Java Lilith's Throne [v0.4.9.9] [Innoxia]

[tehlemon]

After 2 years more or less, I've finally decided to try this game again. It's amazing how there's so much content but with so little depth. This game feels like a playground or a mod with little consistency. It's creative and the possibilities make you wonder, but then you realize there's not a lot behind that.

I don't know if I am being unreasonable and by no means I think developing this kinda game is something easy. I honestly only hope Inno gets better.

Pretty much right on all counts. Well, mostly. I'm finding that building a combat system from scratch for a text only game is really, really hard. I keep coming up with ideas that would just be better if it wasn't text only or is too much for a porn game lol

But yeah, a game like this is really just about time. It takes time to build content. If the game is properly designed to create an easy content pipeline, all you need is the time to keep on writing. With like five years of development, this game should be so much further along. And there's so much to do before we'll ever even get there.

Still a damn fun game until you run out of shit to do. That just, happens way too quickly.

 

[Sarkath]

But yeah, a game like this is really just about time. It takes time to build content. If the game is properly designed to create an easy content pipeline, all you need is the time to keep on writing. With like five years of development, this game should be so much further along. And there's so much to do before we'll ever even get there.

It would be nice if Inno committed to a single content pipeline. Right now LT has two for pretty much all systems—Java classes and XML files. :|

It doesn't help that XML really isn't the best format for something like this. It's sort of like using a pneumatic nailgun to hang a picture. Honestly, I think something like YAML would have been a much better pick. It gives you the simplicity of JSON (without the crazy nesting) and gives you the means of writing freeform text. Considering LT uses schema-less XML, you lose the benefit of early validation so it's kind of pointless anyway.

Yet more evidence of uncontrolled mutation over planned evolution, I guess.

She's also kind of prone to health issues and some of them can last a while; could be "natural causes" but I feel like a good chunk is due to this "job" of her.

Can't quit because it pays your bills but don't want to keep at it because it sucks the life out of 'ya. I don't think she's truly suited for this kind of work IMO.

That's kinda why I try to be a little sympathetic. I don't think Inno is intentionally being malicious, but man…the optics here aren't great. She does have a lot on her plate, and I suspect one of the major reasons for her perpetual burnout is 1) dealing with old mistakes, 2) likely a lack of practical dev experience, 3) the mountain of source code (seriously, LT's repo is massive), and 4) trying to introduce new content on top of this.

I think she'd fare a lot better if she offered some financial compensation for people to help with #1, #2, and #3. Considering how popular LT is, I doubt she'd have a problem finding helpers.

 

[Dr.Feelgood]

That's kinda why I try to be a little sympathetic. I don't think Inno is intentionally being malicious, but man…the optics here aren't great. She does have a lot on her plate, and I suspect one of the major reasons for her perpetual burnout is 1) dealing with old mistakes, 2) likely a lack of practical dev experience, 3) the mountain of source code (seriously, LT's repo is massive), and 4) trying to introduce new content on top of this.

I think she'd fare a lot better if she offered some financial compensation for people to help with #1, #2, and #3.

Considering the number of people that have been booted from the discord for simply asking questions, I don't think there can be any question about the maliciousness. As for the other points... there MUST be some point at which incompetence and a willful refusal to fix one's mistakes can no longer be excused. I'm not sure how long Inno was able to use Hanlon's Razor as a legitimate defense, but that time has passed. The only question is when it happened.

 

[tehlemon]

It would be nice if Inno committed to a single content pipeline. Right now LT has two for pretty much all systems—Java classes and XML files. :|

It doesn't help that XML really isn't the best format for something like this. It's sort of like using a pneumatic nailgun to hang a picture. Honestly, I think something like YAML would have been a much better pick. It gives you the simplicity of JSON (without the crazy nesting) and gives you the means of writing freeform text. Considering LT uses schema-less XML, you lose the benefit of early validation so it's kind of pointless anyway.

Yet more evidence of uncontrolled mutation over planned evolution, I guess.

Yeah, that's pretty much why I brought it up. The game wasn't designed with content in mind at all, at least not in a way that makes sense. I'm 90% sure that it's using XML because it's like the easiest thing you can use if you don't know what you're doing. I used to use it *a lot* for project where it made no sense... during uni.

That's kinda why I try to be a little sympathetic. I don't think Inno is intentionally being malicious, but man…the optics here aren't great. She does have a lot on her plate, and I suspect one of the major reasons for her perpetual burnout is 1) dealing with old mistakes, 2) likely a lack of practical dev experience, 3) the mountain of source code (seriously, LT's repo is massive), and 4) trying to introduce new content on top of this.

I think she'd fare a lot better if she offered some financial compensation for people to help with #1, #2, and #3. Considering how popular LT is, I doubt she'd have a problem finding helpers.

I'm fine with people not being amazing programmers. I'm not. But everything else that happens on top of the shoddy design is what I have a problem with. At this rate, we're back to getting radio silence for a month.

Considering the number of people that have been booted from the discord for simply asking questions, I don't think there can be any question about the maliciousness. As for the other points... there MUST be some point at which incompetence and a willful refusal to fix one's mistakes can no longer be excused. I'm not sure how long Inno was able to use Hanlon's Razor as a legitimate defense, but that time has passed. The only question is when it happened.

Everything about the official discord is toxic and unhealthy as fuck. This is why you don't have official discords. Let fans set up and run their own if they want to, but as a solo dev you should stay away from using them in any official capacity. Their your customers, not your friends. And neither side of the line should forget that.

 

[Sarkath]

Yeah, that's pretty much why I brought it up. The game wasn't designed with content in mind at all, at least not in a way that makes sense. I'm 90% sure that it's using XML because it's like the easiest thing you can use if you don't know what you're doing. I used to use it *a lot* for project where it made no sense... during uni.

I think it's more that XML serialization is built-in. Given how the Maven build file is configured, I kind of get the impression that Inno didn't really know how to reliably pull in libraries, or at least not how to do it in a friendly way for a source-available project.

I'm fine with people not being amazing programmers. I'm not. But everything else that happens on top of the shoddy design is what I have a problem with. At this rate, we're back to getting radio silence for a month.

Well, the thing is, I don't doubt that the shoddy framework plays a large role in the level of productivity we're seeing. We all know that the engine is going through some serious growing pains, and the stress of trying to fix that is bound to suck an amateur programmer dry.

But yeah, like you said, the real issue is in the lack of communication and, by extension, the absence of a clear path forward (until someone suggests nasal sex, that is. I'm sure that would get added immediately).

 

[tehlemon]

Well, the thing is, I don't doubt that the shoddy framework plays a large role in the level of productivity we're seeing. We all know that the engine is going through some serious growing pains, and the stress of trying to fix that is bound to suck an amateur programmer dry.

But yeah, like you said, the real issue is in the lack of communication and, by extension, the absence of a clear path forward (until someone suggests nasal sex, that is. I'm sure that would get added immediately).

True. I probably should have said "I don't mind people not being amazing programmers *for the first few years*" lol

By now, she should be competent enough to start salvaging this stuff. It's her entire career. A little effort would go a long way, specially if this is the kind of work she'd put in for a normal job. I would have fired her long ago if she were my staff.

And yeah, having a plan would do wonders. There used to be one, but I don't think the passion was there to follow it.

 

[Dr.Feelgood]

But yeah, like you said, the real issue is in the lack of communication and, by extension, the absence of a clear path forward (until someone suggests nasal sex, that is. I'm sure that would get added immediately).

Aural Sex. I'm calling it now, that is what we're getting next. I don't know what the fuck that would be, but considering how little sense many of the most recent additions have made, it only seems appropriate that it would be next.

 

[Simp Cattu]

Aural Sex. I'm calling it now, that is what we're getting next. I don't know what the fuck that would be, but considering how little sense many of the most recent additions have made, it only seems appropriate that it would be next.

Funny thing is, that is entirely possible and it actually does make senses. Just manifest your aura to temporary grow a genital, attached at your groin like a normal organ or used like an onahole / dildo. The thing disappears after the sex is done. Leaves no mess, doesn't require cleaning up and handy as hell. Let's hope Inno isn't going to throw another year of dev into this shit.

 

[IvoryOwl]

Funny thing is, that is entirely possible and it actually does make senses. Just manifest your aura to temporary grow a genital, attached at your groin like a normal organ or used like an onahole / dildo. The thing disappears after the sex is done. Leaves no mess, doesn't require cleaning up and handy as hell. Let's hope Inno isn't going to throw another year of dev into this shit.

(If something likes this gets implemented, we will all blame you.)

 

[PussyPassAnon]

I'm alive. Just busy as heck.

 

[Mishun]

can you get fetishes less random?
persons without vagina have vaginal virginity fetish

 

[tehlemon]

can you get fetishes less random?
persons without vagina have vaginal virginity fetish

For generated NPCs, they're going to spawn with what they spawn with.

You can use potions to change the PC/NPCs fetishes to whatever you want. Enchant a kink potion.

 

[DirtyMare88]

The most recent messages (and they're a couple days old now) were "still working on it" and " I've just had a rough few weeks", but I've seen people mentioning that Inno was online recently, so it's just intentional radio silence.
Also, every message I've seen asking about news or the update's status (and I was online when some of them were posted in the chat) was first completely ignored, and then, since the search option doesn't show any of them anymore - deleted, I assume. I just wonder if the people asking were banned as well; certainly wouldn't surprise me if they were.

Didn't poke around much longer than this, I have better things to do. This whole shitshow is still amusing to me, but after all those years it's no longer THAT amusing.

lazy shits are one thing, but these white knight stooges who are actively supporting it are worse. It amazes me people can engage in that sort of censorship and not have the basic self reflection to ask "what the fuck am I doing?"

 

[BupoTiling03-Retired]

can you get fetishes less random?
persons without vagina have vaginal virginity fetish

Options and Content Options, check each tab inside each. You can.

 

[Sarkath]

By now, she should be competent enough to start salvaging this stuff. It's her entire career.

You'd be surprised. I had the pleasure of working with a programmer with 25 years of experience who was utterly incapable of managing his own workload. Some people just need to have someone over them 24/7 or they can't stay on track.

 

[SheepPun]

You'd be surprised. I had the pleasure of working with a programmer with 25 years of experience who was utterly incapable of managing his own workload. Some people just need to have someone over them 24/7 or they can't stay on track.

People seriously underestimate the importance of project managers.

 

[zxcvghjkop[]]

Was the companions mechanic axed because of the codebase being uncooperative or because it was going to be too time consuming making double the content going forward (which I guess would also only be reasonable if the codebase was a shitty mess anyway)? Was one of the more interesting parts of the game to be honest.

 

[BaloneyAmone]

Was the companions mechanic axed because of the codebase being uncooperative or because it was going to be too time consuming making double the content going forward (which I guess would also only be reasonable if the codebase was a shitty mess anyway)? Was one of the more interesting parts of the game to be honest.

I think it was mostly the latter, since you can still access additional party members via elementals, which don't have any special interactions outside of a couple bits, and since they're technically a fragment of your own consciousness, once you write one you write them all, and are much less expected to comment on things; in comparison, proper companions would be far more dynamic, and would demand far more writing to pull off adequately, especially once enslavable NPCs get added to the mix. They're still in the game via a manual toggle under Content Options -> Gameplay if you're clamoring to get them back.

 

[darkgryffon]

Don't know if this is the right place to ask, but a while back i downloaded a modded version that fixed the issues with having too many offspring/load times and what not. any idea if that has been brought up to date or where to find it? or even if there's a precompiled fixed Lilith's throne with mods installed? sorry for the stupid question. i just dont know where else to post this or look

 

[Sarkath]

Don't know if this is the right place to ask, but a while back i downloaded a modded version that fixed the issues with having too many offspring/load times and what not. any idea if that has been brought up to date or where to find it?

Yoo, that might have been mine. If so, it hasn't been brought up to date yet. I'll try to get that taken care of this weekend.