VN Ren'Py Abandoned Fallen Roads [v0.2] [Boketto Games]

[Antonie van Leeuwenhoek]

The event happened in game and the MC was clearly upset - so I think it counts.

This update ended with the MC still thinking she cheated. He hasn't forgiven her.
The assumption is he will. But then, the last update ended with the assumption that Ava cheated.

Maybe I missed something, but Annie never stated that she believes Ava - just that the MC should talk to her.
It might be no more than 'you need to hear her out'. Or not - we don't know.


The last action we saw of Ava was rejecting Bryce.
If you want to believe that doesn't count because of the way she acted before that, then that is your choice. I disagree.

I don't know how you got that impression. All i could deduce was directions and story telling being outrageously flawed.

 

[Avaron1974]

I mean there's so many coincidences that this story can hardly be called realistic. Also I don't think the characters really behave realistic but I guess that's up to the interpretation.

That's the thing and why some people are having a hard time with this, Ava DID behave realistically.

That's how cheaters act.

That exact story is up on r/survivinginfidelity or r/relationships about a guy who's girlfriend was invited to a party by 2 of her male friends. He wasn't invited and said it sounded suspicious but she didn't listen to him and went anyway.

She came back 2 days later claiming to have been raped but people at the party saw her go upstairs with the guys willingly.

 

[clowns234]

The event happened in game and the MC was clearly upset - so I think it counts.

This update ended with the MC still thinking she cheated. He hasn't forgiven her.
The assumption is he will. But then, the last update ended with the assumption that Ava cheated.

Maybe I missed something, but Annie never stated that she believes Ava - just that the MC should talk to her.
It might be no more than 'you need to hear her out'. Or not - we don't know.


The last action we saw of Ava was rejecting Bryce.
If you want to believe that doesn't count because of the way she acted before that, then that is your choice. I disagree.

I don't know how you got that impression. All i could deduce was directions and story telling being outrageously flawed.

Which of the above do you disagree with?

 

[PJWhoopie]

And aren't Bryce and Dick/Richard Best Friends?

if So, how did Ava and Annie date two dudes best friend, went to the same school at the same time... and not know each other?

 

[clowns234]

Mate that is the dev's poor excuse to paint her in a more sympathetic light. As the dev has doubled down with the realism argument, let me tell you something you might not know about Ecstasy/Molly. This drug (or most date rape drugs) does not impair judgement, that is why in the legislation around the world the condition to say it is date rape is that the victim is incapacitated (the dose has to be so high that the victim can not fight). Let me put it in another way, while the drug does give altered sensations it does not impair judgement. That is why you wont see a defense against robbery based on Molly.

While Ava is indeed incapacitated at some point, she would have agreed to cheat on the MC even without the drug. At levels beneath the incapacitation threshold Molly just makes the sex experience more intense. Molly takes about 45 min to take effect so she was not under the effect of the drug when she accepted to go upstairs.

I know little about Molly. I do know a lot about booze. I know from personal experience, people can make terrible decisions while drunk. People can also drink until they pass out. They are not aware of their surroundings until the next day when the alcohol leaves their system. I also know women who like to flirt, especially when they drink. Not a reason to justify raping them. Not a reason to assume 'she had it coming'.

 

[Antonie van Leeuwenhoek]

Which of the above do you disagree with?

(1) why is Annie courting for Ava? Why she asks mc to "listen her out"?
(2) would you believe that Ava did cheat on mc or had intention to cheat if dev showed them fucking together? because that was the only thing left to suggest the obvious.
(3) description says that characters are flawed so does your review but the story says otherwise being the major culprit.

 

[clowns234]

And aren't Bryce and Dick/Richard Best Friends?

if So, how did Ava and Annie date two dudes best friend, went to the same school at the same time... and not know each other?

I think that the Dev is setting up another plot twist. The Dev spends a lot of time on when they were kids. Lots of dots to connect down the road.

 

[KillaMonka]

I agree with most of the opinions here about the Ava situation. It's a weird situation that has changed how I think of her role from Chapter 1, I was interested in how will her role as a cheater will play out because I was interested to see how I would react to remorseful cheater as an LI. But, now I feel nothing on her role but that this unnecessary baggage for the both of us, more depressive thoughts for the Mc to have to deal with and for Ava redemption and overcoming her trauma's and fear of others.

For Annie, I still don't see her in that much of a negative light yet, but I'm afraid that won't be for long depending on the future reveals for her reason for the trip. Maybe it's because I think I need a person like Annie to make become "normal" again by becoming more socially active, but that's beside the point. I think the reason for her to become that angry after hearing Ava's story is that she believed that Dick and Bryce are that much of scumbags that would do something like that, so she believed her story and she wanted to us hear her story because she thought we would as well.

Now the problem I have with the story is that I'm almost certain that the Bully bros aren't only going to be shown in the flashbacks. I believe that the trip Annie is making to NY to meet Dick and try to get back together, so she can try to help her parent's economic problems. I say this because the two major LI's we have would have a clear character arc that involves getting revenge on them.

Now the last thing remaining to solve is who is her what that means for the MC's character arc, depending on who she is it would have different meanings. If she is MC's mom it would have to do with the financial ruin that happened to his family, and as result, his Mum overworking to death as a result. On the other hand, it could be a LI that has died, but I wouldn't expect because we are made to believe that since Annie and Mc started Uni they haven't had the same relationship as before as she didn't know that much about Ava, and it seems Annie knows all about "Her" and the impact of her death(?) had on the MC and lastly Annie's Mom knows about it as well (her, on the other hand, could be referencing to what happened to MC's family) so it can't a Li in my opinion. If the assumption is correct about Her being his Mom then I'm Bryce and Dick's family will have some involvement as well on this plot as well.

 

[clowns234]

(1) why is Annie courting for Ava? Why she asks mc to "listen her out"?
(2) would you believe that Ava did cheat on mc or had intention to cheat if dev showed them fucking together? because that was the only thing left to suggest the obvious.
(3) description says that characters are flawed so does your review but the story says otherwise being the major culprit.

1) Annie has picked up on some stuff - such as the pepper spray. I think it is reasonable for her to see that what Ava said was possible and for her to want MC to hear what Ava has to say. As I said, Annie hasn't said she believes Ava. Just that she thinks MC should hear her out.
2) If she was fully awake and he didn't force himself on her, then yes I would see that as cheating. The fact that the Dev showed Bryce undressing next to her passed out body suggests it wasn't consensual. Had she been looking at him with a smile, then yea - she definitely cheated.
3) When I say flawed, I mean they have 'mental health issues'. The Dev made sure to point out that she has a history with drugs and drinking (addiction?). Also, I don't believe her home life growing up was ideal. As for the MC, most people don't give up on life simply because a girlfriend cheated on him years (?) before. I'd say the MC has some major depression issues.

My point (mostly) is that people are drawing conclusions with so many things still unknown. I don't think the facts back up some people's conclusions.

 

[eddie987]

And aren't Bryce and Dick/Richard Best Friends?

if So, how did Ava and Annie date two dudes best friend, went to the same school at the same time... and not know each other?

You're talking crazy. They are not best friends, just brothers...
Part of the dialogue in the confession flashack:

sam "If you call saving your ass from getting beaten up from Bryce again an introduction…"​

mc "Yup. Fuck that guy."​

sam "And his brother."​

a "Richard."​

mc "Dick."​

a "Kinda fitting that Dick is short for Richard.​

 

[Theboss3213]

I'm generally with you, Boss... it's not clear whether this game deserves an NTR tag. "Rape that felt like NTR to the MC, because the MC did not know the full story..." rather stretches the definition of NTR. I suppose it's technically possible that it could be _both_ rape and NTR -- but I don't think there's a good case for that, at least not yet, based on what we know.

Like you, I am annoyed by the constant, obsessive policing of this kink... which, at its most comical, can involve demands for the NTR tag when a LI is in a room with another guy she finds attractive.

But... Boss -- as I've said before, arguing for a narrow, reasonable (i.e. accurate) definition of NTR in these forums is like Butch & Sundance taking on the entire Bolivian Army... it's just not going to end well.

1000% agree with this Raife!

Like I said my only issue was the MC not knowing what happened other than the "what he said she said" dilemma that occurred. He feels jealous, but if the LI did get raped why would the MC feel jealousy, that is not the Basis of NTR. Sure some NTR stories start with rape but they always evolve into something more and the MC is almost always never around the rape part. In this case, nobody knows if there was cheating or not. I do usually avoid NTR debates since long ago bro. But this one intrigued me, given that the MC doesn't know the truth apparently and is basing his jealousy on just rape. I haven't read a single NTR story where the MC gets jealous cause his LI is getting raped. It just sounds absurd. Obviously, in the NTR stories, MC can go from anger to jealousy when the rape evolves from rape to lustful interest.

I'm not gonna go into it anymore though. But I would like devs to state if there is NTR or not in the game from the get-go. It's 2021...everyone that works on adult games should know by now what NTR is anyway.

 

[Fakeuser002]

>Maaaan I'm gonna need to blunts for this

 

[v1900]

I know little about Molly. I do know a lot about booze. I know from personal experience, people can make terrible decisions while drunk. People can also drink until they pass out. They are not aware of their surroundings until the next day when the alcohol leaves their system. I also know women who like to flirt, especially when they drink. Not a reason to justify raping them. Not a reason to assume 'she had it coming'.

The argument that I tried to make is not if she had it coming. The argument I tried to make is that she was going to cheat even if not drugged. That is why some argue that the dev changed the narrative from cheater (V.0.1) to rape victim (V.0.2). The events leading to the scene when she passes out are all in accordance with the cheater scenario, she knew what she was getting herself in the moment she decided to lie to her boyfriend, she saw the writing on the wall and all was going according to plan until she lost consciousness. Your argument is valid as it is indeed rape because she lost consciousness but she was going to do it regardless.

The thing that rubs the wrong way everybody here is that she is the victim of rape by a technicality (and she might get sympathy for that) but it is not a magical reason that erases that she was cheating the MC and it is not a burden that the MC should carry, even if Annie gets pissed about it.

 

[Antonie van Leeuwenhoek]

As for the MC, most people don't give up on life simply because a girlfriend cheated on him years (?) before.

But most people don't accompany cheating junkie of a ex girlfriend who had histories of bad decisions with them after shit load of years and especially those who are overcoming addiction, thats farrrr from reality in any universe.

 

[Alex5280]

I don't think that Bryce raped Ava. He showed reluctance to go that far through the night. He definitely wanted to fuck her and tried to get her in the mood by slipping her some molly, but I don't think he was willing to go as far as raping her, because he actually liked her. I think Dick probably stripped Ava and took the pic and sent it to the MC after Bryce passed out. Dick was pushing hard for Bryce to fuck Ava by any means necessary and seemed to know exactly why the MC showed up in the morning. I think his motive was to get back at the MC for stopping Dick's relationship with Annie and that is why Annie was so pissed off after hearing Ava's side of the story.

On another note, maybe Annie was hired by the MC's father to bring him to see him, knowing the MC wouldn't come if he asked for him to come. That is why she is being so secretive about the trip.

 

[kartolas]

I don't think that Bryce raped Ava. He showed reluctance to go that far through the night. He definitely wanted to fuck her and tried to get her in the mood by slipping her some molly, but I don't think he was willing to go as far as raping her, because he actually liked her. I think Dick probably stripped Ava and took the pic and sent it to the MC after Bryce passed out. Dick was pushing hard for Bryce to fuck Ava by any means necessary and seemed to know exactly why the MC showed up in the morning. I think his motive was to get back at the MC for stopping Dick's relationship with Annie and that is why Annie was so pissed off after hearing Ava's side of the story.

On another note, maybe Annie was hired by the MC's father to bring him to see him, knowing the MC wouldn't come if he asked for him to come. That is why she is being so secretive about the trip.

Makes sense.

 

[Zephea]

Well... this is certainly one confusing mess. Was Ava raped or not? Should she have gone in the first place? Very relevant questions - but neither would change my opinion towards her at this point. She is no longer, to me, an LI in any sense of the word.
Annie? If Bryce and/or Dick are part of her upcoming NY experience - I hope we have the option to just grab our bag and walk off into the sunset. Broken or not - I would want nothing to do with it. Just not telling me before we left or on the way makes that one a deal breaker.
Since neither of the females are LI's or truly potential LI's... several cliffhangers are hanging over us. Just have to wait and see if our MC has a 'set' or if he takes the path of no return.

 

[Osamabeenfappin]

Well... this is certainly one confusing mess. Was Ava raped or not? Should she have gone in the first place? Very relevant questions - but neither would change my opinion towards her at this point. She is no longer, to me, an LI in any sense of the word.
Annie? If Bryce and/or Dick are part of her upcoming NY experience - I hope we have the option to just grab our bag and walk off into the sunset. Broken or not - I would want nothing to do with it. Just not telling me before we left or on the way makes that one a deal breaker.
Since neither of the females are LI's or truly potential LI's... several cliffhangers are hanging over us. Just have to wait and see if our MC has a 'set' or if he takes the path of no return.

It seems at least to me that Annie is prepping to fuck the MC over in a major way.

But the MC just needs to understand,because he is apparently destined to be their doormat for eternity.

 

[clowns234]

But most people don't accompany cheating junkie of a ex girlfriend who had histories of bad decisions with them after shit load of years and especially those who are overcoming addiction, thats farrrr from reality in any universe.

The plan was to send her away. So far, that is still the plan, as far as he is concerned.
But yes, I'm guessing the Dev will come up with some reason to keep her in the story - but we haven't seen what that is yet - or the MC's reaction. Or Annie's.

 

[MisterNephilim]

Well... this is certainly one confusing mess. Was Ava raped or not? Should she have gone in the first place? Very relevant questions - but neither would change my opinion towards her at this point. She is no longer, to me, an LI in any sense of the word.
Annie? If Bryce and/or Dick are part of her upcoming NY experience - I hope we have the option to just grab our bag and walk off into the sunset. Broken or not - I would want nothing to do with it. Just not telling me before we left or on the way makes that one a deal breaker.
Since neither of the females are LI's or truly potential LI's... several cliffhangers are hanging over us. Just have to wait and see if our MC has a 'set' or if he takes the path of no return.

This is kind of why I'm waiting for Episode 3 to be the dealbreaker. If Annie somehow reveals the reason of the trip and ends up fucking with MC's head (via getting back with Dick to solve money problems or something like that), then I'm going to abort mission for sure.