VN Ren'Py Being a DIK [v0.10.1] [DrPinkCake]

[felicemastronzo]

Sure, but the question is if a Sistine Chapel painted directly by Michelangelo himself would have been different than one painted by people under his supervision. I suspect the answer is yes, though whether it would have been better, worse or effectively the same is impossible to say. But DPC is the one calling the shots. If he thinks a collaborative BaDIK would be sufficiently different from the version he makes himself, there's no reason to doubt him and not much point in debating it. You can think he's making a mistake, obviously, but that's no different than any other artistic disagreement.

The economic question is a separate aspect. If DPC had a single patron who commissioned a massive, college-themed AVN for his 10th reunion and thus needed it done on time, DPC might have been forced to put a team together to meet the deadline. Likewise, if DPC wanted to be the head of a prestigious AVN design studio, he could have assembled a team to make AL, then expanded to make BaDIK. But DPC has a crowd-sourced funding that pays him without hard deadlines, and he seems much happier writing games himself than on managing people. So rather than forcing DPC's hand to develop the game on ways he dislikes, the economics actually encourage and enable him to take his time and do it 'right.'

Which again, doesn't mean that it's the optimum outcome from our own point of view, just that it IS a valid choice, and one we're very unlikely to be able to change.

if Michelangelo had wanted to do it all by himself, probably we would have never seen it... and I don't see why having someone prepare the colors, mount the proofs on the vault of the chapel should have worsened the quality.

the certainty of having it versus the subjective uncertainty of quality, I would say that in the case of the sistine chapel the patreons system worked well

the economic aspect in my opinion is decisive, but in that it is difficult to disagree with DPC

It's been about a month, though the exact timeline is nebulous now. I agree it's frustrating that the MC hasn't spent a night with Maya (much less both girls) since then. As usual, I blame the crossroads.

But I will say it's not quite as unreasonable as it may seem at first glance. The MC and Maya were still insisting they AREN'T a formal throuple yet, and more importantly they are trying to keep the relationship a secret. They should still be doing more to spend time together, but there are practical limits to how much that could happen.

This should begin to change come Season 3 if you're on their branch, but I'm not going to hold my breath.

sleeping together at the end is only symbolic, the problem is that they never even talked about their relationship, that it was absolutely a new experience for everyone and they just wanted to see if it worked or not. and at the end of that month, then there is Patrick's shock therapy, they don't take any step forward, maybe some backwards. they are never 3 but always 2 in rotation...

from that moment on, the only substantial difference is the jealousy they feel for Jill and Sage, and MC's unilateral decision that they have yet to communicate, so for them the crossroad is yet to be reached.

Having a team does not necessarily mean better quality or faster releases. Sometimes the team is just an excuse to justify a bigger budget to Patreon contributors. On the other hand, there is a certain tendency that when a game becomes more complex, because of its story or its features, the releases become less frequent.

These considerations lead me to accept Dr PinkCake's choice as long as the quality follows. But I understand the criticism of those who, from an accounting view, say that the creator can afford to hire developers; but he cannot be blamed for a promise he never made.

you are describing a dysfunctional team, and that therefore must be rebuilt, but that is as good an example as a depressed author who becomes an alcoholic...

About quality, the discourse is subjective, but there is no way to argue that a team works faster than an individual, the whole history of mankind testifies to that.

then the choice of DPC we all have to accept it, and whether we share it or not doesn't matter.

 

[OFT]

from the end of chapter four to the end of chapter six, how much time will have passed?
I would say at least 2 weeks, in these two weeks MC will never "sleep" with Maya and Josy again.

about as believable as Sage being with Chad for months if not years without sex.

It's been about a month, though the exact timeline is nebulous now. I agree it's frustrating that the MC hasn't spent a night with Maya (much less both girls) since then. As usual, I blame the crossroads.

But I will say it's not quite as unreasonable as it may seem at first glance. The MC and Maya were still insisting they AREN'T a formal throuple yet, and more importantly they are trying to keep the relationship a secret. They should still be doing more to spend time together, but there are practical limits to how much that could happen.

This should begin to change come Season 3 if you're on their branch, but I'm not going to hold my breath.

Six in-game days passed from the end of Episode 4 to the end of Episode 6:





The total in-game elapsed time is about 7 weeks, depending on the length of the Episode 7 time skip and the actual ending day of Episode 8. (Breakdown is here.)

 

[Lostanddamned]

Every will they/won't they romance show in western tv except Castle has folded after the season where "they" get together within two seasons

As for Jill, its pretty clear that relationship is 1. going to be totally on Jill's terms til she gets the point that you can't control every variable. 2. you're getting sex every once in a while with her, and only when she considers it meaningful.

This isn't a TV show though, it's a porn game. It's not a good idea to postpone content just because you fear that you will lose your fans. VatosGames postponed the Nora content for like 14 episodes and people already knew what to expect when a new episode dropped, until he finally gave people the scene they wanted (and it was an amazing one, probably the best on in the game by far).

I honestly didn't believe DPC would give us a Jill scene until like episode 9 or 10 and hell then I still thought that it would be like a handjob or something. But he's good at reading his fanbase I guess and he realized that people were getting tired of his shit and ridiculed him for it. As for the scene, it's not great, not terrible. Problem was that he put it in the same episode that had a lot of great scenes and it kinda got lost in the way.

 

[Darkwen]

. I think MC and Josy ( Best Girl ) are closer to what you want. They cleary can't keep their hand off from each others, and take every opportunity to Fuck. . Josy is like Hulk, except she is not always angry, She is Alway Horny
View attachment 1628210

Now I have a green Josy in my head and its kinda turning me on

 

[xinkala]

Now I have a green Josy in my head and its kinda turning me on

well don't ashamed!
I'm already hard

 

[felicemastronzo]

This isn't a TV show though, it's a porn game. It's not a good idea to postpone content just because you fear that you will lose your fans. VatosGames postponed the Nora content for like 14 episodes and people already knew what to expect when a new episode dropped, until he finally gave people the scene they wanted (and it was an amazing one, probably the best on in the game by far).

I honestly didn't believe DPC would give us a Jill scene until like episode 9 or 10 and hell then I still thought that it would be like a handjob or something. But he's good at reading his fanbase I guess and he realized that people were getting tired of his shit and ridiculed him for it. As for the scene, it's not great, not terrible. Problem was that he put it in the same episode that had a lot of great scenes and it kinda got lost in the way.

DPC has done very well

the idea that the plot should be held up by the stage-by-stage conquest of sex is really the height of laziness

first a hand job, then a blow job, then in some cases anal (especially if there is incest), and finally a shocking missionary...

 

[Coinzell]

Who here, when they first started having sex with their girlfriend...

Someone here is having sex and a girlfriend? That's a revelation.

 

[Cabin Fever]

. I think MC and Josy ( Best Girl ) are closer to what you want. They cleary can't keep their hand off from each others, and take every opportunity to Fuck. . Josy is like Hulk, except she is not always angry, She is Alway Horny
View attachment 1628210

The irony of a diminutive girl being compared to Hulk...

 

[ChipLecsap]

This isn't a TV show though, it's a porn game. It's not a good idea to postpone content just because you fear that you will lose your fans. VatosGames postponed the Nora content for like 14 episodes and people already knew what to expect when a new episode dropped, until he finally gave people the scene they wanted (and it was an amazing one, probably the best on in the game by far).

I honestly didn't believe DPC would give us a Jill scene until like episode 9 or 10 and hell then I still thought that it would be like a handjob or something. But he's good at reading his fanbase I guess and he realized that people were getting tired of his shit and ridiculed him for it. As for the scene, it's not great, not terrible. Problem was that he put it in the same episode that had a lot of great scenes and it kinda got lost in the way.

Yeah, and immediately after it , possible one of the Jill's fan, ( or maybe a Bella fan ) , asked for less lewd scene..

 

[Killerwhale5678]

Jill's got the Royal Family Teeth gene

Seems like you're too familiar with it

 

[Lostanddamned]

DPC has done very well

the idea that the plot should be held up by the stage-by-stage conquest of sex is really the height of laziness

first a hand job, then a blow job, then in some cases anal (especially if there is incest), and finally a shocking missionary...

I'm glad he didn't do it that way, it's repetitive and boring because every other dev does the same thing. Hell, even CheekyGimp who is top tier dev did the same thing with Monica. Because in their minds "We can't, but I'll give you a blowjob to help you get some relief" is good plot and logical.

Yeah, and immediately after it , possible one of the Jill's fan, ( or maybe a Bella fan ) , asked for less lewd scene..

I honestly have no idea what you are talking about. If you are trying to imply that I said such thing, I'll let you know that Jill was the last route I completed because after the blackmail storyline I find her the least interesting character of them all.

But hey, if Jill's route opens the way for Bianca's route, count me in. I'm a good guy and I'll sacrifice myself for you.

 

[felicemastronzo]

I'm glad he didn't do it that way, it's repetitive and boring because every other dev does the same thing. Hell, even CheekyGimp who is top tier dev did the same thing with Monica. Because in their minds "We can't, but I'll give you a blowjob to help you get some relief" is good plot and logical.

different LIs can't go at the same speed, and that's fine

the madness is to imagine that they are all mandatory stages

for example for Sage and Bella it fits as a path (more or less fast but from stage to stage), with Jill it would not have made sense, I always argued that we would have sex with her much sooner than when she would offer us other services...

each li has its own story and timeline

 

[ChipLecsap]

I honestly have no idea what you are talking about. If you are trying to imply that I said such thing, I'll let you know that Jill was the last route I completed because after the blackmail storyline I find her the least interesting character of them all.

But hey, if Jill's route opens the way for Bianca's route, count me in. I'm a good guy and I'll sacrifice myself for you.

This time I was not implying anything. I assume not every Bella fan is like you. Just like I don't considering myself to the same league as other "Josy fans" They are all heretics .

But Jokes aside, I said, may be a Bella fan, because it's interesting that this question happened right after both Jill and Bella get their sex scene, and someone immediately demanded less . What the fuck is wrong with Patreon peoples ? . another proof why its good thing DPC does not lissening to them

 

[mindern]

This isn't a TV show though, it's a porn game. It's not a good idea to postpone content just because you fear that you will lose your fans. VatosGames postponed the Nora content for like 14 episodes and people already knew what to expect when a new episode dropped, until he finally gave people the scene they wanted (and it was an amazing one, probably the best on in the game by far).

I honestly didn't believe DPC would give us a Jill scene until like episode 9 or 10 and hell then I still thought that it would be like a handjob or something. But he's good at reading his fanbase I guess and he realized that people were getting tired of his shit and ridiculed him for it. As for the scene, it's not great, not terrible. Problem was that he put it in the same episode that had a lot of great scenes and it kinda got lost in the way.

To be fair people predicted the “after the music concert” time frame like 3 episodes ago.

I don’t think what drove DPC to have the scene now was some pressure to give the people what they want it was because he wrote her arc that way. It was all deliberate. DPC said himself in the recent Q&A his policy is players play the game, game makers make the games. He claims people don’t influence his writing (that’s obviously an easy thing to say) so it’s not insane he just wrote her that way.

Besides, It’s not like the sex with Jill was out of the blue or incongruous. She went on and on about being a virgin, the three date rule… DPC was about as blatant as you can be drawing parallels between her behaviour on stage and her thoughts about sex. He sealed that deal with some extraordinarily rare inner monologue from Jill… how many girls do we actually hear the thoughts of so we know exactly where they stand?

It was the most telegraphed sex scene in the game in my opinion. He spent time setting up her stage fright and then her “bedroom fright” and the MC helping her over come one was kinda inevitably gonna lead to her overcoming the other. I think it was a deliberate choice built over 3+ episodes rather than him giving into complaints.

 

[GWhite]

Amazing game; came for the porn, stayed for the plot!

 

[Lostanddamned]

To be fair people predicted the “after the music concert” time frame like 3 episodes ago.

I don’t think what drove DPC to have the scene now was some pressure to give the people what they want it was because he wrote her arc that way. It was all deliberate. DPC said himself in the recent Q&A his policy is players play the game, game makers make the games. He claims people don’t influence his writing (that’s obviously an easy thing to say) so it’s not insane he just wrote her that way.

Besides, It’s not like the sex with Jill was out of the blue or incongruous. She went on and on about being a virgin, the three date rule… DPC was about as blatant as you can be drawing parallels between her behaviour on stage and her thoughts about sex. He sealed that deal with some extraordinarily rare inner monologue from Jill… how many girls do we actually hear the thoughts of so we know exactly where they stand?

It was the most telegraphed sex scene in the game in my opinion. He spent time setting up her stage fright and then her “bedroom fright” and the MC helping her over come one was kinda inevitably gonna lead to her overcoming the other. I think it was a deliberate choice built over 3+ episodes rather than him giving into complaints.

To say that DPC isn't taking ideas or inspiration from things we write is not exactly. There was a guy here during 0.1, I don't remember who it was, that the dude played the first update and called the Troy/Chad gay storyline, Maya/Josy/Patrick storyline and something else (I don't remember what it was, but I think it was something related to Burke and Quinn) on the spot, like years before they actually happened. And that was during the time when DPC still visited this forum, so the logical explanation would be that either DPC took inspiration from that guy or it was a fake profile that DPC created so he could get the ball rolling.

 

[lipe2410]

Now I have a green Josy in my head and its kinda turning me on

Josy as She-Hulk in Halloween party

 

[felicemastronzo]

To be fair people predicted the “after the music concert” time frame like 3 episodes ago.

I don’t think what drove DPC to have the scene now was some pressure to give the people what they want it was because he wrote her arc that way. It was all deliberate. DPC said himself in the recent Q&A his policy is players play the game, game makers make the games. He claims people don’t influence his writing (that’s obviously an easy thing to say) so it’s not insane he just wrote her that way.

Besides, It’s not like the sex with Jill was out of the blue or incongruous. She went on and on about being a virgin, the three date rule… DPC was about as blatant as you can be drawing parallels between her behaviour on stage and her thoughts about sex. He sealed that deal with some extraordinarily rare inner monologue from Jill… how many girls do we actually hear the thoughts of so we know exactly where they stand?

It was the most telegraphed sex scene in the game in my opinion. He spent time setting up her stage fright and then her “bedroom fright” and the MC helping her over come one was kinda inevitably gonna lead to her overcoming the other. I think it was a deliberate choice built over 3+ episodes rather than him giving into complaints.

and also congruently, the only ones who can access Jill's first time are those who will engage with her (as Bella)

if we had known what this "crossroad" would be it would have been a really easy bet

 

[AchedCroissant]

Josy as She-Hulk in Halloween party

Hey send me a private message because I can't send you one lol

 

[PashafromRussia]

Sure, but the question is if a Sistine Chapel painted directly by Michelangelo himself would have been different than one painted by people under his supervision. I suspect the answer is yes, though whether it would have been better, worse or effectively the same is impossible to say. But DPC is the one calling the shots. If he thinks a collaborative BaDIK would be sufficiently different from the version he makes himself, there's no reason to doubt him and not much point in debating it. You can think he's making a mistake, obviously, but that's no different than any other artistic disagreement.

The economic question is a separate aspect. If DPC had a single patron who commissioned a massive, college-themed AVN for his 10th reunion and thus needed it done on time, DPC might have been forced to put a team together to meet the deadline. Likewise, if DPC wanted to be the head of a prestigious AVN design studio, he could have assembled a team to make AL, then expanded to make BaDIK. But DPC has a crowd-sourced funding that pays him without hard deadlines, and he seems much happier writing games himself than on managing people. So rather than forcing DPC's hand to develop the game on ways he dislikes, the economics actually encourage and enable him to take his time and do it 'right.'

Which again, doesn't mean that it's the optimum outcome from our own point of view, just that it IS a valid choice, and one we're very unlikely to be able to change.



It's been about a month, though the exact timeline is nebulous now. I agree it's frustrating that the MC hasn't spent a night with Maya (much less both girls) since then. As usual, I blame the crossroads.

But I will say it's not quite as unreasonable as it may seem at first glance. The MC and Maya were still insisting they AREN'T a formal throuple yet, and more importantly they are trying to keep the relationship a secret. They should still be doing more to spend time together, but there are practical limits to how much that could happen.

This should begin to change come Season 3 if you're on their branch, but I'm not going to hold my breath.

I don't understand why the game is compared to the Sistine Chapel at all. They have nothing in common with each other. BAD is a game and, most importantly, a business project. The game is getting bigger and bigger with each update, at some point DPC itself will get confused and everything will go to hell.
There are already more than 20 characters in the game and we have passed only half. By the end of season 4, about 50 actors may be involved in the game. And for each character, you will need to prescribe motivation.
DPC obviously does not hurt to hire a one person for post-processing renders and most importantly the editor. There are a lot of examples when too ambitious projects go down the drain when there is no right person who would control the creator. When the creator wants to do a lot and embrace everything, it usually ends badly. Ambition must be controlled by common sense. DPC needs to trust people more, given how high the level of 3D artists is now.