MultiTrav

Newbie
Jul 11, 2018
71
50


View attachment 2610122
Joubei
You are the best.
I thought there was a hentai titled Liliths Game. But that's okay too. I'll tell you what.
I stay here.
Wait for Gwen. :love:
Do skål with Freja... in her bed.
Lying between the twins. after sex.
Fuck Valery the brains out
and dream of a threesome with elves.
Who needs a kingdom anymore?? Oh yeah Lilith.
If she behaves well there will be romance with her. But since Lillith isn't behaving... I'll get out the handcuffs and blindfold. Then on her butt until she asks me to put my... up her butt. As I said
Who Needs a Kingdom?
 
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Joubei

Lilith Rising
Game Developer
Aug 17, 2021
462
1,225


The last poll was a great success, as we found the name “Lilith Rising - Age of Heroines”.
Now we want to find the best girl for his game thumbnail art!

She needs to be sexy, alluring, interesting, inviting, and mysterious.

Select the most attractive girl:


1. Lilith - The Succubus
2. Freja - The Viking
3. Valery - The Huntress
4. Ishi - The Martial Artist
5. Gwen - The Fencer
6. Sophie - The Fire Mage
7. Sylvie - The Ice Mage
8. Jezzabelle - The Witch



Thank you so much!
 
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hitmebaby

Newbie
Apr 22, 2022
54
59


The last poll was a great success, as we found the name “Lilith Rising - Age of Heroines”.
Now we want to find the best girl for his game thumbnail art!

She needs to be sexy, alluring, interesting, inviting, and mysterious.

Select the most attractive girl:


1. Lilith - The Succubus
2. Freja - The Viking
3. Valery - The Huntress
4. Ishi - The Martial Artist
5. Gwen - The Fencer
6. Sophie - The Fire Mage
7. Sylvie - The Ice Mage
8. Jezzabelle - The Witch



Thank you so much!
that is a long ass dum generic name lol the original name at least was short and sweet while being dum and generic ...kids these days.
 
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sdawg1234

Member
Dec 1, 2019
266
417
Who's Lilith? Was she introduced already? Forgive my ignorance haven't been following along just doing my rounds to see if games I have on my HD are still being produced.
 

Joubei

Lilith Rising
Game Developer
Aug 17, 2021
462
1,225
Who's Lilith? Was she introduced already? Forgive my ignorance haven't been following along just doing my rounds to see if games I have on my HD are still being produced.
The main antagonist, you see her in the first scene, then in your dreams at this point (ep2),
you meet here later on in the story though.
 

Joubei

Lilith Rising
Game Developer
Aug 17, 2021
462
1,225


Hey guys!

The last poll was another great success, we ran it in several communities and gathered a-lot of great feedback, and we found our fantasy girl, and she's none other then Lilith herself, now we need to find her best outfit for game's thumbnail art!

She needs to be sexy, alluring, interesting, inviting, and mysterious.

Thank you so much!

Select the most attractive outfit for Lilith:

 
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Abhai

Devoted Member
Sep 12, 2018
8,957
36,972
are you aware that by naming your game "lilith rising - age of heroines" you will most probably lure mainly female-mc players?
your game, your choices ofc.

edit.
unless ofc you did a full remake and put her as the main character (aka female mc).
in which case, forget about previous mention and good luck to you with your game.
 
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Joubei

Lilith Rising
Game Developer
Aug 17, 2021
462
1,225
are you aware that by naming your game "lilith rising - age of heroines" you will most probably lure mainly female-mc players?
your game, your choices ofc.

edit.
unless ofc you did a full remake and put her as the main character (aka female mc).
in which case, forget about previous mention and good luck to you with your game.
With that logic, in the game Freshwomen I should be playing a freshwomen?

Yet its the most successful game at this time.

So, I'm wondering, she's integral to the plot as the MC is her unwilling pawn.

any suggestions?
we've polled this with 1000s of people with many different options.
so far this is the most popular choice.
 

motseer

Engaged Member
Dec 17, 2021
2,557
5,909
Sorry, Joubei. Personally, I'm not a fan of the new title. If the story is about a female protagonist... maybe. But it's not. You're choosing to title the story after it's antagonist with a subtitle that highlights the protagonist's female companions (I assume). He (the MC) might as well not exist. I got "Tainted". The idea that the protagonist's actions are being manipulated. Someone convinced you that wasn't good enough. I think you might have allowed yourself to be "tainted". Stay with your first instinct and first choice. It's usually best. Don't name your work by "popular demand". JMO
 

Abhai

Devoted Member
Sep 12, 2018
8,957
36,972
With that logic, in the game Freshwomen I should be playing a freshwomen?

Yet its the most successful game at this time.

So, I'm wondering, she's integral to the plot as the MC is her unwilling pawn.

any suggestions?
we've polled this with 1000s of people with many different options.
so far this is the most popular choice.
if freshwomen are the most succesfull game, people are became really weird, and you should freely name your game whatever you wanna...just pay for a quick course those dudes (devs of freshwomen) can hold to any fresh developer/s firstly.

now, a bit more seriously - im getting that she is the vital part of the game/story, and naming a whole game after her makes sense.
what doesnt make much sense, imo to underline that, is that second part "age of heroines".
that kinda implies (exclusively) women cast/main roles/mc-s (even more than freshwomen, considering it is something like a second/explaining/additional title here).
to cut it short, i would change that second part to something like "un/willing hero" or so - that would be still general enough and more neutral than "heroines".

my six cents only.
as i have said above, you should stick to your "gut" and your patreon votes (if you already put it there).
 
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Joubei

Lilith Rising
Game Developer
Aug 17, 2021
462
1,225
if freshwomen are the most succesfull game, people are became really weird, and you should freely name your game whatever you wanna...just pay for a quick course those dudes (devs of freshwomen) can hold to any fresh developer/s firstly.

now, a bit more seriously - im getting that she is the vital part of the game/story, and naming a whole game after her makes sense.
what doesnt make much sense, imo to underline that, is that second part "age of heroines".
that kinda implies (exclusively) women cast/main roles/mc-s (even more than freshwomen, considering it is something like a second/explaining/additional title here).
to cut it short, i would change that second part to something like "un/willing hero" or so - that would be still general enough and more neutral than "heroines".

my six cents only.
as i have said above, you should stick to your "gut" and your patreon votes (if you already put it there).
I put the vote on several communities and these were the best picks, I'll think about the second part though, you might be on to something.

thanks for this.
 
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nzn

Member
Aug 9, 2019
395
237
a small point to note on the thread:
perhaps it would be wise to include the previous title in parenthesis to make players find or return to this tread easier.
lilith rising (previously tainted) or something along those lines.
 

PapaPhat

Engaged Member
Mar 31, 2022
3,337
5,609
Sorry, Joubei. Personally, I'm not a fan of the new title. If the story is about a female protagonist... maybe. But it's not. You're choosing to title the story after it's antagonist with a subtitle that highlights the protagonist's female companions (I assume). He (the MC) might as well not exist. I got "Tainted". The idea that the protagonist's actions are being manipulated. Someone convinced you that wasn't good enough. I think you might have allowed yourself to be "tainted". Stay with your first instinct and first choice. It's usually best. Don't name your work by "popular demand". JMO
I TOTALLY agree, my friend, and for the exact same reasons! I had a serious WTF moment when I saw the new name in my watched videos. I nearly set my profile to "Ignore thread" wondering what the hell was going on until I happend to recognize a couple of the LI. The LI here are pretty much unmistakably HOT!!! As in perfect, gorgeous goddesses!:love: If it weren't for the amazing ladies, I would've just chucked this title in the recycle bin just for changing the name this late in the game. Once you name a story, THAT is the name! No more "working title" bullshit that get's changed before release. Once you release a title with a name, THAT is the name of the title. Even the file names are still Tainted.:rolleyes:

This was a fucked up change. I may need to rethink if it's even worth playing this one if the story is THAT damned malleable. My favorite devs write the ENTIRE story out as part of their preproduction process or even well in advance of preproduction. The story is written and named before render one is completed. Those are the stories and devs I respect and enjoy most. This naming and story writing by committee, by popular vote is bullshit. The last title I found was going that direction, I dropped it like a hot rock that was burning my fingers off. If you don't know the story you want to tell then you don't have a story. If you don't know how your character should appear and act in any given situation within the context of your story, you do NOT have a proper character.

Mot, my friend, You've already started this title. So, please let me know how this turns out. At this point, I may or may not play this one. IDK... I need to know if this is going the story by committee route, please. The last title I had to drop for this reason had me wrapped in for 60+ hours of gameplay before I figured out that it was only getting worse, not better. I'd much rather put that time into a game I may just enjoy rather than some flip flop, can't decide what to put out without a vote bullshit.:rolleyes::poop:

Thanks, brother. :) Adventure ever on, Phat:devilish:(y)
 

Joubei

Lilith Rising
Game Developer
Aug 17, 2021
462
1,225
I TOTALLY agree, my friend, and for the exact same reasons! I had a serious WTF moment when I saw the new name in my watched videos. I nearly set my profile to "Ignore thread" wondering what the hell was going on until I happend to recognize a couple of the LI. The LI here are pretty much unmistakably HOT!!! As in perfect, gorgeous goddesses!:love: If it weren't for the amazing ladies, I would've just chucked this title in the recycle bin just for changing the name this late in the game. Once you name a story, THAT is the name! No more "working title" bullshit that get's changed before release. Once you release a title with a name, THAT is the name of the title. Even the file names are still Tainted.:rolleyes:

This was a fucked up change. I may need to rethink if it's even worth playing this one if the story is THAT damned malleable. My favorite devs write the ENTIRE story out as part of their preproduction process or even well in advance of preproduction. The story is written and named before render one is completed. Those are the stories and devs I respect and enjoy most. This naming and story writing by committee, by popular vote is bullshit. The last title I found was going that direction, I dropped it like a hot rock that was burning my fingers off. If you don't know the story you want to tell then you don't have a story. If you don't know how your character should appear and act in any given situation within the context of your story, you do NOT have a proper character.

Mot, my friend, You've already started this title. So, please let me know how this turns out. At this point, I may or may not play this one. IDK... I need to know if this is going the story by committee route, please. The last title I had to drop for this reason had me wrapped in for 60+ hours of gameplay before I figured out that it was only getting worse, not better. I'd much rather put that time into a game I may just enjoy rather than some flip flop, can't decide what to put out without a vote bullshit.:rolleyes::poop:

Thanks, brother. :) Adventure ever on, Phat:devilish:(y)
First the story is not only written for season 1 but for all the 4 seasons of this story,
I even outlined a few possible sequels and spin-offs for the future but this story has been complete before the first frame.

The name and art are pure marketing - and the release here on f95 is "early access" it is not the full game, or the initial release, and I've said so at the start several times. You guys are helping me develop the game in the form of feedback, comments and opinions, and I respect and appreciate all of you.

Both the story and the characters are designed complete with personalities but there is enough flexibility to add or change their reactions and you guys have seen it several times - for example the whole forced-sex scene with Jezz for instance (which was a great insight here on f95) it took lots of thinking, then fixing up the dialogue branches, adding a few more frames and it was good to go, I hope you agree that the new version is better.

Second - marketing is a separate department in game companies from the game development and games (and movies) are in the end a business, i.e. they must generate income.
This is how the game business generates income:
1. Marketing is for acquisition - i.e. getting people to see the game / play it (click to see then buy it)
2. The content is for retention - i.e. to get people to stay (not ask for a refund and give good reviews)
3. And the DLC, sequels and future episodes / seasons are for retention - i.e. get these players to become a community.

Without marketing - none of this is relevant and is why so few games are able to even exist - at the very least they should cover their cost, if not make a little profit.

Our old title (as much as I liked it) - did not work!
People in general had no idea what it meant and we had a tiny community of about 50 Patreons and about 300 followers.
That's not viable in the long run.

After the name change and art upgrade - our community has grown 2x!! in 2 week - (compared to almost 6 months with the previous title) and that's without releasing ep3 which will have tons of improvements - to include most of the feedback we had here on this very thread, and other places.

THIS IS NOT BY COMMETTE!

I'm taking in all the feedback and making decisions according to both business and story.
Might be hard to understand but without the funds I will not be able to keep doing this - at all!
Like not even 1 frame after season 1 will be out.

My goal - and I've said it from the start - is to gather feedback here and launch the best game on steam!
So again - this is early access - and everything including the title is WIP. (it still is even after we launch).

Its ok if a few people will get upset and I understand that, but compared to thousands of people that will actually click on the game and buy it because the title makes more sense, understandable and projects sexy, fun, and interesting experience.

Yeah it was a tough decision but I had to do it.

I asked people what Tainted means - only 1 our of 100 was able to tell me!!! - AND he was not from north America!
This was bad!
Which means on steam when we get tons of traffic, most people will see it - 99% will go "HUH" and just keep on scrolling.

When I showed Lilith Rising to people - they ALL had a silly smile on their face and said "NICE" when does it come out!

Now with the new title if people will see it - most will say - ooooo that looks interesting.

That's the difference.

HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE STORY OR CHARACTERS!

Marketing is not Game development

Between us - I HATE marketing!

It's been super stressful few weeks, with this marketing push, but I'm very happy with the results.
And very happy with the direction.

I truly hope you'll stay with me for the next bit.

But it will be your choice.
 
Last edited:

motseer

Engaged Member
Dec 17, 2021
2,557
5,909
First the story is not only written for season 1 but for all the 4 seasons of this story,
I even outlined a few possible sequels and spin-offs for the future but this story has been complete before the first frame.

The name and art are pure marketing - and the release here on f95 is "early access" it is not the full game, or the initial release, and I've said so at the start several times. You guys are helping me develop the game in the form of feedback, comments and opinions, and I respect and appreciate all of you.

Both the story and the characters are designed complete with personalities but there is enough flexibility to add or change their reactions and you guys have seen it several times - for example the whole forced-sex scene with Jezz for instance (which was a great insight here on f95) it took lots of thinking, then fixing up the dialogue branches, adding a few more frames and it was good to go, I hope you agree that the new version is better.

Second - marketing is a separate department in game companies from the game development and games (and movies) are in the end a business, i.e. they must generate income.
This is how the game business generates income:
1. Marketing is for acquisition - i.e. getting people to see the game / play it (click to see then buy it)
2. The content is for retention - i.e. to get people to stay (not ask for a refund and give good reviews)
3. And the DLC, sequels and future episodes / seasons are for retention - i.e. get these players to become a community.

Without marketing - none of this is relevant and is why so few games are able to even exist - at the very least they should cover their cost, if not make a little profit.

Our old title (as much as I liked it) - did not work!
People in general had no idea what it meant and we had a tiny community of about 50 Patreons and about 300 followers.
That's not viable in the long run.

After the name change and art upgrade - our community has grown 2x!! in 2 week - (compared to almost 6 months with the previous title) and that's without releasing ep3 which will have tons of improvements - to include most of the feedback we had here on this very thread, and other places.

THIS IS NOT BY COMMETTE!

I'm taking in all the feedback and making decisions according to both business and story.
Might be hard to understand but without the funds I will not be able to keep doing this - at all!
Like not even 1 frame after season 1 will be out.

My goal - and I've said it from the start - is to gather feedback here and launch the best game on steam!
So again - this is early access - and everything including the title is WIP. (it still is even after we launch).

Its ok if a few people will get upset and I understand that, but compared to thousands of people that will actually click on the game and buy it because the title makes more sense, understandable and projects sexy, fun, and interesting experience.

Yeah it was a tough decision but I had to do it.

I asked people what Tainted means - only 1 our of 100 was able to tell me!!! - AND he was not from north America!
This was bad!
Which means on steam when we get tons of traffic, most people will see it - 99% will go "HUH" and just keep on scrolling.

When I showed Lilith Rising to people - they ALL had a silly smile on their face and said "NICE" when does it come out!

Now with the new title if people will see it - most will say - ooooo that looks interesting.

That's the difference.

HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE STORY OR CHARACTERS!

Marketing is not Game development

Between us - I HATE marketing!

It's been super stressful few weeks, with this marketing push, but I'm very happy with the results.
And very happy with the direction.

I truly hope you'll stay with me for the next bit.

But it will be your choice.
I'm happy to see (once again) how passionate you are about the work. My friend, Papa Phat, is a very talented and passionate fellow as well. I'm sure you could tell. I would have predicted parts of your response to him and I understand that this was a reasoned "business" decision. I, personally, am not worried about you being unduly swayed by "fan preferences" but, at the same time, you have always seemed open to feedback - marks of an excellent lead developer IMO. All of this doesn't change my opinion of the new title. I really don't like it. o_O But, I'm here for the story, the MC's character development and... well, and the super hot women.:cool:
The title won't chase me away and, if the next update is as rich in story and as well produced as the last one, I'll get Phat back here to try it out - if he hasn't already shown up on his own. If Phat likes it you will gain one hell of champion!

Can't wait for the next chapter! (y)
 
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Joubei

Lilith Rising
Game Developer
Aug 17, 2021
462
1,225
I'm happy to see (once again) how passionate you are about the work. My friend, Papa Phat, is a very talented and passionate fellow as well. I'm sure you could tell. I would have predicted parts of your response to him and I understand that this was a reasoned "business" decision. I, personally, am not worried about you being unduly swayed by "fan preferences" but, at the same time, you have always seemed open to feedback - marks of an excellent lead developer IMO. All of this doesn't change my opinion of the new title. I really don't like it. o_O But, I'm here for the story, the MC's character development and... well, and the super hot women.:cool:
The title won't chase me away and, if the next update is as rich in story and as well produced as the last one, I'll get Phat back here to try it out - if he hasn't already shown up on his own. If Phat likes it you will gain one hell of champion!

Can't wait for the next chapter! (y)
Thanks motseer appreciate it,

I was thinking about:
Lilith Rising: Dark Pawn
Or
Lilith Rising: Pawn’s Gambit

But I’m afraid it’s less sexy… I’m still thinking about options, and such.
If you have more suggestions about the subtitle I’d be happy to hear.

Lilith Rising ticks all the boxes for marketing purposes: not only that it fits the story, as she’s the main antagonist, and the reason for everything, but she’s also famous, immediately connected to sexy, fun, alluring, enticing, fantasy, and mystery, and Rising is gaining power through a long game plan, but also euphemism for erection. So it works perfectly.
Not to mention that it tested amazingly with focus groups and 2 large communities including ours.

Marketing is all about perception, and it’s why different type of people work there then game designers.

The sad truth is that a good game with bad marketing will not sell,
But also a bad game with good marketing will not sell.
Only a good game with good marketing will sell good. It has to be 50/50.
And yes Freshwomen is a perfect example!
So, we should learn from both the mistakes and successes of other devs.

Recently I saw that Beyond two Worlds has sold over 10k in a few months, while Freshwomen sold almost 1mil at the same time period, both on steam.
I talked with Oppai-Man extensively and it’s actually what lead to these changes.

I’d like to tell the full story, and I’d also like to expand the world into prequels and sequels with the prince and other characters as the focus.

And I’d like a team of experts to help me, as now I’m working solo on all rendering, art, coding, and marketing (luckily I have very good consultants).

In the end we’re all bound by funds.
 
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