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- Mar 17, 2019
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what she fear seems to be more linked to corruption, she collects the hearts, and it's linked to mc' arbiter form since he need to find Ella because he's not complete.
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how do I beat the bird on a corrupted/villian playthrough? didnt seem to get enough power any choices I might miss not on the guide I killed and consumed everyone I could and did all the training events and cheerleading events. Do I need to take the horn from the shop keep?
- Sep 6, 2019
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Pretty sure you just need to choose the correct options in the fight. I didn't focus on power at all and beat him.
- Jul 13, 2021
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I had this post in the works for quite some time. I think at this point we have enough information to try and derive the trait makeup of the various characters in the game. This is going to be huge because we have a lot of info and many characters to go through. For the obvious ones I'll try to be conscise. I'm not going to bother with the exact makeup and the generations for this, however I'm going to emphasize the traits that I think are more prominent in every character.
I will try to maintain this post so it can be used as a resource/reference, when new information hits us, but it will have to be confirmed, either ingame or through the monster reports, not implied.
The structure of the document isn't perfect, but I'd rather post it earlier to start a discussion and fix it later, than keep it in my hard drive till it's finished.
The post has three parts.
1. A primer on the various traits based on the abilities shown by beings with high compability. These interactions are not necessarily 100% confirmed. I will try to keep things as fair as possible.
2. A part about Superhumans and Monsters that we know their traits and makeup. For the more prominent of them I will add some extra information.
3. A part where I'm trying to deduce the traits/makeup of various characters. I will use various ingame information, along with the relevant context taken from game text or monster reports.
Edit: Spelling corrections, refactors etc. The quest to fix spelling will give me a lot of exp I'm sure.
I will try to maintain this post so it can be used as a resource/reference, when new information hits us, but it will have to be confirmed, either ingame or through the monster reports, not implied.
The structure of the document isn't perfect, but I'd rather post it earlier to start a discussion and fix it later, than keep it in my hard drive till it's finished.
The post has three parts.
1. A primer on the various traits based on the abilities shown by beings with high compability. These interactions are not necessarily 100% confirmed. I will try to keep things as fair as possible.
2. A part about Superhumans and Monsters that we know their traits and makeup. For the more prominent of them I will add some extra information.
3. A part where I'm trying to deduce the traits/makeup of various characters. I will use various ingame information, along with the relevant context taken from game text or monster reports.
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Edit: Spelling corrections, refactors etc. The quest to fix spelling will give me a lot of exp I'm sure.
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I'm not sure if Claudia has become a superhuman yet, but based on what happened in the time dream i figure there's some degree of omnitemporality. I subscribe to the idea that what happened there was only partially a dream, potentially influenced by the future Claudia.
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This might run into some problems when we know that Illusion(name pending) have the ability to be perceived in any way they so choose. So in theory some of the monsters we've seen do have some degree of Illusion in them even if they don't express the full trait.
I don't quite agree here, I think that considering Light seems to be the ability to empower others, it makes the most sense for darkness to have the opposite ability. An argument can be made for power, but I see the Strength Eaters as being primarily Dark, with some possible Ether and Power as lesser influences
Considering WW strong fascination with copying from mythology. I feel like Asura being Power is like the most obvious thing in the world, unless we get some sort of confirmation to the contrary.
imo, Nyx's abilities over souls and the dead seems to be way more in line with Memory than with Truth, especially considering MC's burdgeoning mindscape. Souls can be considered the memories of the mind to the more poetically minded. My verdict is Power, with a sizeable affiliation with Memory
Considering the very conceptual nature of his abilities, I have to say that Deus screams Truth to me, with a strong helping of Memory. Memory explains a lot of precognition, whereas Truth fits as the most cleanly conceptually based power among the 12 apostles. Possibly some small amount of Space too for the reasons you mentioned.
- Jul 13, 2021
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She probably haven't which is way I added the word "probably". It's heavily foreshadowed though so I'm willing to bet that she will end up a Timespawn. If we get any conflicting info I will edit this.
I tried to add as much detail as I could with the monsters. I will need something tangible to consider an Illusion component because as far as we've seen, those that have some form of the trait tend to target others with it and not to conceal themselves. This is one of the reasons why I have so much trouble with Henri and why I decided to not consider Rina for it.
Dark is considered to have suppression effects so your hypothesis is correct. However we have never seen it actually empower the caster somehow by leeching energy. Michael is the only one who can leech energy from others to empower himself so I have to go with Power for now.
The Strength Eaters are described as monsters who become stronger, not making their enemies weaker. Perhaps both are true but I will need some sort of confirmation. If we had some info that the enemy also becomes weaker, I'd add Dark in a heartbeat.
I have to admit that I didn't even check if the Asura is an actual mythological being. However after checking it, and considering that it's connected to Raksashas which I'm familiar with, aside from the multiple hands, I don't see that many similarities. Rakshasas are shapeshifters and illusionists which are very different from this particular monster.
The Truth component is only for recreating their body from scratch like Eisheth can do for herself. Everything related to preserving the dead and the soul is Memory. Sorry if that wasn't clear.
If by conceptually you mean that he will reach the "truth" through his power, yes it fits. However every effect we've seen in the game has to do with altering the interactions between objects and materializing things. If at any point we get a Truth ability that has to do with the "search for truth" I will consider it. It's funny though, Eisheth is the Chosen of truth, but everything she did was.. not true. She decided to not die, she decided that the rocks don't suffer opposite forces etc. Such a weird concept.
If not, could you elaborate a bit? Give me an example of an ability we can observe?
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- Mar 17, 2019
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She cant restore from nothing, for Duncan she still need his body and she only can revive Duncan as a tree and the operation officer mention that she cant turn stone to flesh again.
She restore the body like he was before his death, so her power could "remember" how the body was before is death and restore him" also Nyx mention that mc could see the dead like her and she know about is power .
Mc:"are you telling me you see dead people?"
Nyx: "I don't know if 'see' is the right word for it... but close enough. You probably could too, you know?"
Nyx:"they are a lot of memories left in a corpse, if you know how to get at them. That's what i'm really seeing, or at least it's a god chunk of it"
And mc could interact with the dead in this last update, Jake,Ella,and Sylla through memories. + that dream with Nyx in the place where she store the souls of dead people, and mc could acces it and she even mention that part of mc soul's is there,and that how she preserv him, it's also made me think about what Sylla said about "having piece of people inside of him and that's how we connect to them."
They clearly have some similarity here.
And if Nyx resurection power is linked to memory, mc could possibly resurrect Ella like that before leaving with her like Ella said in that letter? ( either willingly or maybe Sin will try to use the twins as leverage?)
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- Jul 13, 2021
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I hadn't considered this, but I don't think that Duncan's current predicament is a good example because Ella's power seems to mess up things. Also if Nyx wasn't capable of creating a new body for him, why would she bother burning him down in the first place? Wouldn't that doom him from the get go if he was just a bunch of ashes?
Edit: I will need to research it more. I'll revisit this a bit later.
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- Mar 17, 2019
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Ella also mention that nyx surpassed her monster.
I didn't say that she cant recreate the body, just not from nothing, if something burn, ashes are left and then she restore the body from that, i dont remember if they are exemple where she resurrect people without their body of if it's mentionned somewhere.
During diamond battle, she only start to fight when a third of the people she marked are dead and ask nico to send her in" it sound like she need the body to me and we still have the exemple from the gorgon, if she petrified someone, Nyx cant restore stone to flesh and another exemple are Christie, we now that Ella had a similar securities for Christie and Emily but Ella couldnt resurect Christie after mc had devoured her no? (didnt play that part because i like Christie )
just that every element that we have so far point to her needing at least some leftovers of the body but i could be wrong of course .
but they are still a lot of similarities with memory and how that part of Nyx power work.
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Dunno what are you smoking, but Nyx was stated to be able to nullify the energy of Tiff and Michael during their evolution. That's a Dark trait shebang. Her resurrection power stems from Memory (monster fought by Niko was mostly pure memory judging by the connection displayed), also Dark is stated to be able to imitate things.
So I will preface this with an explanation that of the twelve primary abilities, Truth seems to be the most esoteric. Unlike things like Memory or Body which are more tangible and explain themselves rather easily, Truth appears to be to be much more... poetic? Flowery? Not sure what the best word for it is.
Deus feels like Truth to me in a few ways. Mentally, I have tied together the future sight and his divination of other people as part of the same ability. Think of his future sight as something along the lines of "It is true that if I drop a rock from my hand, it will fall." When he looks at someone and learns all this stuff about them, he's learning all of the true things about them. He was able to immediately understand that the MC was visiting him in a dream, and unlike Michael, he didn't appear to be in any sort of special circumstances that would've allowed him to "come to realize" he was in a dream. In a way, its also something that can extend to his attacks like "It will be true that a light beam will cut this person in two." though this is a bit more of a stretch on my part.
Another point that is more personal opinion than anything else, is that Truth feels much more interesting if you consider Deus to be HERO's secret weapon. Memory, while very strong in its own right, feels less like a grand reveal than someone who absorbs truth.
- Jul 13, 2021
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Yeah, I edited my post because I misjudged your point. There are a few reasons why I think Nyx can resurrect from nothing.
1. Duncan is willing to die to give Nico the chance to take out Ella and he has mentioned numerous times that he is protected by the Reaper. Duncan is an old member of Nyx's team and he probably knows exactly how this works. Also Nico is way too quick to accept his judgement without even a goodbye when she considers herself better than Ella and is already empowered with Clark's power. Nico kills by transporting her victims to the sun. I don't think you can come back from this.
Edit: To add to this, Nico may be able to just transport Ella to a faraway planet and then just retrieve Duncan's corpse . However I doubt that space can actually kill Ella or most level 5s for this matter. They don't need to breath, Ella's body is significantly stronger than Nico's who is confirmed to be able to survive it for weeks, and high level Superhumans don't actually need propulsion to travel, they can just manipulate their energy. So Ella will come back, perhaps in a year, but she will come back. And even if she can't, Hex can do it for her.
2. Ella has probably marked Christie and Emily. However those 2 are just human. If attacked by a monster, it's quite likely that they will get eaten or their body will be left in such a stated that it will be hard to find even a small piece of it. And that's without considering what apocalypse Ella will bring to Earth.
Both present Duncan and the victims of Gorgon have a common point. They are actively affected by someone else's power. Perhaps that's the reason why she can't bring them back. Also I'm quite interested in why Nyx doesn't just use her death ray on Duncan to kill him. If that's her main offensive power and it's confirmed that he can ressurect the people she personally kills, why burn him down in the first place?
Anyway, that's the reasons I think that she is capable of restoring someone from nothing as long as she has preserve their soul. But you make a good point. The Gorgon one is very interesting and it's not like my arguments are fullproof.
However my suggestion of Truth still holds because even if she can't restore a body from nothing, she seems capable of restoring it despite the injuries suffered, which is in line with what Eisheth can do. It does open a possibility for Creation though, similar to how Deryl can regenerate flesh with his Elixir.
I mentioned this about Nyx and left the chance for Dark open, but it's not as clear cut. Nyx stops Michael's energy but not Tiffany's light. She only drains Tiffany when she catches her in her hand. This effect can easily be attributed to Power, similarly to how Michael is capable of absorbing energy and draining other Superhumans. Michael is just a level 2 so his draining effect wouldn't be that amazing anyway. Nyx on the other hand is an extremely advanced level 5, so if she has a similar power, it would be easy to apply it to Tiffany.
Dark is not out of the question, but since she has some similarities to Michael, I'd rather support this angle.
As for the Memory monster having a Dark component for the imitation, sure, it's a possibility, but the monster report mentions simple things like making Armor and a Sword from shadow material. It's quite a jump to extend this to using someone else's powers, especially when Xanthe sets a different precedent.
I won't rule it out completely, but I want to see how Langdon's powers work, which I attribute to the Dark too. If Langdon is capable of using a monster or superhuman body to it's full effect, then perhaps there is more to Dark than what I think.
Hmm, it's obvious that we view the Truth trait differently. In fact we seem to view it completely opposite.
To use your own examples, I think the Truth power is about letting the rock drop and deciding that the correct way to fall is up instead of down, which is probably why Eisheth has telekinetic powers in the first place. Inside Eisheth's domain, not every action has a reaction, rocks fall to the sky, not to the ground, Death is just a suggestion, not a fact. It's exactly what she says, "I decide what is Truth".
Your idea seems to me more like determinism. I like it but I can't observe it in the game in a form that will persuade me that's the case.
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