Ren'Py Abandoned Heavy Five [Ch.2RS] [Nottravis]

[professorx10]

ToNeimadFR

Thanks for a civil reply/comment.
"We know for a fact that Notty doesn't actually ressembles Becca has she admitted to have a lookalike in the game which isn't her but haven't disclosed the characters name."

I don't know, nor care much if Becca is / resembles Notty. I was pointing out that many of the posters on this thread seem to believe or act like they believe that Becca is or resembles Notty.

"You can drop the she/he nonsense has we've had several first person accounts confirming she's female. There even was a recording of her voice floating around at some point."

Ok, I'll take that at face value. With all the banter back and forth, I became doubtful. (see below)

"It's funny that you danced around her gender but got fooled by Anne O'nymous (don't worry, I thought he was female the first few interactions I had with him as well)."

Well, Since Anne O'nymous STATED 'she' was a 52 year old widow, I can be forgiven for that (if that is a) mistake? But that raises the question, can I believe you with regards to Notty's gender? . . .or anyone on this thread? Think about that. What good is your or my or anyone's posts if they have no basis in fact? Yes, we can all lie, exaggerate and BS but SHOULD we? I for one do not/will not except when clearly joking or story telling (all stories are fun lies, yes?)

"I don't particularly recall earlier posts but imho you didn't even criticize Notty, unfairly or otherwise, you defended her by reminding that she's an amateur and shouldn't be held to the standards of AAA studios like some users seem to do."

Thank you for that observation. I did not/am not criticizing Notty for being an amateur. I am an amateur at VNs myself. I have a deep understanding of computing science history and love good story telling but am not a pro programmer. What fascinates me is the level of attention and the emotionalism given this project on this thread. I work with other Devs who's projects are as or more deserving but there it is. I keep asking why this excessive fascination with Heavy-five?

"Saying that most of her appeal is her attractiveness is insulting our intelligence and her work though. I think it comes down to semantics, had you used some instead of most I wouldn't have an issue."

Fair enough...but ask yourself, why DO we have a 1,000 + entry thread for a 3 chapter 2 year old VN/game of high visual quality and little/no plot progression if NOT for some OTHER element drawing people in to comments on it? Am I insulting the audience/posters to call that element "the dev's sex appeal" when it is the main difference I see--and when any mention of it brings out a lot of emotional ire from other posters? What else do you see? I'll listen. But in the meantime, the very type of reaction this observation gets strengthens the case, eg that it is not Notty herself, but most poster's being sold on her personally is what drives this thread. Now, if I'm wrong, most posters won't care or pay attention.

But I have to say, it is the best 'promotional schema' on F95 of any Dev as judged by the reaction it gets. My 'hat's off' to Notty for using it.

Now, if anyone wants, I'd rather talk about the plot so far and the one major flaw I've found in it, to wit, the dramatic landing scene at the outpost. Technically, I find it unbelievable. A damaged spaceship makes a miraculous landing from orbit onto a postage stamp landing pad. Allowing for the models Notty may have had to work with, regardless, I think that scenario still needs a major change to be believable.

 

[NeimadFR]

ToNeimadFR

Thanks for a civil reply/comment.
"We know for a fact that Notty doesn't actually ressembles Becca has she admitted to have a lookalike in the game which isn't her but haven't disclosed the characters name."

I don't know, nor care much if Becca is / resembles Notty. I was pointing out that many of the posters on this thread seem to believe or act like they believe that Becca is or resembles Notty.

"You can drop the she/he nonsense has we've had several first person accounts confirming she's female. There even was a recording of her voice floating around at some point."

Ok, I'll take that at face value. With all the banter back and forth, I became doubtful. (see below)

"It's funny that you danced around her gender but got fooled by Anne O'nymous (don't worry, I thought he was female the first few interactions I had with him as well)."

Well, Since Anne O'nymous STATED 'she' was a 52 year old widow, I can be forgiven for that (if that is a) mistake? But that raises the question, can I believe you with regards to Notty's gender? . . .or anyone on this thread? Think about that. What good is your or my or anyone's posts if they have no basis in fact? Yes, we can all lie, exaggerate and BS but SHOULD we? I for one do not/will not except when clearly joking or story telling (all stories are fun lies, yes?)

"I don't particularly recall earlier posts but imho you didn't even criticize Notty, unfairly or otherwise, you defended her by reminding that she's an amateur and shouldn't be held to the standards of AAA studios like some users seem to do."

Thank you for that observation. I did not/am not criticizing Notty for being an amateur. I am an amateur at VNs myself. I have a deep understanding of computing science history and love good story telling but am not a pro programmer. What fascinates me is the level of attention and the emotionalism given this project on this thread. I work with other Devs who's projects are as or more deserving but there it is. I keep asking why this excessive fascination with Heavy-five?

"Saying that most of her appeal is her attractiveness is insulting our intelligence and her work though. I think it comes down to semantics, had you used some instead of most I wouldn't have an issue."

Fair enough...but ask yourself, why DO we have a 1,000 + entry thread for a 3 chapter 2 year old VN/game of high visual quality and little/no plot progression if NOT for some OTHER element drawing people in to comments on it? Am I insulting the audience/posters to call that element "the dev's sex appeal" when it is the main difference I see--and when any mention of it brings out a lot of emotional ire from other posters? What else do you see? I'll listen. But in the meantime, the very type of reaction this observation gets strengthens the case, eg that it is not Notty herself, but most poster's being sold on her personally is what drives this thread. Now, if I'm wrong, most posters won't care or pay attention.

But I have to say, it is the best 'promotional schema' on F95 of any Dev as judged by the reaction it gets. My 'hat's off' to Notty for using it.

Now, if anyone wants, I'd rather talk about the plot so far and the one major flaw I've found in it, to wit, the dramatic landing scene at the outpost. Technically, I find it unbelievable. A damaged spaceship makes a miraculous landing from orbit onto a postage stamp landing pad. Allowing for the models Notty may have had to work with, regardless, I think that scenario still needs a major change to be believable.

The 1000+ posts was from the good old days of Notty being active daily and interacting with her community by posting previews, chatting about theories and so forth. She was one of the most active devs in that regard basically being her own community manager. Having her own posts deleted for off topic several times was the straw that broke the camel's back and made her leave this forum (that and some users negativity and trolling). The thread doesn't have nearly the traffic it had in those days and now can go weeks without posts. Said posts being mostly whining about the development time and her loyal followers trying to explain the delay to no avail we can definitely say that the thread lost it's panache a long time ago.

 

[moskyx]

ToNeimadFR

Thanks for a civil reply/comment.
"We know for a fact that Notty doesn't actually ressembles Becca has she admitted to have a lookalike in the game which isn't her but haven't disclosed the characters name."

I don't know, nor care much if Becca is / resembles Notty. I was pointing out that many of the posters on this thread seem to believe or act like they believe that Becca is or resembles Notty.

"You can drop the she/he nonsense has we've had several first person accounts confirming she's female. There even was a recording of her voice floating around at some point."

Ok, I'll take that at face value. With all the banter back and forth, I became doubtful. (see below)

"It's funny that you danced around her gender but got fooled by Anne O'nymous (don't worry, I thought he was female the first few interactions I had with him as well)."

Well, Since Anne O'nymous STATED 'she' was a 52 year old widow, I can be forgiven for that (if that is a) mistake? But that raises the question, can I believe you with regards to Notty's gender? . . .or anyone on this thread? Think about that. What good is your or my or anyone's posts if they have no basis in fact? Yes, we can all lie, exaggerate and BS but SHOULD we? I for one do not/will not except when clearly joking or story telling (all stories are fun lies, yes?)

"I don't particularly recall earlier posts but imho you didn't even criticize Notty, unfairly or otherwise, you defended her by reminding that she's an amateur and shouldn't be held to the standards of AAA studios like some users seem to do."

Thank you for that observation. I did not/am not criticizing Notty for being an amateur. I am an amateur at VNs myself. I have a deep understanding of computing science history and love good story telling but am not a pro programmer. What fascinates me is the level of attention and the emotionalism given this project on this thread. I work with other Devs who's projects are as or more deserving but there it is. I keep asking why this excessive fascination with Heavy-five?

"Saying that most of her appeal is her attractiveness is insulting our intelligence and her work though. I think it comes down to semantics, had you used some instead of most I wouldn't have an issue."

Fair enough...but ask yourself, why DO we have a 1,000 + entry thread for a 3 chapter 2 year old VN/game of high visual quality and little/no plot progression if NOT for some OTHER element drawing people in to comments on it? Am I insulting the audience/posters to call that element "the dev's sex appeal" when it is the main difference I see--and when any mention of it brings out a lot of emotional ire from other posters? What else do you see? I'll listen. But in the meantime, the very type of reaction this observation gets strengthens the case, eg that it is not Notty herself, but most poster's being sold on her personally is what drives this thread. Now, if I'm wrong, most posters won't care or pay attention.

But I have to say, it is the best 'promotional schema' on F95 of any Dev as judged by the reaction it gets. My 'hat's off' to Notty for using it.

Now, if anyone wants, I'd rather talk about the plot so far and the one major flaw I've found in it, to wit, the dramatic landing scene at the outpost. Technically, I find it unbelievable. A damaged spaceship makes a miraculous landing from orbit onto a postage stamp landing pad. Allowing for the models Notty may have had to work with, regardless, I think that scenario still needs a major change to be believable.

Also note that this "little/no plot progression" is not entirely true, at least in terms of potential discussions. Because people can talk about what happened in several, different paths, and what to expect from them. It's not like a simpler game where you have just a couple of major choices in 3 chapters and the story discussion is limited to those 4 possible outcomes/paths still surrounded by great uncertainty. Here, some people can talk about Chris dom path, some other people can discuss Sarah's 'blackmail' path (or about her VR games, her weird fetishes and everything in between). Did you get Annie's frustrated blowjob or chose to pursue her 'spanking' path instead? Trisha's story changes a lot depending on your skin color, what is she up to? Did you watch the news? Could your sister be somehow related to them? And what about that odd freezer in the storage area? Why Mike and Marcus are acting so weird about it? Those are just a few examples: a couple of people talking about just one of them can make people who didn't find that content also ask about it, and the discussion can keep going on easily. Meanwhile, in this other more linear and simpler game, theories just die out after a few exchanges no matter how pretty the renders are, unless some very active individuals make an effort to keep the thread alive.

 

[anne O'nymous]

Also note that this "little/no plot progression" is not entirely true, at least in terms of potential discussions. Because people can talk about what happened in several, different paths, and what to expect from them.

Regarding this, the main possible routes so far are:

• Chris as male sub MC ;
• Chris as female MC ;
• Annie as male MC ;
• Annie as female MC ;
• Sarah VR ;
• Sarah CoC ;
• Trish as male white MC ;
• Trish as male black MC.

To this should be included the variations. Among them:
The VR route is as interesting when you win the fights than when you loose them.
With a female MC, it seem that Annie have a route where she'll be on the giving side, and one where she'll be on the receiving one.
Sarah also have her blackmail route ; who dared to do this to poor Sarah ?
If your male MC submitting to Chris, Trisha can jump in, and you'll have the possibility to be a good boy or bad boy.
And of course there's the most important of those variation: Software or hardware ?

Globally speaking, there's probably around 30 different main ways to play the game, and so 30 different main ways to live the story. And since all choice matters, there's details that you'll see or not depending what decision you made.
But don't be afraid by this apparent complexity. It's perfectly possible to enjoy the game with a single playthrough, and all the version are as valid as the others. There's surely one canon version of it, around which Notty based the game, but all the other versions are as valid as this one.
Be also noted that Notty planed to add on more action during the night. Therefore after the release of the chapter five it should be possible to group some playthroughs, having by example a drink with Chris, then later playing with Sarah.


There's also the notion of lore that enter in play.
Depending on the discussion you'll have with the characters, you'll learn different information. By example, asking the right question to Annie at the right moment (I don't remember the detail), you can learn that Sarah's clumsiness is so big that she was near to blow up the Intrepid.


All this imply that there's really matter to talk, exchange your own experience, and share what you learned on your playthrough with those who followed another route.
And of course there's the theories regarding what is happening on Ophion, what is Ophion, what happened to the Vanguard, why MC was called last minute on the mission, is Mike as dumb as he looks, and so on.

What is surprising is not that the thread have 1252 pages, but that it have only 1252 pages.

 

[Hullahopp]

Well, Since Anne O'nymous STATED 'she' was a 52 year old widow, I can be forgiven for that (if that is a) mistake? But that raises the question, can I believe you with regards to Notty's gender? . . .or anyone on this thread? Think about that.

You make the mistake of drawing conclusions based on assumptions. If Anne O'nymous chose this nickname, he is probably a woman. If Nottravis' avatar is an attractive woman, then she is probably an attractive woman. By this logic, Oddball2k is Donald Sutherland, or at least a World War II veteran, NeimadFR is a woman with a moustache, and you are a real professor.
I don't know why Anne O'nymus chose this nickname. Maybe it's a joke. Maybe Anne was the name of his late wife. Maybe it's a pun on Anonymous. Or some other reason I don't know.

On the internet, a large font is usually used to emphasise the message. It's like someone shouting live. This led me to the erroneous conclusion that you are a violent troll. Now do you understand why these conversations are going in the wrong direction? We are all judging based on assumptions.

The same is true of the game. How did Chadwick land the damaged boat? I don't know, I don't know the full story. On that basis I cannot decide whether the scenario is wrong.

 

[Jaun Karr]

Sarah also have her blackmail route ; who dared to do this to poor Sarah ?

Only completely heartless bastards do this (you know who you are)!

is Mike as dumb as he looks

Yes, yes he is.

 

[NeimadFR]

You make the mistake of drawing conclusions based on assumptions. If Anne O'nymous chose this nickname, he is probably a woman. If Nottravis' avatar is an attractive woman, then she is probably an attractive woman. By this logic, Oddball2k is Donald Sutherland, or at least a World War II veteran, NeimadFR is a woman with a moustache, and you are a real professor.
I don't know why Anne O'nymus chose this nickname. Maybe it's a joke. Maybe Anne was the name of his late wife. Maybe it's a pun on Anonymous. Or some other reason I don't know.

On the internet, a large font is usually used to emphasise the message. It's like someone shouting live. This led me to the erroneous conclusion that you are a violent troll. Now do you understand why these conversations are going in the wrong direction? We are all judging based on assumptions.

The same is true of the game. How did Chadwick land the damaged boat? I don't know, I don't know the full story. On that basis I cannot decide whether the scenario is wrong.

To be more correct I am a woman who stole Huitieme's moustache (He never saw the razor coming)

 

[NeimadFR]

Only completely heartless bastards do this (you know who you are)!


Yes, yes he is.

Am I a reformed bastard if I tried the blackmail route but regretted it and never tried it again because it made me feel bad ?

 

[anne O'nymous]

You make the mistake of drawing conclusions based on assumptions. [...]

And I'm not Thea Lundgren! is definitively her.

Maybe it's a pun on Anonymous. Or some other reason I don't know.

Those two.
I like the idea of being double anonymous thanks to the pun. And on Internet, even more on anonymous places like this forum, who and what you are doesn't matter. It's what you do/say that define you.

How did Chadwick land the damaged boat?

While I admit that drunk Annie look like a sailor, the Vanguard is a "ship", not "boat". And she landed it because she's Chris fucking Chadwick

There's hint in the story explaining this. And it's really because she's her and an excellent pilot. With a so limited landing place, I'm not sure that many other V class pilots would have landed so "softly". What raise another question ; have the Vanguard really be sent because it was the only V class available ?
Of course, it's easy to know if another V class is available or not. But the schedule can have been manipulated, defined in such way that when the time came, the Vanguard and its crew was the only solution.

Obviously, this sound like a conspiracy, and why would there be a conspiracy ?
But in the same time, MC is last time called on the mission. Why him ? There's surely more than two engineer on the Intrepid, and some that are on waiting and not full off duty. And then when the Vanguard land on Ophion, surprise ! Among all the possible communication officer that the Iowa could have left, who do we find ? MC sister...
It starts to be a bit too many coincidences...

But knowing Notty, it can perfectly be just coincidences. Will we are looking in this direction, what are we missing that is happening in our back ?

Am I a reformed bastard if I tried the blackmail route but regretted it and never tried it again because it made me feel bad ?

No, the only way to leave the blackmail route is by being pew pew pewed by Annie and finding the only story game over.

 

[NeimadFR]

No, the only way to leave the blackmail route is by being pew pew pewed by Annie and finding the only story game over.

Well I did that and also found 2 other game over so...

 

[I'm Not Thea Lundgren!]

And I'm not Thea Lundgren! is definitively her.

Thea is dead, I saw it on the news!
So I can't be her...

 

[anne O'nymous]

Thea is dead, I saw it on the news!
So I can't be her...

Channel Seven, the channel you can trust...



or not.

 

[NeimadFR]

Channel Seven, the channel you can trust...



or not.

It's actually "The channel you can't rust" ever since they built their stainless steel headquarter.

 

[Hullahopp]

While I admit that drunk Annie look like a sailor, the Vanguard is a "ship", not "boat".

Fair point, I wrote wrong.
(cough)

You must be registered to see the links

And she landed it because she's Chris fucking Chadwick

You know, with all due respect to the Goddess of the Air, but... Well, Becca is the one character who certainly won't shoot me in the back.

Obviously, this sound like a conspiracy, and why would there be a conspiracy ?

“It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts.” - Sherlock Holmes

Will we are looking in this direction, what are we missing that is happening in our back ?

You know what happened to Lot's wife when she turned back.

Am I a reformed bastard if I tried the blackmail route but regretted it and never tried it again because it made me feel bad ?

I see this as an interesting challenge. I have to identify with a character whose values are completely different from mine. And it's very funny when it turns out that being a harasser is not so easy...

Thea is dead, I saw it on the news!
So I can't be her...

"Does Big Brother exist?"

 

[Oddball2k]

About the "little/no plot progression", it all depends on how deep you are in the story telling and how deep your investigation for clues is performed.

Here is my questions about one of the principal characters of the game, the ship named Vanguard aka Vanny:

-Why refitting in a hurry the oldest Vclass ship available for the mission with a port engine near the TBO(Time Between Overhauls) limit?

-Why a flight with only "misfits" flight members with more or less reprimanded disclosed/undisclosed disciplinary actions by the Intrepid's court-martial?

-Were the Vanny, Chris, Annie and Sarah expendable just as the cargo, our MC included?

-Why no Nav officer on the flight?
Andy Jones(aka A. Jones aka Jonesy aka Caverns Master for Sarah) should have been part of the crew as usual, even if it was a simple resupply mission..

Spoiler: What he should have seen..

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I have a whole theory why this weak Nav hyperprocessor fried, to be continued with the release of the new chapter five and all the refreshed first four chapters...

 

[Idontplay]

In my humble opinion this story of "The game has a little/no plot progression" is a little bit strange. The plot is progressing in a similar way to "The good, the bad and the ugly", in which Sergio Leone spent the entire two hours of the movie (which is three hours long) to introduce the characters, the setting, the quest for the buried money and then he spent the last hour to solve the plot. I suppose in this game we will see something similar, in which the first (six/seven?) chapters will be used to introduce all the elements of the setting and the last four/three to see the ending.
Is it a slow development? Yes.
It is a bad development? No.

 

[DirectXD1943]

What are you talking about? She was ALWAYS the MC's sister.
As for the rest, she was always going to add those options, but didn't have the power at first.
Now you want her to start over in Unity? How would that speed anything up?

She never made any secret of her being a noob, and yet she is making Ren'Py do things that most people said was impossible. Best to let Notty and the people who are trying to pay her decide how it goes, and stop trying to backseat dev.

strange to call someone a "noob" who has been making the same game for 4 years. From her own words it sounds more like her perfectionism is her biggest weakness, and she on multiple occassions talks about how she's gone back to redo things that absolutely don't need to be redone. I found the game literally two days ago, but I can at least spend time reading her posts where she STATES IT ALL rather than using a seemingly overused excuse of her being a "noob" or "amateur".

I can respect someone who wants to make their vision come to life, but being a perfectionist isn't necessarily a positive thing. I don't think anyone can reasonably argue that the game and it's timeline is better off constantly being redone over and over and over again, when she could finish the game then work to remaster it after. She clearly sees this as making art over work, which is totally fine, but you're not going to make a lot of people happy when they're waiting years. No one goes "Oh, I love that George R R Martin hasn't written a book in over a decade", despite how you know he's going to write it well. At least there, a book isn't easily edited!

 

[NeimadFR]

strange to call someone a "noob" who has been making the same game for 4 years. From her own words it sounds more like her perfectionism is her biggest weakness, and she on multiple occassions talks about how she's gone back to redo things that absolutely don't need to be redone. I found the game literally two days ago, but I can at least spend time reading her posts where she STATES IT ALL rather than using a seemingly overused excuse of her being a "noob" or "amateur".

I can respect someone who wants to make their vision come to life, but being a perfectionist isn't necessarily a positive thing. I don't think anyone can reasonably argue that the game and it's timeline is better off constantly being redone over and over and over again, when she could finish the game then work to remaster it after. She clearly sees this as making art over work, which is totally fine, but you're not going to make a lot of people happy when they're waiting years. No one goes "Oh, I love that George R R Martin hasn't written a book in over a decade", despite how you know he's going to write it well. At least there, a book isn't easily edited!

I understand your opinion and actually share some of it. Yes she's too perfectionist for her own good but at this point we've accepted that it's her process and we can't change her.
As for releasing the full game before remastering it, I feel like you get one shot at making a good release. If you don't grab people with the initial release how many will care about the remaster? It's better to release it the way you want it to be in the first place.
In my opinion in the world of AVNs development we are privileged to see things that we never see in regular game development. It's never a straight line. You can have a bunch of version with a specific game mechanic and then realise there's a better way and redo it all. I think it happens more than we think but they don't tell us. With this type of development there's no hiding anything but we should treat it as a work in progress that can chaange drastically any moment until the final release.

 

[thyersinia]

any updates ?

 

[moskyx]

Actually, there's a public Patreon post from 35 min ago with a trailer clip of Chapter 5

You must be registered to see the links

Obviously the $64,000 question is when is the release date. At this point, not sure. I'll know better in a couple of weeks and will update you then.