VN Ren'Py Karlsson's Gambit [v0.8.2B Final] [Grym Gudinna Games]

[latex lvr]

Miles, please re-login.

But other than kidding, why should Callista be the one to blame for this? She as a mother gave the maximum knowledge, skills and abilities, she raised decent children (both Olivia and Kane). Her duty as a mother in that sense has been fully fulfilled. And then the following happens - we (the players) take control of Kane, who by nature is not inclined to obey and who has the courage to stand up for his brother and go to jail on false charges...And already there, in prison, we begin (on behalf of Kane) to decide how we should act in this or that case. So what is the mother's fault if the player decides to make Kane a crawling worm?

Players who allow Kane to be himself (i.e. a confident guy) have no such problems, and for them Callista is a good mother whose expectations he has fully met by going through the rehab program in less than a week, reaching K9, performing well and making himself respected. Well if someone doesn't like that Kane is suffering (I don't know 100% since I don't play the sub route) in the K1-K4 ranks, so what does that have to do with the mother if it's solely the “merit” of the player who voluntarily chose that path for himself?

I do agree with you in that it is us the players that are controlling Kane and to certain Aspects other's also. (ie we do make a few choices for the Karlsson sisters ect)

I don't necessarily blame Calista as yet, We still don't have enough information about her or her reasons for what she did. Except to say that she took Olivia with her when she left too protect Kane. We do know that all though Olivia grew up being loved and cared for by Calista, She did treat her differently to Kane and Seth and was a bit harsher on Olivia than the other 2.

However Calista is one of the foundling members of the Karlsson Group. It could be argued that it was because of Calista leaving Alexander, that he became lost. Calista was his love. Therefore by Calista leaving him turned him nasty and thus his 4 daughters were bought up the way they were.
If we look at the 4 children in the order they were born. We have Dominique who is the eldest Although she is quite a strong woman and does have evil tendencies she is a firm but fair woman. Next we have Veronica. I think deep down Veronica is basically a good woman and she is working behind the scenes to help humanity with her various projects. Yes it could be argued that she is the one who has developed the shock chips and the "pain serum" ect But I think she has done that so that she could try and control her Father and ultimately what the group does. She has no interest in running the organisation. (I also think that Calista perhaps had the biggest impact on Veronica because of their shared interest in science.)
Then we have when Olivia was born and Calista Leaving Alexander and thus when he became lost. We have Juliette born who is true Evil and the Same for Alesandra who also is evil but is also A spoilt Princess. These two have obviously has the biggest influence from Alexander on how they were brought up. I don't know where in that order Astrid fits in but I would guess she would be the youngest of all and therefore because Veronica is her (full) big sister and wanting to protect her from Alexander and the other sisters she arrange for her to be taken to Island 4. We don't know much about Astrid yet so hard to comment as to her character.

So based on all of this I feel that Calista does have to take some of the blame and certainly has some hard questions to answer. I also hope that when Kane and her do meet that it is will be a meaningful conversation and she answers those hard questions and not like what we have been getting in the game so far with questions being avoided or being told we are not ready to tell you yet, Also not a conversation where Kane is so pleased to see his mom that he doesn't ask her the difficult questions.

 

[Stan5851]

Alright, day three...let's go for two bad girls today
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Oh yes, Mav, they are beautiful, especially Eloise....But I'm wondering where the 1st and 3rd screenshots above are from? (and I'm not sure about the 2nd one). There must have been some new devlog from Tess that I missed for some reason..

 

[Maviarab]

Oh yes, Mav, they are beautiful, especially Eloise....But I'm wondering where the 1st and 3rd screenshots above are from? (and I'm not sure about the 2nd one). There must have been some new devlog from Tess that I missed for some reason..

First is from upcoming Part 2, third is from Part 1.

 

[Maviarab]

Apologies on the double post....but doesn't really belong in my reply to Stan:

You're all also forgetting a very important line after Kane's visit to the Mines (DomPath) where Dominique and Alessa take Kane for a spot of Jet Skiiing...

Alessa: You should yell at your mother from hiding you from us for so long.
Kane: Maybe, but maybe not....I don't know

Now remember...if Alessa is 'White Tips Ninja'...then she knows Callista is alive and well most likely....Does Kane actually know Callista might be alive? Why would Kane say that...if he thinks Callista died in the helicopter crash? We're told he was trained, she has a plan. Is Kane also a covert spy with knowledge like Olivia????

 

[Stan5851]

It could be argued that it was because of Calista leaving Alexander, that he became lost. Calista was his love. Therefore by Calista leaving him turned him nasty and thus his 4 daughters were bought up the way they were.

It is not Callista's fault that Alexander has become such a diabolically evil man. It's to be blamed on a group of mysterious and powerful women under whose heel Alexander himself has fallen...

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Also, I wouldn't be so quick to whitewash Alexander by making him out to be a one-woman romantic in love who adored Callista. This evil "romantic" fucked everything that moved and fucked a bunch of different women who bore him daughters. Yes, Callista was his true love, but what was Callista's fault if the first child he and Alexander had (apparently) died at birth? The guy's brains went crazy, and he found nothing better to do than try to fuck Elena too in order to get his coveted son...And he ended up just cheating on Callista, who caught them both having sex...So any way you look at it, Alexander's idiotic attempts to play eugenics and "breed a new, perfect heir" have only himself to blame.

But of course Callista has a lot of questions to give us answers to, and here I agree with what MilesEdgeworth writes, and we'll need more than one flashback and more than one heart-to-heart talk (between Kane and Callista) to draw conclusions about all of this and evaluate Callista's role in the story.

 

[Maviarab]

Also, I wouldn't be so quick to whitewash Alexander by making him out to be a one-woman romantic in love who adored Callista. This evil "romantic" fucked everything that moved and fucked a bunch of different women who bore him daughters. Yes, Callista was his true love, but what was Callista's fault if the first child he and Alexander had (apparently) died at birth? The guy's brains went crazy, and he found nothing better to do than try to fuck Elena too in order to get his coveted son...And he ended up just cheating on Callista, who caught them both having sex...So any way you look at it, Alexander's idiotic attempts to play eugenics and "breed a new, perfect heir" have only himself to blame.

More general musings I have written down...but relevent to part of your post....

Mothers???
Alessandra, Dominique & Juliette?
Who is their mother???

Alexander wanted 4 beautiful women (This is confirmed in-game)...was one woman the mother of both Jules/Alessa and Callista was supposed to be the 4th woman??. Or was Callista outside of these 4 woman??? Was she supposed to be the first but life got in the way? What about Dominique's mother? Was she one of the 4 fabled...but she was before the Gambit started...

So far we only have 2 women and 3 daughters confirmed!!

And we still have....Luke....that was the ultimate catalyst for Alexander going off the rails completely, Callista leaving him was just the icing on the cake...but then she did find him balls-deep inside Elena....her best friend...

 

[Stan5851]

First is from upcoming Part 2.

Mav, I realize that. I just can't figure out which of Tess's devlogs I'm missing.

 

[Maviarab]

Mav, I realize that. I just can't figure out which of Tess's devlogs I'm missing.

Oh jeez I don't know....maybe search my name in thread with the word mistress? Should bring up all the roadmap posts. I've been posting them since the very first sneak peaks came heh.

 

[MilesEdgeworth]

It is not Callista's fault that Alexander has become such a diabolically evil man. It's to be blamed on a group of mysterious and powerful women under whose heel Alexander himself has fallen...

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Also, I wouldn't be so quick to whitewash Alexander by making him out to be a one-woman romantic in love who adored Callista. This evil "romantic" fucked everything that moved and fucked a bunch of different women who bore him daughters. Yes, Callista was his true love, but what was Callista's fault if the first child he and Alexander had (apparently) died at birth? The guy's brains went crazy, and he found nothing better to do than try to fuck Elena too in order to get his coveted son...And he ended up just cheating on Callista, who caught them both having sex...So any way you look at it, Alexander's idiotic attempts to play eugenics and "breed a new, perfect heir" have only himself to blame.

But of course Callista has a lot of questions to give us answers to, and here I agree with what MilesEdgeworth writes, and we'll need more than one flashback and more than one heart-to-heart talk (between Kane and Callista) to draw conclusions about all of this and evaluate Callista's role in the story.

I believe he idolized the shit out of Callista to the point where he had to have his blood intermingling with Callista, even if it was through later generations, because of his apparent love of eugenics; he believed the only way to create the perfect offspring was through her. I'm just speculating here, but I disagree with Veronica, where she thinks giving him a son would've given him what he wanted (unless Callista had a daughter, then it would be a different story). His endgame was always a descendant whose blood was his and Callista's.

I think his fucking all those beautiful women was his way of coping with the loss of the kid he had with Callista. He was totally lying to himself.

 

[Stan5851]

More general musings I have written down...but relevent to part of your post....

Mothers???
Alessandra, Dominique & Juliette?
Who is their mother???

Alexander wanted 4 beautiful women (This is confirmed in-game)...was one woman the mother of both Jules/Alessa and Callista was supposed to be the 4th woman??. Or was Callista outside of these 4 woman??? What about Dominique's mother? Was she one of the 4 fabled...but she was before the Gambit started...

So far we only have 2 women and 3 daughters confirmed!!

And we still have....Luke....that was the ultimate catalyst for Alexander going off the rails completely.

Mav, I don't have the answers to those questions yet.. Also, this is the first time I've heard that Alessa and Jules have the same mother (apparently I missed something).

 

[Maviarab]

Mav, I don't have the answers to those questions yet.. Also, this is the first time I've heard that Alessa and Jules have the same mother (apparently I missed something).

It was a question..not a statement

Regardless...one...or two women...came along after Callista left...while Elena and Yvette were still there....so did their mother(s) come along after...or...were they already there?

 

[MilesEdgeworth]

It was a question..not a statement

Regardless...one...or two women...came along after Callista left...while Elena and Yvette were still there....so did their mother(s) come along after...or...were they already there?

As rich as Alex, I imagine a bunch of women were throwing it at him. I'd imagine Dom's mother was a supermodel, while Alessandra's mother was probs some hot, smart lady type. This speculation is solely because of my apparent height bias.

 

[Stan5851]

It was a question..not a statement

Regardless...one...or two women...came along after Callista left...while Elena and Yvette were still there....so did their mother(s) come along after...or...were they already there?

It's hard to say, but if Miss Tess is hiding it from us, then it's either very important to the plot or not important at all...But knowing Tess and her attention to detail and nuance, I'm leaning towards it being important...

And if we fantasize some more (knowing that Alexander plunged into the abyss of evil, finding himself under the heel of a mysterious group of powerful women, then went through a lot, but still managed to deal with them at the end)...And what if one (or two) of these mysterious sadistic women were later forced to become mothers, defeated by Alexander and then simply raped by him... And from this Jules and Alessa were born... And it was quite an elaborate revenge of Alexander, who took revenge on them in this way... because what could be more horrible than taking from mothers their own barely born children?

And one more thing...I have long had a vague feeling that some of these mysterious and powerful female sadists were none other than his closest female relatives...I'm talking about Alexander's sisters (Klara and Karin)..Ofc , this is just a conspiracy theory based only on intuition...but let's see what turns out to be the case. (Assuming, of course, Tess ever does show us these mysterious abusers of Alexander who broke his life).

 

[Maviarab]

It's hard to say, but if Miss Tess is hiding it from us, then it's either very important to the plot or not important at all...But knowing Tess and her attention to detail and nuance, I'm leaning towards it being important...

And if we fantasize some more (knowing that Alexander plunged into the abyss of evil, finding himself under the heel of a mysterious group of powerful women, then went through a lot, but still managed to deal with them at the end)...And what if one (or two) of these mysterious sadistic women were later forced to become mothers, defeated by Alexander and then simply raped by him... And from this Jules and Alessa were born... And it was quite an elaborate revenge of Alexander, who took revenge on them in this way... because what could be more horrible than taking from mothers their own barely born children?

And one more thing...I have long had a vague feeling that some of these mysterious and powerful female sadists were none other than his closest female relatives...I'm talking about Alexander's sisters (Klara and Karin)...Of course, this is just a conspiracy theory based only on intuition...but let's see what turns out to be the case. (Assuming, of course, Tess ever does show us these mysterious abusers of Alexander who broke his life).

Oh I very much believe his mother and sisters were the pwerful women yes.

 

[MilesEdgeworth]

yea I thought the sisters torturing Alex was obvious. Interesting that Olivia looks like one of them. I wonder how Alex felt about that

 

[kinkyshin]

Apologies on the double post....but doesn't really belong in my reply to Stan:

You're all also forgetting a very important line after Kane's visit to the Mines (DomPath) where Dominique and Alessa take Kane for a spot of Jet Skiiing...

Alessa: You should yell at your mother from hiding you from us for so long.
Kane: Maybe, but maybe not....I don't know

Now remember...if Alessa is 'White Tips Ninja'...then she knows Callista is alive and well most likely....Does Kane actually know Callista might be alive? Why would Kane say that...if he thinks Callista died in the helicopter crash? We're told he was trained, she has a plan. Is Kane also a covert spy with knowledge like Olivia????

That's an interesting thought, but you already know it's extremely unlikely. Tess specifically put in a flashback to show that Olivia was considered a ridiculously talented actress. No such flashback for Kane.

Though, now that you point it out it's got me thinking about when Olivia tells Elena about how Callista always taught her things like how to read people, etc.. aka basically prepared her well for this life. Did Callista seriously teach Kane absolutely nothing when he has the potential to be quite literally the most important person on the entire planet?? =\

Maybe she knew how bullshit the testing was. "Son, you will one day be faced with a decision to make fun of Zach or help him... you don't know it yet, but this single action will play a very significant role in determining whether you become the leader of the Karlsson group or thrown into a fire like the worm that you are. Good luck, son."

yea I thought the sisters torturing Alex was obvious. Interesting that Olivia looks like one of them. I wonder how Alex felt about that

I'm confused. Didn't someone say that they were triplets and they were all extremely close?

Yea, this really don't give off the impression that they tortured him. They had a falling out and disappeared on him, but they didn't do anything bad to him by the sounds of it. Idk.

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[MilesEdgeworth]

I'm confused. Didn't someone say that they were triplets and they were all extremely close?

Yea I can't really connect the two things. I want to say he was a secret sub, but tess don't do incest. But a woman dominant world like the one he basically created would seem to indicate he was dominated somehow by his sisters

 

[kinkyshin]

Yea I can't really connect the two things. I want to say he was a secret sub, but tests don't do incest. But a woman dominant world like the one he basically created would seem to indicate he was dominated somehow by his sisters

No way. It's the opposite.
He specifically wanted a male heir, but all his children turned out to be women lol.
Kane + Karlsson sister need to have a male heir that will run the company.

 

[IllDisposed]

I'm confused. Didn't someone say that they were triplets and they were all extremely close?

Yea, this really don't give off the impression that they tortured him. They had a falling out and disappeared on him, but they didn't do anything bad to him by the sounds of it. Idk.

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Up until Callista revealed herself to Elena I was assuming "abondoned him" meant the sisters went to the other side and that the two masked people who arrived with Cynthia and co. were going to turn out to be them. Could still be who the other hoody is I guess.

 

[latex lvr]

It is not Callista's fault that Alexander has become such a diabolically evil man. It's to be blamed on a group of mysterious and powerful women under whose heel Alexander himself has fallen...
Also, I wouldn't be so quick to whitewash Alexander by making him out to be a one-woman romantic in love who adored Callista. This evil "romantic" fucked everything that moved and fucked a bunch of different women who bore him daughters. Yes, Callista was his true love, but what was Callista's fault if the first child he and Alexander had (apparently) died at birth? The guy's brains went crazy, and he found nothing better to do than try to fuck Elena too in order to get his coveted son...And he ended up just cheating on Callista, who caught them both having sex...So any way you look at it, Alexander's idiotic attempts to play eugenics and "breed a new, perfect heir" have only himself to blame.

But of course Callista has a lot of questions to give us answers to, and here I agree with what

Im not saying that Alexander was whiter than white, Yes he might have already be spiralling out of control. We do not know enough yet...
I'm not blaming Calista for Alexander becoming a bad man, However we would assume that when she met him she knew very well what kind of man he was. Nor would I blame Calista for the death of the unborn child. Where I do Think she has to take some of the blame is she would have known what he was like when she got with him and still allowed him to fall in love with her. (What we don't know is if she was coerced) but the fact still remains that she left Alexander (which was probably the right thing for her) and he became so dark and twisted afterwards, That has to explain why the younger children are much more Evil than the older two. She also has to take some of the blame for keeping Olivia, Kane, And Seth in the dark. Also The reason she took Olivia with her was because she was either pregnant with Kane or Kane was a baby and she feared that Alexander would kill Kane. Also bare in mind (although not yet confirmed) Cole is Kane's father so therefore she herself must have cheated on Alexander.

Like I said before we don't know enough about the past yet to fully portion blame on her or not.
I would also Question if she did love Alexander at all because she does say that Cole Was the love of her life.
She has her secrets and the Karlsson group have theirs.