VN Others Completed Double Homework [Ep. 19] [Palmer/Love-Joint]

[Real Kreten]

I am completely satisfied with how MC of the DH is written. I understand his personality, affected by a tragic accident. The only thing that bothered me was when he was stretching the lying to Jo and Tam.

I would just like to draw attention to the criticisms of recent posts. Characters arcs form one of the basic pillars of a good story. Have a "perfect" hero at the beginning? Where would you like to develop him then? Or would you like Mr. perfect whole story, that this basic pillar of the story is cut down?

At DH, we got a hero at the beginning who was shaped by a depressing event, and among other plots, we watch how he deals with it. The story promises that he overcome his trauma, and in the end he will be a better person than ever before.

Without what you're criticizing, we'd only get another generic porn game.

 

[Corambis]

I am completely satisfied with how MC of the DH is written. I understand his personality, affected by a tragic accident. The only thing that bothered me was when he was stretching the lying to Jo and Tam.

I would just like to draw attention to the criticisms of recent posts. Characters arcs form one of the basic pillars of a good story. Have a "perfect" hero at the beginning? Where would you like to develop him then? Or would you like Mr. perfect whole story, that this basic pillar of the story is cut down?

At DH, we got a hero at the beginning who was shaped by a depressing event, and among other plots, we watch how he deals with it. The story promises that he overcome his trauma, and in the end he will be a better person than ever before.

Without what you're criticizing, we'd only get another generic porn game.

There's one update left, unless I'm missing something. There has been no character arc for the MC. Just a downward slope. If he showed growth or that he was struggling to overcome his issues, especially out of love, that would be one thing. Instead, his own inability to do anything about it has led to a situation where the women in his life feel the need to have sex with his enemy in order to protect him.

This isn't an issue specific to DH as far as unlikable MCs go. It's just that given the level of writing in other areas of the game, and the character development of the female characters, at least some of us would hope for more. But even in other games with talented writing, the writers love to go for this same trope, or it just ends up happening. Where DH is different is that they made the MC's issues a major part of the game, and then did nothing to resolve it. It was just there as an albatross around the MC's neck and a drag on the story. Maybe they'll do something in this last update (if it is the last), but if so it would be such a strange reversal for the MC that I don't think I would buy it. So much has to happen in the next update to try to fix things that have careened out of control. I just don't see them being wrapped up well or in a believable manner. I still love the game for the renders of the women and at least their initial personalities, but the MC makes me desperately wish I could have some other choice of character to play.

I have a game I play sometimes. With these games. If I don't like the way the story is heading, I imagine my own, darker ending that maybe explains things a little bit better. Here's my head canon for DH: The MC had a complete mental breakdown after the avalanche thing, and was institutionalized. Tam and Jo are two other patients, as are the other girls. Mosely is the head doctor there. Henry is just another patient there, which explains a lot. And Dennis is maybe the bratty son of the rich guy who owns the institution who loves to come in and try to play head games with the patients and have sex with the pretty ones. He's also hacked the computer system there to mess with the MCs meds to keep him in a bad state.

In the next update, the MC leaps at Dennis in the bed, and struggles with him, only to suddenly find himself being restrained by orderlies who appeared out of nowhere. He's in the institution, coming down from another episode. Dennis is caught red-handed trying to screw a patient in his father's institution and gets sent away.

The MC looks around and sees the girls for who they are, and sees himself for who he is. Now that he knows what's real, that's more than enough to work with.

For some reason, this stuff amuses me, or at least satisfies me. I'm hoping the actual ending to the game will as well, but it would be a difficult proposition for them to give some realistic closure to everything going on.

 

[Real Kreten]

There's one update left, unless I'm missing something. There has been no character arc for the MC. Just a downward slope. If he showed growth or that he was struggling to overcome his issues, especially out of love, that would be one thing. Instead, his own inability to do anything about it has led to a situation where the women in his life feel the need to have sex with his enemy in order to protect him.

My apologies to you, but I haven't read your entire post (sometimes less means more).
But if you write at the beginning: "There has been no character arc for the MC"
Then you disqualify whatever you write later.

Mc is unable to get out of the room at the beginning of the game after a tragic accident. He is not able to face anything. He is afraid of people and their opinion. Any confrontation will drive him back to his room.

In episode 18, MC goes to the scene of his trauma to confront the demons of his past, confronting Denis at the risk of Denis using the collected information. The main thing for the MC is to protect the girls.

If you don't see it as a shift of character for the better.......

 

[Corambis]

My apologies to you, but I haven't read your entire post (sometimes less means more).
But if you write at the beginning: "There has been no character arc for the MC"
Then you disqualify whatever you write later.

Mc is unable to get out of the room at the beginning of the game after a tragic accident. He is not able to face anything. He is afraid of people and their opinion. Any confrontation will drive him back to his room.

In episode 18, MC goes to the scene of his trauma to confront the demons of his past, confronting Denis at the risk of Denis using the collected information. The main thing for the MC is to protect the girls.

If you don't see it as a shift of character for the better.......

He's there out of plot necessity. The character hasn't shown any growth or become any more sympathetic as a character. They've become worst based on their complete failure to respond to Dennis other than to give in to him, and for using several women who obviously love him as emotional support animals with benefits during the entire game. Ultimately, the MC is building a harem not because he really cares about the women, but is trying to fill the void within himself. I still hate how the first time with Tam or Jo (depending on who you chose) came down to him needing to have sex because of his bad emotional state versus anything positive. The MC just kind of uses people around him, but on a more subtle level than Dennis does.

 

[TheSpy101]

He's there out of plot necessity. The character hasn't shown any growth or become any more sympathetic as a character. They've become worst based on their complete failure to respond to Dennis other than to give in to him, and for using several women who obviously love him as emotional support animals with benefits during the entire game. Ultimately, the MC is building a harem not because he really cares about the women, but is trying to fill the void within himself. I still hate how the first time with Tam or Jo (depending on who you chose) came down to him needing to have sex because of his bad emotional state versus anything positive. The MC just kind of uses people around him, but on a more subtle level than Dennis does.

That's an interesting take, I can see that being the case but it should be noted that the MC isn't building a Harem, the player controlling the MC is, it is completely within your control who he fucks (unless it's Jo and Tam, then you can't do shit, just like several of those Amanda scenes in DFD). And I'll have to disagree on the whole "using them as emotional support animals" part. Look at it like this, this game is an AVN (Adult Visual Novel) (I'm not sure if that's the official genre, but I call it that because it makes sense), this game is written in a way that the MC can fuck anything that has a vagina and is human, but at the end of the day its also still a VN, which typically means options and in some cases, entire routes.

I'm not sure about you but personally, I've been on that "Amy route" for a long while now and Episode 18, in particular, showed me that he actually cares about this girl since in my playthrough, she's the primary romantic interest while the others are just there for more fanservice (and since fucking everyone doesn't affect the story, it's clear that's what it's for). If I were pursuing a "Morgan Ending" for example then that would make Morgan the primary romantic interest and everyone else would just be more fanservice.

So instead of looking at every sexual encounter in this game with the different members of the female cast as him "using them", I prefer to look at it as in-game fanservice because, at the end of the day, this is an AVN, this has to be in the game, but that doesn't mean it has to affect the story if we're looking at it from a gameplay point of view.

While I think DFD handled this a lot better, particularly in later chapters where the sex scenes ended up determining your ending, I think the way DH handles this is perfectly fine, having it be there as fanservice, but at the same time not affecting the story a lot and not affecting the particular route you're going down all too much.

So, if you look at the sex scenes separately from the story (Aside from the character you're actually looking to end the game with), then yes the main character has gone through a major shift in character and has almost completed his character arc.

Also, about the first Jo/Tam scene, while I wasn't a big fan of the reasoning, I understand where AW was coming from. This wasn't about the MC being in a bad state of mind, this was about genuine fear for the future and while I think this wasn't the best reason imaginable (not even close), I don't think it was completely 100% selfish and I definitely don't think that he was "using them as emotional support animals".

 

[Corambis]

That's an interesting take, I can see that being the case but it should be noted that the MC isn't building a Harem, the player controlling the MC is, it is completely within your control who he fucks (unless it's Jo and Tam, then you can't do shit, just like several of those Amanda scenes in DFD). And I'll have to disagree on the whole "using them as emotional support animals" part. Look at it like this, this game is an AVN (Adult Visual Novel) (I'm not sure if that's the official genre, but I call it that because it makes sense), this game is written in a way that the MC can fuck anything that has a vagina and is human, but at the end of the day its also still a VN, which typically means options and in some cases, entire routes.

I'm not sure about you but personally, I've been on that "Amy route" for a long while now and Episode 18, in particular, showed me that he actually cares about this girl since in my playthrough, she's the primary romantic interest while the others are just there for more fanservice (and since fucking everyone doesn't affect the story, it's clear that's what it's for). If I were pursuing a "Morgan Ending" for example then that would make Morgan the primary romantic interest and everyone else would just be more fanservice.

So instead of looking at every sexual encounter in this game with the different members of the female cast as him "using them", I prefer to look at it as in-game fanservice because, at the end of the day, this is an AVN, this has to be in the game, but that doesn't mean it has to affect the story if we're looking at it from a gameplay point of view.

While I think DFD handled this a lot better, particularly in later chapters where the sex scenes ended up determining your ending, I think the way DH handles this is perfectly fine, having it be there as fanservice, but at the same time not affecting the story a lot and not affecting the particular route you're going down all too much.

So, if you look at the sex scenes separately from the story (Aside from the character you're actually looking to end the game with), then yes the main character has gone through a major shift in character and has almost completed his character arc.

Also, about the first Jo/Tam scene, while I wasn't a big fan of the reasoning, I understand where AW was coming from. This wasn't about the MC being in a bad state of mind, this was about genuine fear for the future and while I think this wasn't the best reason imaginable (not even close), I don't think it was completely 100% selfish and I definitely don't think that he was "using them as emotional support animals".

All pretty fair points. My focus has been on Jo and Tam, and the first sexual encounter really didn't sit well with me. I don't think either Jo or Tam had sex with the MC then because the time was right for them, but rather because the MC made a point out of needing to be with them for reasons that were largely selfish and focused on himself. I think it was another attempt at doing something different or "deep" with the story that didn't really succeed.

The MC is clearly not in a good place for this entire story though. I think he is needy sexually above and beyond "I'm a standard porn game guy". I'll also agree it's not necessarily a harem, or at least I don't think you're obligated to pursue every girl. I think he does care for Amy and the others, although as with all of these games that is colored somewhat by his involvement with at least two other girls depending on your choices. Emotionally though, he takes far more than he gives.

As you pointed out, each girl's path kind of stands alone, other than the Jo and Tam thing which is intertwined with everything else to a certain extent. It probably should be an issue, too. I wasn't satisfied with how the Jo and Tam conflict was resolved, and I suspect that conflict between any of the women will never really be addressed. In my mind it should be though. If they wanted to inject drama into this game, I'd have loved for it to be between the women and as a result of the MC's choices versus the Dennis and Mosely stuff that just happens.

Despite what I say, I do enjoy the game. I love the graphics. The female characters were well developed at the beginning, although they seem less distinct over time. Every single male character, especially the MC, is a disappointment. The writing is technically great, especially in the realm of erotic games, but so much of the story doesn't work for me. I think they tried really hard to make a game that took chances, but they chose poorly on a lot of them and they didn't really pay off. I see a lot of potential for them to have taken a lot of the elements of this game and have made something much better. Honestly, this game would have been better if they wouldn't have tried so hard. That sounds like an awful thing to say, but had they gone a more traditional route, the game would have been awesome based on the visuals and technical aspects of the writing alone, without other things to actively detract from it.

 

[Zed | Love-Joint]

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Episode 19, the final episode, will be released on

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this month!

 

[IamJAG]

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View attachment 888800

Episode 19, the final episode, will be released on

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this month!

The loss of Palmer really was heartbreaking, but i'm glad to see you guys are doing his baby the final justice. Looking forward to the grand finale of this epic tale.

 

[popalsfs]

Has anyone the new bonus scenes?
Great work btw!

 

[Luigi08]

The loss of Palmer really was heartbreaking, but i'm glad to see you guys are doing his baby the final justice. Looking forward to the grand finale of this epic tale.

My question is how did he pass away? Not for a morbid sense of relief or anything but in hopes that it was peacefully and as painlessly as possible.

 

[sumpfnudel]

My question is how did he pass away? Not for a morbid sense of relief or anything but in hopes that it was peacefully and as painlessly as possible.

From the Love-Joint Patreon Side:

FAQ
Q: What happened to Palmer?
A: We don’t know exactly. But it was sudden and unexpected. And he is gone.

 

[Luigi08]

From the Love-Joint Patreon Side:

FAQ
Q: What happened to Palmer?
A: We don’t know exactly. But it was sudden and unexpected. And he is gone.

thank you, your answer is better than none, and should only be respected. Even without knowing 'em I only express my condolences to the loss of a loved one.

 

[BadWolf71]

As I said on the Discord server. I hate death and I'm tired of death. Death may bring lasting peace to the one that has departed, but death kills the hearts and minds of the ones left behind.

 

[Zed | Love-Joint]

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[cxx]

so not gonna happen.

 

[Zed | Love-Joint]

so not gonna happen.

What's not going to happen?

 

[Holy Bacchus]

What's not going to happen?

Probably that 3-letter acronym people were throwing around here a while ago. The preview definitively debunks that notion for all those people who were very clearly wrong in the first place.

 

[cxx]

What's not going to happen?

that mc beats the shit out of dennis.

i don't care if game has *acronym* content or not. i find those wars funny.

 

[10xRecoil]

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View attachment 898464

Ah, a sight for sore eyes!

 

[Mr. Vargas]

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View attachment 898464

Thank you for the update Zed. I'm so glad that you choose not a dark themed game after all happened in this disastrous year. We definitely need some happiness and joy in our life. I'm also happy that you guys considering downloadable format for your next game. I hope your next game will be a RenPy game. I wish you best luck in your future projects.