Others Corruption of Champions II [v0.7.37] [Savin/Salamander Studios]

[Jbuster]

What is the problem with this or Treatment? Can't writers just go to the logical conclusion and make player choose to be either a villain or a good guy?

I'm not sure any writer would do it, for that, it would require anyone on that team to recognize that what happens in Mallach temples is in any way wrong and I doubt they would do that, and then, they would need to give the player a choice to either push Cait against her faith, once again, doubtful, or let her embrace it, which you do with the temple quest, to get more content

Thing is they have put so much background behind Cait and her faith as something normal despite how shifty it is, that I don't think any of them will ever think, "yeah maybe this doesn't work, maybe putting all those details about Cait doing sex stuff with her whole family full of harlots isn't really a great idea, maybe mentioning that she wasn't an adult before leaving the temple wasn't a smart thing to do either, maybe, maybe the whole deal about the rental wombs with kids being rejected and then repurposed for another job (the dancer and her brother) and Cait's sister wanting to leave and that being a problem because her faith pretty much demands her to be a whore is pretty much what the main evil enemy of this game would do, pretty demonic stuff if you ask me"

And brother, they'll never do that

One day you'll get to tackle those issues when and if, someone makes a mod, till then it's Savin's party, and we are only guests

 

[devilaffect]

pretty demonic stuff if you ask me

Convocation of Mirrors did establish that the Seven weren't wholly benevolent beings, but inhabit a far more grey area of morality due to their origins. I think it stands to reason that at least some of the Seven and their followers should be involved in questionable activities. Grooming probably wasn't a good choice without finding a way to establish it as being outside of the norms for Mallach's followers and working that into character growth for Cait. Though it does help bring into question the dichotomy between the Demons and the Divine in combination with how Kassyra's motivations have played out.

 

[GokutheG]

Convocation of Mirrors did establish that the Seven weren't wholly benevolent beings, but inhabit a far more grey area of morality due to their origins. I think it stands to reason that at least some of the Seven and their followers should be involved in questionable activities. Grooming probably wasn't a good choice without finding a way to establish it as being outside of the norms for Mallach's followers and working that into character growth for Cait. Though it does help bring into question the dichotomy between the Demons and the Divine in combination with how Kassyra's motivations have played out.

Honestly settings with "gods" are very underwhelming. If they are present why don't they help when a big threat comes along? The Seven are much worse since they were originally abominations that wanted to destroy the world but now just want to control it. They aren't much better than demons and in some ways could be considered worse. They could stop the "corruption" that happens but they do nothing. Let's not forget one is the founder of a groomer cult and the other created a race that'll rape you if they're hungry. How exactly are they better than demons?

 

[devilaffect]

Honestly settings with "gods" are very underwhelming. If they are present why don't they help when a big threat comes along? The Seven are much worse since they were originally abominations that wanted to destroy the world but now just want to control it. They aren't much better than demons and in some ways could be considered worse. They could stop the "corruption" that happens but they do nothing. Let's not forget one is the founder of a groomer cult and the other created a race that'll rape you if they're hungry. How exactly are they better than demons?

Yeah, they do tend to be boring since there's not a lot you can do with them outside of exploring grey morality. Which is why I brought Kassyra up since she's the closest thing we have to a foil to the Seven and that seems to be what they are going for. Even if you break up the groups that are supposed to be morally opposed you do have some level right vs wrong within factions when you compare Kassyra to Tollus or Lumia to Mallach/Nareva.

I would agree a large portion of the Seven are morally dubious at best, but that could be by design for the game as a whole and when you look at the more narratively focused content like Convocation of Mirrors, Dog Days, or Den of Foxes it reinforces the idea that it's probably on purpose. Maybe I'm giving them too much credit, but it's present in a lot of the content where fucking isn't the main focus.

 

[NODOGAN]

Honestly settings with "gods" are very underwhelming. If they are present why don't they help when a big threat comes along? The Seven are much worse since they were originally abominations that wanted to destroy the world but now just want to control it. They aren't much better than demons and in some ways could be considered worse. They could stop the "corruption" that happens but they do nothing. Let's not forget one is the founder of a groomer cult and the other created a race that'll rape you if they're hungry. How exactly are they better than demons?

Wasn't it hinted by Mallach and Kasyrra's speech that the only reason they letting Kasyrra do her shtick is so they can steal her soul research? like yeah you're corrupting thousands, armed a crazy cultist like Tollus with a shitton of power, nearly tore reality appart with your science project and summoned Wraiths again and throwing the world into BDMS chaos, BUT!

I wanna see if I can have a soul and still be a God so just note down whatever interesting shit you find before we come in, kill you and steal your research.

 

[Cakei]

I just hoping to be still alive to see this and TiTS modded the shit of him...

 

[Biostar]

View attachment 4568078

Unfortunately.

 

[M0nte]

Why does you MC act like a blushing maiden when Hana proposes to you?
View attachment 4567967

Since she has a dick.

 

[GokutheG]

Yeah, they do tend to be boring since there's not a lot you can do with them outside of exploring grey morality. Which is why I brought Kassyra up since she's the closest thing we have to a foil to the Seven and that seems to be what they are going for. Even if you break up the groups that are supposed to be morally opposed you do have some level right vs wrong within factions when you compare Kassyra to Tollus or Lumia to Mallach/Nareva.

I would agree a large portion of the Seven are morally dubious at best, but that could be by design for the game as a whole and when you look at the more narratively focused content like Convocation of Mirrors, Dog Days, or Den of Foxes it reinforces the idea that it's probably on purpose. Maybe I'm giving them too much credit, but it's present in a lot of the content where fucking isn't the main focus.

That's the thing they usually don't tackle morality. The story typically goes mortals must worship them, they treat people like shit but that's ok because some other group is worse. That's just a lazy excuse.

The only God that I've ever seen that I actually thought was interesting is The Lady of Pain from Planescape.

 

[Jbuster]

Wasn't it hinted by Mallach and Kasyrra's speech that the only reason they letting Kasyrra do her shtick is so they can steal her soul research? like yeah you're corrupting thousands, armed a crazy cultist like Tollus with a shitton of power, nearly tore reality appart with your science project and summoned Wraiths again and throwing the world into BDMS chaos, BUT!

I wanna see if I can have a soul and still be a God so just note down whatever interesting shit you find before we come in, kill you and steal your research.

At least two of the seven's followers reproduce in such a way that numbers shouldn't matter that much, and even then, their power core is not at risk at the moment, with the kitsunes having weeaboo island and their many colonies and the whoredom all the way down there in sexy Agrabah (which is totally safe for kids, Cait said so)

Lumia does have orcs raiding and pillaging and reproducing constantly and there should be plenty more wasp and bees colonies all around the planet, and also guys like Sanders, which add numbers

So, the thing is, how much of the continent you're trapped in are they willing to burn to get that research?, maybe all of it, but maybe they really believe the champion will do it, so that could be part of their big plan. Let the champion do it, after all, every deity till now likes the champion. Lumia is super nice and believes that you, the champion, can do anything. Keros likes you a lot and in a weird twist, is nicer to you than basically everyone in the tree (how weird is that every kitsune outside of that place is nice to your character and really likes you, even Kiyoko, but as soon as you go there, they revert to be a bunch of assholes?), Mallach seems totally willing to send help at some point and even let you see what afterlife will be for Cait, as a never ending orgy, how nice of him?, and the rest are there I guess... Nareva was into foot stuff which is pretty nice, kudos for that

Point being, till now their whole plan is letting the champion fuck to the extreme (like Kasyrra), and maybe get the champion's soul (like Kasyrra), and kill Tollus at some point because that would be really helpful, like, let me kill that guy please, I'm pretty it will be a good thing. The cult is bound to fall apart without Tollus and magic hands man and the bleached kitsune won't be enough to keep it together, so let me kill Tollus Savin, please let me kill that particular guy

 

[Tsubuhaza]

What is the problem with this or Treatment? Can't writers just go to the logical conclusion and make player choose to be either a villain or a good guy?

Because the main character has been irrelevant for a chunk of the game. Either that or it just didn't align with whatever writer wanted to write.

Why does you MC act like a blushing maiden when Hana proposes to you?
View attachment 4567967

...Wait, who wrote that shit?

so let me kill Tollus Savin, please let me kill that particular guy

...I wanna say player agency is a power fantasy but I don't think anyone could not see to reason that the PC should kill the fucker.

 

[GokutheG]

so let me kill Tollus Savin, please let me kill that particular guy

I'm calling it now Tollus is going to be the true final boss in this game especially if you're romancing Kas. They've left too many bread crumbs for that to not be the case.

 

[Jbuster]

Because the main character has been irrelevant for a chunk of the game. Either that or it just didn't align with whatever writer wanted to write.



View attachment 4568901

...Wait, who wrote that shit?



...I wanna say player agency is a power fantasy but I don't think anyone could not see to reason that the PC should kill the fucker.

This will end with the champion teaming up with Kasyrra to destroy ultra Tollus, who is the most powerful ever after some complicated and nonsensical plan no one ever saw coming, followed with an after game escenario about the secret true champion who wields dual katanas and is followed by a mysterious princess who smells like manure, because why not?, it ain't like they'll let your champion do anything

 

[GokutheG]

This will end with the champion teaming up with Kasyrra to destroy ultra Tollus, who is the most powerful ever after some complicated and nonsensical plan no one ever saw coming, followed with an after game escenario about the secret true champion who wields dual katanas and is followed by a mysterious princess who smells like manure, because why not?, it ain't like they'll let your champion do anything

Yeah they're going to team up in the end for sure. I just don't know if Kas will still be a demon at that point tho. I've been thinking that Tollus as a demon will be a much more sinister threat than Kas. I've also started to think he may fuse with a wraith, strengthen his soul like Kas wants the mc to do, somehow steal the mc's soul to bargin with Kas or even more outlandish he'll somehow figure out how the seven were able to obtain "godhood" and use it for himself.

 

[Jbuster]

Yeah they're going to team up in the end for sure. I just don't know if Kas will still be a demon at that point tho. I've been thinking that Tollus as a demon will be a much more sinister threat than Kas. I've also started to think he may fuse with a wraith, strengthen his soul like Kas wants the mc to do, somehow steal the mc's soul to bargin with Kas or even more outlandish he'll somehow figure out how the seven were able to obtain "godhood" and use it for himself.

Everything seems to point in that direction, at least Tollus is a proper villain and the one guy who just won't die

Him outsmarting the seven, Kasyrra and even the champion (I'll pretend outsmarting the champion is somehow something impressive and not an every day occurrence), thus living his power fantasy would be pretty much on brand with this game

 

[Unkoep]

Honestly does Kas even need to corrupt anything? seems like this was world already fucked from the get go, Like you would've thought the demon lady from another dimension would push to world into sexual deviancy but no it was already like that. That what really confused me about this game even from the beginning when it was just starting out

 

[Biostar]

...Wait, who wrote that shit?

Savin

 

[Zoonyo]

Does anyone know if Etheryn can fuck a female MC after the cage comes off?

 

[GokutheG]

Honestly does Kas even need to corrupt anything? seems like this was world already fucked from the get go, Like you would've thought the demon lady from another dimension would push to world into sexual deviancy but no it was already like that. That what really confused me about this game even from the beginning when it was just starting out

Besides messing with the wasps and flower creatures not much. Ryn's sister was an abusive pos before Kas entered the picture, the valley already had orcs raping and pillaging, the minos had a rape problem so the gender changing armor was created, the horse folk had a rape problem so the tea/milk was created.

Besides invading the minotaur city Kas hasn't been a serious problem compared to what's already plaguing the continent.

The centaur village I would say got hit by corruption the hardest and that was done by the cult(who was a problem before Kas).

 

[johnysanchez01]

Thing is they have put so much background behind Cait and her faith as something normal despite how shifty it is, that I don't think any of them will ever think, "yeah maybe this doesn't work, maybe putting all those details about Cait doing sex stuff with her whole family full of harlots isn't really a great idea, maybe mentioning that she wasn't an adult before leaving the temple wasn't a smart thing to do either, maybe, maybe the whole deal about the rental wombs with kids being rejected and then repurposed for another job (the dancer and her brother) and Cait's sister wanting to leave and that being a problem because her faith pretty much demands her to be a whore is pretty much what the main evil enemy of this game would do, pretty demonic stuff if you ask me"

In another world, this *might* have been an opportunity to create some complexity with Cait's character and give her depth that extends beyond "sex cult priestess that fucks everyone". I say might, because such a topic would require a ton of writing skill and sensitivity that no one writing for this project currently possesses. When you take into account that actual cults often involve creepy sexual shit involving incest and minors there's little reason to have this kind of narrative in the game.

I get that the writers talked about giving Cait agency and having her be more than just the player's fucktoy but it just feels kinda fucked that it's done by having her be the product of extensive sexual and religious grooming from childhood. It's not like this is explored in a manner where you see how fucked up it is, it's just presented to you and that's that.

Meanwhile CoC1 (and the expansions) handled dark moments fairly well by acknowledging how fucked up certain situations were.