VN Ren'Py Where the Heart Is [S1 Rev1] [CheekyGimp]

[LionHeart 95]

BIG BIG NEWS !!!!!

You must be registered to see the links

You must be registered to see the links

Unlocked

You must be registered to see the links

Hi folks,

I know I said that I hoped the last DEV update would be my final one before Episode 24 is released, but I wanted to drop a quick note, so I'm not keeping you in the dark. I have now finished everything except the very final sex scene. Writing the last scene (in the comedy club) ended up taking quite a bit longer than initially planned as I ended up resolving a few threads that I was initially planning on pushing to episode 25. But with these extra loose ends tied up in episode 24, I think it will be a cleaner episode. Anyway...hoping to get the sex scene finished tonight or tomorrow and then some testing. But it'll just be the final scene that needs testing. Everything else has been fully tested. So we are down to days, not weeks. Still on track for September!

Thanks,

CG

 

[ename144]

I thought we weren't meant to have any harem routes from what i read other people say just solo and maybe a throuple

AFAICT, the infamous lack of harem routes to have been more about misdirecting the audience than a genuine game design goal. WtHI won't be a harem in the technical sense (you won't be able to romance *all* the girls openly), but based on Episode 23 it sure seems like you will be able to romance a very large subset of them openly, and if the recent dev comments are to be believed you can romance most of the rest in secret. My guess is there will be a few mutually exclusive options and the rest will either be a mini-harem or viable side-girls to said harem (though with Katie and Jenna seemingly part of the harem, I'm not sure exactly who will be forbidden).

Basically, the game is less a dating simulator than it is a cheating simulator. The player was expected to pursue as many girls as possible as long as possible, and only at the very end would he need to take steps to cut losses (either by ending affairs at the right time, or by dropping careful hints to condition the girls to the harem). Trying to find the path that would minimize the number of breakups needed was the main challenge of the game. We can pursue fewer girls if we prefer and the game will try to accommodate us (sort of like a built-in easy mode), but it's clearly not the intended path.

As game designs go this is perfectly reasonable, but it *is* quite different than what I was expecting after all the warnings about the game not being a harem.

 

[Quaszog55]

You can rewrite the question in why should the player be communicated anything? this is a dating sim, at the end of the day, not a spread sheet excel exercise. Idea is to play as you see fit, not counting choice by choice.

Because as someone who plays Tomboy Mono-route right now. Understanding game mechanics would actually help me have more fun.

SuS Points are Hidden and Kept Tracking even for Love Interests you Deselected!
So Tomboy gets Jelly on THOT and NOT MOM (+3 other variables ) even on Tomboys Mono-route and might already reached critical mass before you converted to Mono sorry I check out on this one.
​

I would expect most players to understand "fuck sister of tomboy while dating tomboy -> tomboy gets mad". Might not be a perfect if A then B, but something around the lines, with 95% probability, A implies B.

If THOT Could NOT be added as a voyeur option Later despite being deselected and wouldn't be offering to be cuck-quean from get go...
and Lily and Bi-FF wouldn't offer to share with Tomboy outright...

...then everything you just said would make total sense. But the narrative marks clear routes with flood-lights and disco-balls and the mechanics are RNGesus Divine Smite on Crack.

As horrny said, no harem. Actions and consequences. Try to fuck everything that moves, everything will fuck you back. As simple as that. Just probably not in the way you are expecting... sorry

You guys are a flying circus. NON of the examples I made are a Fuck ALL: Full Selection. Nor is that my problem with the game mechanics.

1) TOMBOY + THOT + One BFF ARE presented through the narrative as a Route.
2) NOT MOM + Tomboy + THOT is not ALL-Harem. Are the first three choices given in the game for ages other than Jo.
3) Lily + one BFF + Carnival Girl? Former two and latter aren't even in the same Plot Archs.

Do not tell me any of you played Celibate until Bella, Elaine or Theresa came along. I picked Jo as my Final Girl on the first play through and am still convinced it was best choice.

Basically, the game is less a dating simulator than it is a cheating simulator. The player was expected to pursue as many girls as possible as long as possible, and only at the very end would he need to take steps to cut losses (either by ending affairs at the right time, or by dropping careful hints to condition the girls to the harem). Trying to find the path that would minimize the number of breakups needed was the main challenge of the game. We can pursue fewer girls if we prefer and the game will try to accommodate us (sort of like a built-in easy mode), but it's clearly not the intended path.

As game designs go this is perfectly reasonable, but it *is* quite different than what I was expecting after all the warnings about the game not being a harem.

That kinda is my vibe as well. Playing the game becomes a headache. Evil Dad sounds much smarter now.
However I raise by saying that the Cheating/Caught mechanic even trips you if you do not cheat with the entire rooster thanks to it being Hidden and Bonkers.

 

[Ayhsel]

Because as someone who plays Tomboy Mono-route right now. Understanding game mechanics would actually help me have more fun.

SuS Points are Hidden and Kept Tracking even for Love Interests you Deselected!
So Tomboy gets Jelly on THOT and NOT MOM even on Tomboys Mono-route sorry I check out on this one.​

What you are saying is this: I like to know exactly what each character is thinking and what can happen with each decision before making any decision.

This is NOT the purpose of the game. Moreover, if that was the case, you would necessarily need to wait until the game is finished. After all, this is a game IN development. No decisions need to be final.

If THOT Could NOT be added as a voyeur option Later despite being deselected and wouldn't be offering to be cuck-quean from get go...
and Lily and Bi-FF wouldn't offer to share with Tomboy outright...

...then everything you just said would make total sense. But the narrative marks clear routes with flood-lights and disco-balls and the mechanics are RNGesus Divine Smite on Crack.

Literal understanding: As far as I remember, there is no RNG, is there? I cannot confirm or deny this, as I don't know. Yet I don't believe there is.

If you are not doing a literal understanding, then once again, you are missing the point of a game. You are NOT supposed to know in advance how every decision affects you. That is why loads are, that is why ctrl are.

Also, again I might be mistaken as my memory sucks, but my understanding is that this games does not force any girl on the player. So, assuming that assumption is true (if it is not please disregard my conclusion), you adding girls and sharing is your responsibility

You guys are a flying circus. NON of the examples I made are a Fuck ALL: Full Selection. Nor is that my problem with the game mechanics.

1) TOMBOY + THOT + One BFF ARE presented through the narrative as a Route.
2) NOT MOM + Tomboy + THOT is not ALL-Harem. Are the first three choices given in the game for ages other than Jo.
3) Lily + one BFF + Carnival Girl? Former two and latter aren't even in the same Plot Archs.

Do not tell me any of you played Celibate until Bella, Elaine or Theresa came along. I picked Jo as my Final Girl on the first play through and am still convinced it was best choice.

Doesn't change the fact, that the game just collapses around update 22 either.

It is literally YOUR problem with the game mechanics, as it is you the one that is complaining about the game mechanics.

As I mentioned several times before, you are not supposed to know in advance what lies ahead. And, also, from a technical point of view, creating as many combinations and paths are possible is not a simple task. The number of combinations explodes very fast. So be glad you have something more complex that simple mono routes. Everything extra is just icing on the cake.

PS: I am not playing celibate, I simply know I will be fucked. Just like in life when you are a cheating bastard and they get to learn. As simple as that.

 

[JackMiejov]

There is no way without Dev Console = True, to run your initial Harem Choices successful, other then Mono-routes

I never used the console and I stopped looking at the scores after about Ep14. It was almost trivial for MC to get and keep all of the girls through Ep21. In Ep22, MC could still keep all of the girls just by making the most obvious dialogue choices, although it was easier to get caught. There was a known bug that wouldn't let MC keep Lily and Katie during the date with Lily and I don't know if the fixed version was ever uploaded to F95. In Ep23, it was again trivial to keep all of the girls until the final cliffhanger scene when Katie discovers MC kissing Jenna. Of course, with those choices, I am fully expecting Ep24 to be a warzone and I plan to use the "Start Any Episode" feature to try different paths after it all blows up in my face.

 

[acewinz]

Spoiler: Text Crit over 9k

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

I don't know how the walkthrough navigates it, but it is somewhat common sense. If you lie and cheat a lot, you start building Sus (suspicion), especially if you make poor dialog choices (but sometimes even when you don't). Sometimes this will result in 2 girls you are romantic with starting a fight that makes things (Sus) worse. Then near the end of the game with few exceptions, your overall Suspicion can end relationships (because you aren't trustworthy, that is when you see them all coming into play vs overall relationship scores). But this isn't the only bullets that come at you. There is also some major choices that can result in unforgivable situations, (score may not save you or even be checked) like getting you caught cheating and no groundwork laid to bail yourself out, but those are often avoidable, especially up till the end. The best I think you are looking for is when Cheeky/Cell complete the game I imagine there will be far more plain paths/variations of the girls who will be compatible together in the end.

Spoiler: To Whom it May Concern

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

Cheating simulator (optional) is a good description.

 

[felicemastronzo]

a mirage!!!

 

[Dessolos]

There is no way without Dev Console = True, to run your initial Harem Choices successful, other then Mono-routes

Honestly just like what [B] JackMiejov[/B] replied to you I had no issue as well on my first blind playthrough. Only times I ever got caught or fucked up I did on purpose just to see the full scene and all the dialogue and reload to my original choice. Granted I did not peruse Monica,Zhara,Lilly or Debbie as I was not interested in them.

 

[sorco2003]

I don't know how the walkthrough navigates it, but it is somewhat common sense. If you lie and cheat a lot, you start building Sus (suspicion), especially if you make poor dialog choices (but sometimes even when you don't). Sometimes this will result in 2 girls you are romantic with starting a fight that makes things (Sus) worse. Then near the end of the game with few exceptions, your overall Suspicion can end relationships (because you aren't trustworthy, that is when you see them all coming into play vs overall relationship scores). But this isn't the only bullets that come at you. There is also some major choices that can result in unforgivable situations, (score may not save you or even be checked) like getting you caught cheating and no groundwork laid to bail yourself out, but those are often avoidable, especially up till the end. The best I think you are looking for is when Cheeky/Cell complete the game I imagine there will be far more plain paths/variations of the girls who will be compatible together in the end.

Spoiler: To Whom it May Concern

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

I didn't even read what you wrote, but it's great to see you back here!

 

[Blueray]

BIG BIG NEWS !!!!!

You must be registered to see the links

You must be registered to see the links

Unlocked

You must be registered to see the links

Hi folks,

I know I said that I hoped the last DEV update would be my final one before Episode 24 is released, but I wanted to drop a quick note, so I'm not keeping you in the dark. I have now finished everything except the very final sex scene. Writing the last scene (in the comedy club) ended up taking quite a bit longer than initially planned as I ended up resolving a few threads that I was initially planning on pushing to episode 25. But with these extra loose ends tied up in episode 24, I think it will be a cleaner episode. Anyway...hoping to get the sex scene finished tonight or tomorrow and then some testing. But it'll just be the final scene that needs testing. Everything else has been fully tested. So we are down to days, not weeks. Still on track for September!

Thanks,

CG

Does that mean it well be done be for Oct?

 

[BeingADikDik]

BIG BIG NEWS !!!!!

You must be registered to see the links

You must be registered to see the links

Unlocked

You must be registered to see the links

Hi folks,

I know I said that I hoped the last DEV update would be my final one before Episode 24 is released, but I wanted to drop a quick note, so I'm not keeping you in the dark. I have now finished everything except the very final sex scene. Writing the last scene (in the comedy club) ended up taking quite a bit longer than initially planned as I ended up resolving a few threads that I was initially planning on pushing to episode 25. But with these extra loose ends tied up in episode 24, I think it will be a cleaner episode. Anyway...hoping to get the sex scene finished tonight or tomorrow and then some testing. But it'll just be the final scene that needs testing. Everything else has been fully tested. So we are down to days, not weeks. Still on track for September!

Thanks,

CG

Cheeky just has to render librarian + captain MILF threesome and we're done, woooooooo!

 

[Quaszog55]

What you are saying is this: I like to know exactly what each character is thinking and what can happen with each decision before making any decision.

This is NOT the purpose of the game. Moreover, if that was the case, you would necessarily need to wait until the game is finished. After all, this is a game IN development. No decisions need to be final.


Literal understanding: As far as I remember, there is no RNG, is there? I cannot confirm or deny this, as I don't know. Yet I don't believe there is.

If you are not doing a literal understanding, then once again, you are missing the point of a game. You are NOT supposed to know in advance how every decision affects you. That is why loads are, that is why ctrl are.

Also, again I might be mistaken as my memory sucks, but my understanding is that this games does not force any girl on the player. So, assuming that assumption is true (if it is not please disregard my conclusion), you adding girls and sharing is your responsibility


It is literally YOUR problem with the game mechanics, as it is you the one that is complaining about the game mechanics.

As I mentioned several times before, you are not supposed to know in advance what lies ahead. And, also, from a technical point of view, creating as many combinations and paths are possible is not a simple task. The number of combinations explodes very fast. So be glad you have something more complex that simple mono routes. Everything extra is just icing on the cake.

PS: I am not playing celibate, I simply know I will be fucked. Just like in life when you are a cheating bastard and they get to learn. As simple as that.

I will shorten your answer for you:

You don't care how the game works.

Good for you. So why are you bother answering?

You don't care how the game plays.

Good for you. So why bother playing?

You don't care if you waste your time.

Good for you. Other people's time is more precious however.

Followed up by: If the out of 20~ characters a three character subset, which is advertised as possible from early development, turns out to be improbable to achieve because the Game Mechanics Make No Sense. That is a problem because my time for having fun is a limited resource.

And there are other games one could support or play instead.

But always good to know that some people will feel personally attacked if a thing they like is criticized and go Ad Hominem the messenger. Lest we could all learn to become better devs or worse players. (Luckily we had JackMiejov on the case )

I never used the console and I stopped looking at the scores after about Ep14. It was almost trivial for MC to get and keep all of the girls through Ep21. In Ep22, MC could still keep all of the girls just by making the most obvious dialogue choices, although it was easier to get caught. There was a known bug that wouldn't let MC keep Lily and Katie during the date with Lily and I don't know if the fixed version was ever uploaded to F95. In Ep23, it was again trivial to keep all of the girls until the final cliffhanger scene when Katie discovers MC kissing Jenna. Of course, with those choices, I am fully expecting Ep24 to be a warzone and I plan to use the "Start Any Episode" feature to try different paths after it all blows up in my face.

Funny thing is, that until Episode 22 you could ignore them as they made no difference. But the Sus scores of all girls are checked against several times with Tomboy (and probably Monica, too), even if checked girls are deselected as LI.

Makes it a pain to keep her if you drop relevant LIs too late. They should no longer be factored in, no point in replaying half the episodes to get points right. I know what I wanted from some point or other.

Guess the Episode jumper / quickstart might be the new way the game is played.
To be fair I played from the first builds. So any saved score might be a mile of if the numbers crunch different from one build to the next. Quickstart might harmonize them.

Heureka!

 

[Ayhsel]

I will shorten your answer for you:

You don't care how the game works.

Good for you. So why are you bother answering?

You don't care how the game plays.

Good for you. So why bother playing?

You don't care if you waste your time.

Good for you. Other people's time is more precious however.

Followed up by: If the out of 20~ characters a three character subset, which is advertised as possible from early development, turns out to be improbable to achieve because the Game Mechanics Make No Sense. That is a problem because my time for having fun is a limited resource.

And there are other games one could support or play instead.

But always good to know that some people will feel personally attacked if a thing they like is criticized and go Ad Hominem the messenger. Lest we could all learn to become better devs or worse players. (Luckily we had JackMiejov on the case )

For someone calling fallacies by their latin names you clearly made a few.

First, I never said myself I didn't care how the game works. Simply that I will not JUDGE a game for it's mechanics when they are are standard mechanics on a game. That would be like playing GTA and complaining I get killed by the polices for stealing a car.

Second, I do care how the game plays. The difference between you and I is that for me the game is not simply "winning or losing", as you seem to imply. I am, if you will for a lack of better term, roleplaying, not trying to get an ending. If my character is a total douchebag and ends up dead, I have still enjoyed the game. Simple as that.

I do care if I waste my time. But who said that playing a game is wasting my time? You are jumping to conclusions on things that are neither stated nor true.

You having a limited time game is your problem. Once again, the game is not finished. As far as we know, game might not even be finished, so whether a promised mechanic is feasible or not is hard to say until later. If this happens to AAA games, it is not unexpected that it will happen to a random game made in Rempy.

By the way, where were those "sets of three" advertised as possible explicitly? I really have no idea, simply making sure that did happen.

PS: we all have limited time. And we are wasting it on a forum... not the smartest choice, to be honest.

 

[Harlaw]

For someone calling fallacies by their latin names you clearly made a few.

First, I never said myself I didn't care how the game works. Simply that I will not JUDGE a game for it's mechanics when they are are standard mechanics on a game. That would be like playing GTA and complaining I get killed by the polices for stealing a car.

Second, I do care how the game plays. The difference between you and I is that for me the game is not simply "winning or losing", as you seem to imply. I am, if you will for a lack of better term, roleplaying, not trying to get an ending. If my character is a total douchebag and ends up dead, I have still enjoyed the game. Simple as that.

I do care if I waste my time. But who said that playing a game is wasting my time? You are jumping to conclusions on things that are neither stated nor true.

You having a limited time game is your problem. Once again, the game is not finished. As far as we know, game might not even be finished, so whether a promised mechanic is feasible or not is hard to say until later. If this happens to AAA games, it is not unexpected that it will happen to a random game made in Rempy.

PS: we all have limited time. And we are wasting it on a forum... not the smartest choice, to be honest.

By the way, where were those "sets of three" advertised as possible explicitly? I really have no idea, simply making sure that did happen.

Honestly, you're probably wasting your time arguing with someone who is operating on a very different wavelength than you.

I have read their posts multiple times and I can't make much sense of it. It's made up of a bunch of statements that are factually correct on their own, even if phrased in a rather eccentric manner, but lead up to an almost non sequitur conclusion.

 

[StopMeIfYouCan]

I don't know how the walkthrough navigates it, but it is somewhat common sense. If you lie and cheat a lot, you start building Sus (suspicion), especially if you make poor dialog choices (but sometimes even when you don't). Sometimes this will result in 2 girls you are romantic with starting a fight that makes things (Sus) worse. Then near the end of the game with few exceptions, your overall Suspicion can end relationships (because you aren't trustworthy, that is when you see them all coming into play vs overall relationship scores). But this isn't the only bullets that come at you. There is also some major choices that can result in unforgivable situations, (score may not save you or even be checked) like getting you caught cheating and no groundwork laid to bail yourself out, but those are often avoidable, especially up till the end. The best I think you are looking for is when Cheeky/Cell complete the game I imagine there will be far more plain paths/variations of the girls who will be compatible together in the end.

Spoiler: To Whom it May Concern

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

Are u back, back acewinz ?

 

[LionHeart 95]

Are u back, back acewinz ?

you should read the intire post spoilers included!

 

[HornyyPussy]

I don't know how the walkthrough navigates it, but it is somewhat common sense. If you lie and cheat a lot, you start building Sus (suspicion), especially if you make poor dialog choices (but sometimes even when you don't). Sometimes this will result in 2 girls you are romantic with starting a fight that makes things (Sus) worse. Then near the end of the game with few exceptions, your overall Suspicion can end relationships (because you aren't trustworthy, that is when you see them all coming into play vs overall relationship scores). But this isn't the only bullets that come at you. There is also some major choices that can result in unforgivable situations, (score may not save you or even be checked) like getting you caught cheating and no groundwork laid to bail yourself out, but those are often avoidable, especially up till the end. The best I think you are looking for is when Cheeky/Cell complete the game I imagine there will be far more plain paths/variations of the girls who will be compatible together in the end.

Spoiler: To Whom it May Concern

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

Good to see you again buddy even if you aren't back

 

[keefer43]

I didn't even read what you wrote, but it's great to see you back here!

Who?

 

[milos1fan]

Who?

Scotty doesn't know...

 

[Quaszog55]

Return of the Whiny Rules Lawyer!

If you use Quickstart on any Episode: Every Sus Score is ZERO! ​

That should be impossible to achieve on Full Harem Selection... or any other.
Why play if you can cheat Quickplay? Rest my case.