VN Ren'Py Superhuman [v0.999] [WeirdWorld]

[Tahxeol]

Of course, but I've recently been arguing that the closer an opposing force nears omnipotence, Skill takes a backseat to Power in order to deal with them.

The power level in it is lower than Superhuman, but I believe the comparison with Darwin Games still works.
In it, Greed (the BBEGs) has multiple lieutenants, two of which are Emulator and Witch.

Spoiler: Emulator

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Spoiler: Witch

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I would also like to add a strategy that Sylla almost used that tend to be neglected to win in the long term: the Joestar techique

Edit: Just checked, a better translation had their powers translated as (The universal function, Laplace) and (Destiny observation, Laplace), so it is inded the same power.

 

[DecadentDesires]

Just to help a little: you can stack multiple responses into one. This way you don't clutter (read "spam") the thread with a bunch of replies; that's why I think they approved banning some of your posts here. Because you just made 5-6 posts in a row, and that can be viewed as spamming the thread. Hope it helps.

Thanks. But actually, I didn't get reported for that actually. I got reported for posting a 10k word count post at once, showing all of my different theories. In fact, let's not give anyone any ideas, lmao.

 

[obibobi]

I would bet that no Superhuman has suffered more immense pain for extended periods of time than Ella! Not Cole, or even Nyx.

There is no basis for this, but either way, it really shouldn't matter, your robbing yourself of some of the stories enjoyment by making it a measuring contest, the character suffered and that's part of what shaped them, you don't need to measure it against another characters.

There's a joke where Michael tells the MC his backstory and the MC's seems mundane in comparison but that is used for humor, it doesn't mean its not important.

 

[DecadentDesires]

There is no basis for this, but either way, it really shouldn't matter, your robbing yourself of some of the stories enjoyment by making it a measuring contest, the character suffered and that's part of what shaped them, you don't need to measure it against another characters.

There's a joke where Michael tells the MC his backstory and the MC's seems mundane in comparison but that is used for humor, it doesn't mean its not important.

Oh, I was just making a observation. I agree. It does the rob the story of some of it's enjoyment. But I can't help that's just how my mind works like some people here who can't help but be peeved by the Weird World's strange monster weights while I can just ignore it entirely and chalk it up to WW is a human and sometimes, humans make mistakes. With that said, Ella's turning, suffering, mentoring and training has probably led to her seemingly being the most power obsessed character shown so far. The character who seems most wronged by those in power is the character who seems most obsessed with it.

It's like she seeks power in order to never be subjected to what she was in her past ever again. It's great character development. Perhaps others have suffered but as goes the old proverb, "Out of sight, out of mind."

 

[Snugglepuff]

Fine, I've made a oversight with the use of that word then. I get it now, I'll change my example then.

Only because you realise that not one example you could possibly give doesn't also have a requirement of needing skill in order to use power.

Who's in a superior position to win in a duel? The most skilled human mortal or Dr.Manhattan as originally written by Alan Moore in his comics, "Watchmen" ?

Dr Manhattan still had to train. He had to learn to wield his power.
The very first thing he learned, and it took him time to do so, was to reassemble his own body... Skill makes power both useful and usable.

I believe Ozymandias vs Dr. Manhattan was a good example of Power vs Skill.

Not in the overly simplistic context you've been attempting to restrict it to, now to the point of a human without any form of superpowers whatsoever going up against the closest thing to a god that Watchmen has to offer.

As for why your previously deleted post might have been deleted for spam, just look at how many posts you've flooded page 1334 with that are all individual replies, instead of multi-quoting.
Too many posts, too close together in time, is tantamount to spamming.

 

[DecadentDesires]

So the next arc is really truely the last one? It just feels ... way too soon

And there are still 2 evolutions and whatever possibly could come afterwards left :/ and it kind feels everyone but mc is now railroaded in shortcuts/different ways to get more powerful (and possibly faster) which im not this big of a fan of tbh

I feel like there so much left to explore, so many interesting characters but i guess it wont be explored this in deepth anymore

Agreed. There's a shit load of potential content left. With that said, this being the last Arc doesn't really mean that it can't just be a really long one.

 

[TheShelly]

Agreed. There's a shit load of potential content left. With that said, this being the last Arc doesn't really mean that it can't just be a really long one.

Ehh, WW has said multiple times on his streams that he will most likely make Superhuman 2, most likely not immediately after he finishes Superhuman 1. He does have other games he wants to make while taking a break from SH.

Then again, WW has also notoriously lied on stream many times and has said to never take anything he says for granted, so...

 

[Zolrazz]

Omnipresent, Omniscient, and Omnipotent, the one who is everywhere and nowhere, someone so stupidly powerful, that the mere fact of trying to understand his powers, is idiotic, the "GOD"

Said, I think that even the Apostles could and should train, but they don't because they are arrogant, each one of them represents an aspect of the universe, having brothers as powerful as themselves, they're not perfect or complete, they don't shape the universe, their will, because they don't have the power to do so, because, yes, a God, truly powerful, would do that without needing an avatar or anything like that

That said, for me skill and power are important

 

[sho33h3dj]

Oh, I was just making a observation. I agree. It does the rob the story of some of it's enjoyment. But I can't help that's just how my mind works like some people here who can't help but be peeved by the Weird World's strange monster weights while I can just ignore it entirely and chalk it up to WW is a human and sometimes, humans make mistakes. With that said, Ella's turning, suffering, mentoring and training has probably led to her seemingly being the most power obsessed character shown so far. The character who seems most wronged by those in power is the character who seems most obsessed with it.

It's like she seeks power in order to never be subjected to what she was in her past ever again. It's great character development. Perhaps others have suffered but as goes the old proverb, "Out of sight, out of mind."

Its probably not even that deep. Its a porn story, a great one, but at the end its just a story and not everything need to make sense.

Played through my first one. Like I said earlier, great story but often many unneccassary details to the narrative which made me scroll through some long sequences that wouldnt stop even though the purpose was done. And some fights were way too long *good though). Missed out on the sex events with Amber and Emily , so prob gonna restart and see how I missed that one. Maybe a second walkthrough will make me appreciate all the details more too who knows.

Whos everyone favorite girl in it. Mine must be Alice. Do I even need to say why lol. This is a great game for lovers and admirers of tits... D

 

[DecadentDesires]

Only because you realise that not one example you could possibly give doesn't also have a requirement of needing skill in order to use power.



Dr Manhattan still had to train. He had to learn to wield his power.
The very first thing he learned, and it took him time to do so, was to reassemble his own body... Skill makes power both useful and usable.



Not in the overly simplistic context you've been attempting to restrict it to, now to the point of a human without any form of superpowers whatsoever going up against the closest thing to a god that Watchmen has to offer.

As for why your previously deleted post might have been deleted for spam, just look at how many posts you've flooded page 1334 with that are all individual replies, instead of multi-quoting.
Too many posts, too close together in time, is tantamount to spamming.

It seems that you think I'm stating that Skill isn't important. It is. Power is just more important. You claim I use overly simplistic examples to get my point across, but those examples seems to be the only way I have to communicate my point to you. When you tell me that Dr.Manhattan had to train or learn to use his power, what it feels like you are telling me is that is being Dr.Manhattan in a duel with Ozymandias isn't preferable over vice versa even with limited training. I think that is a lie. A freshly born Dr. Manhattan would kill Ozymandias just like an Apostle would destroy any spawn regardless of how powerful or skilled they are.

Perhaps we differ on our meaning on the word, "Skill". To me, learning how to reassemble one's own body while being Dr. Manhattan is akin to five year old learning how to run. If having and using one's own common sense to survive and thrive is called Skill now, then I guess I'm wrong.


At this point, I think you just are refusing to concede that its better to be a ignorant and lazy god than a skilled and talented mortal and at this point, I'm done trying to convince you otherwise or trying to convince you to admit otherwise while knowing that divinity is superior to mortality.

It would seem that making people read my responses to others while looking for my response to them in my responses would be annoying. Maybe, I'm on my own for thinking that. You could end up skimming through five responses while looking for my response to you. This is kinda aforum limitation that Reddit and Stack Exchange solved. Perhaps, I should switch to multiquotes permanently(I have used them in a post before in case anyone thinks otherwise.) That removed post was a post I made at least an hour before my last post so it definitely wasn't for quick post succession.

With that said, I do thank you for your responses, but this is getting in the time wasting zone for both of us. You believe what you want and I what I want and that's that.

 

[DecadentDesires]

Its probably not even that deep. Its a porn story, a great one, but at the end its just a story and not everything need to make sense.

Played through my first one. Like I said earlier, great story but often many unneccassary details to the narrative which made me scroll through some long sequences that wouldnt stop even though the purpose was done. And some fights were way too long *good though). Missed out on the sex events with Amber and Emily , so prob gonna restart and see how I missed that one. Maybe a second walkthrough will make me appreciate all the details more too who knows.

Whos everyone favorite girl in it. Mine must be Alice. Do I even need to say why lol. This is a great game for lovers and admirers of tits... D

Ella's probably one of the most developed characters in this VN, if not the most, it actually is probably that deep,

 

[sho33h3dj]

Ella's probably one of the most developed characters in this VN, if not the most, it actually is probably that deep,

Well lets see what happens then maybe youre right who knows

 

[Hobocop Harrier du bois]

I wonder if Superhuman 2 would have a different mc and different powers. Like Instead of shapeshifting, he'd have soulstealing and he can integrate parts of his enemies soul into himself and gain their powers. Maybe even keep a few souls as his pets and call them out when he needs.

 

[DecadentDesires]

Said, I think that even the Apostles could and should train, but they don't because they are arrogant, each one of them represents an aspect of the universe, having brothers as powerful as themselves, they're not perfect or complete, they don't shape the universe, their will, because they don't have the power to do so, because, yes, a God, truly powerful, would do that without needing an avatar or anything like that

That said, for me skill and power are important

Apostles could and should train. Agreed. I would train as an Apostle skill and power simply due to my knowledge that they are others like me in existence, related or otherwise. Zolrazz, I will say this, though, you can't actually say that the apostles don't train. They very well might. I would just argue nobody is beating an Apostle unless they are or empowered by another Apostle, The Eye, an Arbiter, or something divine like those Parasitic Gods. Mortals aren't beating the Divine by their lonesome. Only the most lazy, and incompetent deities could allow such a thing to happen. They would literally have to be mentally challenged.

Now, I would argue that there's some type of creator god likely involved in the universe of Superhuman. As Deryl stated, the same exact species(nearly) existing throughout the entire universe in different planets in different galaxies seems extremely unlikely unless such an entity existed. This supposed being would likely have to be as powerful or superior to the Apostles to set the stage for the Apostles turning of humans on worlds or conquering of worlds.

Now if you ask what I train with my MC, I go for the biggest percentage improvements I can when choosing to train Power Or Skill. My MC's mixed. I missed out on alot of power because I either refused to engage in deeply immoral behavior and/or take unnecessary risks.

 

[DecadentDesires]

Alice better be pregnant as heck when she returns.

I hope not. Prefer her to be completely capable of fighting unrestrained and totally prefer to choose whether or not if the MC has kids in the end. Love being a Child Free harem having bachelor.

 

[Zekethor]

Omnipresent, Omniscient, and Omnipotent, the one who is everywhere and nowhere, someone so stupidly powerful, that the mere fact of trying to understand his powers, is idiotic, the "GOD"

Said, I think that even the Apostles could and should train, but they don't because they are arrogant, each one of them represents an aspect of the universe, having brothers as powerful as themselves, they're not perfect or complete, they don't shape the universe, their will, because they don't have the power to do so, because, yes, a God, truly powerful, would do that without needing an avatar or anything like that

That said, for me skill and power are important

View attachment 4763866

Honestly, I can't really imagine entities that represent the foundations of reality actually 'training.' That almost feels a bit childish to picture, to be honest. I can imagine them being deceived, misled, hating, etc. (That’s because even if they are the ultimate embodiment of what they represent like creation, destruction, power, authority, etc. they must still fail in other areas outside their domains, like desire, emotions, or even having limited knowledge in a certain sense.) But the idea of them 'training' the very power they are supposed to embody in its most complete form feels... strange.

 

[Snugglepuff]

It seems that you think I'm stating that Skill isn't important. It is. Power is just more important.

Ah, so now your argument has changed.
No, power is not more important than skill. Skill is a requirement for power to be properly used.

You claim I use overly simplistic examples to get my point across

You do, and you do it without fully thinking them through beforehand.

but those examples seems to be the only way I have to communicate my point to you.

That's your failing, not mine.
Yours for starting off with "Power is all that matters" and exemplifying with God and then the ludicrous "Dr Manhattan vs Ozymandias", before changing your argument to "No no, Power is just more important than skill, not that skill isn't needed".

When you tell me that Dr.Manhattan had to train or learn to use his power, what it feels like you are telling me is that is being Dr.Manhattan in a duel with Ozymandias isn't preferable over vice versa even with limited training.

What you "feel like" I'm telling you is not the same as what I was telling you.

I think that is a lie.

A freshly born Dr. Manhattan would kill Ozymandias just like an Apostle would destroy any spawn regardless of how powerful or skilled they are.

No, a freshly born Dr Manhattan couldn't kill Ozymandias.
He would literally be a baby called Johnathan Osterman. Think before you write...

Perhaps we differ on our meaning on the word, "Skill".

Yes, you don't understand what it means.

To me, learning how to reassemble one's own body while being Dr. Manhattan is akin to five year old learning how to run.

Something else you're wrong about then.

If having and using one's own common sense to survive and thrive is called Skill now, then I guess I'm wrong.

Here you're showing that you don't even know what common sense is by comparing it to not only a fictional character learning how to use his powers over time, but also showing a lack of the necessary understanding that goes with common sense by comparing it a child learning to walk.

At this point, I think you just are refusing to concede that its better to be a ignorant and lazy god than a skilled and talented mortal and at this point

At no point did I partake of your stupid little "who would win in a fight" example, only justifiably criticise it and you for using it in the first place.

I'm done trying to convince you otherwise or trying to convince you to admit otherwise while knowing that divinity is superior to mortality.

Now you've gone from "Power is better than skill" to "God is better than man"... Those are literally different arguments and you're incredibly disingenuous in your argument.

You could end up skimming through five responses while looking for my response to you.

No, I'd be taken straight to your response to me, just like I have every time you've replied to me. The same way everyone else knows when you've replied to them.
The exact same way you know when I've replied to you...

Try harder to sound magnanimous next time.

Perhaps, I should switch to multiquotes permanently(I have used them in a post before in case anyone thinks otherwise.)

It would definitely cut down on your reply spam.

 

[DecadentDesires]

Ah, so now your argument has changed.
No, power is not more important than skill. Skill is a requirement for power to be properly used.



You do, and you do it without fully thinking them through beforehand.



That's your failing, not mine.
Yours for starting off with "Power is all that matters" and exemplifying with God and then the ludicrous "Dr Manhattan vs Ozymandias", before changing your argument to "No no, Power is just more important than skill, not that skill isn't needed".



What you "feel like" I'm telling you is not the same as what I was telling you.






No, a freshly born Dr Manhattan couldn't kill Ozymandias.
He would literally be a baby called Johnathan Osterman. Think before you write...




Yes, you don't understand what it means.



Something else you're wrong about then.



Here you're showing that you don't even know what common sense is by comparing it to not only a fictional character learning how to use his powers over time, but also showing a lack of the necessary understanding that goes with common sense by comparing it a child learning to walk.



At no point did I partake of your stupid little "who would win in a fight" example, only justifiably criticise it and you for using it in the first place.



Now you've gone from "Power is better than skill" to "God is better than man"... Those are literally different arguments and you're incredibly disingenuous in your argument.



No, I'd be taken straight to your response to me, just like I have every time you've replied to me. The same way everyone else knows when you've replied to them.
The exact same way you know when I've replied to you... View attachment 4764089

Try harder to sound magnanimous next time.



It would definitely cut down on your reply spam.

Thanks for the info.

Power>Skill unless the Power difference isn't big enough. It's kinda like, "Who would win in a MMA fight, the most skilled flyweight vs a Cole tier heavyweight?"


The answer is Heavyweight. I don't care if the flyweight is Mighty Fucking Mouse. They are being snuffed out. You switch out the word "flyweight" to "bantamweight" chances of success for the weaker opponent increases, and so on for smaller weight class difference.


At a certain lack of power difference, Skill becomes much more important. A much more skilled Light Heavyweight would beat the shit out of bum Heavyweight. A Middleweight of the same skill would still win, but not as easily. A welterweight, maybe. Lightweight, hell no. If BJ Penn couldn't do it, it probably can't be done.


Now, determining how Weird World calculates thiss accurately in his story world would improbable without his input,


What should a agent in the world of Superhuman seek to improve as a Superhuman?


Depends on one's goals and circumstances. Sometimes, skill is better. Sometimes, power. But there's seems to be a limit on how powerful one can become while remaining "uncorrupted". If you have a problem with being corrupted, you should focus on skill, typically, but not always. Essentially, go for Power when there's lack of corruption and the math makes sense. What do I mean about the math making sense?


I'll explain.



I personally go for the superior percentage increases in game.



For example



Let's say there's a reward of 50 Power and 10 Skill. 50 Power sounds better without knowing current stats but let's say that your current stats is 500 Power and 30 Skill. 50 Power would be an increase of power by 10% and 10 Skill would be an increase of skill by 33.33% percent.


In that case, I'm going for the Skill boost.


It is like BenoTF25 suggested you need both. Crossfit train both of them as much as possible. Don't be a Cole.

Let me put your knowledge to use. The above is my original argument that Power is Superior to Skill but both are important from more than two weeks ago. My argument was never that skill wasn't important.


Your quote of me quoting that "Power being all that matters" is me discussing omnipotent or near omnipotent deities over skilled and talented mortals. In those conflicts, power would be all that matters. The only way a mortal is beating deities is by the deity self destructing or harming, deities being plagued abulia or being mentally challenged or by being part deity such as MC. Technically, all of the Chosen, their Monster Creations and their Spawn are part deity if you view the Apostles as divine.


Yes, I stated that Power is better than Skill and stand by it. I also stated that God is better than Man and stand by it. God represents Power in my example and Man represents Skill. When that didn't seem to get my point across, I switched to Dr,Manhattan would beat Ozymandias in a duel to the death. In that example, Dr. Manhattan represents power and Ozymandias represents Skill.


You admitted that, and I quote,


"At no point did I partake of your stupid little "who would win in a fight" example, only justifiably criticize it and you for using it in the first place.

"


That's because you know and everyone else does that's logical Ozy isn't beating Dr.Manhattan in a duel in any reasonable time frame and neither is Man beating God. Nor will either allow either to develop for insanely long times in order to even become a threat.

I said multiple times to multiple people that Skill is important. To me, you seem to equate Skill to simply not being mentally challenged. A bird flying isn't skill. It's simply doing what a bird does.

Perhaps, I'm wrong for not praising a five year old for running, Dr. Manhattan for reassembling himself, a boxer for knowing to not spam jabs while doing nothing else or a bird for flying. Guess, I'm just too much of an elitist for that to register to me as being skilled. I've already stated that perhaps my definition of Skill is too strict.


A god using his natural power to me is no more praiseworthy than a human adult male throwing a badly formed punch, or someone literate deciding to read.

Hyberbole is figurative language and I'm allowed to use figurative language in a argument. How you feel about that is how you feel.


Your argument that Skill is as important as Power hasn't even been given one direct example outside of the moron Cole Yun. Cole Yun was a special case of stupidity, and arrogance unlikely to ever be duplicated in game. You think MC would've beaten Cole if you given almost anybody else his power and abilities? Heck, no. Only an absolute moron and/or coward could've messed up all his advantages in that fight.

Honestly, I can't really imagine entities that represent the foundations of reality actually 'training.' That almost feels a bit childish to picture, to be honest. I can imagine them being deceived, misled, hating, etc. (That’s because even if they are the ultimate embodiment of what they represent like creation, destruction, power, authority, etc. they must still fail in other areas outside their domains, like desire, emotions, or even having limited knowledge in a certain sense.) But the idea of them 'training' the very power they are supposed to embody in its most complete form feels... strange.

Do they represent foundations of reality or are they simply thought of as such? Has this been confirmed by Weird World? For all we know, they can be created entities serving a greater, more powerful entity? It's possible that these Apostles have had to work or at the very least experiment, to master their powers and that their powers are based on said specific domains, but they aren't exactly those domains personified perfectly. We know that some process at the very least or someone at the most, created the Superhuman universe and prefilled certain planets with humanoids without any input from the Apostles.

 

[Zolrazz]

I wonder if Superhuman 2 would have a different mc and different powers. Like Instead of shapeshifting, he'd have soulstealing and he can integrate parts of his enemies soul into himself and gain their powers. Maybe even keep a few souls as his pets and call them out when he needs.

No, it's going to be the continuation of this one, I don't see a weird doing that, not least because it would be a lot of work and he'd try to avoid it

Honestly, I can't really imagine entities that represent the foundations of reality actually 'training.' That almost feels a bit childish to picture, to be honest. I can imagine them being deceived, misled, hating, etc. (That’s because even if they are the ultimate embodiment of what they represent like creation, destruction, power, authority, etc. they must still fail in other areas outside their domains, like desire, emotions, or even having limited knowledge in a certain sense.) But the idea of them 'training' the very power they are supposed to embody in its most complete form feels... strange.

I agree, it would be strange, but I said that because in the end, although they are extremely powerful, they are not omnipotent. In fact, we know very little about them, especially the real extent of their powers, maybe they train, maybe they feel emotions, maybe they care about their chosen ones, their true children, at the moment all we have are theories and questions

 

[Dipasimaan]

Shit, didn't think I'd ever see such an idiotic argument about skill and power that uses Watchmen as examples...