That is not what those posts were about. Your posts were about the creators being put in prison for false pedophilia charges you imagined up and being raped. They didn't even have any other substance to them beyond multiple posts of this unnecessary content, much less anything whatsoever about the business model of the game.
Moderators are having to do their job because some people are simply spamming off topic content or comments, or stuff that violates the rules excessively in this thread. Just keep it appropriate and on topic. Everyone knows you got an agenda here but there are ways to communicate it without breaking rules, that is all. (my post seemed to have gotten nuke as product of quoting yours, too. rip)
not trying to dodge the question just not entirely sure what you mean, the only thing that changed is window where you can still buy the 36$ tier, if you didn't opt in you only need to pay 15$ or with ingame currencies (not sure if this still implies)
This was found searching with the following on Google: "rebuild team" inurl:"fallen-doll"
Maybe someone can tweak it a bit and find a cap of the original comment. Either way the above is obviously not common in agile, it's the literal antithesis of agile.
That convo is still around, though a little cleaned up. I probably have more caps of it saved somewhere, but I think these alone give the general gist. Large periods of silence and no builds is his idea of agile.
That convo is still around, though a little cleaned up. I probably have more caps of it saved somewhere, but I think these alone give the general gist. Large periods of silence and no builds is his idea of agile.
Colress
A bit of a wall of text here maybe. Let’s talk about the outside investment, and bear in mind on this silence speaks volumes since offers alone don’t come with NDAs.
To start, Helius has been open in the past that more money = more influence on the project. Even if it was something objectionable.
The 15 million dollar offer came in not long before the Harem update in November of that year. Prior to that, most of the staff was happy to hate on gacha and even say they’d never go for something like Nutaku do to it wanting free to play and said gacha.
Now the game is obviously a free to play gacha now, which seems to imply the investment was taken. And the fact the first harem release was so rushed feeling, as though there was a last minute direction change due to, say, a big investment seem to imply it was accepted. Though more than that the screenshots of Helius accepting the offer would imply he’s accepted it.
So, with that sfw campaign gone and a third party having it’s hand in the project we kinda need to know how deep that goes. To what extent do backers still have an influence on the project? To what extent has this third party developer forced Helius' hand? Given the timeline, the statement it was to be accepted, and the sudden shift to a new model I think it's clear that some deal happened. How much has that influenced things?
So, with that sfw campaign gone and a third party having it’s hand in the project we kinda need to know how deep that goes. To what extent do backers still have an influence on the project? To what extent has this third party developer forced Helius' hand? Given the timeline, the statement it was to be accepted, and the sudden shift to a new model I think it's clear that some deal happened. How much has that influenced things?
Removing the rest of the post because its a bit more complicated and just going to approach the core issue.
From what I can see Helius has specific goals and the backers are able to influence things to a degree within a set framework, but ultimately Helius has a project Helius wants to realize. Helius has taken feedback but as for how much influences will impact things going forward it seems that polls and major changes are going to be off the table soon until the alpha rebuild goes live and makes significant progress since doing that plus taking even more changes with already limited progress would only serve to hurt the project, ex. Star Citizen. The last major poll is up and it will probably be some time into beta before Helius starts looking at more major feedback and polls.
I wouldn't be surprised if community response has some impact on the existing framework but in terms of features, design, and so forth I suspect it will be more subtle for many months going forward in its current state.
As for the deal prior mentioned? I don't know enough to comment too much on what Helius has done regarding their financials or deals. As far as I get in terms of impressions of the situation it seems like Helius has dominant control over the game and not some financial backer. I don't think the gacha is because of a deal but because Helius realized its valuable along with the content delivery season passes, though perhaps communications from those that offered such related deals may have educated and thus influenced Helius' regarding these concepts, but I could be wrong. Helius talks about tweaking the grinding rates and also allowing some automated grinding systems such as in Erotes so I don't think it will be too bad and is more of a system intended to extend the game's longevity. The multiplayer has some benefits for more complex systems, anti-piracy measures (to an extent), unique sex features for those who like it, while allowing you to set invisible if you want to disengage from the multiplayer aspect. I'm sure there is more I've missed on both the gacha model and multiplayer aspect which is kind of Helius fault for not better communicating objectives and reasoning for these two, but it may help set a frame of mind.
To be fair name a game where its fans are like "fuck yes! it has gatcha!" Thought so. It is done because its a very lucrative concept and if done well it can be very profitable while not being a glaring problem for the players. The multiplayer aspect is something they have their own vision on and while they could communicate it better some of the reasons are understandable. Do you think games are made by adhering to every single person's want? No, games are ultimately a function of what the creator wants to produce, not the fans. The fans can opt to not support it in a fan backed project like this but as we can see they're still readily supporting it and it obviously isn't a huge complaint even if its not exactly popular. The online component isn't really a problem anyways and is blown up by a bunch of self-conscious people with disorders who can't accept invisible mode because of unhealthy paranoia. I have no idea what your piece about F2P is.
Well...yes...but my point was that they're reinvesting in shite for the very reason that all this is against the players directly, it's not just an inconvenience or whatever.
Nobody wants a gatcha.
Nobody wants multiplayer, for objective reasons like performance, not just privacy (which is...kind of a big deal, not just something about 'insecurities'...)
And not one of the patrons wants fucking F2P after they PAID for the game for MONTHS or years, and all they get is some stupid packs of xyz.
All of this isn't just a slight inconvenience as you seem to be picturing it. It's a massive 'fuck you' to everybody and if a normal game studio would pull this shit they would lose a lot more support, but the partial monopoly that helius has allows him to fuck everyone over I guess.
It's such a big 'fuck you' that I'm glad I just pirate all their shit instead of buying it, and that says something no matter the product, especially when I'm certainly not alone
Colress
A bit of a wall of text here maybe. Let’s talk about the outside investment, and bear in mind on this silence speaks volumes since offers alone don’t come with NDAs.
To start, Helius has been open in the past that more money = more influence on the project. Even if it was something objectionable.
The 15 million dollar offer came in not long before the Harem update in November of that year. Prior to that, most of the staff was happy to hate on gacha and even say they’d never go for something like Nutaku do to it wanting free to play and said gacha.
Now the game is obviously a free to play gacha now, which seems to imply the investment was taken. And the fact the first harem release was so rushed feeling, as though there was a last minute direction change due to, say, a big investment seem to imply it was accepted. Though more than that the screenshots of Helius accepting the offer would imply he’s accepted it.
So, with that sfw campaign gone and a third party having it’s hand in the project we kinda need to know how deep that goes. To what extent do backers still have an influence on the project? To what extent has this third party developer forced Helius' hand? Given the timeline, the statement it was to be accepted, and the sudden shift to a new model I think it's clear that some deal happened. How much has that influenced things?
as far as it stand now no investment has been taking this has been the direction helius wanted to take the game in, the 15 million deal got put on the back burner but would be a back up in the future if there would be enough interest for a campaign more details on this i also do not have, only that currently there is no 3rd party but there has been interest from larger companies
as far as it stand now no investment has been taking this has been the direction helius wanted to take the game in, the 15 million deal got put on the back burner but would be a back up in the future if there would be enough interest for a campaign more details on this i also do not have, only that currently there is no 3rd party but there has been interest from larger companies
I know you may not have access to too much financial stuff like that, but I'm really gonna need more than that to take your word on it. What we have in favor of it being taken is
The changes made fit the timeline of when the offer came in. (A couple months before harem with harem debuting gacha)
The changes were what Nutaku and competitors were requesting. (Freemium and gacha, which Helius was stated against previously)
Helius pretty much stating money = influence for this project. (Poor Oregano, the dude so wanted to smooth things over)
A statement from Helius they would accept and use it to expand the team.
Expansion of the team this year after a wretched launch that left you in the red most of the year you were hiring.
Let's do this in layers. You're going to need something substantial to say that all happened by pure coincidence.
Assuming you can manage something like that, follow up:
Why did Helius spend the first delay lying about gacha/freemium? If that wasn't a last minute request from a new investor than he would've known he was working towards free to play gacha while assuring people that's not what was happening during the first hiatus.
Where is the money to hire and expand the team coming from that he apparently didn't have last year but now has, even though he's making less now than he was then?
I know you may not have access to too much financial stuff like that, but I'm really gonna need more than that to take your word on it. What we have in favor of it being taken is
The changes made fit the timeline of when the offer came in. (A couple months before harem with harem debuting gacha)
The changes were what Nutaku and competitors were requesting. (Freemium and gacha, which Helius was stated against previously)
Helius pretty much stating money = influence for this project. (Poor Oregano, the dude so wanted to smooth things over)
A statement from Helius they would accept and use it to expand the team.
Expansion of the team this year after a wretched launch that left you in the red most of the year you were hiring.
Let's do this in layers. You're going to need something substantial to say that all happened by pure coincidence.
Assuming you can manage something like that, follow up:
Why did Helius spend the first delay lying about gacha/freemium? If that wasn't a last minute request from a new investor than he would've known he was working towards free to play gacha while assuring people that's not what was happening during the first hiatus.
Where is the money to hire and expand the team coming from that he apparently didn't have last year but now has, even though he's making less now than he was then?
You won't get those questions answered. They are not obligated to disclose investors and there is plenty of reason why they would not want to say if they have one. If they don't have one, well how he is supposed to prove it ?
Where is the money to hire and expand the team coming from that he apparently didn't have last year but now has, even though he's making less now than he was then?
-They got cash injection from selling beta access.
-They only hit the big numbers last year. During 2020 the project has grown by 250%. Having experienced such growth you can't really commit all that money to hiring people. You need a pool of money as backup in case of decline in support. Now they probably have that reserve. So even if they are making less then what they have last year they can commit much higher % of that money to hiring people.
Well...yes...but my point was that they're reinvesting in shite for the very reason that all this is against the players directly, it's not just an inconvenience or whatever.
Nobody wants a gatcha.
Nobody wants multiplayer, for objective reasons like performance, not just privacy (which is...kind of a big deal, not just something about 'insecurities'...)
And not one of the patrons wants fucking F2P after they PAID for the game for MONTHS or years, and all they get is some stupid packs of xyz.
All of this isn't just a slight inconvenience as you seem to be picturing it. It's a massive 'fuck you' to everybody and if a normal game studio would pull this shit they would lose a lot more support, but the partial monopoly that helius has allows him to fuck everyone over I guess.
"Nobody wants" is something we can easily agree on as said features don't really bring anything good to the table .(well the multiplayer might for some, we will ignore them).
But the question is how many out of those will tolerate those features and how many will actively avoid the game because of them.
I think the latter will be in minority.
It's such a big 'fuck you' that I'm glad I just pirate all their shit instead of buying it, and that says something no matter the product, especially when I'm certainly not alone
I think if you really wanna boycott something you shouldn't be pirating it, that is when it really says something.
If you pirate it then it is shallow and begs the question "what if you couldn't pirate it?". I've seen people change their song enough times to know that you can only know answer to that question when it happens.
You won't get those questions answered. They are not obligated to disclose investors and there is plenty of reason why they would not want to say if they have one. If they don't have one, well how he is supposed to prove it ?
I'm not the tax man trying to bust them. There's some pretty important implications that come with it for backers. Galatea isn't the only character MIA, there's also the horse and pig monsters who had in game models previewed and have had nothing done with them. A bigger company investing would be another source of pressure to transition to more moderate content. And people just generally don't like crowdfunding mixing with actual businesses backing the project.
As for proof, anything timestamped from Helius contradicting him actually going through with it that wasn't part of the later backtrack from the backlash. Any novel info on it really without a Miya/Pasix PR spin. Or info pre the offer showing it was headed free to play and gacha. No shortage of ways really.
-They got cash injection from selling beta access.
-They only hit the big numbers last year. During 2020 the project has grown by 250%. Having experienced such growth you can't really commit all that money to hiring people. You need a pool of money as backup in case of decline in support. Now they probably have that reserve. So even if they are making less then what they have last year they can commit much higher % of that money to hiring people.
The hiring quote from him is towards the end of 2021. He'd be aware at the point of how much he could hire without the investment. I might be getting too specific on that question, though my point is just it fits the timeline and statement of what he'd use the investment for. On its own, probably not indicative of much. With everything else it starts to add up.
I know you may not have access to too much financial stuff like that, but I'm really gonna need more than that to take your word on it. What we have in favor of it being taken is
The changes made fit the timeline of when the offer came in. (A couple months before harem with harem debuting gacha)
The changes were what Nutaku and competitors were requesting. (Freemium and gacha, which Helius was stated against previously)
Helius pretty much stating money = influence for this project. (Poor Oregano, the dude so wanted to smooth things over)
A statement from Helius they would accept and use it to expand the team.
Expansion of the team this year after a wretched launch that left you in the red most of the year you were hiring.
Let's do this in layers. You're going to need something substantial to say that all happened by pure coincidence.
Assuming you can manage something like that, follow up:
Why did Helius spend the first delay lying about gacha/freemium? If that wasn't a last minute request from a new investor than he would've known he was working towards free to play gacha while assuring people that's not what was happening during the first hiatus.
Where is the money to hire and expand the team coming from that he apparently didn't have last year but now has, even though he's making less now than he was then?
Look this question won't lead to anything, nor is it something i can really answer without showing some kind of information on paper, even if I'd give posted information there is no way to confirm or deny on your end nor anyway to believe in what I'm saying so no matter what statement i give you tried filling in the gap's no matter if what im saying is right or wrong it's impossible to change someone's mind on the subject unless like i said i have some "official" way of proving this and i don't want to be blunt but helius has no obligations or reason to share that information publicly nor do have I access to such information, i do not say you need to take everything being said as face value and i do believe some form of skepticism is healthy to have. I can only provide you with information that is shared with me, which is what i stated above i do not really have a incentive too lie about information that I'm sharing but again it's fair enough too have some skepticism.
Look this question won't lead to anything, nor is it something i can really answer without showing some kind of information on paper, even if I'd give posted information there is no way to confirm or deny on your end nor anyway to believe in what I'm saying so no matter what statement i give you tried filling in the gap's no matter if what im saying is right or wrong it's impossible to change someone's mind on the subject unless like i said i have some "official" way of proving this and i don't want to be blunt but helius has no obligations or reason to share that information publicly nor do have I access to such information, i do not say you need to take everything being said as face value and i do believe some form of skepticism is healthy to have. I can only provide you with information that is shared with me, which is what i stated above i do not really have a incentive too lie about information that I'm sharing but again it's fair enough too have some skepticism.
Yes, you're right in that Helius has no obligation to share that and can sell the game to whoever, but he isn't free from criticism on it. That indignant "Backers deserve to know nothing" treatment that comes with major decisions in the project like this, any swap from one project to the next, freemium/gacha, more extreme content put on hold etc, etc is what gets Helius the rep as a dishonest dev. Helius can decide whatever he wants in the background, but if backers didn't want those decisions and they were hidden then he's certainly not an honest up front kind of guy.
But you're right that we've hit a dead end on this topic so we can drop it.
As much as I appreciate Colress willingness to shed light into this mess, why exactly are we taking PH's past/present/future statements at face value? Even the whole "we got an offer/investors wanted changes" sub plot could be completely made up. We know they often stall and/or openly go back in their words while banning naysayers. I'm sorry but the PH team has 0 credibility. And even with screenshots proving their constant shifts in narrative, some people will always try to play with words to put them in a good light.
taboge9459 I've learned that, if you derail from political correcteness, you get silenced, that's how it goes here and it's one of the reasons I've been posting less and also shorter comments.
Look this question won't lead to anything, nor is it something i can really answer without showing some kind of information on paper, even if I'd give posted information there is no way to confirm or deny on your end nor anyway to believe in what I'm saying so no matter what statement i give you tried filling in the gap's no matter if what im saying is right or wrong it's impossible to change someone's mind on the subject unless like i said i have some "official" way of proving this and i don't want to be blunt but helius has no obligations or reason to share that information publicly nor do have I access to such information, i do not say you need to take everything being said as face value and i do believe some form of skepticism is healthy to have. I can only provide you with information that is shared with me, which is what i stated above i do not really have a incentive too lie about information that I'm sharing but again it's fair enough too have some skepticism.
Can we start with you using periods please? Granted, you have no obligations to do so.
Yet, a disorganized writing shows a disorganized mind. I wonder if you can get a grip and come across as someone who has his shit together. I mean this in a supportive way.
Can we start with you using periods please? Granted, you have no obligations to do so.
Yet, a disorganized writing shows a disorganized mind. I wonder if you can get a grip and come across as someone who has his shit together. I mean this in a supportive way.
Don't know if he's a dev or not because I haven't been paying attention, but I can already picture what his code looks like if he is...
I can't even be arsed to read something like that wall of text to be honest...I mean, it's not like it's going to be anything useful to us anyway
As much as I appreciate Colress willingness to shed light into this mess, why exactly are we taking PH's past/present/future statements at face value? Even the whole "we got an offer/investors wanted changes" sub plot could be completely made up. We know they often stall and/or openly go back in their words while banning naysayers. I'm sorry but the PH team has 0 credibility. And even with screenshots proving their constant shifts in narrative, some people will always try to play with words to put them in a good light.
taboge9459 I've learned that, if you derail from political correcteness, you get silenced, that's how it goes here and it's one of the reasons I've been posting less and also shorter comments.
This was the only thing i could offer, like i said in the beginning i do not know everything helius does only thing i can do is shed some light on our side of the conversation with the information we have. if you believe this or not is for you to decide, I'm at least glad not everyone on this forum is acting like children trying to throw mud and was able to have normal conversation, everyone has their own opinion on this situation and reasonably so. it's oke to have some skepticism time will tell on how this story evolves from here on. that being said I'll probably move away from the forum soon and hope everyone here the best i'm also sure taboge9459 will let everyone know if something changes or there is some new news about the game. you can always contact me on discord or helius discord if there is any need for clarification.
This was the only thing i could offer, like i said in the beginning i do not know everything helius does only thing i can do is shed some light on our side of the conversation with the information we have. if you believe this or not is for you to decide, I'm at least glad not everyone on this forum is acting like children trying to throw mud and was able to have normal conversation, everyone has their own opinion on this situation and reasonably so. it's oke to have some skepticism time will tell on how this story evolves from here on. that being said I'll probably move away from the forum soon and hope everyone here the best i'm also sure taboge9459 will let everyone know if something changes or there is some new news about the game. you can always contact me on discord or helius discord if there is any need for clarification.
This thread would be less vitriolic if there were anything positive to talk about but there isn't. Discord leakers are the only news source and the news usually makes Helius look incompetent and/or greedy.
This was the only thing i could offer, like i said in the beginning i do not know everything helius does only thing i can do is shed some light on our side of the conversation with the information we have. if you believe this or not is for you to decide, I'm at least glad not everyone on this forum is acting like children trying to throw mud and was able to have normal conversation, everyone has their own opinion on this situation and reasonably so. it's oke to have some skepticism time will tell on how this story evolves from here on. that being said I'll probably move away from the forum soon and hope everyone here the best i'm also sure taboge9459 will let everyone know if something changes or there is some new news about the game. you can always contact me on discord or helius discord if there is any need for clarification.
Oh god this is more responsibility than I've ever had before. Anyway I'll probably abstain from posting in the discord still, but we might be able to rig up another game of telephone if any big news drops. Akukin discord guy, keep the flame alive. Thanks for coming, there might not be much to share at the moment but maybe that's on us for doing this after a year of silence.
Don't know if he's a dev or not because I haven't been paying attention, but I can already picture what his code looks like if he is...
I can't even be arsed to read something like that wall of text to be honest...I mean, it's not like it's going to be anything useful to us anyway
Play nice. His first language isn't english. One of the languages with compound words that take up approximately half the page each iirc. We can get him back for the big insider info when things fold if we treat him well.
