I appreciate the info and link. I think there's a perfect middle ground between literal translation and localization that a lot of TLers seem to miss (again no shade thrown... pun intended), I'll have to check that one out as well. I wish Shade luck with the local issues.
- Thread starter Shadesishere
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- May 5, 2024
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There is definitely no way to entirely please everyone, and different people have different priorities, but for me personally, readability is indeed a big factor in the enjoyment one gets from a translation, possibly even more so than accuracy. If a translation is pleasant enough and plausibly faithful, you probably won't even think about its accuracy, or at least not be concerned enough about it for it to damage the experience. If it reads poorly, on the other hand, it makes it easier to get frustrated with every other error as well and just end up feeling worse about everything.
Shades's TL is definitely rough at the moment, I'm sure he would admit as much and is working on it. Kagura's TL is disappointingly awkward in many respects... some parts make me wonder if the main person they had working on it is even a fluent English speaker, honestly. Which really is a shame for a game that, niche as it may be, is wildly good and surely deserves a better shake.
- Aug 25, 2017
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I think it also depends on how story heavy a game is. If we're talking about this game, sure, a little inaccuracy is probably fine. If we're talking about Sister Travel, hell no, accuracy is important. There's parts to that game where I have to wonder if the person doing the translating themselves understand what the hell is going on plot-wise.
- Apr 15, 2019
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This. And for the love of god, if a game is character driven like Kozue's Strange Journey. Don't mess up their characters by trying to add in western phrases and memes. Like Kozue's Strange Journey.
- Jun 28, 2020
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I remember hearing someone say something like "bad localizers view their job as a creative role instead of a technical role" which is probably the most succinct criticism I've heard about shitty localizations.
- May 5, 2024
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Cases like that are more an issue of script quality than necessarily accuracy. You could easily imagine a localization which completely changes the dialogue yet is consistent with itself, so it's perfectly logical to follow, but not at all accurate. It's when you get those inconsistencies that you start to wonder what the issue is. If you were having a good time, you might not think that far at all; without checking against the original script, how would you even know?
That said naturally I would prefer that translations do aim to accurately represent the original script to the degree that they can, which for some reason is an eternal struggle with English localizations. But, script quality is what you are evaluating long before accuracy can come into the picture; if it is unpleasant to read such that you're not having a good time, anything else it might be is moot. If you are having a good time, it might only be years later that you run into something that makes you realize that the "translation" was actually completely full of shit.
- Apr 15, 2019
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quick questions: Where are you two getting this information about Sister travel getting a reboot/remake? And how does the explorer demo imply it's a sequel to Travel when the main MC and heroine looks to be completely different from Travel? How are you connecting these seemingly unconnected dots??
- May 5, 2024
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Translation necessarily has a creative component, as languages do not not map 1-1 to each other, and cultures all have their different ways of expressing things, let alone references to obscure things that audiences in another language have absolutely no hope of knowing about. But there are very much differences in attitudes towards how those challenges should be handled. I can't help but think of a little event in Persona 4 that really captures this for me (so much that I have this screenshot of it from forever ago).
The correct answer, as per the game mechanics, is the first one (make up bullshit). Fundamentally, I disagree with this approach. When I run into this issue, what I'll do is grab the offending phrase and start doing web searches on it. Fortunately these days, there will often be encyclopedia entries about a lot of niche things, or you'll see people using it in actual conversations and be able to figure out what's going on. From there, you can decide if there is a sufficiently accurate English equivalent, or if not, how you want to represent it. Ancient weeb that I am, I find TL notes acceptable, so that may ultimately be the result.
In this way though I'm very happy to be doing fan TL rather than anything "professional". This way I can just handle it however I want to see it in the script: writing for an audience of one (me), rather than some theoretical audience of paying consumers. The "average player" experience can shove itself, I'mma just make the translation that makes me happy, and if there are others who enjoy it as well, then that's just a bonus.
- Jun 28, 2020
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I understand that some creative liberties need to be taken to make a translation read well, my issue is with translations that try to undermine the authorial intent, mess with characterization, make things more "palatable", etc. When a translator makes an alteration to a script because they personally didn't like the original message, that seems kinda shitty to me. I think the best translations are the ones that try to preserve the original message as much as possible, and let the viewer/reader/player decide for themselves how to feel about it.
- Aug 25, 2017
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If we're talking about obscure idioms, sure. If we're talking about puzzles that would otherwise be impossible to solve, also fair game. But don't touch the overall plot or characters. I wouldn't bother playing a plot-heavy game outside of MTL unless I gave a shit about what's going on. And I'd reason that the guy who wrote the characters/scenes/plot for the game dumped a shit ton of hours into making a long ass story because they give a shit about the plot and want you to give a shit about the plot. To have a half-assed localization that ignores the creator's intended experience feels insulting to the effort that went into the game.
Edit: And I also want to point out that not every story is going to find an audience in another language. If it doesn't look like it'll work without rewriting a significant portion of the script, don't even bother localizing it, just leave it alone. Anything that requires you to buy into a significant amount of knowledge external to the game should automatically be disqualified for translation/localization.
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It's all inferrence. I'm not saying Travel itself is getting remade or anything, but the plots from Travel and Fantasy are not consistent with each other despite the ending of Fantasy implying it's going to continue on into Travel (Although a big part of this could be a faulty localization from Kagura). Meanwhile, Explorer's demo implies pretty strongly that it's a direct sequel to Travel, with a neat story gimmick to excuse why it's you and a random girl to start with. Since Travel's story was probably made as a once off thing to excuse a plot that lets a character fuck a bunch of imouto stereotypes, but Fantasy is trying to tie it all into a single franchise universe, it's safer to let the newer games bring up what parts of Travel's plot still matter.
It's actually pretty likely Explorer's going to be getting the remake treatment at this point. Inusuku's essentially had 3 art style changes with the three games he's made since Travel / Explorer Demo. He's also learned how to actually implement a mouse. To go back to the full keyboard control of Travel / Explorer Demo is a bad look after making a game whos english port has been bought at least 200,000 times on steam. It'd be nice to see if the Live2D ass animations of Explorer will stay in the game if the art is updated to post Fantasy DLC levels.
Inusuku posted his long term plans few weeks ago.
First he finish monochrome remake ( encore). - All art is done and only story/scripts left to do.
Then he is doing Explorer.
There is also possible bad news about monochrome remake.
Since Fantasy had battle game elements it was easy to release on steam with Kagura games.
But Inusuku is not sure it is possible to release monochrome remake since it is mostly H visual novel.
First he finish monochrome remake ( encore). - All art is done and only story/scripts left to do.
Then he is doing Explorer.
There is also possible bad news about monochrome remake.
Since Fantasy had battle game elements it was easy to release on steam with Kagura games.
But Inusuku is not sure it is possible to release monochrome remake since it is mostly H visual novel.
- May 5, 2024
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Heh, I quite like your edit point. It goes the other way, too: writing with a "global" audience in mind can impose a lot of restrictions on a Japanese writer. 9 years in, the only mobage I play still has no English version, and it's almost certainly better for it; the sensitivities can be quite different indeed.
Unfortunately, money tends to be a better motivator than creative vision, and licensing the IP and shipping slop seems to be pretty effective for the parties involved.
That's unfortunate for Inusuku. Guess we should make an even more concerted effort to purchase the game directly when it drops.
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man, its always wild to beat a fight in one turn and still get the "injured" tag at the end of the subjugation
- May 14, 2022
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Use winlator and for you question "who knows", i think is better stop waiting
- May 14, 2022
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