VN Ren'Py Superhuman [v0.991] [WeirdWorld]

[alkeera]

As far as things go otherwise, I can't help but think that the stakes got ramped up too high, and the only way for the world to not be awful to live in from here is what I mentioned before. Reset the status quo in terms of superhumans at least somewhat, limit their numbers, and get rid of all major scumbag players.
Otherwise, it will just be an eternal power struggle until humanity is wiped out and the remaining superhumans slowly die out or stop being human in any sense, which isn't much better. The MC still feels like a regular dude who is trying to have as normal life as possible amongst this madness, and man do I relate to that.

I can think of at least 5 ways WW could naratively deal with this problem.
1) Someone or something with insane level of power and authority takes over the world, starts to rule humanity and deals with chaos.
2) Send MC to some other world and continue story there.
3) Travel back in time where this problem doesn't exist yet.
4) New strong enemy for everyone emerges and they unite.
5) Fuck it. Chaos spreads. Law of The Jungle begins.

 

[Vitklim]

I can think of at least 5 ways WW could naratively deal with this problem.
1) Someone or something with insane level of power and authority takes over the world, starts to rule humanity and deals with chaos.
2) Send MC to some other world and continue story there.
3) Travel back in time where this problem doesn't exist yet.
4) New strong enemy for everyone emerges and they unite.
5) Fuck it. Chaos spreads. Law of The Jungle begins.

None of these solutions are any good unfortunately. Mostly because they rely on cheap cop-outs or because they are narratively unsatisfying.
1) and 5) are basically the bad ending, that people won't like, myself included. And that's important, because people want to have a good payoff, one that made the journey worth it.
4) is technically fine, but unsatisfying because it doesn't solve the future issues I outlined, and it would make no sense for the atrocities of either Ella or H.E.R.O. to be forgiven. Also, the world might be screwed afterwards anyway.
2) and 3) are very cheap escape routes. 2) would negate all the work that went into characters and plot, it's basically a nuke button for 90% of the work that came before. 3) is just lazy and much the same way, plus it doesn't solve the problems long-term.

The real skill of a writer is to not get themselves stuck in a corner in the first place, or be very skilled at maneuvering your way out of them without destroying previously established rules, or breaking audience immersion and investment. So far so good, but with stakes this high, it becomes hard to manage.

 

[alkeera]

None of these solutions are any good unfortunately. Mostly because they rely on cheap cop-outs or because they are narratively unsatisfying.
1) and 5) are basically the bad ending, that people won't like, myself included. And that's important, because people want to have a good payoff, one that made the journey worth it.
4) is technically fine, but unsatisfying because it doesn't solve the future issues I outlined, and it would make no sense for the atrocities of either Ella or H.E.R.O. to be forgiven. Also, the world might be screwed afterwards anyway.
2) and 3) are very cheap escape routes. 2) would negate all the work that went into characters and plot, it's basically a nuke button for 90% of the work that came before. 3) is just lazy and much the same way, plus it doesn't solve the problems long-term.

The real skill of a writer is to not get themselves stuck in a corner in the first place, or be very skilled at maneuvering your way out of them without destroying previously established rules, or breaking audience immersion and investment. So far so good, but with stakes this high, it becomes hard to manage.

I don't agree. They all sound boring because i simplifined them to one sentence each. All 5 can be interesting if writer is skillful, planned for this ahead and didn't just decide to do this on a whim or to drag a story more. There are other options which i didn't think of. For example some kind of MacGuffin which can also solve above-mentioned problem.

 

[Vitklim]

I don't agree. They all sound boring because i simplifined them to one sentence each. All 5 can be interesting if writer is skillful, planned for this ahead and didn't just decide to do this on a whim or to drag a story more. There are other options which i didn't think of. For example some kind of MacGuffin which can also solve above-mentioned problem.

I didn't say boring. That's not the issue with any of them.
But they come at the cost of negating previous groundwork, or giving an unsatisfying resolution to the story. Neither are good things to sacrifice.

And really, the problem comes down to the scale being too great for what we're dealing with. Any realistic consideration for consequences will mean that the world goes to shit because humans are not meant to have this much power. Everyone turns into superhumans - society is ruined and everything becomes wildly unstable. H.E.R.O wins the ensuing conflict against both Ella and monsters - congratulations, now not only is everyone going to become superhuman or die, but also you have an unstoppable tyrannical corp in charge. Ella or monsters win - Lmao, you may as well kill yourself now. Some unpredictable outcome where none of the above happen - if evolution 5 superhumans still exist, any of them, the world is still screwed because being able to ignore all laws of nature and a single individual having that much power is not going to end well.

You can sensibly resolve this, but it basically comes down to some form of the status quo I outlined earlier in the thread, else the world is going to be a cesspit that you can't really have a "happy" ending in.

 

[alkeera]

I didn't say boring. That's not the issue with any of them.
But they come at the cost of negating previous groundwork, or giving an unsatisfying resolution to the story. Neither are good things to sacrifice.

And really, the problem comes down to the scale being too great for what we're dealing with. Any realistic consideration for consequences will mean that the world goes to shit because humans are not meant to have this much power. Everyone turns into superhumans - society is ruined and everything becomes wildly unstable. H.E.R.O wins the ensuing conflict against both Ella and monsters - congratulations, now not only is everyone going to become superhuman or die, but also you have an unstoppable tyrannical corp in charge. Ella or monsters win - Lmao, you may as well kill yourself now. Some unpredictable outcome where none of the above happen - if evolution 5 superhumans still exist, any of them, the world is still screwed because being able to ignore all laws of nature and a single individual having that much power is not going to end well.

You can sensibly resolve this, but it basically comes down to some form of the status quo I outlined earlier in the thread, else the world is going to be a cesspit that you can't really have a "happy" ending in.

I still don't see how is it a bad thing. Making everything unstable just gives author more tools to work with and helps exploring game topics furhter. I just hope WW doesn't lose focus on MC too much. Also to my understanding the story is far from being concluded and it is still too early to talk about resolution.
And about happy endings - they are overrated. Personally i like duality or ambiguity. Oh, and fuck humanity tis nothing but a chain that binds me, stopping from unveiling secrets of the universe and becoming a greater being.

 

[Vitklim]

I still don't see how is it a bad thing. Making everything unstable just gives author more tools to work with and helps exploring game topics furhter. I just hope WW doesn't lose focus on MC too much. Also to my understanding the story is far from being concluded and it is still too early to talk about resolution.
And about happy endings - they are overrated. Personally i like duality or ambiguity. Oh, and fuck humanity tis nothing but a chain that binds me, stopping from unveiling secrets of the universe and becoming a greater being.

This might be too long of a discussion for this thread, but there is a reason the only exception I can think of to the rule of happy endings being preferable is tragedies. It goes to the core of most narrative structures and the reasons for why we like reading stories to begin with. The reason for why some formats or tropes are so cemented in fiction is because they work and people like them. They appeal to some part of human nature we all share.

As for humanity being nothing but a chain, once again, this isn't a good place for this, but no. Absolutely no. And I will literally just point to Bernhardt and Malik for case studies within just this game. Why would a "greater being" have a need of a wife or trusted companions? Because it's something that grants you the least sense of belonging and meaning. It's a human solution to a human problem. A mind severed from all limitations has no reason to act, so why would ascending beyond all limits be a desirable end goal if it leaves your existence utterly meaningless? It's why I consider any claim of superiority made by the superhumans (even powerful ones) in this story an utter lie, because their actions speak otherwise, by holding onto specifically human characteristics they have no reason to abide anymore.
Basically, in the scenario where this is possible, you have no idea what you're fucking with by trying to destroy the limits that have been placed on humans by the nature of what they are. And the likely consequences are not good.

 

[jthunderk89]

3) Travel back in time where this problem doesn't exist yet.

MC may not be able to real his power without giving himself away and would need to adopt a new look, likely one not too dissimilar from his regular state so that he can maintain it easier. He'd also need a new name, maybe something like Deus

 

[alkeera]

This might be too long of a discussion for this thread, but there is a reason the only exception I can think of to the rule of happy endings being preferable is tragedies. It goes to the core of most narrative structures and the reasons for why we like reading stories to begin with. The reason for why some formats or tropes are so cemented in fiction is because they work and people like them. They appeal to some part of human nature we all share.

As for humanity being nothing but a chain, once again, this isn't a good place for this, but no. Absolutely no. And I will literally just point to Bernhardt and Malik for case studies within just this game. Why would a "greater being" have a need of a wife or trusted companions? Because it's something that grants you the least sense of belonging and meaning. It's a human solution to a human problem. A mind severed from all limitations has no reason to act, so why would ascending beyond all limits be a desirable end goal if it leaves your existence utterly meaningless? It's why I consider any claim of superiority made by the superhumans (even powerful ones) in this story an utter lie, because their actions speak otherwise, by holding onto specifically human characteristics they have no reason to abide anymore.
Basically, in the scenario where this is possible, you have no idea what you're fucking with by trying to destroy the limits that have been placed on humans by the nature of what they are. And the likely consequences are not good.

Definition of "Happy" is different for everyone. For me "Happy ending" is a dead end, nothing will become better anymore, no future growth, only death awaits.

You just proved my point. Human mind is bound by selfmade definition of "meaning" which does not exist outside of our perception in the real world. And with our primitive restricted minds we can't see what other truths are out there.

 

[Vitklim]

Definition of "Happy" is different for everyone. For me "Happy ending" is a dead end, nothing will become better anymore, no future growth, only death awaits.

You just proved my point. Human mind is bound by selfmade definition of "meaning" which does not exist outside of our perception in the real world. And with our primitive restricted minds we can't see what other truths are out there.

All depends on the perspective. And the fundamental question is - why should a human take anything but a human perspective? And if the question is what makes a human, it would be origin and experience.

And yes, meaning is subjective to humans. As it would be to any other lifeform. You can't escape this as long as you're not literally god/universe. At which point you may as well not exist, as why would an omnipotent lifeform with no desires do anything at all? Basically, don't screw with things you don't understand, may end up far worse than you could imagine.

 

[alkeera]

All depends on the perspective. And the fundamental question is - why should a human take anything but a human perspective? And if the question is what makes a human, it would be origin and experience.

And yes, meaning is subjective to humans. As it would be to any other lifeform. You can't escape this as long as you're not literally god/universe. At which point you may as well not exist, as why would an omnipotent lifeform with no desires do anything at all? Basically, don't screw with things you don't understand, may end up far worse than you could imagine.

Why must a human continue being a human and take human perspective? In this game you can stray away from it beyond simply gaining superpowers and that is what i am committed to do in my playthrough.

What makes human a human? And what makes cat a cat? There is no need for those questions. They are all filled with meanings and labels hence they mislead you from gaining the truth.

My point was not that meaning is subjective (which i agree with) but that meaning does not exist at all.

 

[Bombmaster]

Why must a human continue being a human and take human perspective? In this game you can stray away from it beyond simply gaining superpowers and that is what i am committed to do in my playthrough.

What makes human a human? And what makes cat a cat? There is no need for this questions. They are all filled with meanings and labels hence they mislead you from gaining the truth.

My point was not that meaning is subjective (which i agree with) but that meaning does not exist at all.

A person is mortal. Therefore imperfect.
Then.
Evolving becoming something more, leaving humanity behind to new heights, worlds, sensations.

Why must a human continue being a human and take human perspective? In this game you can stray away from it beyond simply gaining superpowers and that is what i am committed to do in my playthrough.

What makes human a human? And what makes cat a cat? There is no need for those questions. They are all filled with meanings and labels hence they mislead you from gaining the truth.

My point was not that meaning is subjective (which i agree with) but that meaning does not exist at all.

 

[necromater]

I can think of at least 5 ways WW could naratively deal with this problem.
1) Someone or something with insane level of power and authority takes over the world, starts to rule humanity and deals with chaos.
2) Send MC to some other world and continue story there.
3) Travel back in time where this problem doesn't exist yet.
4) New strong enemy for everyone emerges and they unite.
5) Fuck it. Chaos spreads. Law of The Jungle begins.

I like the 5th one XD fuck it all.

 

[necromater]

Boy long time we had a debate this heavy. I think the question is not what is human?but what is a person? And is funny to find this here because is a porn game forum XD. That means that this game is that good or that we are weirdos most likely both ;P.

 

[alkeera]

Boy long time we had a debate this heavy. I think the question is not what is human?but what is a person? And is funny to find this here because is a porn game forum XD. That means that this game is that good or that we are weirdos most likely both ;P.

This game is attracting weirdos and filter out casuals.
Btw, if all those monsters are descended from humans then i riot.

 

[DrakoGhoul]

As funny as the monster solution would be, I'd rather the MC overpower the stupid limitations in the name of the harem.

As far as things go otherwise, I can't help but think that the stakes got ramped up too high, and the only way for the world to not be awful to live in from here is what I mentioned before. Reset the status quo in terms of superhumans at least somewhat, limit their numbers, and get rid of all major scumbag players.
Otherwise, it will just be an eternal power struggle until humanity is wiped out and the remaining superhumans slowly die out or stop being human in any sense, which isn't much better. The MC still feels like a regular dude who is trying to have as normal life as possible amongst this madness, and man do I relate to that.

I don't think there would be an eternal power struggle, personally. There's only like 13 known lvl 5 superhumans currently(12 from HERO and Ella). We know Hero doesn't know about the Numbered(on the surface) and treat monsters who are likely below them as major threats. If a Numbered and their S Rank kin wanted to, they could probably wipe out most of, if not all of, Hero and humanity. The way I see it, a status reset for supehumans wouldn't change anything. Like Xanthe said to Clark after he reached lvl 5, if the monsters actually worked together, they would wipe everyone out. The world is going to be awful no matter what because the monsters are also increasing in activity.

Even if we went with your suggestion and got rid of superhumans or limited them, the monsters would still be a threat. They exist beyond earth in other planes/realms/domains out there in the universe. Humanity still would fall prey to them and as far as we know, there's no way to get rid of them permanently. At least from a superhuman/humanity side of things. Even Nico would struggle to enter a domain of Hex, so without superhumans in general, humanity would still be at risk of annihilation from types out there. I'm not sure what WW has planned but only a power black hole, for the lack of a better way to say it, would save everyone. Where all of the monster power and their genes returned to their origin and disappeared altogether. Whether that be from a superhuman going around and taking all of the power within themselves before self detonating or the Dark God coming and doing it. Beyond that, limiting superhumans wouldn't actually help humanity as there would still be monsters out there.

This is just how I see it though. It would look different if I included the theories I have but I wanted to keep it somewhat grounded into the topic at hand. Until we get a grasp on the gap between lvl 5 superhumans and the Numbered, it seems a bit too early to say anyway. If the gap is as vast as I think it is between the 2 then it doesn't matter what humans and superhumans do, they'll lose in the end.

 

[X-Topic]

Demons of the Hearth
Moniker Smith's Bloodlines (Interesting story, but all of the vampires look like bimbos which kinda puts me off to it)
Eternum (Sort of)
Sicae
The DeLuca Family

Τry

Dreams of Desire
The Heiress

Also
Midnight Paradise was good but it is abandoned i believe... :/

 

[New Kid]

I don't think there would be an eternal power struggle, personally. There's only like 13 known lvl 5 superhumans currently(12 from HERO and Ella). We know Hero doesn't know about the Numbered(on the surface) and treat monsters who are likely below them as major threats. If a Numbered and their S Rank kin wanted to, they could probably wipe out most of, if not all of, Hero and humanity. The way I see it, a status reset for supehumans wouldn't change anything. Like Xanthe said to Clark after he reached lvl 5, if the monsters actually worked together, they would wipe everyone out. The world is going to be awful no matter what because the monsters are also increasing in activity.

Even if we went with your suggestion and got rid of superhumans or limited them, the monsters would still be a threat. They exist beyond earth in other planes/realms/domains out there in the universe. Humanity still would fall prey to them and as far as we know, there's no way to get rid of them permanently. At least from a superhuman/humanity side of things. Even Nico would struggle to enter a domain of Hex, so without superhumans in general, humanity would still be at risk of annihilation from types out there. I'm not sure what WW has planned but only a power black hole, for the lack of a better way to say it, would save everyone. Where all of the monster power and their genes returned to their origin and disappeared altogether. Whether that be from a superhuman going around and taking all of the power within themselves before self detonating or the Dark God coming and doing it. Beyond that, limiting superhumans wouldn't actually help humanity as there would still be monsters out there.

This is just how I see it though. It would look different if I included the theories I have but I wanted to keep it somewhat grounded into the topic at hand. Until we get a grasp on the gap between lvl 5 superhumans and the Numbered, it seems a bit too early to say anyway. If the gap is as vast as I think it is between the 2 then it doesn't matter what humans and superhumans do, they'll lose in the end.

Yeah, the monsters are actually the biggest problem... superhumans are the response to the monster threat after all, unless we get some reliable soldiers to fight against the monster faction it doesn't matter wheter Ella or HERO wins their little feud the monsters will still come for humanity and destroy/consume everything. The future after that will be bleak anyway because the tech to make superhumans already exists and is now public knowledge, also Ella was already changing people underground for quite a while so believing that it's possible to erradicate the superhumans when a serum or a pill is all that takes to make a new one at this point is an exercise in futility.

I think the best scenario we can hope for is that whoever wins in the end at least provide some shelter/protection for the people that didn't want to go superhuman, something in line with that number 1 possibility alkeera mentioned. Even in a chaotic world what the top dog says is law after all, maybe a MC with low corruption and high morality?

 

[mcmng]

Was just about to say that lmao. Ravager and this game are both on the same level of goddamn amazing. Only issue with it for me is that it actually allows you to be a bit too evil lol.

au contraire mon ami, more player agency is always welcome as long as it doesn't cause the game's scope to grow out of control.

1) Someone or something with insane level of power and authority takes over the world, starts to rule humanity and deals with chaos.

(Excuse the shitty cropping, I hastily edited the image using mspaint )

 

[ItzSyther]

Yeah, the monsters are actually the biggest problem... superhumans are the response to the monster threat after all, unless we get some reliable soldiers to fight against the monster faction it doesn't matter wheter Ella or HERO wins their little feud the monsters will still come for humanity and destroy/consume everything. The future after that will be bleak anyway because the tech to make superhumans already exists and is now public knowledge, also Ella was already changing people underground for quite a while so believing that it's possible to erradicate the superhumans when a serum or a pill is all that takes to make a new one at this point is an exercise in futility.

I think the best scenario we can hope for is that whoever wins in the end at least provide some shelter/protection for the people that didn't want to go superhuman, something in line with that number 1 possibility alkeera mentioned. Even in a chaotic world what the top dog says is law after all, maybe a MC with low corruption and high morality?

Something we can't rule out is the possibility of another group or rather, path. If I remember correctly, the MC can express not wanting to be controlled by HERO to his friends, and they agree with him (mostly Alice, I think), but they need to get stronger if they ever have hopes of getting under HERO's thumb.

I'd love to be able to fight against Ella and her goons and HERO via our own path where we ultimately decide our own fate and everyone else's, which it seems like Weird has laid down at least the idea of in the future.

We also have Jared's dad and whatever the heck he has going on with his group (although a lot of whatever he has is from Ella so it's probably all compromised if he ever considered wielding it against her).

I do wonder what the MC would do if they defeated Ella and HERO, lots of possibilities depending on the corruption/morality.

 

[Vitklim]

I don't think there would be an eternal power struggle, personally. There's only like 13 known lvl 5 superhumans currently(12 from HERO and Ella). We know Hero doesn't know about the Numbered(on the surface) and treat monsters who are likely below them as major threats. If a Numbered and their S Rank kin wanted to, they could probably wipe out most of, if not all of, Hero and humanity. The way I see it, a status reset for supehumans wouldn't change anything. Like Xanthe said to Clark after he reached lvl 5, if the monsters actually worked together, they would wipe everyone out. The world is going to be awful no matter what because the monsters are also increasing in activity.

Even if we went with your suggestion and got rid of superhumans or limited them, the monsters would still be a threat. They exist beyond earth in other planes/realms/domains out there in the universe. Humanity still would fall prey to them and as far as we know, there's no way to get rid of them permanently. At least from a superhuman/humanity side of things. Even Nico would struggle to enter a domain of Hex, so without superhumans in general, humanity would still be at risk of annihilation from types out there. I'm not sure what WW has planned but only a power black hole, for the lack of a better way to say it, would save everyone. Where all of the monster power and their genes returned to their origin and disappeared altogether. Whether that be from a superhuman going around and taking all of the power within themselves before self detonating or the Dark God coming and doing it. Beyond that, limiting superhumans wouldn't actually help humanity as there would still be monsters out there.

This is just how I see it though. It would look different if I included the theories I have but I wanted to keep it somewhat grounded into the topic at hand. Until we get a grasp on the gap between lvl 5 superhumans and the Numbered, it seems a bit too early to say anyway. If the gap is as vast as I think it is between the 2 then it doesn't matter what humans and superhumans do, they'll lose in the end.

I did mention at one point that the monster threat would have to be mitigated as well, at least to the level of them being highly uncommon occurrences which don't actually fuck up the world much. Sorry if that got overshadowed by other things.
I agree that this would have to be accounted for as well.