues to fix the dynamics between Nami and Nika
- Aug 16, 2022
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I did suggest a new release of season 1 with only changes to the script. Clean up the dialogue and make their relationship clearer from the get-go. But some people started freaking out thinking I was suggesting yet another rework
Also after all the rushed changes he had to do to get the game published on Steam, I doubt Ocean wants to go back to the S1 release. I got the feeling he just wanted to move forward so he'll probably explain things later and leave the S1 shitshow as is.
- Dec 24, 2018
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I agree with you on the whole about their reactions not making sense, but the line about being red? The script literally points out they have different parents at that exact point. In normal english, we'd understand that the stress on 'her' parents vs 'your' parents is 100% clear when mentioned sequentially, especially followed by 'they' 'and (what about) Nami's?' It'sclear what the script means there.
za "Why is she red?"
scene ad959 with dssa
d "That you'll have to ask her parents."
scene ad960 with dssa
za "What happened to yours?"
scene ad961 with dssa
d "They died in a car accident."
scene ad960 with dssa
za "And Nami's?"
scene ad961 with dssa
d "Believe it or not... The same."
So... believe it or not, the line here with Zara shows that the race against impossible odds doesn't make sense, their behaviour doesn't make sense, not their history. It's the same as when everyone thought they were a cute couple. The script makes sense, Nami and Nika's reactions don't.
Besides, given Nami's porn habits, if I were Noji I'd be worried about her weird relationships ALL.THE.TIME.
How Ocean reconciles their behaviour with their history, well, I'm as keen as you for it to be cleared up and neatly explained. Based on the current script, it is their hangup that is th oddity.
Everyone is SG knows and obeys the ToS that Ocean operates under, so I can't see how Nika or Nami would be so disrespectful to Ocean. Maybe that's a deadpool style fourth wall breaking - Nika and Nami know Ocean is against them!And if they are ralated at the end? Maybe both lost their parents in a car accident because they are siblings and for some reason someone don´t want them to know so they have been raised as roomates
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Oh I completely agree with you, was reinforcing your point not contraring it. The problem is that we know that the oblivious answer is not on the table anymore, the question then is how will Ocean handle the problem? And how much it will affect the story? Personally I don't have a clue and I don't think he can maintain the uncertainty of it either, so he either as a one hell of a explanation or this part of the game will always have a weirdness about it. The same goes for WiaB, we are speculating that the twins are adopted, but I don't think Patreon distinguishes between blood and law relations as some might do, and if William is not even adopted then that story really needs some really good explanation to make sense.
- Dec 24, 2018
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Yes.
I like the stories of both games, but currently they both have holes that need filling. Normally that comment means something else on this forum... anyway...
Remember that WiaB isn't on patreon, so the future proofing is not only concerning what we currently know, but about Ocean's plot moving forward for both games, and ensuring the details aren't mistaken. Ocean also mentions about how to make sure they make sense for the kind of story he wants to tell.
About Nika and Nami. Ocean just needs to put the entire narrative weight on the fear of Nojiko discovering their affair.
Let's start with a few tearful flashbacks from their childhood where Nojiko hugs them and says you're like my children to me. You need to create the impression that Nojiko treats them like her real children and will never accept any intimacy between them. And then you have an explanation for why they have to hide. If someone from the College knows, then the whole College knows, and so does Zara, and if she knows, then so does Nick, and if he knows, then so does Nojiko.
Let's start with a few tearful flashbacks from their childhood where Nojiko hugs them and says you're like my children to me. You need to create the impression that Nojiko treats them like her real children and will never accept any intimacy between them. And then you have an explanation for why they have to hide. If someone from the College knows, then the whole College knows, and so does Zara, and if she knows, then so does Nick, and if he knows, then so does Nojiko.
My suspicion is that Ocean does not want to change the story more than he has to. Nami's path was thought out as taboo, change it is change the entirely of the path and I think Ocean is not so keen in doing it. Now what could be as taboo as incest that explain their behavior ?
Besides, given Nami's porn habits, if I were Noji I'd be worried about her weird relationships ALL.THE.TIME.
Does Nami's porn habits still is in game ?beyond the face sitting thing ?
To be perfectly honest, I don't think that he can pull it off, not for a lack of skill of his part but because it was too core to the story to now they just be good old friends. Does not work. I plan on still follow the games, but I think it will lessen the story if William has no relations to the Zanes. As for SG we have to wait and see but Nami's path will look pretty strange as it is.
I don't think that it works, still would not explain their reactions at Vic's and would paint Nojiko in a not so good light. It also does not solves the problem as Nojiko is only their landlady.
- Dec 24, 2018
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Yep, Nami's still a weirdo.
n "Asshole!"
n "You swore, you wouldn't tell her I rented Spank Canyon 4!"
scene s51 with dssa
d "No? I said I'd hint at it to make you uncomfortable."
n "I bet she has a secret trapdoor to a sex dungeon."
n "Let's watch a porno."
n "I can either give you a very long speech about why we're gonna watch a porno, or you save us both some time and we just watch a porno."
Regards WiaB, Leia and William are not just good friends. The change clearly states that. What that means for the rest of the game and the universe is something else. I guess my thoughts with both games, is, can we leave our preconceptions and what we once believed aside to see waht the change actually does to the plot? If the characters are engaging and the dramas feel consequential, maybe it'll still be an excellent game, even if it's not the one we'd hoped. I mean, heck Star Wars did me dirty after the first three movies, LotR pissed me off and I loved it anyway. I'm going to suspend my judgement until I can actually play through the change and see what it's like.
Nojiko is only landlady part will never make any sense you can't take care of two 12 and 13 year olds and not have any papers for it. And he will never fix it because then romance with Nami is illegal on patreon so that's already a mistake you will never get rid of