Ren'Py Desert Stalker [v0.16b] [Zetan]

[ksatnod]

She had to avoid the looters/stalkers that arrowed the one dude in the head

There was a storm/blowout or what ever its called in the stalker series that would've gotten her if Ivy's friend was more suspicious of others.

And finally just because things are quiet most of the time, doesn't mean the area is safe.

 

[Kellermann]

I don't think it would be a bad move to have players reload a save, if they fuck up somewhere. It would only add to the danger purported by the setting.

I'd rather not if you are talking about constant game overs. Unless it is video game with mechanics and gameplay that support something like that (ex.Metal Gear Solid games or horror genre), then it just becomes annoying very quickly. I don't think visual novels lend themselves well to game overs. Reloading a save, yes I do that often (usually to grab a new lewd scene), but a game over screen mid-story? I haven't found one yet on F95 with constant game overs that doesn't royally piss me off. Fortunately here I think the zone is the only time we have approached something like a hard cut game over. To its credit the "bad end" there was easy to spot coming and avoid.

Rather than game overs, there could different outcomes (good outcome, ok outcome, undesirable but not deadly outcome). I quite liked the dilemma we were faced with during hive mission. But the problem with the previously mentioned different outcomes is it requires a lot more writing and rendering. The more outcomes, the more branching required. Great for players but a chore for developers and I would be sad to see DS become another once-per-year update game. 3 to 4 months is ideal, especially for kind of quality entertainment we receive in DS.


_somewhat unrelated section _
Recently a number people have called for changes to certain aspects of story or characters (I also asked from time to time, oops), or they have wondered why this game can't have a weaker "more realistic" MC, but it never seems to turn out well when a developer caves to the wants of the general public and changes their original vision. imo, this game has a high level of support and praise precisely because it has gone its own way and takes a different tack than most other games on F95.

 

[ksatnod]

I haven't found one yet on F95 with constant game overs that doesn't royally piss me off.

Only times I ever had game overs that didn't detract, were VNs that put in the effort to make the "game over" a scene unto it self, which I think has similar problems to decision trees.

 

[Filipis]

I don't think this is a good example. The raiders would take the settlement either way and Zaton's role is supposed to be the diplomat, who prevents more bloodshet. But in the end it turns out your choices don't actually have any serious consequences for Zaton's quest or the fate of the raiders. It simply comes down to if you want to play the good guy or stroke it to the settlers suffering. There's nothing more to it, which was pretty disappointing to me honestly. The quest played out like an oldschool rpg at first, but in the end it shied away from disturbing the power fantasy even slightly.

On the one hand you can miss whole chunks of content depending on your choices, but on the other hand there are never really any bad consequences at least for Zaton and the characters close to him (unnamed side characters can be gored for fun, though). I don't think it would be a bad move to have players reload a save, if they fuck up somewhere. It would only add to the danger purported by the setting.
For example, the zone would have been pretty disappointing, if it wasn't for the one bad outcome, where Shani could get trapped. I'm not even sure what in the zone required extensive stalker training and a truckload of equipment (that weirdly enough vanished somewhere before Shani even entered the zone).

Also... the Zone part is still on-going? It's not over, so Shani can still get in a serious situation. But I would like to see more... permanent consequences from some choices presented to the MC.

 

[Idontsniffpanties]

It's too early in the story to tell. I am sure there will be major changes down the line thatdirectly result from choices. It's set up like that.

 

[nccnnc09]

I don't think this is a good example. The raiders would take the settlement either way and Zaton's role is supposed to be the diplomat, who prevents more bloodshet. But in the end it turns out your choices don't actually have any serious consequences for Zaton's quest or the fate of the raiders. It simply comes down to if you want to play the good guy or stroke it to the settlers suffering. There's nothing more to it, which was pretty disappointing to me honestly. The quest played out like an oldschool rpg at first, but in the end it shied away from disturbing the power fantasy even slightly.

On the one hand you can miss whole chunks of content depending on your choices, but on the other hand there are never really any bad consequences at least for Zaton and the characters close to him (unnamed side characters can be gored for fun, though). I don't think it would be a bad move to have players reload a save, if they fuck up somewhere. It would only add to the danger purported by the setting.
For example, the zone would have been pretty disappointing, if it wasn't for the one bad outcome, where Shani could get trapped. I'm not even sure what in the zone required extensive stalker training and a truckload of equipment (that weirdly enough vanished somewhere before Shani even entered the zone).

from the first time open the game you can see they say that every choice matter but actually, every choice create work, which means if dev drilling into creates some consequence, he gonna waste a lot of time. So the solution normally be like stop you from the quest or changing a tiny bit in the character. we all know it, but this raider quest is just start and who know what will he add into it. Anyways, think like a dev for a bit and wait, if it bad, leave. But i think he made a good line of choice for sure. In my first run, I have missed half of scenes.

 

[Filipis]

from the first time open the game you can see they say that every choice matter but actually, every choice create work, which means if dev drilling into creates some consequence, he gonna waste a lot of time. So the solution normally be like stop you from the quest or changing a tiny bit in the character. we all know it, but this raider quest is just start and who know what will he add into it. Anyways, think like a dev for a bit and wait, if it bad, leave. But i think he made a good line of choice for sure. In my first run, I have missed half of scenes.

This. I was blown away by the fact that this was just 0.12b version of the game, and so much content was already in it. Main quests have barely even started, and most of the present choices in the game are character-building, rather than story-defining. This is a clear "wait & see" situation.

Off-topic, but I am a new player of DS, what has the developer's reputation & update cadence been like so far? Steady, small updates or larger, infrequent updates? How long did it take to get to 0.12b (from first release)?

 

[Kellermann]

This. I was blown away by the fact that this was just 0.12b version of the game, and so much content was already in it. Main quests have barely even started, and most of the present choices in the game are character-building, rather than story-defining. This is a clear "wait & see" situation.

Off-topic, but I am a new player of DS, what has the developer's reputation & update cadence been like so far? Steady, small updates or larger, infrequent updates? How long did it take to get to 0.12b (from first release)?

Great rep and regular updates (3 to 4 months). Not going to find much better for a highly rated game on F95. Amount of content is excellent for me, but I don't speed run and I read everything including all the lore pages. If you just fast forward to the bewbies then it might not last that long

 

[Hildegardt]

from the first time open the game you can see they say that every choice matter but actually, every choice create work, which means if dev drilling into creates some consequence, he gonna waste a lot of time.

But that's not the problem. The game is already full of choices and different outcomes, so it doesn't seem like Zetan sees this as a waste of time. The problem is rather that the choices never have any meaningful consequences for the PC.
Zaton goes around deciding the fate of the different characters he meets and there's never any conflict to it. Like for example in the aforementioned quest: How does he convince the savage sadistic raiders that building a shed for some braindamaged guy is a better idea than their original plan of pillaging and killing the settlement? How is suggesting to the raiders that they should help rather than doing what they do best not an obviously bad idea?

 

[JaxMan]

But that's not the problem. The game is already full of choices and different outcomes, so it doesn't seem like Zetan sees this as a waste of time. The problem is rather that the choices never have any meaningful consequences for the PC.
Zaton goes around deciding the fate of the different characters he meets and there's never any conflict to it. Like for example in the aforementioned quest: How does he convince the savage sadistic raiders that building a shed for some braindamaged guy is a better idea than their original plan of pillaging and killing the settlement? How is suggesting to the raiders that they should help rather than doing what they do best not an obviously bad idea?

I didn't get the idea that he expected the raiders to move into the settlement and run it administratively. My thought was that MC was trying to create a tribute giving settlement to the raiders and it would be run by the people living there. The raiders won't be the ones building a shed. The raiders would come by and collect tribute as payment for not attacking the queen's caravans or destroying the settlement. Can Kyra keep the more violent and destructive elements of the raiders in check, but she seems to be more reasonable? There may be an issue with that later, who knows?

 

[Walter Victor]

I'd rather not if you are talking about constant game overs. Unless it is video game with mechanics and gameplay that support something like that (ex.Metal Gear Solid games or horror genre), then it just becomes annoying very quickly. I don't think visual novels lend themselves well to game overs. Reloading a save, yes I do that often (usually to grab a new lewd scene), but a game over screen mid-story? I haven't found one yet on F95 with constant game overs that doesn't royally piss me off. Fortunately here I think the zone is the only time we have approached something like a hard cut game over. To its credit the "bad end" there was easy to spot coming and avoid.

Rather than game overs, there could different outcomes (good outcome, ok outcome, undesirable but not deadly outcome). I quite liked the dilemma we were faced with during hive mission. But the problem with the previously mentioned different outcomes is it requires a lot more writing and rendering. The more outcomes, the more branching required. Great for players but a chore for developers and I would be sad to see DS become another once-per-year update game. 3 to 4 months is ideal, especially for kind of quality entertainment we receive in DS.

Only times I ever had game overs that didn't detract, were VNs that put in the effort to make the "game over" a scene unto it self, which I think has similar problems to decision trees.

An obvious way to have game-overs that are not annoying is to have the game branch back to the decision point so that the player can make a different choice and continue on with the game without having to resort to save-spamming.

This would also allow for extra scenes for the game-over routes. There is a lot of opportunity for humor when such a solution is adopted. If the player doesn't want to see the ending scene, fast-forward is always an option.

 

[Ragnar]

Zaton is a Desert Stalker, they're the best warriors of the setting as far as I know. I'm fine with some game overs if you make mistakes like in the Hive but I can't see him being pussy whipped by the Queen. She needs him more than he needs her.
There are plenty of games with young mcs wetting their pants at the sight of their landlady's boobs.

 

[incog44]

Zaton is a Desert Stalker, they're the best warriors of the setting as far as I know. I'm fine with some game overs if you make mistakes like in the Hive but I can't see him being pussy whipped by the Queen. She needs him more than he needs her.
There are plenty of games with young mcs wetting their pants at the sight of their landlady's boobs.

He's not exactly pussy whipped by her if you go the dominant route with the queen. It seems it's leading up to her being more than happy with him being controlling with her. Of course if you went the "yes ma'am" route it's going to seem like he takes shit from her. This game is what YOU make it.

 

[Sum Gi]

Read the title as "Deep Stalker" and had some pleasant flashbacks.

Ahh skintheft...

 

[Ragnar]

He's not exactly pussy whipped by her if you go the dominant route with the queen. It seems it's leading up to her being more than happy with him being controlling with her. Of course if you went the "yes ma'am" route it's going to seem like he takes shit from her. This game is what YOU make it.

I know but some people are talking about how Zaton is too much of a Gary Stu to make the story believable.

 

[Kellermann]

I know but some people are talking about how Zaton is too much of a Gary Stu to make the story believable.

Oh noes, a porn game that isn't believable. I'm sure their idea of neutering Gary Stu would certainly make it more believable apoc sci-fi game with zombies, mutants, and girls that are horny 24/7.
It is just a matter of people having a kink they aren't seeing fulfilled in game. Can't really blame them when almost every F95 game stars a weak, timidly, or inexperienced shota who must use mind control to get anywhere.

Suspending disbelief goes with the territory with any of these AVNs. You either buy into a 'might makes right' game world with experienced, capable, top tier Stalker MC who can handle problems without falling to pieces and constantly losing or you don't. Personally, I wouldn't much enjoy having MC who has his Omar levels increased and his Zaton levels decreased.

 

[Zerorox]

Oh noes, a porn game that isn't believable. I'm sure their idea of neutering Gary Stu would certainly make it more believable apoc sci-fi game with zombies, mutants, and girls that are horny 24/7.
It is just a matter of people having a kink they aren't seeing fulfilled in game. Can't really blame them when almost every F95 game stars a weak, timidly, or inexperienced shota who must use mind control to get anywhere.

Suspending disbelief goes with the territory with any of these AVNs. You either buy into a 'might makes right' game world with experienced, capable, top tier Stalker MC who can handle problems without falling to pieces and constantly losing or you don't. Personally, I wouldn't much enjoy having MC who has his Omar levels increased and his Zaton levels decreased.

Yeah, such MC's are rare nowadays, especially backed up with at least mediocre writing/personality.
So let's hope MC'll never cross the line with "pussylicking" and will not become another "shonen anime MC"
Edit: I meant metaphorically, nothing against cunnilingus...

 

[Cynicaladm]

Yeah, such MC's are rare nowadays, especially backed up with at least mediocre writing/personality.
So let's hope MC'll never cross the line with "pussylicking" and will not become another "shonen anime MC"

whut?
what's wrong with cunnilingus?

 

[Zerorox]

whut?
what's wrong with cunnilingus?

I meant too much being "under heel", "selfless Hero", "White knight"... I have nothing against some pussylicking in game

 

[Kellermann]

Yeah, such MC's are rare nowadays, especially backed up with at least mediocre writing/personality.

True and we don't have much an alternative. Keep in mind that if you lose a fight in this realm, you are likely become dead or slave.

Already discussed how constant game overs are a terrible idea in visual novels. It is like devs who put in menu choice with only one option to select. The end result is going to be the same, you are just postponing the inevitable with more busywork mouse-clicking.

You could make more capable opponents to challenge MC.. We already have Lord Abrax who seems like a badass but not much screen time yet this early in story. Must wait and see on that front. We also have our bitchy queen whom you can be subservient to if you need to get your beta fix that badly. Fangs also can hold her own from what we have seen. The decayed could prove very deadly if they ever gather and concentrate feu d'enfer to attack in force.

We also talked about including more non-fatal options (ex. good, bad, ugly outcomes), but as previously stated that requires a lot more writing, rendering, coding for each branch. Will that extra work add that much more entertainment value? I don't know maybe, but this game already has a high entertainment level with quick turnaround. One of the few high rated games with regular sub 6 month intervals.

Spoiler: Hero's Journey

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