VN Ren'Py Summer's Gone [S1 Steam + DLC] [Oceanlab]

[BobTheDuck]

I'm outta reacts, I get one back then they're gone

I don't either. I doubt it can. You can't make Amber work as a therapist in a serious story if you keep lewding her up. If you want her to be a credible LI and therapist you will have to delay her path significantly to a point where her "job" as the MC's therapist is "done".

I argue she was already not working. It's hard to buy her as a professional therapist when she holds her client, whom she just met, to her bosom like a small child during a session. Or when you catch her in a low cut dress or her pierced nipples are showing. It's a stark contrast to the Amber that pretends she doesn't know the MC at the book club in order to keep his privacy or refuses to discuss he's a patient in front of her daughter.

This is one of the reasons I was so against the addition of that goddamn awful porch scene that has no fucking purpose whatsoever other than provide some lewd shots of Nojiko. It undermines her role of "mother" or caretaker. It cheapens the story and the character. As hot as she is (and goddamn she fucking IS hot), as much as I want to see lewds of her, I value the story more.

So you gotta pick a lane here. Serious story or porn plot. You can't have both.

I agree. The issue is that a high enough percentage of the supporters want a porn game, and some level of fan service is inevitable. In WiaB, that's easier, because Katie is the fan service, and then there are the other LI's for people who don't want the best girl. All Ocean has to do there is release emergency Katie renders and the fans are happy. Lewds? well we KNOW there will be in WiaB, so we're not impatient, even if it will take Katie's path a while to open. But we have lewds, no need to pretend. In SG without lewds, everything has to be some level of bait. Gotta keep people guessing, gotta cover every interest, maximise the appeal.

At some point (S2CH1 by the looks of it) we'll have at least some form of lewds, accidental or otherwise. Porn logic will to some extent is written into the game - all these hot LI's with no prospects? Why is Nika better than Jeff or Aziz? It's not because of Nika's amazing social etiquette. So porn logic, all girls find the MC irresistable. At least we know it's him and not his sausage they find irresistable for a change.

I was glad when Ocean reworked Amber's office scenes. The even better move would have just been to make her blouse non see-through. Simpler, and gives of that stict professional look.

Ocean might say that it's story first, but ultimately his audience is mostly into porn. I just hope he doesn't let the porn logic make too many decisions.

Because the dev just picks whatever clothes look sexy for no reason other than that. After the lips and tits being too big, this is my biggest complaint about the game. It's supposed to "not be a porn game" but the only place women dress like they do in the game is in porn. It happens in a lot of AVNs. It's annoying every time.



100% agree here. Nojiko is probably the 2nd hottest in the game after Nami. Though, it's not like there's too much competition since most of the women have blow-up doll proportions. Despite all that, I'd have much rather she not be having a motherly heart to heart while barely wearing a robe.

Alternatively, Ocean started two porn games and subverted the porn logic, but learned how to make VN by playing porn games. No one wears BDSM gear to class, most women can't afford that level of make up daily, and most can't be assed after the first three weeks. SOmething i noticed at uni - overly attractive women became serious women after they settled in and felt comfortable going to uni without major makeup like they worse going out at night. A couple of assignments due and suddenly we got the real them.

Basically everyone looks like they're modelling clothing and their lifestyle, representing their influencer self 24/7. The fake eyelashes are the biggest giveaway.

Possibly not only Nami

Yeah, but Maja might change the locks

 

[dameromexxx]

Yes, at least is what I am hoping for.

Was more general. I can't see how Amber can work in a non porny way.

I understand now you just don't want this romance to look like a scenario for My Friends Hot Mom or My First Sex Teacher.
I think this relationship has to deepen to the point where the situation is reversed and Nika becomes a kind of therapist for her. This Bond has to be really strong to be worth taking the risk. For me this is the real ''Race Against Impossible Odds'' of this game, this romance has SCANDAL written in capital letters. An affair with a patient of a person from the elite of this city, not to mention connections with Bella. It's easy to imagine what will happen if Nicole finds out about it

 

[OdinTGE]

Basically everyone looks like they're modelling clothing and their lifestyle, representing their influencer self 24/7. The fake eyelashes are the biggest giveaway.

It's more than that. I absolutely don't remember her name, or when exactly it was, but at one point there's a woman in class wearing something so low cut, and her tits are so scaled up, that her areolas are just out and about for everybody to see. The outfits the women wear in this game are just pure porn fantasy. It's actually a shame I like the characters and story, because it's overall just a frustrating experience playing the game. Trying to enjoy that stuff while being annoyed by everything else.

 

[jadepaladin]

I'm still looking for a therapist that wears see through blouses, has pierced nips, will cradle me, doesn't mind if I call her mommy, and isn't the premise to a porn.

I think SG has altered my view on reality somewhat.

In WiaB, that's easier, because Katie is the fan service, and then there are the other LI's for people who don't want the best girl. All Ocean has to do there is release emergency Katie renders and the fans are happy.

Emergency Katie renders do placate me, damn.

 

[LHDLLB]

I understand now you just don't want this romance to look like a scenario for My Friends Hot Mom or My First Sex Teacher.
I think this relationship has to deepen to the point where the situation is reversed and Nika becomes a kind of therapist for her. This Bond has to be really strong to be worth taking the risk. For me this is the real ''Race Against Impossible Odds'' of this game, this romance has SCANDAL written in capital letters. An affair with a patient of a person from the elite of this city, not to mention connections with Bella. It's easy to imagine what will happen if Nicole finds out about it

The position of power, the age gap. Everything is a bomb with Amber. I would like if she was something of a man eater. Like it is porny too, but less so than fuck me pretending I am Summer, or we are stuck on this hotel room with only one bed. Like, I will like if Amber is the one doing the chasing, lets lean in the predatory aspect of it. It is fucked up só let it be fucked up, don't try to excuse it. At least it can make sense then

 

[Holyx9]

View attachment 4503047

If Ocean can cut down 6-8 weeks of development time per update than this work station upgrade was well worth it.

 

[BobTheDuck]

It's more than that. I absolutely don't remember her name, or when exactly it was, but at one point there's a woman in class wearing something so low cut, and her tits are so scaled up, that her areolas are just out and about for everybody to see. The outfits the women wear in this game are just pure porn fantasy. It's actually a shame I like the characters and story, because it's overall just a frustrating experience playing the game. Trying to enjoy that stuff while being annoyed by everything else.

Yeah, that sort of stuff has no place regardless. I thinkt hat was Ayua in the previews, Ocean already did the same with Marla. Making characters develop into whether they're getting any or not doesn't serve the story, agreed. But on the whole, everyone is far too glamorous for normal life. I get the reason, I don't like it though. Luckily these moments are the odd ones out. If there's some sort of logic - like when Vanessa mentions sexy underwear is more comfortable for sports, at last we have plausible deniability.

No one no matter how horny would be risking public exposure like Ayua was. Nika couldn't even see the show she put on! First time I saw Ocean do this was in WiaB when you're at Relucia with Leia. It looked super cheap then, and doesn't get better with better renders.

 

[OdinTGE]

lol. I just got to Chapter 3.5. The dinner with Bella. Her areola is out. I just don't understand choices like this. I'd only really seen this kind of thing in Inceton games before.

Unrelated, it is *so* rare to find an AVN set in an American college/university where the dev has actually been to one. I assume they're making guesses based on TV and movies? Or something? I wish I could just ignore stuff like that, but man it just bothers me constantly.

 

[Old Man Al]

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Hello,

The log after this one will be on Wednesday the 12th. I want to return to the Wednesday Dev logs.
I took the liberty of postponing this log until I had some numbers from the new Workstation... And boy do I have them now.

With the arrival of the new Workstation, my old 2021 Workstation will become a slave PC.
The entire process of moving the library and everything else over took around 60 hours.

Workstation comparisons and data.
I did the following tests:

• Load & render a scene with 2 people in it.
• Load & render a scene with 20 people in it. (Book club from Chapter 5)
• Render a test animation.
• Load a character into the scene.
• Scene saving

---------------------------
2 People scene. (Opening and rendering)
Old: 13:20min
New: 8:25
Improvement: ~5min
---------------------------
20 People scene. (Opening and rendering)
Old: 46:08min
New: 29:20min
Improvement: ~17min
---------------------------
Test animation - 70 Iterations - 120 frames
Old: 1:45h
New: 1:13h
Improvement: ~32min
A final animation would run at 1500 iterations and there it would save even more time because of the additional A6000. (I would assume it would run 2-3h faster. I'll test it overnight.)
---------------------------
Okay, okay... You save 5min here and 17min there... Let me put this into perspective.
If I have an update that is ~7000 renders big, and I save an average of 11min per render, we're looking at 53+ days saved.
That's almost 2 months saved of just Daz opening and rendering scenes.
The bigger the scene, the more time I save... In the grand scheme of an entire update, we're talking about months.
After Chapter 1, I'll return to my normal update size of ~3000-3500 renders. With an average of 11 minutes saved, we save almost an entire month.
This is without adding the 2nd Workstation to it, which currently runs on a 4090. It will render animations until there are none left to render, at which point it moves over to the stills.
I haven't had the chance to test the new PC in the queue yet, but if it can render more than 55-70 renders a night, it will constantly outperform me.
---------------------------
Other improvements that will add up:

• Scenes like the book club save 5-10x as fast. It sometimes takes almost a minute to save a scene, which disrupts the flow. Now, it saves giant scenes in less than 10 seconds.
• Loading characters into the scene. On the old Workstation, it took 2:30 minutes to load Bellchen into a scene, whereas it took 1:01 minutes on the new workstation. This is a big one, as I often have to load assets and characters into the scene. I can only assume that poses will also load faster.
• And my favorite: the viewport performance. On the old Workstation, it feels like you have 3 fps in the book club scene. It feels like going through mud up to your thighs with a screen freeze every 10-15 seconds.
  On the new PC, it feels like there are maybe four people in the scene. Scenes with just two characters feel empty.
  This is so important because it directly impacts your mental. If a scene lags and the screen freezes every X seconds it will annoy the shit out of you.
• The airflow of the case is amazing. It keeps the 3x A6000 ADAs at ~60-65°C without me removing the side panel. (Which I had to do for all other PCs.)
• Photoshop feels much smoother. A big hassle during postwork is that after a while the performance drops hard.

On paper this Workstation is worth every penny, however, let's see how it will perform over a long period of time.
From now on, I will count every render I make and give you the number in every dev log. So in 11 days, you'll hear about what I rendered, not just setup, but actually rendered out.
We're starting at 0.

If we ignore the past 3 days in which I spent setting everything up, work has been continued as usual.
I do my scenes, the queue does queue-things and that's all there is.
Actually, the phone chat is done and I'm preparing SFX files for the update.

Previews:
I just picked two random renders for previews today, as I just wanted to test if my Adobe workflow works on the new PC.

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The Mila render looks like a wallpaper but is actually an ingame render on a specific route with a slightly different art style.
With the next Dev Log I'll make true of what I said a few dev logs ago, there will only be one preview from now on.
Apparently, I'm one of the only devs who shows multiple previews every single Dev Log and while I like doing it, it shows too much.
I want to keep more scenes a secret and sometimes, I'll add a nude preview for the Summer tier and above.

I'll end this Dev log here because I'm so excited to work. I want to see and feel what it's like to work with this beast.
I mentioned the Specs of the workstation in the last Log I think... I added my previously acquired two A6000 ADAs to the one that came with the workstation.
I also got enterprise SSDs with 7.68TB and one of them is in RAID 1 to minimize the risk of data loss.

I'll see you in 11 days with some numbers.

• Ocean

 

[D2M3]

Dev logs that give me numbers like this make me realize one thing and one thing only:

Someone needs to take Daz software out back and shoot it in the head.

I'm sorry what. Those render times with modern 6000 ada architecture?

Motherfuckers, I train entire LLM checkpoints in the time it takes to render a 20 ppl scene!

Those GPUs have ungodly amount of power in them.

Exactly what the fuck is going on in those render softwares?!

 

[Old Man Al]

Dev logs that give me numbers like this make me realize one thing and one thing only:

Someone needs to take Daz software out back and shoot it in the head.

I'm sorry what. Those render times with modern 6000 ada architecture?

Motherfuckers, I train entire LLM checkpoints in the time it takes to render a 20 ppl scene!

Those GPUs have ungodly amount of power in them.

Exactly what the fuck is going on in those render softwares?!

What's going on in those render softwares he asks. No idea in general, but in Ocean's case:

Spoiler

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[dameromexxx]

Unrelated, it is *so* rare to find an AVN set in an American college/university where the dev has actually been to one. I assume they're making guesses based on TV and movies? Or something? I wish I could just ignore stuff like that, but man it just bothers me constantly.

I'm guessing it's probably way over the top? but in general American pop culture creates false perceptions of many things. A few movies mixed with the popularity of syntwave music created a romanticized and mythological image of what the 80s were. Out of curiosity, is there a movie or tv show in which an American college is presented most realistically

 

[D2M3]

What's going on in those render softwares he asks. No idea in general, but in Ocean's case:

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IF that's magic, it's from the Vincent Clortho Public School for Witches and Wizards.

 

[OdinTGE]

I'm guessing it's probably way over the top? but in general American pop culture creates false perceptions of many things. A few movies mixed with the popularity of syntwave music created a romanticized and mythological image of what the 80s were. Out of curiosity, is there a movie or tv show in which an American college is presented most realistically

I don't think it's "over the top" really. It's just all the little things that annoy me. To be clear, none of it matters to the actual content. I'm just being irrational. Some examples that I see in many AVNs:

1) Colleges do not have a "front desk" or "reception" such as the now iconic "college reception" that's in like 500 AVNs. The closest you're going to find is some sort of main administration office, but that's going to be some boring place you might *never* physically go to in your 4 years attending the school. I went to a tiny private college (1200ish students) for 2 years. I was in the deans office once for...something? I never saw the main admin offices. I then went to a state school (10s of thousands of students). I saw the main admin offices there, but only because I was a transfer and had extra paperwork.

2) Colleges do not have hallways lined with lockers. That's high school.

2.5) Your schedule in college is different pretty much every day, and unless you're really cramming in the credits trying to graduate in less than 4 years, or you're doing a double major, you're probably looking at 3 to 4 hours of class *at most* some days. Other days you have have 0 or 1 hour.

3) Dorm rooms are not in the same buildings as offices or classrooms. I suppose this is possible, but between the two schools I attended, and a few others I visited, I've never seen this.

4) You don't need an ID to be on campus. Even that tiny secluded private school I went to was still just...a place you could drive in to and then you're just around. The bigger schools are litteral cities. They have dozens, or hundreds of buildings and 10s of thousands of students. They're often intermixed with the cities they are in to the point that you have no idea when you're "on campus" or not.

4) When talking about the day to day of attending lectures/lessons/class you "go to class." You don't "go to school," or "go to college." You would never say something like "why weren't you in college today?" You'd ask "why weren't you in class today?"

5) College professors are not high school teachers. They do not deal with fuckery, shenanigans, or discipline. For example, the scene with getting into a fight with Bella and drawing all over each other. Then the professor escorts you to the bathroom to clean up, and she lectures you and all that. Absolutely not. You'd just be kicked out of the class, probably permanently, and that would be it. High School teachers have to deal with that shit and try to get you in line. You're required to be there. You don't have to be in college. You're paying to go. If you act like a dumb ass and get kicked out, that's just on you.

6) *Everything* about college sports in every AVN I've seen is wrong, with the exception of Move the Chains. All the terms people use, the systems that seem to be in place, the teams, the type of people on the teams. Literally everything is so very very wrong. Summer's Gone is *very* bad in this regard. Even if we ingore the insane outfits the girls wore in that first basketball scene. Also, Trey an Jeffery are *not* basketball players. I laugh out loud every time they talk about playing basketball. In fact, almost none of the men in the game are basketball players. They're all built like Linebackers.

6.5) I'm just now getting to more sports stuff in SG. What...is happening? The only thing accurate here is that the sport of basketball exists. First team? Second team? Coed teams? Coaches somehow in competition with each other? The idea that everybody is involved in sports at all? The *vast* majority of college students will never do anything related to official sports. This is a fever dream.

7) Specific to Summer's Gone there has been mention a couple times so far of a "rival college." This can be a thing, but this goes back to sports. No college that is as tiny as the one in the game, is going to have a "rival college" because you'd need actual sports programs that are relevant for this to be a thing. You can't exactly work up the Red River Rivalry or the Iron Bowl with an enrollment under 1000.

8) Lol, colleges do not have bars that are actually part of the college. They're typically surrounded by bars, but the idea of a college or university (that is primarily made up of students too young to legally drink) having an official bar is just...so silly.

 

[Allenebs]

I can only suggest you to read the Ocean's dev log again.

Personally, I don't see how your examples of an individual or a large company that needs a customized hardware relate to him and his case of leasing the workstation to reduce his business costs. And frankly, I'm not very interested in discussing it, for the same reason as the part of the post below.

Although it's hopeless, I'll try to explain it as simply as possible.

Here is Ocean, who makes a game that I consider to be the best among AVNs. I can launch the game at any time and see with my own eyes the results of Ocean's work, what his experience, knowledge, work processes and hardware allowed him to create. I can open the latest dev log, which is posted regularly, and read about the current development status, plans, issues, and see previews of the upcoming release.

And there are you, and all the content that is available to me is your posts about how the Ocean does everything wrong and how he should do everything differently.

Forgive me, please, but I am probably inclined to trust the results and not someone's reasoning about how it should be.

Everything I really wanted to write in response to this does not pass my new non-aggression/tolerance filter.

Let me assure you that neither I nor my buddies on this site are in any way affiliated with that anonymous group of excuse recipients you refer as "we." So I have no idea what you're talking about, and I'm not discussing it.

Advice for advice. Post all this on the Ocean's Discord, there is a suggestions channel.
Personally, I see only good in careful planning of work, strict release schedules and time/cost estimates. Maybe Ocean just doesn't know about it, and you will open his eyes and "we" will all benefit from it.

What's a workstation? Hardware. Leasing is almost NEVER cost effective. This is the first time I've even seen it mentioned, or paid it attention at least, but that's a problem unto itself. Things like workstations and pc components hold their value really well, especially these days. My modded hardware sells well above MSRP. You can pretty easily recover 70-80% of MSRP when reselling things like this. Some times you can recover the full value, if properly cared for. Where as with a lease, you tend to pay well over the actual products value with no way to recover any of that expense. Yes, we're talking thousands of dollars, but this is his business. And that's a MASSIVE, unrecoverable expense placed against a massive, yet mostly recoverable expense.

He's not the USFS, the rail road, a farmer, etc who knows that when they're leasing a vehicle, it will be utterly destroyed by the time the lease expires. This is a workstation operating under standard operations.

You can't say you're not a part of the group that receives the excuses while citing them, bud. Just bc you vehemently believe them and see no flaws in his actions, doesn't doesn't mean there aren't issues. There are plenty of people quite literally calling bullshit, when I completely believe him. These are just stupid mistakes that anyone who runs a business should immediately set out to remedy. What we're discussing are things he should actively be researching himself, as I write this, if he hasn't finished doing so already. It's not something he should need me or anyone else to tell him. Yet part of the process is addressing it with his consumers when he resolves it.

I do "this" professionally, as in improve production processes. I've said that before. This is not a hobby for Ocean, he needs to learn and grow, and me having to point out such major fucking issues in the process after so many years... He makes enough that this shouldn't be a problem. Worst case, he gets a small business loan while easily being able to prove that he has a profitable business. His personal credit might be shit, and that would bypass that problem, too. The interest rate on a loan would still be significantly cheaper than a leased workstation.

And if you don't want to discuss these things, just don't. Stop giving your input. You weren't asked for it, but I respect the effort. You have just as much of a right to offer your feedback as I do, but give up the pretense that you hold some secret knowledge about how all of this is necessary. It's not and is easily proven. In my job, if I negatively impact the quality of our product, I'm fired. I'm not suggesting he reinvent the wheel. What I'm suggesting would directly correlate to reduced overheard and reduced dev cycles while having zero impact on the quality of his work.

You don't have to respond to me, you're choosing to. You just can't justify any of the positions you've taken. If you don't want to read the posts, don't. I will provide my feedback where I choose to, not where you want me to. If any of these devs wanted to sit down and have a real conversation about refining their production process, I would oblige. Until then, I will choose where I decide to yell into the clouds. Not you.

 

[BobTheDuck]

You must be registered to see the links

Hello,

The log after this one will be on Wednesday the 12th. I want to return to the Wednesday Dev logs.
I took the liberty of postponing this log until I had some numbers from the new Workstation... And boy do I have them now.

With the arrival of the new Workstation, my old 2021 Workstation will become a slave PC.
The entire process of moving the library and everything else over took around 60 hours.

Workstation comparisons and data.
I did the following tests:

• Load & render a scene with 2 people in it.
• Load & render a scene with 20 people in it. (Book club from Chapter 5)
• Render a test animation.
• Load a character into the scene.
• Scene saving

---------------------------
2 People scene. (Opening and rendering)
Old: 13:20min
New: 8:25
Improvement: ~5min
---------------------------
20 People scene. (Opening and rendering)
Old: 46:08min
New: 29:20min
Improvement: ~17min
---------------------------
Test animation - 70 Iterations - 120 frames
Old: 1:45h
New: 1:13h
Improvement: ~32min
A final animation would run at 1500 iterations and there it would save even more time because of the additional A6000. (I would assume it would run 2-3h faster. I'll test it overnight.)
---------------------------
Okay, okay... You save 5min here and 17min there... Let me put this into perspective.
If I have an update that is ~7000 renders big, and I save an average of 11min per render, we're looking at 53+ days saved.
That's almost 2 months saved of just Daz opening and rendering scenes.
The bigger the scene, the more time I save... In the grand scheme of an entire update, we're talking about months.
After Chapter 1, I'll return to my normal update size of ~3000-3500 renders. With an average of 11 minutes saved, we save almost an entire month.
This is without adding the 2nd Workstation to it, which currently runs on a 4090. It will render animations until there are none left to render, at which point it moves over to the stills.
I haven't had the chance to test the new PC in the queue yet, but if it can render more than 55-70 renders a night, it will constantly outperform me.
---------------------------
Other improvements that will add up:

• Scenes like the book club save 5-10x as fast. It sometimes takes almost a minute to save a scene, which disrupts the flow. Now, it saves giant scenes in less than 10 seconds.
• Loading characters into the scene. On the old Workstation, it took 2:30 minutes to load Bellchen into a scene, whereas it took 1:01 minutes on the new workstation. This is a big one, as I often have to load assets and characters into the scene. I can only assume that poses will also load faster.
• And my favorite: the viewport performance. On the old Workstation, it feels like you have 3 fps in the book club scene. It feels like going through mud up to your thighs with a screen freeze every 10-15 seconds.
  On the new PC, it feels like there are maybe four people in the scene. Scenes with just two characters feel empty.
  This is so important because it directly impacts your mental. If a scene lags and the screen freezes every X seconds it will annoy the shit out of you.
• The airflow of the case is amazing. It keeps the 3x A6000 ADAs at ~60-65°C without me removing the side panel. (Which I had to do for all other PCs.)
• Photoshop feels much smoother. A big hassle during postwork is that after a while the performance drops hard.

On paper this Workstation is worth every penny, however, let's see how it will perform over a long period of time.
From now on, I will count every render I make and give you the number in every dev log. So in 11 days, you'll hear about what I rendered, not just setup, but actually rendered out.
We're starting at 0.

If we ignore the past 3 days in which I spent setting everything up, work has been continued as usual.
I do my scenes, the queue does queue-things and that's all there is.
Actually, the phone chat is done and I'm preparing SFX files for the update.

Previews:
I just picked two random renders for previews today, as I just wanted to test if my Adobe workflow works on the new PC.

Spoiler

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The Mila render looks like a wallpaper but is actually an ingame render on a specific route with a slightly different art style.
With the next Dev Log I'll make true of what I said a few dev logs ago, there will only be one preview from now on.
Apparently, I'm one of the only devs who shows multiple previews every single Dev Log and while I like doing it, it shows too much.
I want to keep more scenes a secret and sometimes, I'll add a nude preview for the Summer tier and above.

I'll end this Dev log here because I'm so excited to work. I want to see and feel what it's like to work with this beast.
I mentioned the Specs of the workstation in the last Log I think... I added my previously acquired two A6000 ADAs to the one that came with the workstation.
I also got enterprise SSDs with 7.68TB and one of them is in RAID 1 to minimize the risk of data loss.

I'll see you in 11 days with some numbers.

• Ocean

Thank you for sharing the devlog - it's vastly appreciated.

I'll like the shit out of your post once I get my reactions back.

 

[Tremonia]

I don't think it's "over the top" really. It's just all the little things that annoy me. To be clear, none of it matters to the actual content. I'm just being irrational.

I studied only one semester in the US as part of an international program and can confirm the things you mentioned. But there's one point why I give Ocean some slack. His story don't take place in the USA. It's a fictional country with fictional education system. Even the society doesn't fit. Wollust isn't a place in USA.

 

[BobTheDuck]

What's a workstation? Hardware. Leasing is almost NEVER cost effective. This is the first time I've even seen it mentioned, or paid it attention at least, but that's a problem unto itself. Things like workstations and pc components hold their value really well, especially these days. My modded hardware sells well above MSRP. You can pretty easily recover 70-80% of MSRP when reselling things like this. Some times you can recover the full value, if properly cared for. Where as with a lease, you tend to pay well over the actual products value with no way to recover any of that expense. Yes, we're talking thousands of dollars, but this is his business. And that's a MASSIVE, unrecoverable expense placed against a massive, yet mostly recoverable expense.

He's not the USFS, the rail road, a farmer, etc who knows that when they're leasing a vehicle, it will be utterly destroyed by the time the lease expires. This is a workstation operating under standard operations.

You can't say you're not a part of the group that receives the excuses while citing them, bud. Just bc you vehemently believe them and see no flaws in his actions, doesn't doesn't mean there aren't issues. There are plenty of people quite literally calling bullshit, when I completely believe him. These are just stupid mistakes that anyone who runs a business should immediately set out to remedy. What we're discussing are things he should actively be researching himself, as I write this, if he hasn't finished doing so already. It's not something he should need me or anyone else to tell him. Yet part of the process is addressing it with his consumers when he resolves it.

I do "this" professionally, as in improve production processes. I've said that before. This is not a hobby for Ocean, he needs to learn and grow, and me having to point out such major fucking issues in the process after so many years... He makes enough that this shouldn't be a problem. Worst case, he gets a small business loan while easily being able to prove that he has a profitable business. His personal credit might be shit, and that would bypass that problem, too. The interest rate on a loan would still be significantly cheaper than a leased workstation.

And if you don't want to discuss these things, just don't. Stop giving your input. You weren't asked for it, but I respect the effort. You have just as much of a right to offer your feedback as I do, but give up the pretense that you hold some secret knowledge about how all of this is necessary. It's not and is easily proven. In my job, if I negatively impact the quality of our product, I'm fired. I'm not suggesting he reinvent the wheel. What I'm suggesting would directly correlate to reduced overheard and reduced dev cycles while having zero impact on the quality of his work.

You don't have to respond to me, you're choosing to. You just can't justify any of the positions you've taken. If you don't want to read the posts, don't. I will provide my feedback where I choose to, not where you want me to. If any of these devs wanted to sit down and have a real conversation about refining their production process, I would oblige. Until then, I will choose where I decide to yell into the clouds. Not you.

Without knowing the terms of the lease, you're talking about secret knowledge. As you said yourself:

Leasing is almost NEVER cost effective

So what kind of lease is it? A lease to purchase? A lease with flexible upgrades, replacement in case of failure? There is a reason leases exist for businesses beyond merely the cost, otherwise people would just get the loan and buy outright. There is a service component, and businesses chose what service suits their cashflow.

I do get your point, I buy my business assets outright myself, but there are reasons why the lease model works beyond physical depreciation/wear and tear. Not the least of these is tax offsets depending on the taxation rules where Ocean lives, and how he can claw some of that back.

But unless you have the contract, and Ocean's full financial status in your hand to analyse, your post is hot air.

 

[AlexFXR]

I agree. The issue is that a high enough percentage of the supporters want a porn game, and some level of fan service is inevitable.

This was originally a porn game, of course fans want to see sex scenes. Isn't that logical?

 

[dojito]

8) Lol, colleges do not have bars that are actually part of the college. They're typically surrounded by bars, but the idea of a college or university (that is primarily made up of students too young to legally drink) having an official bar is just...so silly.

Shame, we do have bars inside the college in Spain, several actually and you can drink whatever you want, u missing out there guys.