Abelius, I think that everything you're saying (or almost everything) I exposed months ago... I was branded as crazy, XD, but it's good to know that one of the creators shares my opinion back then.
- Thread starter Alexander Krisnov
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Elder Drake
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- Mar 27, 2019
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Robberbaron
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Ever considered continueing old LoK 0.8 parallel to the new version? Since the demo releases soon 0.8 files could be replaced. Personally i´d support both projects. So the artwork of 0.8 wouldn´t go to waste.Well Vlad... at least I hope you now understand what I achieved by putting my version together as an almost one-man-army.
What I don't get from an ethical standpoint is that you're still posting my version on the Patreon page, and a full year has already passed since you made up your minds to do the remake...
And you even set an "Updated June 2nd" on the link, lol. I know it's because you must have reuploaded the file, but anyone discovering the Patreon for the first time will have the impression you've just posted 0.8 some weeks ago, when the truth is that...:
Now... I think of Kuja, who I still respect regardless of the drama, and I won't ask you to remove it. But it would be nice if, at least, you made abundantly clear that it's not just "old stuff", but my game which I dedicated two years of my life to make.
- There won't be 0.9
- It doesn't represent the game you want to make
- You're getting new patrons because of my work
Seems fair to me.
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- Sep 19, 2017
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I have never once suggested that you did not do impressive work on the game, I have always stated you were a hard worker and capable of a lot.Well Vlad... at least I hope you now understand what I achieved by putting my version together as an almost one-man-army.
What I don't get from an ethical standpoint is that you're still posting my version on the Patreon page, and a full year has already passed since you made up your minds to do the remake...
And you even set an "Updated June 2nd" on the link, lol. I know it's because you must have reuploaded the file, but anyone discovering the Patreon for the first time will have the impression you've just posted 0.8 some weeks ago, when the truth is that...:
Now... I think of Kuja, who I still respect regardless of the drama, and I won't ask you to remove it. But it would be nice if, at least, you made abundantly clear that it's not just "old stuff", but my game which I dedicated two years of my life to make.
- There won't be 0.9
- It doesn't represent the game you want to make
- You're getting new patrons because of my work
Seems fair to me.
We reuploaded the game because the link you hosted died. We've made it clear that it is an older version that is not going to be continued.
1. Of that version, no. You are correct.
2. Not totally true, we will cover the same characters and redo much of the content that previously existed.
3. I wrote all of the characters for you and much of the dialogue, Kuja made the art, and yes you coded/animated it. It was a group effort, and now it is defunct because we decided to go into a different direction.
I am fully aware of how long it took you, and that is why I wanted to keep you on the project, and made concessions to keep you on board. Your pride and this grudge against me is why you're no longer on it. You willingly left.
You're the only one propagating this 'drama', by the way. At this point I would assume you want free publicity for your project by making a ruckus. I hope you realize that all you're doing is making us both look bad.
That is impossible and pointless. The change in the art was Kuja's decision as the original artist, who felt his skills had improved.
I'm a late comer to this game so I missed all the drama and slow progress and whatever else was going on.
I think moving to a new game is probably a good idea because just from playing I can see the limits in the engine, the animation style of basically 2005 newgrounds videos using nothing but tweening a static image is very dated and limited. I can't begin to tell you just how disappointed I was when I realized that the animation style was literally never going to allow for a change in perspective and that even if there was more lewd content with various forms of penetration it was always going to be of the same sprite just tweened in a different position.
The game also REEKS of overreach, There is a whole intro on a space ship with promises of other systems and places to visit and interact with in a later build, only to have you leave that spaceship in 5 minutes and never see it again. That is a whole lot of work that has already been done and a HUGE amount of promised mechanics to a place that isn't really even part of the game. This sort of overreach exists in the regular meat of the game too with NPCs and areas with no current purpose but promises of future purpose while the actual content is considerably smaller. Even speaking with NPCs like the huntress lady would sound like 'hey here are all these cool ideas we have for future encounters outside the village but we haven't actually added anything to the village yet! Hope you're excited for all the content you don't have!'
Jumping to a new game should be a good opportunity to trim the project down to something more manageable, you can always expand in the future but creating a more complete vertical slice of gameplay is going to feel more rewarding for the players (and the dev team) than this current mosh of barely finished anything.
However I don't want to come accross as negative because I did find myself enjoying the core loop of gameplay and if there was more to do I would actually REALLY REALLY like it. The way everyday was basically the same but had a few changing pieces made me feel excited to see what would have changed on the next day, who would be the next person to introduce a new situation or push krystal to go further. Imagine that same core idea except instead of doing the exact same task everyday you had 5 or 6 tasks you could be doing so you picked whatever you felt like doing for the day and watched as krystal became more and more enthused by this overtly sexual society. Very cool idea that would be a huge amount of fun to play at completion.
I really hope the project continues to see some effort put into it as it's actually very promising compared to most of the games on this site, despite being so feature incomplete. I think cutting back on some of the planned content to make a more focused target and having a more variable animation system to allow for a wider range of content could easily make this game one of the best in it's class.
I think moving to a new game is probably a good idea because just from playing I can see the limits in the engine, the animation style of basically 2005 newgrounds videos using nothing but tweening a static image is very dated and limited. I can't begin to tell you just how disappointed I was when I realized that the animation style was literally never going to allow for a change in perspective and that even if there was more lewd content with various forms of penetration it was always going to be of the same sprite just tweened in a different position.
The game also REEKS of overreach, There is a whole intro on a space ship with promises of other systems and places to visit and interact with in a later build, only to have you leave that spaceship in 5 minutes and never see it again. That is a whole lot of work that has already been done and a HUGE amount of promised mechanics to a place that isn't really even part of the game. This sort of overreach exists in the regular meat of the game too with NPCs and areas with no current purpose but promises of future purpose while the actual content is considerably smaller. Even speaking with NPCs like the huntress lady would sound like 'hey here are all these cool ideas we have for future encounters outside the village but we haven't actually added anything to the village yet! Hope you're excited for all the content you don't have!'
Jumping to a new game should be a good opportunity to trim the project down to something more manageable, you can always expand in the future but creating a more complete vertical slice of gameplay is going to feel more rewarding for the players (and the dev team) than this current mosh of barely finished anything.
However I don't want to come accross as negative because I did find myself enjoying the core loop of gameplay and if there was more to do I would actually REALLY REALLY like it. The way everyday was basically the same but had a few changing pieces made me feel excited to see what would have changed on the next day, who would be the next person to introduce a new situation or push krystal to go further. Imagine that same core idea except instead of doing the exact same task everyday you had 5 or 6 tasks you could be doing so you picked whatever you felt like doing for the day and watched as krystal became more and more enthused by this overtly sexual society. Very cool idea that would be a huge amount of fun to play at completion.
I really hope the project continues to see some effort put into it as it's actually very promising compared to most of the games on this site, despite being so feature incomplete. I think cutting back on some of the planned content to make a more focused target and having a more variable animation system to allow for a wider range of content could easily make this game one of the best in it's class.
Okay. Old dev/New dev team fights of course are interesting to watch, but i have a question. When the demo is coming out?
It was meant to be early june, then you decided to delay it because of the quality of some animations. Its 20.06 now. Still fixing the anims, or you decided to improve something else?
Cause how i've seen it - there used to be minor problems that reqiured an extra week or so, but now its up to three already.
It was meant to be early june, then you decided to delay it because of the quality of some animations. Its 20.06 now. Still fixing the anims, or you decided to improve something else?
Cause how i've seen it - there used to be minor problems that reqiured an extra week or so, but now its up to three already.
I don't think whatever Abelius will say will make you appear any worse than what you do yourself. He still made the only version of the game that your patreon promises. Also you still have to prove what you are making is going to be able to match up to Abelius made product, for now the original version seems to have better looking visuals and a more solid gameplay concept.
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We asked the people whether they wanted to wait for polished animations, or have an immediate release. They said they wanted to wait, so we're waiting. Animators are polishing what they have, and we will release as soon as they are done.
Abelius worked with a team. You don't know the full story.
The original version is not a more solid gameplay concept as it didn't really have any gameplay beyond 1 mediocre mini-game and a bunch of boring quests (that people endlessly complained about).
The visuals had more time and were much simpler, so of course they looked more complete. Will we make something better than v0.8? Absolutely. How long will it take? I don't know. We're making something far more difficult and ambitious.
Well, that's your opinion but I don't think that the almost 2000 patreons that the game has at the moment is for are for a "future promise". I guess a lot of them will be from the cancelled game, right?
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I grow tired of this 'canceled' bullshit. We have 2/3 teammembers from the previous iterations, using the same characters, with a similar plot. We're remaking the game with better quality in mind. It isn't canceled.
Tannin00
Member
- Jul 1, 2017
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No, the case of this project is that the development team is working on 2 or 3 projects at the same time, so it takes time. Which is the most stipulated in my humble opinion. Since instead of finishing things one by one, now they have 3 different sides that they want to be prioritized.
Ion.TemUS
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- Jun 8, 2017
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Im just here to see the trainwreck at this point, imma be honest. I just know when Im ckecking in again in 2 months there will probably not be a lot different from today.
Elder Drake
Newbie
- Mar 27, 2019
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That tends to be the case with these games. The yandere simulator of the adult game world in a way lol. This is exactly the reason why so many people tend to avoid supporting patreons and such like the plague.
What I don't understand is that nobody had the thought to release the version as it is now and then release an update when the animations are done is a possibility.
I'm just baffled by this. All for a tech demo no less.... just what the fuck
I'm just baffled by this. All for a tech demo no less.... just what the fuck
- Sep 19, 2017
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The mindset about this is the problem.
This is a tech demo, people are voting to have H animations be completed as if the game was ready to be released as an early build w a solid foundation. The thing about this, the tech demo should be released to see how the game actually plays since it's naturally going to be the first thing anybody would be expected to interact right at the get go.
The poll is centered on the H animations, which is the main draw to be abundantly clear, but it's been a approx. a year since this remake has been in the works. It'd be appropriate to release the tech demo as it is. Yeah, no duh people are going to choose the option to complete the animations. That'd be a given regardless if there wasnt a poll but pictures and released as it is.
Again, to reiterate, the tech demo should be about the gameplay in it's current form. People can wait for H scenes to come in. LOK:R has had years to reach to that point w Cenvir but it already had a foundation to stand on as a game, though barren in gameplay itself.
The poll is a false choice in the matter. The animations will come regardless ((per your options)), but people thinking w the wrong head decided to extend the tech demo beyond the timeframe as it is. If given the choice to wait it out even more by forgoing the tech demo release, wait an actual build to release w even more H scenes in store with no timeframe given on when it'd release, the people would still support that.
There's a reason why terms like Sunk Cost fallacy, echo chambers and Yes Man exists
For someone like yourself to tell your criticisms of gameplay in regards to other LoK games, one would think you'd show off the tech demo for the gameplay itself. Or is this due to a lack of confidence in the gameplay and relying on the H animations to carry through? To which, that's understandable as that's the majority of most H games content being barren in gameplay but abundant in H scenes
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Robberbaron
Newbie
- Oct 8, 2017
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I´d imagine it would be a win for everyone:
You put aside your differences, Abelius can rejoin as dev with focus on the 0.8 version, you could quickly animate new scenes with Nesi/Sek/Keakrix/Nemiri/Eri etc. with the already existing artwork and code of 0.8, a good amount of 0.8 favoring ex-patrons might repledge and everyone would have more LOK Rebrith (current AND old version) content to enjoy. I myself am a fan of both versions.
Just my thoughts.
Don't misrepresent yourself, I repeat, are the almost 2000 patreons you have now from 9 months ago or are they already from the first versions of LOK Rebirth? Maybe the game wouldn't be as bad as you're painting it.